The Crown v Gerard Baden-Clay, 1st July - Trial Day 13, Week 3

[Neuromancer]

And maybe dear ole game warden, NBC brought some of EBC's clothes to help GBC -re-dress Allison as putting fitting clothes on a dead weight is virtually impossible!

A few people have mentioned this in relation to the oversize tracky dacks.
Dressing inert bodies isn't actually that hard - you just have to roll them from side to side and pull up one side of the garment at a time.

 

[catswhiskers]

Just posting a link to todays musings/summary on the Crims site - worth a read for a little more insight into the general tone in court today.

http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2014/07/01/how-to-win-friends-and-influence-people-the-gbc-method/

 

[marlywings]

Re the cut on his palm I believe this was confirmed by the prosecution as being substantiated.

I have been thinking about the pyjamas and the question Mr fuller asked GBC about are they in the photo. It would have been a pointless question to ask if GBC could have answered, no they are not in the photo because they were in the bathroom or in the dirty clothes basket in the laundry etc etc.

Mr Fuller does not ask pointless questions so there is a good reason he asked this one. I think they must be unaccounted for!

I don't recall reading about the cut on hand being confirmed. This is last I read of it....

Text copied from Detective McCleod's first bail application charge sheet and summary

The defendant stated that he received this injury whilst he was changing a light bulb at a house he was preparing for open house.

An employee of the Century 21 business, Jody Meynell, was present at this time and refuted this claim that the injury was sustained during the preparation of the open house.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9048041&postcount=3"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Bail Hearing Documents *No Discussion*[/ame]

 

[frustrated detective]

I don't recall reading about the cut on hand being confirmed. This is last I read of it....

Text copied from Detective McCleod's first bail application charge sheet and summary

The defendant stated that he received this injury whilst he was changing a light bulb at a house he was preparing for open house.

An employee of the Century 21 business, Jody Meynell, was present at this time and refuted this claim that the injury was sustained during the preparation of the open house.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Bail Hearing Documents *No Discussion*

I would like to see him give a demo of how that happened, and watch him pretend to cut his left hand, and then realise that it should have been his right!

 

[alioop]

I thought it was reported that the other agent/colleague present at the time of the supposed light bulb incident refuted GBC's story?
I could be wrong - getting a bit addled here myself tonight though ... :crazy:

You are right, that was in the bail hearing docs but since then, in the trial it has been confirmed as being substantiated.

Edit. Marly I have a distinct recollection of it being ruled out. Does anyone else. It's not in the agreed facts as I just checked.

 

[BatWoman]

This is the pic of the treadmill side of the bed.

 

[Tangled_Web]

I don't recall reading about the cut on hand being confirmed. This is last I read of it....

Text copied from Detective McCleod's first bail application charge sheet and summary

The defendant stated that he received this injury whilst he was changing a light bulb at a house he was preparing for open house.

An employee of the Century 21 business, Jody Meynell, was present at this time and refuted this claim that the injury was sustained during the preparation of the open house.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Bail Hearing Documents *No Discussion*

I believe the cut on his hand was satisfactorily accounted for in court yesterday.

 

[DrWatson]

I don't recall reading about the cut on hand being confirmed. This is last I read of it....

Text copied from Detective McCleod's first bail application charge sheet and summary

The defendant stated that he received this injury whilst he was changing a light bulb at a house he was preparing for open house.

An employee of the Century 21 business, Jody Meynell, was present at this time and refuted this claim that the injury was sustained during the preparation of the open house.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Bail Hearing Documents *No Discussion*

Doesn't "refuted" mean she says it did NOT happen? As opposed to confirmed?

But I thought ealier in the court proceedings, perhaps in the agreed evidence (correct terminology Ali?) there was some mention that the claim about the hand injury had been corroborated?

 

[MaxwellSmart]

Just a question about post sentencing (presuming there is one), what are we Alison baden clay sleuthers going to do? I feel we have created such a tight community brought together from a tragic event that I will miss you guys. The case has been a considerable focus for us but there has been such an accepting environment regarding our own struggles with anxiety, depression, violent spouses, fainting kids, lung transplants etc it would be a shame to lose that connection. .... maybe WS could create a thread called "Alison Baden-Clay withdrawal support group" and we could pop in for a chin wag and a cyber cuppa from Marly every now and again. I would hate to think that our only interactions were as a result of other unfortunate murderous events! Have really enjoyed the discussions, humour and the out pouring of empathy and sorrow for the BC girls and Mr and Mrs Dickie.

 

[DrWatson]

Just a question about post sentencing (presuming there is one), what are we Alison baden clay sleuthers going to do? I feel we have created such a tight community brought together from a tragic event that I will miss you guys. The case has been a considerable focus for us but there has been such an accepting environment regarding our own struggles with anxiety, depression, violent spouses, fainting kids, lung transplants etc it would be a shame to lose that connection. .... maybe WS could create a thread called "Alison Baden-Clay withdrawal support group" and we could pop in for a chin wag and a cyber cuppa from Marly every now and again. I would hate to think that our only interactions were as a result of other unfortunate murderous events! Have really enjoyed the discussions, humour and the out pouring of empathy and sorrow for the BC girls and Mr and Mrs Dickie.

You could always apply to join my Roundabout Withdrawal Group Therapy sessions...

EDIT: BOG - Bring Own Gin

 

[frustrated detective]

You are right, that was in the bail hearing docs but since then, in the trial it has been confirmed as being substantiated.

Edit. Marly I have a distinct recollection of it being ruled out. Does anyone else. It's not in the agreed facts as I just checked.

Could someone clarify this as I understand 'refuted' to mean oppose, contradict or shoot down.

Also, surely the screwdriver would be held in his right hand and not his left, unless he is left handed.

 

[Neuromancer]

June 12, 2014

She recalled seeing her father returning from the garage when she went to the kitchen for a glass of water about 10 minutes after going to bed and said her mother was watching TV in her pyjamas at the time

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...mans-scream-20140612-zs5o7.html#ixzz36CgXL7lk

Thanks Marly - yes that's the first mention I saw of pyjamas on the couch. And then BGC goes on about checked ones in his ramble this week. I'm just wondering if he's only adding this detail now, since it was in daughter's testimony. Are there other police statements that he's made that aren't in the public record where he could have said that? or could he just be coming up with it now?

From what I've read in available statements, they only focussed on the "walking outfit" in his interviews. You'd think if he'd said in the early days what she was wearing when last seen on the couch, the cops would have made a big deal of looking for that outfit at the time. Otherwise it's too late now. >.<

 

[BatWoman]

I would like to see him give a demo of how that happened, and watch him pretend to cut his left hand, and then realise that it should have been his right!

The screwdriver is plausible imo. If you're using it with your right hand and holding something in your left, it's possible to slip and hurt your left. I'm sure i've done it before. It's really not important in the big scheme of things.

 

[JK673]

Thanks Marly - yes that's the first mention I saw of pyjamas on the couch. And then BGC goes on about checked ones in his ramble this week. I'm just wondering if he's only adding this detail now, since it was in daughter's testimony. Are there other police statements that he's made that aren't in the public record where he could have said that? or could he just be coming up with it now?

From what I've read in available statements, they only focussed on the "walking outfit" in his interviews. You'd think if he'd said in the early days what she was wearing when last seen on the couch, the cops would have made a big deal of looking for that outfit at the time. Otherwise it's too late now. >.<

They may had kept it quiet. After all. Thr phone is missing after being triangulated. In GBCs presence.....

 

[Amee]

Baden-Clay said he went to a friend&#8217;s home renovation that afternoon.

He said two staff members come along to the home to check it before it went to auction, and while changing a light fitting he cut his hand.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-allison-in-2012/story-fnihsrf2-1226971633938

 

[itsthevibe]

Just a question about post sentencing (presuming there is one), what are we Alison baden clay sleuthers going to do? I feel we have created such a tight community brought together from a tragic event that I will miss you guys. The case has been a considerable focus for us but there has been such an accepting environment regarding our own struggles with anxiety, depression, violent spouses, fainting kids, lung transplants etc it would be a shame to lose that connection. .... maybe WS could create a thread called "Alison Baden-Clay withdrawal support group" and we could pop in for a chin wag and a cyber cuppa from Marly every now and again. I would hate to think that our only interactions were as a result of other unfortunate murderous events! Have really enjoyed the discussions, humour and the out pouring of empathy and sorrow for the BC girls and Mr and Mrs Dickie.

I have thought about this too. I like your idea. However I'm still uncertain as to what the verdict will be, as it is hard to get into the minds of the jury who are hearing all of this for the first time. It still scares me that there could be reasonable doubt in enough of their minds. So if he gets off, we will still have plenty to talk about i guess, for quite a while, and in fact many of us may need a lot of comforting and counselling! If he is found guilty, then I suspect he will appeal, so this whole shebang could be going on for quite some time yet.

 

[frustrated detective]

The screwdriver is plausible imo. If you're using it with your right hand and holding something in your left, it's possible to slip and hurt your left. I'm sure i've done it before. It's really not important in the big scheme of things.

Perhaps ... Though normally it wouldn't be necessary to choose the awkward option for a light fitting.

Trouble with chronic liars is that after a while you don't believe anything they say.

 

[itsthevibe]

Baden-Clay said he went to a friend’s home renovation that afternoon.

He said two staff members come along to the home to check it before it went to auction, and while changing a light fitting he cut his hand.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-allison-in-2012/story-fnihsrf2-1226971633938

.... and I thought there was a witness who verified that he did? Or was it rumour? I did think there was an actual witness or some sort of verification reported, maybe by the police who checked it out?

But if that's the case I'm wondering why Fuller raised it today in questioning.

 

[toe]

I wonder if he gave himself an uppercut in the prison van on his way back to his new home for being such a dill for thinking by going into the box he would sail through this and come out smelling like a rose?

Guilty Gerry!!!:floorlaugh:

 

[digitup]

My theory with the chipped tooth is.

That happened when Allison was trying to use her phone to get help, he's grabbed at the phone and knocked the phone against her mouth and chipped her tooth.

or

The cut on his hand which appears to be suspicious with respect to his story about how it occured and the RE personel who was with him at the time denying his story of the cause. I'm wondering if Allison actually bite him whilst he had his hand over her mouth to stop her screaming and her tooth was chipped during this scuffle.

OK I think I should leave this up to Mr Fuller extraordinaire::blushing:

I believe that the blood in the car was a result of her head hitting the interior of the car when being loaded into it. Unconscious bodies are very limp and very floppy, very hard to control (I know this from moving my euthanized pet). I also think this is where the chipped tooth occurred. The blood came from either the tooth piercing the lip or from a blood nose which would definitely explain a rivulet type flow in situ. I believe that the perp either suffocated or rendered the victim temporarily unconscious using a choke hold at the family home.I reckon that the victim regained consciousness and tried to defend herself at or near the scene of her death at Kholo Creek. I don't think that the perp realised that his victim had bled therefore he overlooked the need to 'clean' the car?