The Fall Of Kabul To The Taliban

[ringbearer]

Please don't make me do the math!

Pentagon Press Sec John Kirby ( today ) : "Of the 2,000 over the last 24 hours" who have been evacuated from Afghanistan "nearly 300 of them were Americans."

https://twitter.com/DailyCaller/status/1428383208748593155

Link includes C-span video portion of today's press briefing with the U.S. Pentagon

IMO, this " Fall of Kabul" has been handled so poorly by the U.S. government, as evidenced by the initial order to American citizens to " shelter in place".... THEN the order to evacuate to the airport. ( But you're on your own )...kinda like "tag...you're it!" Followed by the clearly evident evacuation of 30 times the number of Afghani refugees to U.S. citizens. It just isn't making a bit of sense to me!

Right? If diplomacy with the Taliban is the only way for people to run the gauntlet to the airport, as stated by officials in the recent presser, and Americans are not getting through -- who are and why?

 

[Gardenista]

The videos remind me of something you might see in caveman days, only with guns.

 

[shotgun09]

The videos remind me of something you might see in caveman days, only with guns.

The videos I have seen via the MSM, (as well as others) are devastating to watch. Not an ounce of comfort or reassurance. And, to be quite honest...I can visualize the taliban dragging a woman by the hair...just like the caveman days

 

[LadyL]

Zaki Anwari: Afghan footballer falls to death from US plane in Kabul

 

[shotgun09]

To the U.S. Military leaders, and the POTUS and Commander in Chief:

This is not indicative of a well thought out contingency plan!

From Idrees Ali, Reuters Foreign Policy Correspondent Covering the Pentagon

https://twitter.com/idreesali114/status/1428377803045617665

U.S. officials tell Reuters that the current intelligence indicates that the Taliban control at least 2,000 U.S.-made armored vehicles, between 30 and 40 aircraft and an untold number of small arms.
10:26 AM · Aug 19, 2021·Twitter Web App

 

[KALI]

First guess is people with a lot of money to bribe.

Right? If diplomacy with the Taliban is the only way for people to run the gauntlet to the airport, as stated by officials in the recent presser, and Americans are not getting through -- who are and why?

 

[KALI]

As posted in many articles. They are confiscating the residents firearms. That's one of my personal fears. No way to defend your family and yourself.
Then they can just waltz in and take whatever they want. Including your daughters.
What a nightmare.

The videos remind me of something you might see in caveman days, only with guns.

 

[Charlot123]

BBM about understanding tribal dynamics. It's sad if, according to that Marine, they didn't understand tribal dynamics, but many other Americans did and still do. I read about tribal dynamics in the ME back in the late 80's and early 90's. Someone wrote an op-ed a few days ago explaining how tribal dynamics in Afghanistan have historically seen factions maintain agreements about surrender among themselves. The examples they gave were during battles back in the 1980's. How did our US military and intel operations experience such amnesia that they lose such institutional knowledge?

Even post WWII, experts knew it would be impossible to bring U.S.-style democracy to ME countries. It doesn't fit, doesn't work with their history, culture and religion. Their form of government, such as it is, is based on tribalism and the agreements tribes maintain among themselves. We can't change it, no matter how much we bomb and annihilate them. How many times does the US have to learn the same lesson?

JMO

Not only this. If anyone would attempt to bring in our democracy to Britain of 1350, he’d fail, too. The country had to go through feudalism, then, absolute monarchy, then constitutional monarchy. Somewhere along the line, there would be the schism of Christian church, and the Puritans that were so conservatives that even the Netherlands could not tolerate them, and then they’d cross the ocean…I mean, it took centuries of development. Things get faster nowadays, but Afghanistan got the short end of the stick, with 42 years of being at war, it is still at feudalism, and it’s main industrial product is opium. This the Talibans won’t destroy, so we might need to think how to deal with it.

 

[Betty P]

From my actual experience, the vast majority of Afghans want exactly what we want: to live and to work to support their families and to come home each day and live their life. Absolutely ZERO of the Afghan women or children (ie: the majority of the population of Afghanistan) I met, helped and worked with ever wanted to live under Taliban rule and I am extremely doubtful they wish to do so again; it's deadly for them. Nor did the Afghan men I met and worked with want to either.

Is your work colleague a male perchance? Interesting also to note that Pakistan harboured the Taliban, but it's not like the Taliban imposed sharia law there and were executing Pakistani womenfolk for working, being out, being burqha-less or executing Pakistani citizens of any sex /age for playing outside, for laughing, for playing music etc etc or for not practicing the Taliban version of ultra-politics and religion, or torture techniques.

I guess when one isn't themselves subjugated to actually living under Taliban rule it's easy to write-off those who fear such, and who've actually had to live it, as "meh".

Maybe its time to go back to the old way of working to resolve these problems through the United Nations with peacekeeping forces and other diplomatic interventions.

 

[worldwatcher]

Tom Tugendhat on UK and Afghanistan: Anger, grief, rage

In an emotional speech, Conservative MP Tom Tugendhat tells of the anger, grief and rage felt by veterans at the "abandonment" of Afghanistan.

Army veteran silences MPs with powerful Afghan speech

 

[ringbearer]

First guess is people with a lot of money to bribe.

You'd think the Americans would have the most money, since that's the reason most of the "contractors" are there.

 

[shotgun09]

BBM
WASHINGTON, Aug 16 (Reuters) - The United States spent more than $8 billion over 15 years on efforts to deprive the Taliban of their profits from Afghanistan's opium and heroin trade, from poppy eradication to airstrikes and raids on suspected labs.

That strategy failed.

As the United States wraps up its longest war, Afghanistan remains the world's biggest illicit opiate supplier and looks certain to remain so as the Taliban is on the brink of taking power in Kabul, said current and former U.S. and U.N. officials and experts.

Profits and poppy: Afghanistan's illegal drug trade a boon for Taliban

 

[shotgun09]

This was no surprise.....

BBM

"About two dozen State Dept officials serving at US Embassy Kabul sent a dissent cable to Secretary of State Antony Blinken and another top State Department official last month warning of Taliban's territorial gains, and the need for fast evacuations"

https://twitter.com/vmsalama/status/1428466602358493192

Vivian Salama is National Security Reporter for the Wall Street Journal

 

[mickey2942]

Reminds me of "Benghazi". Another disaster that could have been avoided.

 

[worldwatcher]

By viewing all the media news and catching up, by all the post in this thread, I also believe that a civilian war is unavoidable.

I just read about, the son of Ahmad Shah Massoud,

www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/ahmad-massoud-son-of-assassinated-anti-taliban-fighter-requests-us-for-weapons-101629367056733-amp.html

Here is more info about him:
"The son of Ahmad Shah Massoud, one of the main leaders of Afghanistan's anti-Soviet resistance in the 1980s, has pledged to hold out against the Taliban from his stronghold in the Panjshir valley."
Son of slain Afghan hero Massoud vows resistance, seeks support

ETA:
Anti-Taliban forces coming together in Panjshir Valley, says Russia

 

[MajorHoople]

As posted in many articles. They are confiscating the residents firearms. That's one of my personal fears. No way to defend your family and yourself.
Then they can just waltz in and take whatever they want. Including your daughters.
What a nightmare.

That's exactly what will happen.

 

[dotr]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-afghanistan-afghans-evacuation-taliban-1.6146764
Aug 19, 2021 5:17 PM ET rbbm.
''Liberal Leader Justin Trudeau said today it's going to be "almost impossible" to bring most of the Afghans who worked with Canada's military mission to safety, along with their families, because the Taliban is blocking the effort.''

''There are at least 1,500 Afghan interpreters with up to 5,000 dependents on a waiting list for Canadian visas, said a source.''

"But unless the Taliban shift their posture significantly — which is something the international community and Canada are working on — it's going to be very difficult to get many people out," Trudeau told reporters while campaigning in Victoria, B.C.''

''Others have told CBC News the Taliban have been searching for anyone who has worked with foreign governments. They say their time is running out.

So far, Canada has resettled more than 800 people from Afghanistan in Canada since flights started in early August. A plane carrying 92 evacuees landed at Toronto Pearson International Airport on Tuesday.''

 

[SuziQ]

Blinken was warned last month Kabul would fall, report claims | Daily Mail Online

 

[SuziQ]

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[SuziQ]

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