The Grand Jury & Trial

[gngr~snap]

In regards to Harris being "lazy"
There was discussion early on in this case. How after they got married his wife handled the finances and Ross goofed around while still attending college. He graduated in 2012.
So he was older than the average college student. He had a falling out with his best friend, but his friend continued to support him. This is the friend that introduced JRH to LeAnna.
He was shocked and said he guessed he never knew him, calling him a monster.

Statement from his friend.
He was late to his own wedding because he had to stop and buy hairspray (for himself)

He also said Ross wasn't the kind of guy into commitments, but when he met LeAnna he said I'm gonna marry that girl.
They were polar opposites.

"We joked he was the kind of person to be late to his own funeral," M said. "It didn't seem like he ever took anything seriously. But I always assumed he could be serious when he needed to be."
*http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ho...-dad-he-was-ferris-bueller-tuscaloosa-n153156

I had forgotten about this!
Harris never called 911, and when an officer told him to get off his phone, he refused and even said, "F*** you" before an officer took his phone and handcuffed him, the detective said.

"Ross Harris had recently been passed over for a promotion,"

*http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/03/justice/georgia-hot-car-toddler-death/

Make your own assumptions about his character. I see an immature man that was a folllower not a leader...
:cow: JMO


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[LinasK]

Of course! If only he had gone that route!

But that is not what I meant. In his world, I don't think he would divorce his wife. For one thing, I think he's too conservative to do that (yes, I know the irony of not wanting to commit the sin of divorce but go ahead and murder instead). Also, and this might be the bigger reason, he's too lazy and passive to take the steps to divorce and to face the judgement of others regarding leaving a wife and child.

The way he killed Cooper - if it was murder - was lazy and passive. He didn't have to do anything except "forget."

Just my opinion.

Yup! Just watched an episode of Dateline a couple of nights ago where the perp killed a couple of his wives- they never suspected him in the death of the first wife until they looked at him for the 2nd one. This one was a Jehovah's Witness and he would rather kill than be "disfellowshipped" for divorce!!! :banghead::banghead:
And... wife #2 was his son's mother-in-law to be and he married her just days before his son's scheduled wedding!

 

[LinasK]

On what evidence do you base your opinion he was "lazy and passive?"

Okay Hope to get you up to speed- he spent his mornings laying around watching cartoons and texting and going into work late on a regular basis. He also didn't want to be a father if you look at photographs where Leanna placed Cooper on Ross's stomach and took pictures. He isn't smiling in any of them. He looks distressed.
He shares many narcisstic traits in common with Casey Anthony and Scott Peterson. Like Casey, he waited two years to kill his kid and be child-free. Don't take Leanna's public words that he was a good father- she divorced him. She does play the Cindy Anthony role in this case- defending him at the funeral "not my husband", and declaring she'd have more kids with him. She's too cowardly to admit she screwed up by marrying him.

 

[Magdalyn]

Okay Hope to get you up to speed- he spent his mornings laying around watching cartoons and texting and going into work late on a regular basis. He also didn't want to be a father if you look at photographs where Leanna placed Cooper on Ross's stomach and took pictures. He isn't smiling in any of them. He looks distressed.
He shares many narcisstic traits in common with Casey Anthony and Scott Peterson. Like Casey, he waited two years to kill his kid and be child-free. Don't take Leanna's public words that he was a good father- she divorced him. She does play the Cindy Anthony role in this case- defending him at the funeral "not my husband", and declaring she'd have more kids with him. She's too cowardly to admit she screwed up by marrying him.

and this:

Mr. Harris graduated from high school in 1999 and worked a series of jobs around Tuscaloosa, including as a police dispatcher and campus mail clerk. In 2006, he married Leanna, an aspiring dietitian.

She eventually prevailed upon Mr. Harris to return to college, Mr. McRea said. Mr. Harris enrolled at the university in 2009 and pursued a degree in management information systems. Mr. McRea said that his friend, as a 28-year-old new university student, began hanging out with underclassmen and falling back into the life of a college student, sometimes keeping late hours that his wife would nag him about.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/12/u...ruct-fathers-role-in-toddlers-death.html?_r=0

 

[Hope4More]

In regards to Harris being "lazy"
There was discussion early on in this case. How after they got married his wife handled the finances and Ross goofed around while still attending college. He graduated in 2012.
So he was older than the average college student. He had a falling out with his best friend, but his friend continued to support him. This is the friend that introduced JRH to LeAnna.
He was shocked and said he guessed he never knew him, calling him a monster.

Statement from his friend.
He was late to his own wedding because he had to stop and buy hairspray (for himself)

He also said Ross wasn't the kind of guy into commitments, but when he met LeAnna he said I'm gonna marry that girl.
They were polar opposites.

"We joked he was the kind of person to be late to his own funeral," M said. "It didn't seem like he ever took anything seriously. But I always assumed he could be serious when he needed to be."
*http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ho...-dad-he-was-ferris-bueller-tuscaloosa-n153156

I had forgotten about this!
Harris never called 911, and when an officer told him to get off his phone, he refused and even said, "F*** you" before an officer took his phone and handcuffed him, the detective said.

"Ross Harris had recently been passed over for a promotion,"

*http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/03/justice/georgia-hot-car-toddler-death/

Make your own assumptions about his character. I see an immature man that was a folllower not a leader...
:cow: JMO


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Thanks for the info. I've been reading threads backwards, most recent to oldest.

But...a trial and his innocence or guilt doesn't rest upon his character (or lack thereof). His most consistent trait seems to be immaturity, and his wife seems to have had (or have chosen to) nudge him along. Helps me to better understand the basis for his complaint that she wouldn't let him go out and play when he wanted to, and why with his immaturity he might have felt wronged by that.

I'm listening, and reading, but so far am not convinced there isn't reasonable doubt.

(FWIW, one of my best and life-long friends was similarly immature for years and years into his marriage - he married young, at 22. He kept living the life he had before marrying, which was more about his job than wanting to socialize and drink beer or whatever (he built work boats for broke watermen and barely broke even because he usually ended up charging for costs only). His wife was the grownup.)

I wouldn't have wanted to be his wife, but he was even then a genuinely great guy, and he grew up all the way when they had their first child, and became a great father and husband as well.

I guess I believe very much in the capacity for change and growth, and with the exception of one friend who keeps getting referenced, their friends seem to think he adapted really well to being a father and loved his son.

 

[magnolia]

Okay Hope to get you up to speed- he spent his mornings laying around watching cartoons and texting and going into work late on a regular basis. He also didn't want to be a father if you look at photographs where Leanna placed Cooper on Ross's stomach and took pictures. He isn't smiling in any of them. He looks distressed.
He shares many narcisstic traits in common with Casey Anthony and Scott Peterson. Like Casey, he waited two years to kill his kid and be child-free. Don't take Leanna's public words that he was a good father- she divorced him. She does play the Cindy Anthony role in this case- defending him at the funeral "not my husband", and declaring she'd have more kids with him. She's too cowardly to admit she screwed up by marrying him.

BBM -- But, look at his big smile in this photo.

 

[gngr~snap]

Thanks for the info. I've been reading threads backwards, most recent to oldest.

But...a trial and his innocence or guilt doesn't rest upon his character (or lack thereof). His most consistent trait seems to be immaturity, and his wife seems to have had (or have chosen to) nudge him along. Helps me to better understand the basis for his complaint that she wouldn't let him go out and play when he wanted to, and why with his immaturity he might have wronged by that.

I'm listening, and reading, but so far am not convinced there isn't reasonable doubt.

I agree. Just because someone has flaws, (we all do) doesn't make them guilty of murder.
What struck me is how shocked his friends were, upon finding out the whole story, that that was not the "Ross" They knew.
They wondered was he always a wolf in sheep's clothing, pretending to be the nice guy everyone knew and loved and always had a dark side or was this a new side of Ross that had developed in recent years since they had lost touch with him.
I believe a lot of what they were referring to were the things about him that came to light after Cooper’s death. That if he was doing what police reported like sexting etc and had planned and carried out the murder of his own child, he had them all fooled.
I know a few that supported him early on quickly changed their opinions of him.

If you are reading backwards, a lot of things you read will surprise you.
IMO he was always a "player" never really committed to a relationship or his marriage.

It's hard for me to find a lot of the articles written in 2014. There are so many things I read, but I can't repeat without verifying my own memory and a valid link! [emoji39]


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[gngr~snap]

Here is one example of him leading a double life...
Evidence is showing us right now that he's got this whole second life he was living, with alternate personalities and alternate personas,'' Cobb County Detective Phil Stoddard testified during the hearing.
*http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/07/fundraising_campaign_for_justi.html


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[Hope4More]

Okay Hope to get you up to speed- he spent his mornings laying around watching cartoons and texting and going into work late on a regular basis. He also didn't want to be a father if you look at photographs where Leanna placed Cooper on Ross's stomach and took pictures. He isn't smiling in any of them. He looks distressed.
He shares many narcisstic traits in common with Casey Anthony and Scott Peterson. Like Casey, he waited two years to kill his kid and be child-free. Don't take Leanna's public words that he was a good father- she divorced him. She does play the Cindy Anthony role in this case- defending him at the funeral "not my husband", and declaring she'd have more kids with him. She's too cowardly to admit she screwed up by marrying him.

She just divorced him, right? And still maintains that he loved Cooper and wouldn't have harmed him?

If what you are saying about her is true, then she values her own pride and reputation more than she valued and loved her son. That's a really gigantic accusation to make, IMO. We "know" each other well enough that I assume you know I mean it when I say that "with all due respect,".....it is IMO an unfair one without a great deal more evidence that it's true.

 

[gngr~snap]

BBM -- But, look at his big smile in this photo.

Keeping up appearances or truly a loving father?
I wonder why the day care email didn't ring any bells? Maybe her never read it?!

"Asked whether Harris was a guy who talked about how life might be without a child, Hall said he was the opposite: the kind of dad who talked about his child to the point that people were tired of hearing about it."

"But Harris not only forgot his child, he got an e-mail from his son's day care during the day and at one point went to the vehicle to place lightbulbs inside, never once remembering Cooper, the prosecutor said."

*http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/03/justice/georgia-hot-car-toddler-death/

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[Hope4More]

Here is one example of him leading a double life...
Evidence is showing us right now that he's got this whole second life he was living, with alternate personalities and alternate personas,'' Cobb County Detective Phil Stoddard testified during the hearing.
*http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/07/fundraising_campaign_for_justi.html


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I read more support than not in this article. As far as multiple alternate personas...my real name is not Hope4More, nor is it the multiple alternate names I use to participate/ comment on other forums and on MSM online news sites, etc.

Using alternate names on SM doesn't necessarily mean one is leading a mysterious and awful double life (I'm just as cantankerous in "real life," for example ).

All it means is that Ross didn't use his real name on SM where he apparently went trolling to hook up.

 

[DaleTray]

I think I read where hot car child death happens like 38 times per year. Some parents have had their lives turned upside down since and probably a few suicides can be attributed. I feel sure even some child murders have walked or not even indicted and brought to trial. I wish we could find 6 married couples (or just loving couples) that have this terrible experience in their past sit as jurors and look into the eyes of all people testifying. They would maybe know better small signs to look for while listening to all the facts. Let's let these jurors determine if they think Ross loved his son from what people that witnessed Ross/Conner interactions. Well, we can't find these jurors so I guess the normal voir dire procedure will have to do and the normal process of hopefully 12 unbiased jurors listening to all the facts then debating after the trial. Emotions are charged on this website for this case and rightfully should be for a child's sake. But if you read A LOT of the comments they are biased for their own personal opinion rather than facts. I know, I know, that is what this website is about, sleuthing, discussing, debating and each of us can just overlook or skip that opinion if it seems to have no support of truth. But this case seems to really stretch the boundaries.

 

[Inthedetails]

Thanks for the info. I've been reading threads backwards, most recent to oldest.

But...a trial and his innocence or guilt doesn't rest upon his character (or lack thereof). His most consistent trait seems to be immaturity, and his wife seems to have had (or have chosen to) nudge him along. Helps me to better understand the basis for his complaint that she wouldn't let him go out and play when he wanted to, and why with his immaturity he might have felt wronged by that.

I'm listening, and reading, but so far am not convinced there isn't reasonable doubt.

(FWIW, one of my best and life-long friends was similarly immature for years and years into his marriage - he married young, at 22. He kept living the life he had before marrying, which was more about his job than wanting to socialize and drink beer or whatever (he built work boats for broke watermen and barely broke even because he usually ended up charging for costs only). His wife was the grownup.)

I wouldn't have wanted to be his wife, but he was even then a genuinely great guy, and he grew up all the way when they had their first child, and became a great father and husband as well.

I guess I believe very much in the capacity for change and growth, and with the exception of one friend who keeps getting referenced, their friends seem to think he adapted really well to being a father and loved his son.

I totally agree there is reasonable doubt. I myself have doubts about this case.

But I'm not on the jury and I do look at his character as I discuss the case here on WS to determine what I think made this guy tick and to determine what happened that day. I'm not here to try the case in court under the law, but to understand it. I'll analyze people in the cases I follow...and sometimes over-analyze them.

That character analysis is what interests me in following cases. Other people like the legal wrangling or search for justice. I don't follow cases into the courtroom, with the exception of this case with Cooper. I think the reason it holds my interest is because of the "doubt."

 

[Hope4More]

I totally agree there is reasonable doubt. I myself have doubts about this case.

But I'm not on the jury and I do look at his character as I discuss the case here on WS to determine what I think made this guy tick and to determine what happened that day. I'm not here to try the case in court under the law, but to understand it. I'll analyze people in the cases I follow...and sometimes over-analyze them.

That character analysis is what interests me in following cases. Other people like the legal wrangling or search for justice. I don't follow cases into the courtroom, with the exception of this case with Cooper. I think the reason it holds my interest is because of the "doubt."

I completely understand that, and share the compulsion to understand and analyze the psychological of any case.
I'm always equally interested, though, in the minutest details of the legal wrangling that goes on, especially in cases like this where public opinion is so lopsidedly against the defendant.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Eh?? He could be spouse free with a divorce.

Can't be free of child support and alimony with a divorce.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Thanks for the info. I've been reading threads backwards, most recent to oldest.

But...a trial and his innocence or guilt doesn't rest upon his character (or lack thereof). His most consistent trait seems to be immaturity, and his wife seems to have had (or have chosen to) nudge him along. Helps me to better understand the basis for his complaint that she wouldn't let him go out and play when he wanted to, and why with his immaturity he might have felt wronged by that.

I'm listening, and reading, but so far am not convinced there isn't reasonable doubt.

(FWIW, one of my best and life-long friends was similarly immature for years and years into his marriage - he married young, at 22. He kept living the life he had before marrying, which was more about his job than wanting to socialize and drink beer or whatever (he built work boats for broke watermen and barely broke even because he usually ended up charging for costs only). His wife was the grownup.)

I wouldn't have wanted to be his wife, but he was even then a genuinely great guy, and he grew up all the way when they had their first child, and became a great father and husband as well.

I guess I believe very much in the capacity for change and growth, and with the exception of one friend who keeps getting referenced, their friends seem to think he adapted really well to being a father and loved his son.

JRH was 31 when this happened.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

BBM -- But, look at his big smile in this photo.

...where he was out in public, putting on his Normal Guy disguise...

 

[MzOpinion8d]

She just divorced him, right? And still maintains that he loved Cooper and wouldn't have harmed him?

If what you are saying about her is true, then she values her own pride and reputation more than she valued and loved her son. That's a really gigantic accusation to make, IMO. We "know" each other well enough that I assume you know I mean it when I say that "with all due respect,".....it is IMO an unfair one without a great deal more evidence that it's true.

Read her victim impact statement at this link:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10837802

And remember that it is supposed to be about her loss of COOPER.

 

[Hope4More]

Read her victim impact statement at this link:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10837802

And remember that it is supposed to be about her loss of COOPER.

She's been absolved of any involvement in her son's death. Because you or I or anyone else can't identify with her response doesn't make her anything else but a mother who lost her baby and is entitled to grieve in her own way, on her own terms.

 

[Hope4More]

JRH was 31 when this happened.

Maybe you're much younger than I am. 31 to me is barely an adult, with what should be a lifetime ahead to grow up.