The Innocence Project and Darlie Routier

[cami]

What's always gotten me to lean toward innocence is the fact that her own wounds were fairly severe and her carotid artery was nearly cut if memory serves correctly.

She had minor injuries compared to her sons. The sheath covering the carotid artery and jugular vein was nicked. It was a serious but non life threatening injury

 

[Bjax]

Hi I am a new member and I thought I would respond on the subject of Darlie superficial neck injury

The injury was 9 cm(3.5 inches)in length and yes one end of the cut was close to the artery (but that artery is close to the surface of your neck) and the injury was only 1.27 cm(1/2 inch) deep. So the injury did not cut muscle or deeper tissue as to become life threatening

If someone stabs you they obviously want the knife and injury to be as deep as possible

But if the injury is self inflicted it’s the appearance of the injury that is required and of course she only wants a superficial injury as not to cause herself serious harm and pain

Also a fact of note the entire cleansing, evaluation and closing procedure of Darlie injury took 49 minutes and was considered an outpatient procedure. If it was not for the press and circumstances, Darlie would have been discharged later that same morning.

But compared to the boys injuries of repeated deep penetrating knife stabs, the injury Darlie inflicted on herself is comparatively minor.

Also I found out today from a book excerpt that according to a family friend after the boys funeral they all gathered at the elder moms house

Darin and Darlie announced they have “plans in place to go to Europe, get plastic surgery for Darlie and try to conceive another child preferably a girl while on the trip. This was not even a week after the murders, at a sombre gathering after the funeral, the purpose of which to mourn the loss of the two boys, not excitedly inform people of an already planned European vacation.

They did not have the cash to even pay bills before the murder but now flush with cash for an expensive European vacation after their children are slaughtered

Each child was worth 5 k to Darlie

According to neighbours at 9 am Darlie would scream at the boys to get their *es
outside and at 9 pm she would scream at them to get their *es inside

Darlie stuffed her child’s face in a piece of birthday cake and then verbally and emotionally abused him in front of everyone at his own birthday party because he got Darlie wet with a water squirt gun

Again no doubt that she slaughtered the boys

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I, for one, am very thankful to see TIP has taken Darlie's case. I know they do not ever do this lightly.

I have always believed she was found Guilty based on the silly string celebration for her little son. From what I remember this wasn't even Darlie's idea, but her sister's after they all had all come to pray together.

There is never such a thing as too much evidence that can perhaps be uncovered by TIP when someone is facing the death penalty.

TIP certainly have saved many others where everyone was just as 100 percent sure of their guilt for years too as those who believe DR is guilty.

Jmho

 

[sloane7777]

I, for one, am very thankful to see TIP has taken Darlie's case. I know they do not ever do this lightly.

I have always believed she was found Guilty based on the silly string celebration for her little son. From what I remember this wasn't even Darlie's idea, but her sister's after they all had all come to pray together.

There is never such a thing as too much evidence that can perhaps be uncovered by TIP when someone is facing the death penalty.

TIP certainly have saved many others where everyone was just as 100 percent sure of their guilt for years too as those who believe DR is guilty.

Jmho

Bravo - Great post !

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Bravo - Great post !

Thank you.

I am a firm believer in the death penalty where it is warranted. If DR is guilty she certainly warrants for it to be applied.

But, imoo there have been too many unanswered questions which can only be answered by the highly trained experts at TIP who are first, and foremost at uncovering the true answers we should all want.

We are aware that others have been put to death only to be found totally innocent after it's way too late to undo the grave harm done to them.

However I believe in justice, and fairness for the entire process. If there are further testing available... not usually done in trials or in appeals, Those with higher knowledge testing techniques must be allowed to test them. This is some of the reasons how new testing is found, and becomes highly valuable to our forensic communities throughout our justice system.

Imo, from following many TIP cases for many years now they thought it very worthy of taking each one, and it turned out TIP was right for taking those cases they painstakely select.

Imo, it shows TIP highly trained experts see major flaws in the evidence entered in Darlie's trial, and they feel they may find evidence of their own that merits taking her case that can greatly contradict them.

If not, they would have selected from the thousands of others cases they are begging to take they feel has more merit. They selected hers for valid reasons they see in it.

They are an amazing group of people. They don't fall for every guilty murder defendant who tells them they are innocent. They only select cases they feel once all of their evidence is tested by some of the best experts in the world can the real truth be known.

If it reaffirms guilt, then so be it, but if not then we as a nation should all be thankful for the many heroes at TIP. This is not their first rodeo by any means. I trust them explicitly to find out all the answers.

Jmho

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Thank you.

I am a firm believer in the death penalty where it is warranted. If DR is guilty she certainly warrants for it to be applied.

But, imoo there have been too many unanswered questions which can only be answered by the highly trained experts at TIP who are first, and foremost at uncovering the true answers we should all want.

We are aware that others have been put to death only to be found totally innocent after it's way too late to undo the grave harm done to them.

However I believe in justice, and fairness for the entire process. If there are further testing available... not usually done in trials or in appeals, Those with higher knowledge testing techniques must be allowed to test them. This is some of the reasons how new testing is found, and becomes highly valuable to our forensic communities throughout our justice system.

Imo, from following many TIP cases for many years now they thought it very worthy of taking each one, and it turned out TIP was right for taking those cases they painstakely select.

Imo, it shows TIP highly trained experts see major flaws in the evidence entered in Darlie's trial, and they feel they may find evidence of their own that merits taking her case that can greatly contradict them.

If not, they would have selected from the thousands of others cases they are begging to take they feel has more merit. They selected hers for valid reasons they see in it.

They are an amazing group of people. They don't fall for every guilty murder defendant who tells them they are innocent. They only select cases they feel once all of their evidence is tested by some of the best experts in the world can the real truth be known.

If it reaffirms guilt, then so be it, but if not then we as a nation should all be thankful for the many heroes at TIP. This is not their first rodeo by any means. I trust them explicitly to find out all the answers.

Jmho

Is TIP the Texas Innocence Project?

I haven't seen any reports that they have taken on this case. Only the New York Innocence Project has been mentioned.

The New York Innocence Project, now convinced that an innocent woman is languishing on Texas Death Row, has joined forces with Routier’s appellate team: Steve Cooper and Richard Smith of Dallas and Richard Burr of Houston.

I wonder why TIP hasn't jumped on board since this is a Texas case?

Old Case, New Developments

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Is TIP the Texas Innocence Project?

I haven't seen any reports that they have taken on this case. Only the New York Innocence Project has been mentioned.



I wonder why TIP hasn't jumped on board since this is a Texas case?

Old Case, New Developments

Sometimes it takes an outside IP to look at other cases objectively.

The one in New York is highly trained, and very qualified to take her case.

One of the best in the nation, imo. Countless highly trained experts are from NY, and live there.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Sometimes it takes an outside IP to look at other cases objectively.

The one in New York is highly trained, and very qualified to take her case. One of the best in the nation, imo. Countless highly trained experts are from NY.

True. I do think that The Texas Innocent Project can be objective. At least I don't have any reason why they wouldn't be. JMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Sorry, duplicate post.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

True. I do think that The Texas Innocent Project can be objective. At least I don't have any reason why they wouldn't be. JMO

Possibly.

But no better more accomplished forensic scientists who are some of the most highly trained experts in the world could have agreed to take on Darlie's case than in New York.

Iirc, the founder of the Innocent Project that have saved so many lives is Barry Scheck which is based in New York.

While IPs are found in most states now, I think even they know there are no better experts that can be found than in NY who have been doing cases like this for over two decades now. The field of experts first came from the New York area. Imo, they have only honed their skills through the decades. They take on cases from all around the country, and even international cases.

Whatever is the outcome I think her case is in very good hands now to find all of the answers to so many questions that have plagued this case.

Whatever the outcome is at the end of this thorough investigation, testings, and process by the NY team, good or bad for DR, I do believe these experts will come to the correct conclusion whatever it may be.

IMO, It's like going to several doctors for a very long time who are each supposed to be highly trained specialists in those particular fields, yet none of them ever find out what the real reason or cause is for why the patients had to constantly endure it ...sometimes for many agonizing years..

But then all it takes is finding the right doctor or team of doctors who has the knowledge needed, and capability to recognize what is actually wrong, and knows how to treat it.

JMHO

 

[neesaki]

Is TIP the Texas Innocence Project?

I haven't seen any reports that they have taken on this case. Only the New York Innocence Project has been mentioned.



I wonder why TIP hasn't jumped on board since this is a Texas case?

Old Case, New Developments

Interesting article, and the comments too.

But on the IP website if Darlie’s case is there I can’t find it. In fact I only found one active case. Do they not usually post the current cases they’re working on?

Innocence Project - Help us put an end to wrongful convictions!

 

[oceanblueeyes]

That 20/20 episode was short on the real facts and long on skewing the evidence, taking it out of context and out and out lies. It was disgraceful, profiting on the death of two children. Darin's window experiment for one thing. A completely open window, no screen, in an empty well lit garage. Yet the night of the murders photo shows the garage absolutely piled high with junk with a barely discernible path to the kitchen, plus dark. An intruder in the dark in an unfamiliar garage, hardly comparable to Darin's window experiment.

Skip Hollandsworth claiming when the police got there there were bloody footprints all over the kitchen but they didn't tell you they were
Darlie's footprints and no one else's.

Kathy Cruz claiming Darlie almost died. Not supported by the doctors who treated her at Baylor.

I noticed in the show, Darlie's neck wound looked thick and red, LOl but in the photos of her a few years after the murders, you can barely see the scar so they played that up.

No mention of any new evidence and no mention of the IP taking her case. The IP has not confirmed they are taking her case anyway, her mother is the source.

This reminds me of the David Westfield murder case. He had never been inside the Van Dam home before, nor knew beforehand where little Danielle Van Dam's bedroom was on the second story.

Yet he was able to enter the Van Dam home in the middle of the night when all lights were off kidnapping, and taking little Danielle out of her bedroom down the long flight of stairs taking her out through the first story level of their home to be raped, and murdered.

Forensic experts went all over their home from top to bottom, but found no evidence whatsoever DW had ever been there. Not even hair or fiber evidence from him was found. No fingerprints or shoe prints were found belonging to him. Yet he came in darkness, and was in many areas of their home never leaving any trace he had ever been there.

And when Joe Duncan entered the Groene home he couldn't have left a more bloody crime scene behind after bludgeoning three of the victims to death with a large hammer.

Police said it was a blood bath inside of their home yet JED left no fingerprints, bloody shoe prints, hair or even fibers behind even showing he was the one who had murdered all 3 before kidnapping their two young children.

So that part of your post doesn't really mean all that much, imo, since others have entered homes they had never been in doing horrific murders, and walked out without leaving any evidence of themselves of them ever being there at all.

Often this is the reason why so many cases remain unsolved because the murderer left no evidence of themselves at the scene that would tie them to the murders.

Jmho

 

[Bjax]

But there was evidence of whomever killed the boys, there is just no other evidence of any other person other then Darlie

All the available evidence points to her and there is nothing that points to any one else

If I recall correctly in 2014 a group of independent investigators from around the USA meet to throughly review the evidence in the case, everything in detail. They went to extraordinary lengths to ensure they carefully and in great detail reviewed everything up to and including a mocked up crime scenes of the house

The unanimous decision: Darlie is guilty and they feel Darin had some post crime involvement

They invited a juror named Charlie Samford (who Darlie supporters trot out by saying “if he saw the picture(s) of the bruises he would not have voted to convict Darlie” as Mr Sanford has said many times publicly)

After the investigators carefully and in methodological detail reviewed the evidence with Mr Samford and explained what every single piece of evidence meant, he recanted his statement of feelings that Darlie is innocent

There is no evidence of any intruder, the evidence contradicts her story. That is often the case in crimes when criminals fully anticipate and expect their self serving story to be believed and attempt to explain away conflicting evidence.

Darlie did not mention another family member in the house, which was her baby at the time of the murders

When LE was searching the house upstairs the officer “ happen to come across the baby in his crib” and was shocked to discover him. After all the search was for someone who killed two kids and Darlie never mentioned the baby alone upstairs

If an actual intruder was in the house that killed two kids and attacked her, would it not be the VERY FIRST thing a mother would tell LE upon arrival.

But she kept quiet about the baby, all the while alleging an intruder broke in and killed her kids. She had no sense of fear for her baby safety or urgency of his well-being alone upstairs unsupervised. The officer by the way had to leave the baby in the safety of his crib just in case LE came across the intruder during his search of the house

LE either verifies the story through evidence or disproves the story through evidence

Again it’s the totality of evidence compared to a self serving story to try to deflect blame for these horrific murders

So in essence maybe the Innocence Project taking this will be a good thing because it will conclusively prove Darlie story does not match the evidence, DNA, blood pattern analysis of her clothing and the crime scene

There is just so much evidence that conclusively points to her guilt. But I kind of have mixed feeling about the Death Penalty, I just do

 

[Berrybell]

But there was evidence of whomever killed the boys, there is just no other evidence of any other person other then Darlie

All the available evidence points to her and there is nothing that points to any one else

If I recall correctly in 2014 a group of independent investigators from around the USA meet to throughly review the evidence in the case, everything in detail. They went to extraordinary lengths to ensure they carefully and in great detail reviewed everything up to and including a mocked up crime scenes of the house

The unanimous decision: Darlie is guilty and they feel Darin had some post crime involvement

They invited a juror named Charlie Samford (who Darlie supporters trot out by saying “if he saw the picture(s) of the bruises he would not have voted to convict Darlie” as Mr Sanford has said many times publicly)

After the investigators carefully and in methodological detail reviewed the evidence with Mr Samford and explained what every single piece of evidence meant, he recanted his statement of feelings that Darlie is innocent

There is no evidence of any intruder, the evidence contradicts her story. That is often the case in crimes when criminals fully anticipate and expect their self serving story to be believed and attempt to explain away conflicting evidence.

Darlie did not mention another family member in the house, which was her baby at the time of the murders

When LE was searching the house upstairs the officer “ happen to come across the baby in his crib” and was shocked to discover him. After all the search was for someone who killed two kids and Darlie never mentioned the baby alone upstairs

If an actual intruder was in the house that killed two kids and attacked her, would it not be the VERY FIRST thing a mother would tell LE upon arrival.

But she kept quiet about the baby, all the while alleging an intruder broke in and killed her kids. She had no sense of fear for her baby safety or urgency of his well-being alone upstairs unsupervised. The officer by the way had to leave the baby in the safety of his crib just in case LE came across the intruder during his search of the house

LE either verifies the story through evidence or disproves the story through evidence

Again it’s the totality of evidence compared to a self serving story to try to deflect blame for these horrific murders

So in essence maybe the Innocence Project taking this will be a good thing because it will conclusively prove Darlie story does not match the evidence, DNA, blood pattern analysis of her clothing and the crime scene

There is just so much evidence that conclusively points to her guilt. But I kind of have mixed feeling about the Death Penalty, I just do

BJax I do not support the death penalty for various reasons, because it is not handed down in a fair and impartial manner. The main reason is I cannot think of a more just punishment than living the remainder of your natural life caged. I know people say inmates become institutionalized and it becomes normal for them, I don't think it truly becomes the new normal just more of routine, every single day they are told when and what to eat, when to sleep or not sleep. They have lost the right to govern their own bodies I cannot imagine that becoming a feeling of normal. As we look at Darlie she went into the system young and beautiful now she has grown into a overweight, middle age, dowdy woman.

 

[ColyH]

I saw the video of the birthday celebration at the gravesite and thought people kept themselves in check. The only thing that I saw suspicious was Darlie sticking out her tongue towards the side of her mouth when she sprayed that silly string. She came across as being goofy when she was the last person who should have been acting that way however people act differently in certain situations.

 

[Bjax]

I guess the thing that was bother some to me to say the least, about that video, is it appears to me that Darlie is happy and excited when she was at the gravesite. Is she celebrating Devons birthday as stated or in her warped mind his death at his gravesite. Only Darlie knows....but boy is she happy

It is as if she was relaxed, stress free and in a mood to celebrate, 8 days after Devon was stabbed to death, while he slept in his own home. He was gone from her life and all of her parental responsibilities towards him and his brother instantly vanished upon the murders

She chuckled, laughters, chewed gum and gave an interview on tv.

There was a solemn service and that should have been all there was, out of respect for the dead boys

The kids were a means to an end for Darlie

She benefited financially from the boys deaths. Insurance money. No one else benefited financially except Darlie

Like a man who said he did not kill his wife, jumping for joy after her funeral in the parking lot. A few minutes before a very upset grieving husband at a funeral acting appropriately. When he thinks no one is watching literally jumping for joy walking to his car. He was convicted of his wife murder

Darlie just broadcast this conduct at the gravesite, out in the open for everyone to see, because as far as she thought she had gotten away with murders, she was not a suspect, her story was believed and she was going to be happy and relaxed on her planned romantic European vacation (paid for I suspect from insurance money as they were in prior financial dire straits) and enjoy trying to conceive a new baby during the trip hopefully a girl.

Without even giving a second thought to whom killed her kids and if the person had been caught to prevent harm to others and bring that person to justice for a double homicide of her kids

Contrary to myth the pictures of Darlie bruises were shown to the jury. Because of medical science and observation it was proved that these bruises were fabricated after the murders with testimony of medical staff. Self inflicted as a self injury to manipulate the investigation and try to deflect any suspicion from her. Like her neck injury....

 

[MsMarple]

Interesting article, and the comments too.

But on the IP website if Darlie’s case is there I can’t find it. In fact I only found one active case. Do they not usually post the current cases they’re working on?

Innocence Project - Help us put an end to wrongful convictions!

Same here. The best I understand it, two people from the IP have agreed to consult with Darlie's appellate team (Steve Cooper, Richard Smith and Richard Burr). That may or may not mean that the IP is *officially* on Darlie's case.

At least one article has claimed there is a signed partnership with the IP but I found no substantiating evidence of that on any of the IP web sites.

I'll say again, if any evidence surfaces that indicates an intruder, be it DNA, fingerprints or crimes with the same MOs over the years then I'm in favor of reviewing Darlie's case. But so far none of that has happened.

Furthermore, since the murders of the two boys we've seen many cases here where mothers, fathers and other caretakers have murdered innocent children. IMO Darlie's case doesn't stand out as an anomaly when compared to those cases.

As pointed out above, why wasn't Darlie terrified that the killer had harmed Drake? IMO it's because she was too busy constructing an alibi for herself. Oh, no, she picked up the knife! So she made a point of telling the 911 operator that maybe they could have gotten fingerprints off of it but it never occurred to her that Drake (or Darin) might have also been stabbed? GMAB. MOO.

 

[Bjax]

Unfortunately the reality of life is that parent harm their kids

So I absolutely agree that Darlie is not an anomaly, but she will never change her story. She probably believes after all this time that an intruder did break in and slaughter her kids

Considering the totality of the evidence and the most likely through review of all the evidence in this case, I suspect the Innocence Project will come to the same conclusion that Darlie is not innocent

Again, I fail to see any verifiable info that the investigators have actually taken her case due to a miscarriage of justice and wrongful conviction

 

[SAMS]

I believe her to be guilty as hell. Her husband is whacked as well.

Wow my exact thoughts. MOO

 

[Berrybell]

I guess the thing that was bother some to me to say the least, about that video, is it appears to me that Darlie is happy and excited when she was at the gravesite. Is she celebrating Devons birthday as stated or in her warped mind his death at his gravesite. Only Darlie knows....but boy is she happy

It is as if she was relaxed, stress free and in a mood to celebrate, 8 days after Devon was stabbed to death, while he slept in his own home. He was gone from her life and all of her parental responsibilities towards him and his brother instantly vanished upon the murders

She chuckled, laughters, chewed gum and gave an interview on tv.

There was a solemn service and that should have been all there was, out of respect for the dead boys

The kids were a means to an end for Darlie

She benefited financially from the boys deaths. Insurance money. No one else benefited financially except Darlie

Like a man who said he did not kill his wife, jumping for joy after her funeral in the parking lot. A few minutes before a very upset grieving husband at a funeral acting appropriately. When he thinks no one is watching literally jumping for joy walking to his car. He was convicted of his wife murder

Darlie just broadcast this conduct at the gravesite, out in the open for everyone to see, because as far as she thought she had gotten away with murders, she was not a suspect, her story was believed and she was going to be happy and relaxed on her planned romantic European vacation (paid for I suspect from insurance money as they were in prior financial dire straits) and enjoy trying to conceive a new baby during the trip hopefully a girl.

Without even giving a second thought to whom killed her kids and if the person had been caught to prevent harm to others and bring that person to justice for a double homicide of her kids

Contrary to myth the pictures of Darlie bruises were shown to the jury. Because of medical science and observation it was proved that these bruises were fabricated after the murders with testimony of medical staff. Self inflicted as a self injury to manipulate the investigation and try to deflect any suspicion from her. Like her neck injury....

What has always bothered me is that Darlie & Darin invited the news reporters. Who does that? When you have lost a child you want to grieve not be the center of attention.