The Puppy That Caylee Talked About

[shadow of my mind]

My 1/2 sister has BPD and is at the point where she does splitting; if you agree with her you are her friend and confidant and if you say anything that she does not like you are her sworn enemy. I saw my niece and nephew on a regular basis, was at her home, she was at mine, my other 1/2 sisters and other various family members. There was always some type of drama with her, big long stories of whey she didn't have money to pay this and why she threw my niece's father out again. It was not until they children were 11 and 14 that the oldest one got up the courage to tell me just one thing that mom was doing when no one else was around to notice. It was more of a comment than anything else and I questioned him over a period of a couple of days. One question here, one there so he would not feel if I was prying.
To make a really long story short those kids were afraid to say anything. I can remember when my niece used to stay overnight at our house she takled a blue streak at age 3 but she never said much about about her mother or what they did at home or where they went. Just she talked about things and people that where right in the current day; our house, yard, cats etc. Children know when things are different between households and when you are raised and told to be quit about what goes inside your home that is what you do. When I asked my nephew why didn't you tell us sooner he just shook his head and said he thought that was the way it was everywhere.

 

[Firefly]

I've said this before but I really feel that as Caylee got older she was able to relay more of what KC was doing during the day. I believe that this cause heated arguements between KC and CA.
During CA's "time for loving and funtime, etc." I am sure that Caylee told things that KC would have preferred CA not to know. I know my children at that age were quite capable. Because of KC lack of maturity I think she thought of Caylee as a snitch.

This is an important insight into the dynamics between child/mother/grandmother. Caylee was innocent in all that she said to G'ma but I bet you her reports caused great turmoil in that house. I believe Casey needed to silence her and also get back at her mother. Too bad G'ma didn't move to take her away sooner and now she is paying also for her daughter's misdeed.

 

[BetsyB]

I've also questioned this very thing in multiple posts. I truly do not get it.
The only thing I can come up with, is that CA and GA did know there was no nanny/Zanni (remember GA telling LE he was pretty sure Casey hadn't had a job in 2 years). But once again they decide it's better not to question all the obvious clues that Caylee wasn't at nanny's house every day, in order to maintain the peace in the house, and continue the patterns of denial they had regarding Casey.

I have to go along with this. There is a conspiracy of silence--when you live in a situation in which the truth is pretty terrifying (bringing up a wellspring of further questions that require exploration, etc.), and you're already stretched about as far as you can go, emotionally, then it's sheer self-preservation not to question. Rocking the boat is scary when your emotional resources are scarce. It's just extremely difficult to put yourself out on a limb if you might fall.

 

[GreenEyes727]

I have been going back over all the pictures and videos of the Anthony's house. I have also been on google maps, microsoft live maps to "drive" down the roads. If I have it right, if you go up (N) the Anthony's street 7-8 houses, cut through that house's back yard, there is a lake type area there.

Put this in the map and take a look:
4937 Hopespring Dr
Orlando, FL 32829

There is a parallel road to Hopespring called Florence Harbor Dr. There is also a road at the end of Hopespring called Suburban Dr. which cuts through the woods to Econlockhatchee Trail.

Being that I believe KC is lazy and would not go far from home if she is not in the backyard, I believe she would be in that wooded area between Florence Harbor and Econlockhatchee Trail.

Someone said something about a firehouse they kept seeing. That firehouse is #14 and the address for it is 5450 S Econlockhatchee Trail which is almost behind the Anthony's house (through the woods)

Gail St. John was right there but couldn't get back there at the time - not sure if she was ever able to get back there or not. In one of Alyzabeth's inkblots, the #14 came up. If Caylee is "close", that could be where she is. This case drives me nut.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2773551&highlight=inkblot#post2773551

 

[tiredofthis]

I've said this before but I really feel that as Caylee got older she was able to relay more of what KC was doing during the day. I believe that this cause heated arguements between KC and CA.
During CA's "time for loving and funtime, etc." I am sure that Caylee told things that KC would have preferred CA not to know. I know my children at that age were quite capable. Because of KC lack of maturity I think she thought of Caylee as a snitch.

I agree with you. Children at that age will talk about anything and everything. I'm sure Caylee had quite a few stories to tell her grandmother about KC's activities during the day.

 

[robotdog]

I have been going back over all the pictures and videos of the Anthony's house. I have also been on google maps, microsoft live maps to "drive" down the roads. If I have it right, if you go up (N) the Anthony's street 7-8 houses, cut through that house's back yard, there is a lake type area there.

Put this in the map and take a look:
4937 Hopespring Dr
Orlando, FL 32829

There is a parallel road to Hopespring called Florence Harbor Dr. There is also a road at the end of Hopespring called Suburban Dr. which cuts through the woods to Econlockhatchee Trail.

Being that I believe KC is lazy and would not go far from home if she is not in the backyard, I believe she would be in that wooded area between Florence Harbor and Econlockhatchee Trail.

Someone said something about a firehouse they kept seeing. That firehouse is #14 and the address for it is 5450 S Econlockhatchee Trail which is almost behind the Anthony's house (through the woods)

i like this :crazy:

 

[dkitty]

I think GA may be getting ready to do just that in the Grand Jury hearing on Tuesday.

I think he will too!!

 

[magiemay]

I do not buy for one minute that Cindy never ask any questions my mom baby sat my daughter from birth until she was 12 yrs as a happen so my daughter called my mom Nanny she could not say Grammy at an early age and it came out Nanny and just stuck anyway I knew all about what went on at Nanny's and did not have to ask Nanny could make a sandwitch better than me !!!LOL She cooked certain foods better than me, And this child would tell me they say things without thinking at this age I think one of the ones that sticks out most is when she was 3 yrs old she always had a backpack with her at Nanny's on a Saturday when we were cleaning she randomly decided to go thru the backpack pulled out a cookie and said out loud there is that cookie I didn't get to eat cause I was in time out I said what you were in time out she put the cookie away and would not talk about it she did not want me to know she had been in time out. Point being they talk at this age they even slip and tell you things they did not intend to. Secondly I did not live at home was in my own home but if my daughter would have missed being at Nanny's house for even 1 week my mom would have been calling the whole country to see who had my daughter, The police would not have had to locate Zanny my mom would have long since did it for them. Cindy's mom says she stayed at home 1 week of vacation waiting for KC to bring Caylee she also went to Universal once to supposedly pick her up and KC was a no show. Makes no sense at all why did she not try to find Zanny then?? She might not have had her phone # but knowing my mom she would have gone thru my room and my things with a fine tooth comb there would have been a number or a name somewhere that she would have used to begin her search you can put money on that. I just believe with all my heart there was more going on than Cindy would like for us to know.

 

[LCoastMom]

My 1/2 sister has BPD and is at the point where she does splitting; if you agree with her you are her friend and confidant and if you say anything that she does not like you are her sworn enemy. I saw my niece and nephew on a regular basis, was at her home, she was at mine, my other 1/2 sisters and other various family members. There was always some type of drama with her, big long stories of whey she didn't have money to pay this and why she threw my niece's father out again. It was not until they children were 11 and 14 that the oldest one got up the courage to tell me just one thing that mom was doing when no one else was around to notice. It was more of a comment than anything else and I questioned him over a period of a couple of days. One question here, one there so he would not feel if I was prying.
To make a really long story short those kids were afraid to say anything. I can remember when my niece used to stay overnight at our house she takled a blue streak at age 3 but she never said much about about her mother or what they did at home or where they went. Just she talked about things and people that where right in the current day; our house, yard, cats etc. Children know when things are different between households and when you are raised and told to be quit about what goes inside your home that is what you do. When I asked my nephew why didn't you tell us sooner he just shook his head and said he thought that was the way it was everywhere.

You're post made my blood run cold, that's exactly what I'm talking about. The baby that I 'watched' wasn't really talking when she first came over, but over those 11 mos she became a different child and she talked a blue streak but never about mom, never. At 2 years old, she knew.

One night when I brought her home, I had to run back to my house to get something for her sister. When I got back (2,3 minutes) she was crying, clung to me but wouldn't tell me why. Mom said she had an 'accident', which yeah that happened sometimes, but I'd never seen her cry about it before.

I watched this baby 6 days a week, 12 or more hours (including overnite), our families spent time and holidays together for 2 years. One nite mom picked her up and said she wouldn't be bringing her back. And that was that.

I have never stopped worrying about her.

 

[LCoastMom]

I have been going back over all the pictures and videos of the Anthony's house. I have also been on google maps, microsoft live maps to "drive" down the roads. If I have it right, if you go up (N) the Anthony's street 7-8 houses, cut through that house's back yard, there is a lake type area there.

Put this in the map and take a look:
4937 Hopespring Dr
Orlando, FL 32829

There is a parallel road to Hopespring called Florence Harbor Dr. There is also a road at the end of Hopespring called Suburban Dr. which cuts through the woods to Econlockhatchee Trail.

Being that I believe KC is lazy and would not go far from home if she is not in the backyard, I believe she would be in that wooded area between Florence Harbor and Econlockhatchee Trail.

Someone said something about a firehouse they kept seeing. That firehouse is #14 and the address for it is 5450 S Econlockhatchee Trail which is almost behind the Anthony's house (through the woods)

I understand your line of thinking, it makes great sense, but wouldn't the cadaver dogs followed this trail after alerting?

Is this one of the areas the dive team did their 'training'?

 

[LCoastMom]

I do not buy for one minute that Cindy never ask any questions my mom baby sat my daughter from birth until she was 12 yrs as a happen so my daughter called my mom Nanny she could not say Grammy at an early age and it came out Nanny and just stuck anyway I knew all about what went on at Nanny's and did not have to ask Nanny could make a sandwitch better than me !!!LOL She cooked certain foods better than me, And this child would tell me they say things without thinking at this age I think one of the ones that sticks out most is when she was 3 yrs old she always had a backpack with her at Nanny's on a Saturday when we were cleaning she randomly decided to go thru the backpack pulled out a cookie and said out loud there is that cookie I didn't get to eat cause I was in time out I said what you were in time out she put the cookie away and would not talk about it she did not want me to know she had been in time out. Point being they talk at this age they even slip and tell you things they did not intend to. Secondly I did not live at home was in my own home but if my daughter would have missed being at Nanny's house for even 1 week my mom would have been calling the whole country to see who had my daughter, The police would not have had to locate Zanny my mom would have long since did it for them. Cindy's mom says she stayed at home 1 week of vacation waiting for KC to bring Caylee she also went to Universal once to supposedly pick her up and KC was a no show. Makes no sense at all why did she not try to find Zanny then?? She might not have had her phone # but knowing my mom she would have gone thru my room and my things with a fine tooth comb there would have been a number or a name somewhere that she would have used to begin her search you can put money on that. I just believe with all my heart there was more going on than Cindy would like for us to know.

You're still thinking like a rational person with a healthy relationship with your mom.

Step into KC's head for a minute (I know, it's a dark and scary place but you'll be OK).

Your daughter is 3 yrs old, you tell your mom you're taking her to a new babysitter. If she wants contact info you can tell her the phones is down or she doesn't have one, whatever, she can't force the info from you and since Zani isn't real she can search your room all day and not find a thing.

Everyone who knew KC said she'd never hurt Caylee, most thought she was a great mom. CA had no legal rights to Caylee. There was nothing that CA could have done.

Telling CA that Caylee was going to be someplace and CA going there to see her, then the whole Caylee being home by her BDay show KC's true colors. There is a cruelty to that that I have never seen before.

 

[Marple]

To make a really long story short those kids were afraid to say anything. I can remember when my niece used to stay overnight at our house she takled a blue streak at age 3 but she never said much about about her mother or what they did at home or where they went. Just she talked about things and people that where right in the current day; our house, yard, cats etc. Children know when things are different between households and when you are raised and told to be quit about what goes inside your home that is what you do. When I asked my nephew why didn't you tell us sooner he just shook his head and said he thought that was the way it was everywhere.

This is so true! When are are IN it, it seems normal. It's not until you get older and start seeing other families that you realize things in your family are not right.

This is often the case with abused women and children. They think it's this way for everyone and it's just something you have to live with.

 

[passionflower]

IMO, a 3 year old girl is usually a 'chatty Cathy'...............my daughter and grand daughter ( and boys) were and are! I come in the room and before my coat is off, they start 'telling everything' they hear or know............1 grandson used to go to a bathroom, close the door, dial me on speed dial and say "your son is being bad.......put him in time out!".........family joke now.
At 3, children are smart, innocent and can tell all! IMO, Caylee knew too much and told grandma and grandpa and KC got very mad! IMO, she shut 'snot head' up..............

 

[FightTheOstrich]

CA knew there was no nanny. A woman that made sure to have a will made, naming her as guardian would have made sure that she could get in touch w/ the nanny and that the nanny could get in touch w/ her. CA being a nurse (and mother) knows the importance of emergency contact information. There was/is no nanny, and CA has always known.

 

[Janis396]

CA knew there was no nanny. A woman that made sure to have a will made, naming her as guardian would have made sure that she could get in touch w/ the nanny and that the nanny could get in touch w/ her. CA being a nurse (and mother) knows the importance of emergency contact information. There was/is no nanny, and CA has always known.

Yep. She just chose to bury her head rather than confront Casey and find out the truth of what was really going on. She was a coward and an enabler, and I think that contributed greatly to what happened to Caylee.

 

[TURBOTHINK]

I understand your line of thinking, it makes great sense, but wouldn't the cadaver dogs followed this trail after alerting?

Is this one of the areas the dive team did their 'training'?

I don't think there would have been a "trail" because I believe they were alerting on where she had been earlier. Those dogs are different than search dogs in they don't "trail" - they just alert. A S/R like mine could possibly have followed, but if she put her back in the car to take her there it is hard to say and not very likely after that length of time.

I don't know where that dive team was, but I do remember it being said it was behind the Anthony's house. There are houses surrounding that now from the looks of the pictures I have seen, so my best guess is she went down Suburban road and into the woods between Florence and the firehouse.

 

[BB12]

This is my take on the lack of info...BS When my son was small I had a dear friend that would watch him if I went out of town. I use to do living History Events..anyway I had a piece of paper drawn up & notarized for her & my mom that they could take him to the Dr Or Emergency Room for treatment if anything happened. With Cindy being a nurse it seems that she would of had something like like that drawn up also. Living in the State of Fla..we have Hurricanes & Tornadoes what if something happened & Cindy had to pick up the baby from the sitter...again it makes no sense to me that they would not have an emergency plan..which would include who ..what..when..& where Caylee was with.

Something is not right with that ...There are too many holes in the story. Cindy being the control Freak that she is would have to know everything there is to know...JMO

EXACTLY AND THE POLICE ASKED CASEY THAT VERY QUESTION AND HER RESPONSE WAS THAT THE MEDICAL FORM HAD JUST CA GA AND KC ON IT.......

I AM DIVORCED AND I HAVE A STANDARD FORM I DOWNLOAD AND SIGN EVERY TIME MY SON GOES TO MY IN LAWS. I HAVE IT NOTORIZED WHEN HE WOULD TRAVEL OUT OF STATE....THIS IS WHAT RESPONSIBLE PARENTS DO.....

AS FOR THE NANNY- THERE WAS A STANDARD ONE AT THE LOCAL DOCTORS OFFICE AND EVEN WHEN I WAS MARRIED MY MOM WOULD SOMETIMES HAVE TO COME HELP US OUT AND PICK OUR SON UP FROM DAY CARE ETC....COME ON EVEN ON A FRIDAY - I WENT OUT TO BAR AND HAD MY SISTER PICK MY SON UP. WHEN YOU HAVE DAY CARE IT IS NOT UNUSUAL FOR PEOPLE TO HELP YOU OUT AND PICK UP/DROP OFF....:behindbar

 

[Willlow65]

Your thoughts?

For a child not to mention (even if she was 2-3 years old) a nanny she had for 2 years to her live in grandmother is beyond strange. What's stranger is the grandmother not knowing or meeting with her once. If my child was a known psycho, I would have investigated on my own and would not trust my daughter. CA knew her daughter was not all there. How KC was able to trick her family for 2 years as to her job, nanny etc is beyond me. It makes no sense at all.
Another thing that bugs me is how could a mother (CA) bad mouth her daughter to others. I have no respect for a mother talking bad about their child to anyone even if that child deserves it.

 

[sharpar]

This puppy bugged me too and then I remembered Kc said it -

I havent found one credible person saying anything about Kaylee talking
about zani's puppy =

I think this was just one more detail she threw out that has no basis in
reality

I have put my faith in the technology - the pings the foresnics
are gonna get KC behind bars - nothing she says is worth a hoot .

 

[LCoastMom]

I don't think there would have been a "trail" because I believe they were alerting on where she had been earlier. Those dogs are different than search dogs in they don't "trail" - they just alert. A S/R like mine could possibly have followed, but if she put her back in the car to take her there it is hard to say and not very likely after that length of time.

I don't know where that dive team was, but I do remember it being said it was behind the Anthony's house. There are houses surrounding that now from the looks of the pictures I have seen, so my best guess is she went down Suburban road and into the woods between Florence and the firehouse.

Thank you for explaining this, I didn't know cadaver dogs don't trail. I wonder if they ever had S/R dogs at the house? I understand it would have been a long shot after 30 odd rainy days, but those dogs are amazing and you just never know...

I just remembered CA wouldn't give Tim anything for his dogs to work with so I guess that answers that.:crazy: