The SODDI Defense (Some Other Dude Did It)...If not KC, who?

[Balthazar]

I took the title of this thread to mean that if someone did not agree with a SODDI defense they were free to voice the fact they thought if not KC, then they feel the evidence doesn't really point to anyone.

LKB may have insinuated that a SODDI defense could be possible if she meant to link it to Sam Sheppard, but from what I've read about AL so far, that's not an avenue she likes to go down on DP cases, so this whole concept may be moot eventually. Until then, I think it's interesting to weight the various merits of different SODDI scenarios even vs. no SODDI scenario.

I take the title of the thread to mean, what might the SODDI Defense be? Who is the SOD if Casey didn't do this?

So my thought is that we should be proposing different SODDI Defenses and trying to punch holes in them. To me, this thread is not about if someone thinks Casey is guilty or innocent - that doesn't matter nor does it even fit with the subject of the thread. What each of us believes has absolutely NOTHING to do with the Defense case whatsoever because none of us are on the defense team. I think where we keep getting off track here is when people start making this personal. It's just not a personal subject. It's a very impersonal one - we are theorizing what the Defense SODDI case may be and trying to come up with one that might work.

LKB said straight out in a TV interview that Casey's case is just like the Sam Sheppard case. Then we have the whole defense team saying Casey is innocent and should never have been arrested to begin with and that there "is NO evidence against Casey." Based on what the Defense team is claiming, I think the odds are good that they are going the SODDI route or at least have been going that way up until Lyon joined the team.

 

[MissJames]

Yes, my dog was more than willing to air scent too. i had to work to teach him to track. As a matter of fact, being a Mal I had to work to teach him to use his nose at all, as he would prefer to use his eyes, ears, and brain to solve problems. He also was a very fast worker. His son was so fast I could not use him at all. The son insistad on running everywhere! He couldn't be trused around cliffs.

Congratulations on your having the insite to train your own search dog, and please forgive any preceved slight on my part, as it was not intended.

We didn't train him ourselves...I'd be in trouble if we relied on that.We got him from an agency that trains dogs for people with disabilities.Then they train us to use the dog appropriately. If you have a child like mine who wanders,doesn't answer you and knows no danger,you need a tracking dog! He does a lot more than track,though.
I'm even more amazed with cadaver dogs.If I had the time I'd get more involved with that.

 

[USARDOG]

Someone made the remark, and I paraphrase, perhaps it was dead pig in kc's trunk that the dogs were hitting on.

Pig was at one time used to train dogs in cadaver scent. That was back when humans did not understand how discriminating a dog's nose is. What happened was, the dogs went out and searched for dead pigs! In the present, only human scent is used to train cadaver dogs. That said, one can now see why it could not have been dead pig in kc's trunk the dogs were hitting on. Perhaps one might fool a human with a dead, uncooked pig, but your not going to fool a dog, which is why the dogs were brought in.

However, as I write this, it does put the book "Alive" in a different light for me!

 

[MissJames]

I take the title of the thread to mean, what might the SODDI Defense be? Who is the SOD if Casey didn't do this?

So my thought is that we should be proposing different SODDI Defenses and trying to punch holes in them. To me, this thread is not about if someone thinks Casey is guilty or innocent - that doesn't matter nor does it even fit with the subject of the thread. What each of us believes has absolutely NOTHING to do with the Defense case whatsoever because none of us are on the defense team. I think where we keep getting off track here is when people start making this personal. It's just not a personal subject. It's a very impersonal one - we are theorizing what the Defense SODDI case may be and trying to come up with one that might work.

LKB said straight out in a TV interview that Casey's case is just like the Sam Sheppard case. Then we have the whole defense team saying Casey is innocent and should never have been arrested to begin with and that there "is NO evidence against Casey." Based on what the Defense team is claiming, I think the odds are good that they are going the SODDI route or at least have been going that way up until Lyon joined the team.

We've been through this before Princess,so please bear with me.If you read the original post that PattieMarie wrote when she started this thread it was not about what the defense might use.It asked if not KC who? She appeared to be amazed that some people weren't yet convinced KC was guilty and was asking who else do you [anyone not yet convinced] think did it if KC didn't do it.It didn't have anything to do with what the defense might go with.
Somewhere along the way it evolved into the defense theory,but that does not seem to be the original intent of this thread.
Please forgive me PattieMarie if I've put words in your mouth.:blowkiss:

 

[MAMABEAR]

One would also wonder whether KC would remain incarcerated to protect CA.

I don't think KC would take prison and watch her mother prance around on TV. If there was some way KC could put CA in prison, she would jump on that like stink on d00-d00.

She would never have to worry about answering to CA again---she could snub her nose at CA---have a fresh plate to pile new set of lies on---she would lay out any fantasy that pops into her head, like CA is doing with her new "foundation". Nope---she would not remain incarcerated to protect CA. Even SP said KC hated CA more than she loved Baby Caylee.

 

[MissJames]

I have been reading through some posts and catching up and am still amazed to read posters stating that they are not sure Casey murdered her daughter.

If Casey didn't do it? Who did? What evidence points to a different murderer other than Casey?

This is the first post from the person who started the thread.Just to back up my point ,princess,that this was not started to discuss the defense case and how to punch holes in it.
I'm confused why you keep insisting it's to punch holes in the defense case.Why can't others post as they understand the thread to mean?

 

[whiteangora]

This is the first post from the person who started the thread.Just to back up my point ,princess,that this was not started to discuss the defense case and how to punch holes in it.
I'm confused why you keep insisting it's to punch holes in the defense case.Why can't others post as they understand the thread to mean?

Well there ya go! That'll teach me not to read the first post of a thread. Thank you so much MissJames for trying to bring this thread back to the topic in which it was intended.:blowkiss:
Maybe it's just me, but I always feel uncomfortable if I think there might be info being put out there that could "help the defense".
Especially with this case.

 

[Balthazar]

By leaving her story as it is and not correcting what she originally told LE ,KC is ,in essence,continuing to lie to police.

Actually, I'm talking about the legal definition of what is taking place. Under the Fifth Amendment Casey has the right to follow the advice of her attorney and not say anything further to LE. This cannot be held against her as she is simply invoking her right. So she is not continuing to lie in essence. Not at all. Although often portrayed as a sign of guilt in movies and on TV, pleading the Fifth is not a sign of guilt under US law and is not taken as such in the courtroom.

 

[Balthazar]

Well there ya go! That'll teach me not to read the first post of a thread. Thank you so much MissJames for trying to bring this thread back to the topic in which it was intended.:blowkiss:
Maybe it's just me, but I always feel uncomfortable if I think there might be info being put out there that could "help the defense".
Especially with this case.

How could ANYONE think that what we put out here could help the defense?

 

[Gaia713]

These are my feelings on the SODDI topic here.
If the Defense does decide to pin Caylee's death on someone else, it will either be a family member or a close friend/associate of Casey.
I think they are going to cry accident, that is really the only logical choice for JB and his crowd to use.

I agree accident is the best defense, but they have locked themselves into the INNOEnt DEFENSE. Gonna be harde to change it and I cana't see Casey agreeing to that. Basically she wants her freedom and even a Man1 would result in jail time. They are also going to have to get Cindy and George on board with the accident theory and I don't see Cindy going for it either.

 

[Gaia713]

Actually, I'm talking about the legal definition of what is taking place. Under the Fifth Amendment Casey has the right to follow the advice of her attorney and not say anything further to LE. This cannot be held against her as she is simply invoking her right. So she is not continuing to lie in essence. Not at all. Although often portrayed as a sign of guilt in movies and on TV, pleading the Fifth is not a sign of guilt under US law and is not taken as such in the courtroom.

Yet she tells her parents that NO ONE IS LISTENING TO HER. Maybe because she isn't talking? She and Cindy have the same problem - the inability to face reality or to tell the truth.

 

[MAMABEAR]

Wow. Funny how we all see this thread thru different eyes and brains. I love this thread--have really tried to stay away from it tho. LOL

What I have seen in this thread is peeps post about some other soddi and the others try to match the evidence with what the post said. The fact that the defense may be getting ideas here---fine-so be it---but they also have to watch the posts that can bring up the evidence. KWIM?

 

[treeseeker]

I"d think a good prosecutor would appreciate this kind of sleuthing. Could help them close up any holes and leave no wiggle room for the defendant at trial.

 

[akashana]

These are my feelings on the SODDI topic here.
If the Defense does decide to pin Caylee's death on someone else, it will either be a family member or a close friend/associate of Casey.
I think they are going to cry accident, that is really the only logical choice for JB and his crowd to use.

For the life of me I don't understand why this hasn't been the defense strategy all along. At the earliest, the detectives were trying to convey to her that it could be understood if it happened and she got scared and covered it up, but that it had to end now; she had to be forthcoming. And while nobody would agree she should get off scot-free, I think a credible case could have been made for a charge much less than 1st degree murder. At that point, anyway. But from KC's attitude, and then JB's leading her down the path, claiming she is innocent . . . people are sick of the BS and want the truth and a pound of flesh. I can't believe that a jury will accept a SODDI defense unless there will be a Perry Mason moment at trial, which I don't believe FL courts even allow under their procedural rules. We can conjure scenarios til the cows come home, but at the end of the day none have been enough to cast reasonable doubt as to her guilt, or address all of the points of issue. Sad and sick as it seems, I totally believe KC committed murder against her little Caylee, and I think the state has the goods to prove it.

 

[USARDOG]

I would think what the defense could learn here is that a sod will not work unless they try and confuse the facts of the case. I'm thinking a jury will not buy it. IMO still best idea, plead accident, but with jb and kc sharing licorice and at the helm, I don't think a plea will be forthcoming.

I agree with akashana 100%, KC had her chance to say yes, there was an accident, but I guess she would have had to admit putting duct tape on Caylee, and in addition, at that point there may have been a lot more homicide evidence, like, chloroform for one.

IMO, she should try and cop a plea before going to trial. I'm thinking the state may grant small favors to save money and time.

 

[autumnlover]

I agree accident is the best defense, but they have locked themselves into the INNOEnt DEFENSE. Gonna be harde to change it and I cana't see Casey agreeing to that. Basically she wants her freedom and even a Man1 would result in jail time. They are also going to have to get Cindy and George on board with the accident theory and I don't see Cindy going for it either.

ITA. She will never agree with any defense that has her participating in the crime. She'll protest her innocence, along with CA and GA, all the way to the needle.

 

[Gaia713]

I would think what the defense could learn here is that a sod will not work unless they try and confuse the facts of the case. I'm thinking a jury will not buy it. IMO still best idea, plead accident, but with jb and kc sharing licorice and at the helm, I don't think a plea will be forthcoming.

I agree with akashana 100%, KC had her chance to say yes, there was an accident, but I guess she would have had to admit putting duct tape on Caylee, and in addition, at that point there may have been a lot more homicide evidence, like, chloroform for one.

IMO, she should try and cop a plea before going to trial. I'm thinking the state may grant small favors to save money and time.

I just don't think KC will go for a plea. She's determined to walk out of that jail scot free. IT's not gonna happen imo

LOL, Scotti is not free..

 

[Gaia713]

I have a tracking dog.That's him in my siggie.He moves at the speed of light when he's on a track.We have to work him around at times so he doesn't overshoot a scent.If he has lost a scent or is trying to pick one up he may air scent for a moment,but his nose is usually to the ground.He tracks live people.Cadaver dogs are not tracking exactly,they move around until they hit upon the scent at the place a dead body was or is.
Was actually confirming your post while replying to AE ,USARDOG.I defer to you as the expert.I just have one that's trained to track because my son has autism : )

I Have a lot of faith in dogs. They have no ax to grind with one side or the other. They work hard and do good work. They may not be 100% accurate, but they can lead you in the right direction.

 

[Gaia713]

She meant that Sheppherd claimed SODDI, was not believed, and was ultimately proved innocent. Which, by extension, means that we should take KC's SODDI claims seriously.

She forgot to mention that in Sheppard's day, we did not have the DNA and other criminalist technology that we have now.

Sheppard was tried in 1954! The two cases are as comparable as a propeller- driven airplane and a rocket ship.

Sheppherd has nothing in common with this case imo - LKB's examples are very poor for a supposedly intelligent person. Sheppard had a neck injury from the fight with his intruder. Did KC have a bruse from Zanny twisting her arm? Bruises from being pushed to the ground? I think not.

 

[Gaia713]

LKB will dispute the science and claim everyone smelled pizza.That's how she rolls and it's why she was hired .

I missed Spectre - is that how she really works - that's incredible. Particularly since anything the lawyer says in court is not to be taken as truth. They are not under oath.