The Verdict - Do you agree or disagree?

[2door73chevy]

Here's the problem - for the DP/LWOP penalty case. No one had heard the drowning story for three years - not a peep - not from Mr. Baez, who along with his client, insisted the child was "missing" all those long years with his face on any media show that would have him.

No one, repeat, no one heard the drowning "story" until Baez's opening statements.

On June 16th, the LE gave FCA every opportunity to say it was an accident, but no - not a peep, just denial and kidnapping...

Why not fess up at that time.....er..um...a little matter of the duct tape and the swamp...

Like I've said in my previous posts...I don't think it was a drowning.

 

[2door73chevy]

1st degree premeditated murder is a DP worthy consideration.

Casey planned to murder her child. imo.

This is where you and I disagree and that's ok.

 

[beccalecca1]

This really jumped out at me.

2. Tire well scrapings
Methanol extracts of the tire well scrapings showed many diverse compounds (Acetic acid,
Octadecane, I-Heptanol, I-Undecanol, I-Nonanol, etc). Acetic acid (in an acid environment) and/or acetate ion (in an alkaline environment) are by-products of making chloroform with acetone and chlorine. pH measurements of the Florida trunk carpet sample indicate that the pH of the Florida trunk carpet was approximately 5.5 (acidic), which could have caused the formation of acetic acid.

Is the acetone and chlorine nothing more than nail polish remover and bleach?

Also, this:

1) Nearly all the compounds present in early human decomposition were detected in the
trunk samples if their concentrations were high enough to detect. Carbon tetrachloride
was also detected and is a human specific marker within these animal sets.

I hate to use Wiki, but it is the first thing that popped up to explain this supposed "exclusive human specific" chemical...

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_tetrachloride"]Carbon tetrachloride - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:Tetrachlormethan.svg" class="image" title="Structural formula of carbon tetrachloride"><img alt="" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/97/Tetrachlormethan.svg/100px-Tetrachlormethan.svg.png"@@AMEPARAM@@commons/thumb/9/97/Tetrachlormethan.svg/100px-Tetrachlormethan.svg.png[/ame]

Carbon tetrachloride, also known by many other names (notably, carbon tet in the cleaning industry, and as a Halon or Freon in HVAC

Snipped.

I don't believe all of these chemicals are only present in a decompositional event.

 

[logicalgirl]

Like I've said in my previous posts...I don't think it was a drowning.

So are you saying you think the verdict would have been different if it had been just a LWOP murder charge? I'm curious...

 

[Sustained]

Nope....That's not going to change my mind about the DP in this case..It should have NEVER been on the the table and I bet if the state could go back and change it they would..JMO

I actually agree with you on this one, but for select jurors to say that they considered the DP punishment when considering FCA's guilt is a violation of jury instructions.

 

[beccalecca1]

Help me out here ... when did GA throw FCA under the bus ?

When he testified at the Grand Jury. Something changed the dynamics of their relationship from that point.

 

[logicalgirl]

Yes, apparently you do.

Oh I see - Hmmm - I guess this means I should change out of my Polyanna PJ's and put my hip waders back on? Gotcha..

This will take a while - bb in a bit...

 

[beccalecca1]

...I don't know. Just as much evidence supports space aliens killing her.

Really? Just out of curiosity, what evidence supports this?

 

[Baznme]

This really jumped out at me.

2. Tire well scrapings
Methanol extracts of the tire well scrapings showed many diverse compounds (Acetic acid,
Octadecane, I-Heptanol, I-Undecanol, I-Nonanol, etc). Acetic acid (in an acid environment) and/or acetate ion (in an alkaline environment) are by-products of making chloroform with acetone and chlorine. pH measurements of the Florida trunk carpet sample indicate that the pH of the Florida trunk carpet was approximately 5.5 (acidic), which could have caused the formation of acetic acid.

Is the acetone and chlorine nothing more than nail polish remover and bleach?

Also, this:


I hate to use Wiki, but it is the first thing that popped up to explain this supposed "exclusive human specific" chemical...

Carbon tetrachloride - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Snipped.

I don't believe all of these chemicals are only present in a decompositional event.

LinTX explained it very well. Be it far from me to argue this. Either look up her posts or take it up with Dr. Vass/Voss. Not my forte when it comes to chemical makeup of the human body. I just pointed out what I thought was relevant to Dr. Vass/Voss's argument when he testified.

 

[Sustained]

When he testified at the Grand Jury. Something changed the dynamics of their relationship from that point.

Since this question was spurred on by the suggested molestation by GA, why didn't FCA come right back at GA with the molestation charges instead of waiting until the trial ?

 

[Baznme]

When he testified at the Grand Jury. Something changed the dynamics of their relationship from that point.

I agree becca. He realized his grandaughter was gone and his daughter had something to do with it.

She then realized her father was not going to cover for her mistakes anymore. It was time to tell the truth..........to the grand jury.

 

[beccalecca1]

IIRC, LE was inside the HOUSE, not the garage! Law enforcement didn't "walk past the car", they entered the house through the front door. If you will remember, the Anthony's were separated to talk to different LE that night. I don't recall any of the LE officers walking past the car in the garage that FIRST night. :waitasec:

LE testified to entering the house through the garage door. No one used the front door that night.

 

[TorisMom003]

The State had what they knew. They had the evidence that was provided to them. They had information from LE that did the investigation into Caylee's disappearance. Then in December of 2008 the State had even more, they had Caylee's remains. Based on what the State had against KC the State decided that there was enough to go for the death penalty. I, personally, agree with them.

KC had ample time to claim an accident had happened. KC was asked repeatedly during her talks with LE if an accident had happened. KC repeatedly said no, the nanny had kidnapped Caylee. KC even went so far as to claim that she had spoken to Caylee on the phone for a brief period, knowing that it was a lie because Caylee was already dead.

Fast forward 3 years. During those 3 years KC, her DT, her parents had tried to place the blame on anyone and everyone that they could think of. The nanny did it, but the nanny does not exist. The nanny is code for Jesse G, but that too was not true. KC's "friends" had something to do with what happened to Caylee, but they were more concerned about Caylee than her own mother was when they learned that Caylee had not been seen for 31 days. Then Roy K had the misfortune of finding Caylee, well he is shady so he must have done something to her. During those 3 years KC still claimed that Caylee was taken by the nanny. In fact she changed the nanny "kidnapping" story three times. But KC stuck with the nanny taking Caylee. Then we begin the trial. During the opening statement of KC's DT we then hear that Caylee died by accidental drowning. Now why, after 3 years and ample opportunity to admit this before, does KC wait til the first day of her 1st degree murder trial to say this? Is it because it is the truth? Or is it because all of the other people that KC, her DT, her parents tried to blame did not pan out?

KC and her DT then take it one step further. Let's claim that George molested KC when she was younger. KC is messed up in the head because of this. KC did not report the "accident" because she was afraid of her mother. KC did not know how to show emotions because of her father's actions towards her. KC was taught at a young age to lie and cover for her parents so she then learns that she is to behave the same way. KC did nothing with Caylee after she died, George handled that part. Somehow Roy K came into the picture and he played hide and seek with her body for awhile before deciding he wanted money and fame and then reported where Caylee was. Now, during all of this "confession" that KC's DT is telling the jury not once does KC take any of the blame for anything. Nothing is KC's fault. By definition, that is not a confession.

KC sits in court day after day and plays a part for the jury. We see her flirting with her DT, we see her laughing with them, we see her come into the courtroom and put her chair as low as it can possibly go. The jury of course sees none of this. They do however see KC "tear up" at some certain things, they do see her DT "comfort" her, they do see KC shake her head no at testimony that she does not agree with or that goes against what her claims are. Again, a part, an act, for the jury. Not the real KC. Not the KC that the jury hears in the jailhouse phone calls to home, or the KC that the jury sees in the jailhouse visits with her family and friend.

All of this is my way of saying that the State did their job. They went for the death penalty for a "mother" that they knew, based on the evidence, had killed her child. The DT went for cheap tricks. The DT went for things that they knew were false and promised to prove very serious accusations and then failed to follow through. The DT went over the line, that line that makes people think bad things about defense lawyers. But it worked. The jury bought it. The jury believed the DT about the lies. The jury bought the easy way out. Now, not only does the jury have to live with their decision, so do the rest of us. Those of us who feel that KC got away with murder, that feel that Caylee did not receive the justice she so deserved. Those of us who may one day come across KC and have to worry about what she may do in the future. I feel more than just sadness for all of us, I feel shame. Shame that a little innocent girl was forgotten or overlooked alll in the name of "justice".

MOO

 

[Horace Finklestein]

Really? Just out of curiosity, what evidence supports this?

The same evidence of a drowning = none whatsoever.

 

[Baznme]

Excuse/forgive me for my "bold addition" Baznme, but I get nutty when folks discuss the DP as if it was the only choice. Now I know you know that....but I like to make a point of Both choices during these discussions about guilt for the capital murder charge.

You're absolutely correct on that. I was trying to point out to chevy that I too, may have not found her guilty of capital murder had she told the truth from the start irregardless of what the penalty may have been. Since to this day, we haven't heard word one in that regard, I'm still on the fence but there are others that wouldn't have qualified as a DP juror anyway........myself included. That darned chloroform and duct tape keeps getting in the way...........for me anyway.

Did I make sense?

 

[beccalecca1]

Here's the problem - for the DP/LWOP penalty case. No one had heard the drowning story for three years - not a peep - not from Mr. Baez, who along with his client, insisted the child was "missing" all those long years with his face on any media show that would have him.

No one, repeat, no one heard the drowning "story" until Baez's opening statements.

On June 16th, the LE gave FCA every opportunity to say it was an accident, but no - not a peep, just denial and kidnapping...

Why not fess up at that time.....er..um...a little matter of the duct tape and the swamp...

You mean no one in the public had heard this for 3 years, PT and the A's knew about this prior to trial.

 

[cuppy199]

When he testified at the Grand Jury. Something changed the dynamics of their relationship from that point.

Well I guess it would considering his testimony is one of the reason the grand jury indicted her.If I remember correctly none of the other family was called to testify so the only one KC could possible blame was GA so no wonder their relationship change but its not like GA had a choice in the matter. Lets not forget this was before Caylee body was found in a swamp.

 

[Caligram]

The jury never stopped to consider whether JB spoke the truth in his opening statement.
They never stopped to consider how CA looked when she was angry and holding a hammer. They never stopped to consider that if CA if had any suspicion that GA was molesting FCA....CA would have fixed GA forever. Also, CA wouldn't have called 911 after she put the knife down and flushed a very private part of GA down the toilet.
Not trying to be funny.....but seriously.....anybody really believe that GA would risk it.
GA did not do what JB said....that was done to make him look evil. FCA was the evil one, murdering her own child and letting her own father be named a molester to get her sorry azz out of there.

 

[Baznme]

The State had what they knew. They had the evidence that was provided to them. They had information from LE that did the investigation into Caylee's disappearance. Then in December of 2008 the State had even more, they had Caylee's remains. Based on what the State had against KC the State decided that there was enough to go for the death penalty. I, personally, agree with them.

KC had ample time to claim an accident had happened. KC was asked repeatedly during her talks with LE if an accident had happened. KC repeatedly said no, the nanny had kidnapped Caylee. KC even went so far as to claim that she had spoken to Caylee on the phone for a brief period, knowing that it was a lie because Caylee was already dead.

Fast forward 3 years. During those 3 years KC, her DT, her parents had tried to place the blame on anyone and everyone that they could think of. The nanny did it, but the nanny does not exist. The nanny is code for Jesse G, but that too was not true. KC's "friends" had something to do with what happened to Caylee, but they were more concerned about Caylee than her own mother was when they learned that Caylee had not been seen for 31 days. Then Roy K had the misfortune of finding Caylee, well he is shady so he must have done something to her. During those 3 years KC still claimed that Caylee was taken by the nanny. In fact she changed the nanny "kidnapping" story three times. But KC stuck with the nanny taking Caylee. Then we begin the trial. During the opening statement of KC's DT we then hear that Caylee died by accidental drowning. Now why, after 3 years and ample opportunity to admit this before, does KC wait til the first day of her 1st degree murder trial to say this? Is it because it is the truth? Or is it because all of the other people that KC, her DT, her parents tried to blame did not pan out?

KC and her DT then take it one step further. Let's claim that George molested KC when she was younger. KC is messed up in the head because of this. KC did not report the "accident" because she was afraid of her mother. KC did not know how to show emotions because of her father's actions towards her. KC was taught at a young age to lie and cover for her parents so she then learns that she is to behave the same way. KC did nothing with Caylee after she died, George handled that part. Somehow Roy K came into the picture and he played hide and seek with her body for awhile before deciding he wanted money and fame and then reported where Caylee was. Now, during all of this "confession" that KC's DT is telling the jury not once does KC take any of the blame for anything. Nothing is KC's fault. By definition, that is not a confession.

KC sits in court day after day and plays a part for the jury. We see her flirting with her DT, we see her laughing with them, we see her come into the courtroom and put her chair as low as it can possibly go. The jury of course sees none of this. They do however see KC "tear up" at some certain things, they do see her DT "comfort" her, they do see KC shake her head no at testimony that she does not agree with or that goes against what her claims are. Again, a part, an act, for the jury. Not the real KC. Not the KC that the jury hears in the jailhouse phone calls to home, or the KC that the jury sees in the jailhouse visits with her family and friend.

All of this is my way of saying that the State did their job. They went for the death penalty for a "mother" that they knew, based on the evidence, had killed her child. The DT went for cheap tricks. The DT went for things that they knew were false and promised to prove very serious accusations and then failed to follow through. The DT went over the line, that line that makes people think bad things about defense lawyers. But it worked. The jury bought it. The jury believed the DT about the lies. The jury bought the easy way out. Now, not only does the jury have to live with their decision, so do the rest of us. Those of us who feel that KC got away with murder, that feel that Caylee did not receive the justice she so deserved. Those of us who may one day come across KC and have to worry about what she may do in the future. I feel more than just sadness for all of us, I feel shame. Shame that a little innocent girl was forgotten or overlooked alll in the name of "justice".

MOO

This is the long and the short of it. Exactly how I feel and this was very well said. Thank you.

 

[beccalecca1]

The same evidence of a drowning = none whatsoever.

Actually, the judge allowed JB to discuss the drowning during closing arguments because there was evidence to support that.

I don't recall anyone claiming aliens had anything to do with the case, or there being any evidence related to aliens.