Theories On What Happened to Caylee Part #3

[Nehemiah]

why does casey take caylee's clothes off if she's just expecting her to sleep while she's in the trunk?

My thoughts as well, unless posters are thinking that she would be cooler in the trunk w/out clothing? If she were drugging Caylee with Xanax, why not just take a "sleeping" Caylee into the flavor-of-the-day's apartment and lay her on the couch or somewhere in the house? I can't go with the thought that she put her in the trunk every time. I am of the mindset that she did that with the body after she was dead, until she figured out her "plan"--with assistance from someone.

I am wondering if she actually had access to that empty apartment at Sawgrass (via her friends who worked there) and left her drugged inside there where it was cool? I think we will find out that the empty apartment has some relevance.

 

[kiki the parrot]

I'm not trying to be rude. I just need an explanation for why LE filed murder charges if they had evidence suggesting Caylee drowned accidently. Please explain. Everyone who thinks this was an accident keeps dancing around answering this simple question. So, I'll ask it one more time: Why would LE file murder charges against KC if Caylee in fact accidently drowned?

There are many answers we would all like! I believe she may have left them no choice. KC's refusal to provide any alternative explanation, nor any truthful details of the events surrounding her daughter's death, nor willingness to be linked in any way whatsoever to Caylee's death, made it necessary for LE to include the harshest charge possible but LE also included lesser charges in hopes perhaps that KC may still talk. ME has no clue re COD but said this can be 'revisited.'

Here's where I have a problem with all the 'staged to look like a kidnapping' and 'wanted the body to be found sooner' theories. The things I am posting here are established facts, not my opinion.
Casey lied to everyone about where Caylee was for 31 days.
Evidence of decomp determined to be at the stage of approximately 2.6 days was found in the trunk of the car.
I won't go into the gory details, other than it has been stated by experts, and it can be researched, what kind of decomp takes place under the conditions at the time in 2.6 days.
Casey did not initiate reporting Caylee missing, Cindy did, after 31 days.
Cindy contacted Amy with a phone number she found in the car, went to the mall and picked Amy up, and Amy took Cindy to where Casey was. This led to the confrontations about where Caylee was, which led to Casey finally admitting Caylee had been 'missing' for 31 days. I'm including this under fact, as this is the story everyone involved told, and I doubt they are all lying about it.
Where in this line of fact does it look like Casey was wanting Caylee found sooner to support her nanny kidnap story?
Lanie

Why is there a 'thumb's down' thing at the top of my post????

(bold mine) I am unfortunately only too familiar w all of the heartwrenching facts made public in this case. As I've repeated ad infinitum, there is nothing reasonable, responsible nor how a mature, caring, unselfish adult would act about KC's response in the aftermath of a possible negligence scenario nor have I ever attempted to defend her behavior--only to discover the true events of that tragic day.

I think she put the duct tape over Caylees mouth and around her head and put her in the trunk "out of her way" to go be with Tony on the 16th. I don't think someone's first choice to keep body fluids from leaking out any further would be to use duct tape. Too up close and horrific for this girl. She'd have to really face what she had done to do this, people like this don't think they are "bad" and refuse to see anything that would show that. I also don't think duct tape would have stuck very well if fluids were leaking out - especially to still have some skin attached to the tape.

I believe she came home the next day and backed in the driveway to get her out of the trunk and found her dead.

I believe she did bury her in a shallow grave in the backyard under the playhouse on the 18th. Decided that wasn't good enough and dug her up on the 20th and put back in the car trunk. This would explain the dirt and maggots in her trunk.

I believe little Caylee was in the trunk still, covered with clothing and other items on the 24th during the confrontation with GA about the gas cans and when she left she immediately and quickly dumped her body in a panic.

I believe that she started telling Amy about the smell the next day to have an excuse for the smell if confronted about it. Unfortunately, the smell continued to get worse and she decided to throw out some of the other stuff in the trunk - hence the "got rid of the smell" comment to Amy on the 27th.

I'm thinking she may have returned to where she dumped little Caylee to leave her other items from the trunk, and saw/smelled what was left of Caylee, was upset / not wanting to face what she had done and abandoned the car and called Tony to "get away from reality". I do think she left her purse there in plain view hoping someone would steal the car which would hopefully leave prints or be able to claim someone else killed Caylee.

Unfortunately, I was involved with someone that I convinced to go for psychological testing a couple of years ago due to my experience and knowledge of them and they were diagnosed as having antisocial personality disorder. Talking with him was way too much like the crazy stuff Casey has been claiming. Reading her interviews is just like conversations I would have with him. Even when faced with the fact of their lies, they just can't admit it. No concern for others, just what they want at any cost. INFURIATING.

One thing I find interesting is I haven't seen anyone mention this yet (might have missed it somewhere), but, if she did tape her mouth shut to leave her in the trunk, prior to death, this would have been done so she couldn't call out and draw attention, right? Meaning she would have still been alive. What would have prevented little Caylee from possibly removing the tape from her mouth when she awoke? I have a feeling her arms were also probably bound and possibly her feet to prevent her from kicking as well. Horrific, but makes a certain amount of sense if these were her reasons for taping her mouth.

In Caseys interview she said that she received a call from Caylee on July 15th at around noon. She said all Caylee wanted to talk about was this book she had been reading and her shoes. Bet the shoes were near the book as well.

(bold mine, agree w bolded) There is not a doubt in my mind that KC had derailed or spiralled by this point into some sort of escapist, compulsive behavior but just for the record this could occur just as easily following a negligence scenario as w a premeditated one. (In fact if coldblooded and planned and she is a true sociopath w no conscience whatsoever, why the need to distract/divert herself w all the compulsive, escapist behaviors.) In any case it would be easier to share, respond, and discuss the facts if people were not so quick to jump on anyone w an alternate opinion or theory. I will nevertheless boldly venture to say that if my own 20 year-old daughter, God forbid, found herself faced w any tragedy involving my two year-old granddaughter I can only hope and pray that she would have the humility, maturity and courage to confess any negligence or responsibility and to report this immediately!! This has broken my heart in a way a grandmother and mother of these same ages, who has gone thru similar battles, is especially able to appreciate. All are free to speculate at this point, but there just seems no end to our need or desire to embellish, far beyond the painful evidence and sordid facts, with the most gratuitous, and diabolical, details. So forgive me if I don't join you but would rather spare my heart and mind for now from unnecessarily wandering to these darkest of all possible places with you. As I said until remaining facts are learned at trial it won't be possible for me to entirely rule out negligence and a really desperate cover-up. Haters, hate but for the time this remains MHO

:angel:JOY + PEACE TO MY FELLOW SLEUTHERS THE GREATEST GIFT IS HIS LOVE TO ALL:angel:​

 

[DesSands]

I have gone over so many scenarios since Caylee was reported missing and we were made aware of some of the transcripts, forensics of the trunk, etc.
It's really enough to make you crazy, but I think the best approach is the simplest one. I thought she'd be found close to home as she stated and that over analyzing KC is giving her too much credit. She's really not the brightest little bulb on the tree as I've said before.

I have a couple of theories but I'm not totally convinced of anything except that it WASN'T an accident.
Something that keeps coming back to me is another little snippet that KP threw out on the NG show within the last week or so. He said KC was seen pacing in a parking lot of a motel or hotel, the late hrs of the 15th, going into the wee hrs. of the 16th, this is of course June.
So that leads me to believe that she duct taped her mouth because she was fighting as anyone would to stay alive. I think she chlorofromed her and Caylee woke up, scared in the trunk. The human body can come out of deep sleep when it is charged with adrenaline from fear. So she put the duct tape around her mouth and paced outside of the car (since it was probably annoying her, or hard to listen to) until she stopped kicking in the trunk.

There is no way she ever left her in the trunk for any length of time before this as no one could survive the heat, they warn not to even let your pets stay in the car in the Summer.
If LP is right about this one, then they have her on tape for those hrs. 1:30 on the morning ot the 16th at the hotel.

My second theory is pretty bad too. I think that's why LE took clothes and shoes from her closet and also pics of the medicine cabinet. She took her to the end of their street and walked her in alittle ways and killed her there. Late night hrs. of the 15th of June. Then she put her in the trunk until she could think of a better cover up.
With either theory she then took her from there and put her in her trunk to transport her back to the A house (2.6 days of decomp) where she wrapped her in the sheet or blanket, took her clothes off so she couldn't be identified too easily. She used the shovel to scoop her out of the trunk as she was liquifying and took her to the back of the playhouse so no one would see.
That's why they have soil from both places in or around the bag and body. Also why the dogs hit as the liquids and body were in the backyard for a short time for her to accomplish this.
They know drugs are involved, that's the reason for taking pics of the A's medicine cabinet.
This was no accident as she would be reacting very differently. She practically admitted it by saying Mom should have called the police a long time ago. Maybe I am a spiteful .

 

[K9 5er]

I believe there was a fight, we heard about it early on IIRC Greta show M Furman, and then from Jesse through Lee, it was probably the first time Cindy put her hands on Casey. Casey stealing from her Grandparents was probably the straw that broke the camels back for Cindy. If it is true that Cindy had talked to a councilor about kicking Casey to the curb, she could have told Casey that night.Cindy probably told Casey that she was going to try to get custody.At that time she had only known Tony for a few weeks, he was not the reason for Caylee's demise, it was the threat of not having a bargaining chip with Cindy.Caylee was there in the middle of this and probably was upset at what she saw.Casey probably lost it with Caylee wanting to stay or go home, she probably killed her in a rage. JMO

I agree with your scenario. Tensions had to be high in that household for a while if Cindy saw a counselor in May to discuss the problems she was having with her out of control daughter.

I also feel Zannie was a composite of many people (for what reason she did this is beyond me); when a friend (Annie?) got a puppy she talked about Zannie's puppy, when Amy had an accident (totaled her car) KC talked of Zannie being in an accident in Tampa. So when "Zannie" kidnapped Caylee b/c KC owed her money and did it to teach her lesson I suspect this falls into what happened on the 15th. When confronted by Cindy about the money she stole from the grands, maybe Cindy told KC she planned on taking custody of Caylee to teach her a lesson? Those two had ongoing issues for a while, but something that night crossed the line (probably b/c it became physical) and poor Caylee was at the receiving end of KC's rage. Anyway, just my humble opinion.

 

[MUGENDAI]

kc is by far no mila kunis ha...

american psycho, puulease...

and is not as hot as her either. kc wants to be anybody but herself.

 

[chelle70]

I refuse to believe Caylee was in the trunk of that car for more than 2 days, and that would have to be right after her death.
This was the middle of June in Florida. I don't care what state you live in, in the summer, your trunk temperature is going to be a lot higher than the temp outside. High temperature speeds decomp. Caylee was approximately 35 pounds. After a couple of days, the smell might not have been noticeable from the outside if the car was completely shut up, but inside the car would have been unbearable. Factor in the humidity, so there is no chance the body mummified. Any more time in that car would have the smell everywhere, closed up or not.
At the tow yard, all that was left in the car to smell was a small stain, and probably residual smell from when Caylee actually was in the car, and tow yard guy said he noticed the car smelled (shut up) sometime in the week before it was picked up. I say Caylee in the car for even 5 days would have had anyone on the road by Casey's car stopped at a red light with their window down gagging, much less people parking next to it, etc. It wouldn't have just been a whiff of a foul odor, it would have been overwhelming.
Lanie

I concur completely!!! I am from Florida and I know there's no way she wasn't in there for more than 2.5 days! You're right.......people would be gagging.:crazy:

 

[impatientredhead]

I concur completely!!! I am from Florida and I know there's no way she wasn't in there for more than 2.5 days! You're right.......people would be gagging.:crazy:

Me too, and it ties in very closely with the shovel borrowing time.

 

[sometimer]

Casey had no self confidence. She had no skills to leave and make it on her own. She was very dependant on her parents and thought of herself as a child. I believe that is why she did not try to leave town. She may have wanted to, but like small child who wants to run away, she didn't know how to do it.
I believe Cindy kicked Casey out. Maybe she told her to be out by the time she got home from work on the 16th.
She is like a child and throws temper tantrums.
I believe at some point after she left Caylee made her angry. Maybe she was crying for grandma and wouldn't stop. Casey lost her temper and taped her mouth shut. Perhaps Casey wanted to talk to her boyfriend on the phone and wanted Caylee to be quiet. I think this may have been how Caylee died. Since her mother had kicked her out Cindy thinks she is doing what is right and taking responsibility. Cindy still thinks Casey has a job. She knows Casey is angry with her. As time goes on Cindy starts to realize something isn't right. She is really starting to miss Caylee and is getting worried about her.
TL was Caseys true love, except he didn't quite feel the same about her. She knew that. His lifestyle was different than any of her other friends and it was the lifestyle she wanted. She now has to make things work with this guy. She has nowhere else to go. TL did not even allow her in the apartment when he was gone. Casey never had a plan. I think Casey knew she would eventually get caught. I think Casey was surprised she pulled it off for so long. I think her attorney actually convinced her that she may even get away with it. She felt her mother pushed her into doing this and therefore it is Cindys fault. I believe Cindy also feels this way. This is why Cindy cannot accept what has happened.
Casey may have thought of killing her mother or even the whole family. She blamed them for destoying any chance for happieness that she had. They were getting in her way, but she still needed them.
That's just my opinion for the day.

 

[JWG]

As I said until remaining facts are learned at trial it won't be possible for me to entirely rule out negligence and a really desperate cover-up. Haters, hate but for the time this remains MHO

Agreed. As much as it has distressed me to come to this conclusion, I believe the evidence that has trickled out thus far does not rule out an accidental death and in many ways strongly supports an accident. I also believe the evidence does support a horrific and callous cover-up.

By accident I do not mean accidental overdose. I mean accident - such as drowning in the pool while Casey is distracted.

I can only hope that if the above is true that the crimes committed after Caylee's death are enough to put her in jail for a very long time. She certainly won't get sympathy or mercy based on her character.

 

[Duckley]

Cindy seemed so sure there were facts of the case that had not been made public that would explain everything... especially the innocense of Casey. What do you suppose Cindy's beliefs were? What theories could have been convincing?

Does any one know what Cindy is thinking/saying now - does she still beleive these theories?

 

[Friday]

Cindy seemed so sure there were facts of the case that had not been made public that would explain everything... especially the innocense of Casey. What do you suppose Cindy's beliefs were? What theories could have been convincing?

Does any one know what Cindy is thinking/saying now - does she still beleive these theories?

Here is what Cindy is thinking and planning to do, according her lawyer, BC, on 12/22:

On WKMG-Channel 6, Conway said that George and Cindy Anthony are supporting Casey. "They want the truth, whatever that is," Conway said. "Whatever the truth is, they will stand by their daughter."

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2008/12/caylee-anthonys.html#more

 

[panthera]

:clap::clap: Totally agree. I posted a link in another thread to a woman in Florida that dumped her 83 year old mother's body, wrapped in garbage bags out on the road somewhere and cashed her retirement checks during the time it took them to find the body which decomposed so badly they had to ID her from a serial number on her hip replacement. Daughter lied when they came knocking, finally fessed up, 4 years probation. In Florida. If this was an accident she would have saved her by now.

Four years probation? OMG! :furious: MOO

 

[panthera]

(respectfully snipped)

Bottom line, there are three possible scenarios, IMHO. It was an accident, Casey killed Caylee, or someone else killed Caylee. I guess I would ask the people who theorize accident what in what we know makes the accident scenario the more likely scenario? KC's behavior, statements to LE, even the manner in which Caylee was discarded seem to suggest otherwise. In weighing the evidence, what other evidence is strong enough for the accident proponents to set these circumstances aside? I'm open to the possibility I missed something, but the accident thing is just not adding up for me.

I couldn't have said it better! I have a lot of problems with the two main "accident" theories that have floated around ~ drowning in the swimming pool and dying from chloroform. Casey's behavior is inconsistent with Caylee accidentally drowning in the swimming pool. If Casey was chloroforming Caylee to sedate her and she died, there isn't anything "accidental" about that since chloroform is illegal and Casey had no business using it on Caylee to begin with. MOO

 

[SoCalSleuth]

It was not an accident. If it were an accident there would be some sort of emotional reaction, guilt at the very least. But we have a woman here that is shown in pictures as having the time of her life during the period her daughter was presumably missing. Carefree is the word that comes to mind when I view these pix. Carefree, no responsibilities. Caylee was in the way of her leading the life she wanted. No trips, couldn't go out every night, no midday meetings with her lover (remember the text messages)...once Caylee was "kidnapped" she didn't miss any social outings now did she?

 

[ecs5298]

Pretty new here on WS but I'll throw my $.02 in.

My daughter is just 7 days older than Caylee was. I know how almost 3 year olds can get. They test their limits, they push you to your limits. Whining and crying seems to be the preferred method of communication most days. Don't get me wrong, it's all perfectly normal 3 y/o activity.

I'm imagining that after the fight between CA and Casey on the night of June 15th, Caylee was very upset and probably crying and whining and not wanting to leave CA's and GA's house. I'm betting that Casey was pretty pizzed off at CA and it probably didn't take much from Caylee to send her past the point of no return. Since there was no soft tissue left, will never know if she was beaten to the extent that she died of an internal hemorhage. As long as Casey didn't break a bone while beating Caylee, there would be no evidence in the skeletal remains. She probably wrapped Caylee's head with duct tape so she didn't have to listen to her scream while she beat her.

Hopefully during the trial the facts will come out. I do think that the only one who really knows what happened is Casey. I'd really like to "reach out" to her they way she "reached out" to Caylee.

 

[Grace1984]

I don't think she used chloroform or Xanax on Caylee. Seeing videos of Caylee it is clear that she knew how to talk and if she was closer to Cindy than to Casey it seems likely that she would say something about it to her... I can see her saying something to the effect of , mommy put me in the trunk last night or I don't like sleeping in the trunk, it's hot in there.

I think that after the fight with Cindy Casey was upset and took it out on Caylee. Shaking her may have done the trick or even putting a pillow over her face and smothering her. Casey may not have been trying to kill her but was taking her frustration out on her. When she realized she killed her she freaked out and had to figure out what to do. Don't have any theories on how she got in the backyard or why she put her in the trunk...

My opinion...

 

[Irish_Eyes]

I'm not sure Caylee ever had to be in the backyard post mortem...

If the dogs were tracking a decomp scent, there could be other simpler explanations...like maybe at some point Casey had the mats from her stinky car in the backyard, trying to hose off the decomp scent...

 

[panthera]

It was not an accident. If it were an accident there would be some sort of emotional reaction, guilt at the very least. But we have a woman here that is shown in pictures as having the time of her life during the period her daughter was presumably missing. Carefree is the word that comes to mind when I view these pix. Carefree, no responsibilities. Caylee was in the way of her leading the life she wanted. No trips, couldn't go out every night, no midday meetings with her lover (remember the text messages)...once Caylee was "kidnapped" she didn't miss any social outings now did she?

And it became a "beautiful life". MOO

 

[Mi Perro Querido]

My thoughts keep going back to the pool, like LE had mentioned awhile back.
If a swimsuit was found in the bag with Caylee, and she had been wearing it when she died, IMO, KC taped her mouth and/or eyes, and threw Caylee into the pool at their house. Caylee's pleas for help would'nt be heard by neighbors, and it would be quick, and all KC would have to do is just stand there and wait, and not even see Caylee die, she would sink to the bottom, and KC would just have to fish her out before C and G got home in a few hours. IIRC, GA mentioned to LE that the pool ladder was down that Monday, when it usually is put out of reach for safety reasons. KC does'nt cover her tracks well, but is able to fantasize in great detail. :furious:

 

[zadari]

My thoughts keep going back to the pool, like LE had mentioned awhile back.
If a swimsuit was found in the bag with Caylee, and she had been wearing it when she died, IMO, KC taped her mouth and/or eyes, and threw Caylee into the pool at their house. Caylee's pleas for help would'nt be heard by neighbors, and it would be quick, and all KC would have to do is just stand there and wait, and not even see Caylee die, she would sink to the bottom, and KC would just have to fish her out before C and G got home in a few hours. IIRC, GA mentioned to LE that the pool ladder was down that Monday, when it usually is put out of reach for safety reasons. KC does'nt cover her tracks well, but is able to fantasize in great detail. :furious:

omg .. i dont want to think about her dieing such a horrible death oh how sad