Tim Bosma: Dellen Millard & Mark Smich chgd w/Murder; Christina Noudga, Accessory #3

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  • #541
That's a pretty close description. It has been pretty popular in Toronto, especially in the Jane and Finch area. Lots and lots of people are carded.

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2013/11/18/carding_by_toronto_police_drops_sharply.html

I don't know when DM was carded and the MSM reports all seem to just say a "physical feature", but AB claims it was his tattoo.

http://www.annrbrocklehurst.com/2013/11/dear-readers.html

Thanks for the link, AD. Gosh, if LE jots down all the tattoos sported by everyone they "card" it would take them all day to fill out the forms on MWJ, for instance, or most of his friends. Anyway, for some reason, we're given to understand that note was made of this particular, rather modest tattoo. Yes, the tattoo! That amazing disappearing/reappearing tattoo. Sometimes on one arm, sometimes on both, sometimes with a boxed border, sometimes with none. The RBEG noticed the tattoo on the wrist of a test driver who wore a short sleeved orange shirt. I don't know the protocol for meeting tattooed people for the first time. Do we establish eye contact or do we read their tattoos? Let's presume it to be rather uncomfortable to be reading a stranger's body unless there was an opportunity to do so unobserved. Sort of like sneaking a look at your watch when the luncheon speaker is boring. If so we can presume this tattoo was on the right wrist, i.e. the one nearest RBEG as passenger enabling the RBEG to read the tattoo as presented with DM's hands on the steering wheel. However, the word is then upside down. Can you correctly read the word "Ambition" upside down?

By the next evening, one of the test drivers who arrived at the Bosma household also wore an orange shirt, but this time it was long sleeved and night had already fallen, so it is unlikely, even improbable that SB could have seen this tattoo. MSM and early LE reports seem to fudge the issue. It's never stated that she saw this tattoo, or least not in any article I have found.

Nevertheless, it appears undeniable that DM has a tattoo "Ambition" on his arm.

Here's a photo, showing a eensie little something rather high on the left wrist. It does not appear to be enclosed in a border and IMO it is not positioned where men usually wear wrist watches, and it is not on the right arm. Maybe someone has a better image, this one being rather unreadable, IMO.

534d54127609f-30_v1_GRID_0417.jpg



I find it very interesting that Hamilton LE had early and immediate access to Toronto LE files sufficient to pull up every notation of the name and address of anybody with an "Ambition" tattoo in the two large metropolitan districts. Given that this appears to have been the case, it follows that DM is the only person in the broad area who has such a tattoo.

By the way, anybody with an indelible sharpie can create a reasonable facisimle in the off chance, just for example, that they wanted to impersonate someone who has the word "Ambition" tattooed on their arm but they don't know exactly what that tattoo looks like. That's part of the reason I find the eyewitness description so potentially relevant as expressed in the poster LE released at the time. It's because it seems to differ significantly from the tattoo DM actually has (although it is on the left arm.) Is this LE drawing based either on the RBEG's description or on the carding report.

Whatever the source it does not appear to look like DM's tattoo. IMO. IMHO. Are other people seeing something I'm not?

images
 
  • #542
Then in THIS picture DM seems to have something in approximately the same position on his right arm. Did he have them on both wrists? How many "ambition" tattoos does he actually have? How many did LE make carding notes about? How many did the RBEG see?

520ef09b3646f.jpg
 
  • #543
Maybe that's the problem, all of DM's life he's had people defending him when they shouldn't have. He was placed on a pedestal and thought he could do no wrong, but if he did, he could easily wiggle his way out of a bad situation blaming someone else or lie his way out, brainwashing others he was just this awesomely, wonderful, guy that everyone should look up to. If you fell under his spell you were rewarded with maybe a steak dinners or a jet ski, drugs and raves, maybe a bunk in the basement of good old dad's house. It's pretty sad when you have to buy friends for those to me are not real friendships. MOO.
 
  • #544
A former tenant hmm. Tampering with her engine ? What did she do leave her car unlocked to give them easy access to the hood latch? How can you tamper with a car at night in the dark without having access to the vehicle? Now if she had said they let hers tires down, I may have been interested, but tampering with engine? No name given, just former tenant who has come out of hiding to tell this questionable snippet of non-information IMO

Thieves can get into locked cars in seconds flat. Older cars they used a slim-jim ... newer cars they can spoof the wireless fob using a $5 scanner.

https://www.google.ca/?gws_rd=ssl#q="thieves+opening+cars+without+keys"
 
  • #545
Oh bother, where did that Tattoo thread go Bessie? Could you link it please? TIA.
 
  • #546
Then in THIS picture DM seems to have something in approximately the same position on his right arm. Did he have them on both wrists? How many "ambition" tattoos does he actually have? How many did LE make carding notes about? How many did the RBEG see?

520ef09b3646f.jpg

Yes DM had tattoos on both wrists and a few others including a lengthy message tattooed on his right side. I believe it was suggested by another poster some time back, the message is words to a certain song.

OH NO! Not the Sharpie and framing aspect again... :drumroll: :D
 
  • #547
Yes DM had tattoos on both wrists and a few others including a lengthy message tattooed on his right side. I believe it was suggested by another poster some time back, the message is words to a certain song.

OH NO! Not the Sharpie and framing aspect again... :drumroll: :D

LOL ... RBEG must be good friends with that former tenant and AS ... and they all hang out with the nosey neighbours at the farm and on Tinsmith.
 
  • #548
I wonder how he managed to race up and down a street with children playing on it when his street was a tiny circle with only a handful of houses, according to Google Earth? That's not a lot of room to race, in my opinion. But if it was reported by someone that an anonymous neighbour said it, it must be true.
 
  • #549
LOL ... RBEG must be good friends with that former tenant and AS ... and they all hang out with the nosey neighbours at the farm and on Tinsmith.

Har, har, nudge, nudge, etc.

Is it too upsetting to consider that some people may, frankly, be less interested in the framing potential than in indications of puzzling investigatory procedures and inconsistent MSM reports.

For my own part I don't accept that LE never makes mistakes or that MSM only presents absolutely accurate and on point information. What would be the point in sleuthing if that were so? (Hasn't anyone here ever been interviewed by the press or been associated with some event reported in the press? If so you must surely know that even the best reportage is sometimes very far off the mark for various reasons. IMO.)

With regard to the notion that DM may have been framed, IMO, is there truly any reason to abandon that consideration? I have no idea whether it might even be possible or if it did happen, what players may have been involved or how long planning may have taken. However, there is certainly ample motive potential, is there not? When millions of dollars and considerable power and influence hang in the balance and only a young naive stands in the way, it's really quite amazing what serious mischief could materialize. IMO. IMHO.

I am reminded of the "friendly competition" reference in the infamous Obituary as well as DM's interview comment that what took place is "as plain as the nose on your face."

Again, the trial will fill in these blanks. Meanwhile, I don't think any avenue for sleuthing should be closed because some posters are either impatient with it or because it has become the opinion for some that it doesn't matter much who pays the price for the tragic death of TB, only that somebody does. Oh, and of course, same goes for WM and LB, too, but not so much, I guess. MOO. IMHO.

(Oh, by the way, on a tinier detail, when a tenant won't or can't pay the rent, it's 80 percent if not 100 percent probable they'll come up with some 🤬🤬🤬🤬 and bull story for the rentalsman - especially when they're so far behind that it's actually been necessary to take them to that forum. DM and co are just lucky they didn't find themselves on the accusatory end of some much more frivolous and damaging allegations, as is too often the case. IMO)

IMO. IMHO. All MOO. etc.
 
  • #550
Maybe that's the problem, all of DM's life he's had people defending him when they shouldn't have. He was placed on a pedestal and thought he could do no wrong, but if he did, he could easily wiggle his way out of a bad situation blaming someone else or lie his way out, brainwashing others he was just this awesomely, wonderful, guy that everyone should look up to. If you fell under his spell you were rewarded with maybe a steak dinners or a jet ski, drugs and raves, maybe a bunk in the basement of good old dad's house. It's pretty sad when you have to buy friends for those to me are not real friendships. MOO.

Hmm. So that's interesting. What is a "real" friend? Let's say you're an active person with a like-minded circle of friends when you win a lottery or otherwise acquire a considerable amount of money or at least come into much more money than you had previously. Do you pretend that you live hand to mouth like most of your buddies or do you try to make your world "a reality" for them? Didn't DM say something like that in the Dec interview? How is that buying their friendships? Maybe some people would say, screw this, now is the time to step up into the next social class where everyone pretty much shares your same financial status. So you jettison those now embarrassingly needy old friends who certainly don't fit in with your toney new crowd anyway. What do you think? Is that what a good friend needs to do?

Those European trips that appear to have involved mostly hanging out with relatives and their well travelled friends seems to have been considerably more relaxed in tone, as least as revealed in the pictures. Probably everyone was unquestioningly more or less on the same socio-economic scale so nobody was ever particularly worried about who was going to be paying for dinner or buying the gas.

In my opinion, if you have the resources, paying for things for your friends that they can't afford is a generous and kind thing to do. Of course it also makes you vulnerable to exploitation if you're an idiot, etc. IMO. MOO. There is also the extreme possibility that it might make one or more of your "friends" blindly jealous.

IMO. MOO. IMHO. etc.
 
  • #551
YES , and I wouldn't be surprised if they watched his every move , and monitored every communication in those 4 hours in case DM contacted any of his cohorts or whatever.

And I bet police had those preparations in place BEFORE they even got to the hangar , and maybe even monitored him a day or two BEFORE they came to the hangar

Police do not fly in the dark , they may already have spotted enough tentacles to DM to make him a likely suspect .... the interview at the hangar was likely part of the staging , during the interview they would realize DM was being deceptive which would help to confirm his involvement .

Within those following 4 hours they put together a slam-dunk warrant and got the SWAT team to arrest him , and he has not been been released since.

It also wouldn't surprise me , after police left the hangar , if DM maybe called MS and said .... "hey , the cops were just here asking about the truck , but I told them I knew nothing and they went away".

That alone may not be enough to arrest MS right away so police were likely monitoring him to see what he did and where he went (they were still looking for the truck) ... I am sure MS's actions during those days would provide lots of "tells" .... his partner DM had been arrested and he would be spooked knowing they were looking for the other kidnapper - truck thief.

I enjoy all your posts and your logic matou , thanks

Monitoring him a day or two BEFORE they even went to talk to him?? Goodness, I hope not. Considering they were still hoping to find Tim alive at that point, one would think that time would be of the essence.

You may want to re-check your "facts". It was MS who was arrested by the SWAT team with tear gas.

Oakville resident S***** C******, who lives opposite the Smich home, said she saw a ten-man SWAT team swoop in on the home early this morning.

"I was leaving for Target. Seeing a SWAT team was the last thing I expected to see," she said. "It's hard to believe someone like that can live here in this neighbourhood."

C****** said they used what looked like tear gas, before the heavily armed SWAT team barged through the front door.

http://www.theifp.ca/news-story/5369660-oakville-man-arrested-in-tim-bosma-murder/

Remember him? The one that they brought extra security into the court for?

Extra security was brought in for his appearance, which lasted 10 minutes.

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/3236885-second-man-accused-barely-audible-in-court/

All we've heard about DM's arrest was...

When he got out of the car, he saw more than a dozen people — plainclothes officers with protective vests — pointing guns at him.

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/4292468-jail-interview-dellen-millard-says-he-didn-t-kill-tim-bosma/
 
  • #552
Monitoring him a day or two BEFORE they even went to talk to him?? Goodness, I hope not. Considering they were still hoping to find Tim alive at that point, one would think that time would be of the essence.

You may want to re-check your "facts". It was MS who was arrested by the SWAT team with tear gas.



http://www.theifp.ca/news-story/5369660-oakville-man-arrested-in-tim-bosma-murder/

Remember him? The one that they brought extra security into the court for?



http://www.thespec.com/news-story/3236885-second-man-accused-barely-audible-in-court/

All we've heard about DM's arrest was...



http://www.thespec.com/news-story/4292468-jail-interview-dellen-millard-says-he-didn-t-kill-tim-bosma/

Doesn't mean that LE viewed DM as any less dangerous than MS. Police prefer to take down suspected armed and dangerous felons outside and unexpectedly, in a situation where they have decided can control collateral impact. That is likely why they followed DM in his car, where he was observed to be alone, and they wanted to get him before he got into his house where he could have an arsenal and others in hiding that they may not have observed. The arrest team for DM was still extreme and indicated that they expected him to be armed and dangerous.

In MS's case they would expect that he had heard of DM's arrest, and may have armed and barricaded himself in preparation to resist arrest. Potentially a much tougher and dangerous arrest no matter who the suspected felon is. That's when they send in the SWAT team.
 
  • #553
How would it be safer for the public for armed and dangerous criminals to be taken down outside, where unobservant bystanders can walk into the takedown, can be grabbed as hostages, or can have stray bullets wound or kill them? I think the unexpected part makes sense, but not the outdoors part.

DM was arrested in the middle of a street, in public, where any number of people could have been injured if things had gone wrong. Luckily he went peacefully and without resisting in any way. I believe that they expected differently with MS and that was why they sent the swat team to his home. His arrest was supposed to take place indoors, where only his own family and friends could be innocent bystanders, in my opinion. It was MS who chose to run out and lead the swat team on a chase that ended in an apparently violent takedown. I think it is more likely that they expected MS to have the barricades in place, in my opinion.
 
  • #554
So DM had "more than a dozen" guys pointing guns at him, and MS got a home visit by "a ten-man SWAT team" (to handle MS and whoever else was in the house and the dogs)

By the numbers, DM needed more guys...was he the bigger threat?
 
  • #555
How would it be safer for the public for armed and dangerous criminals to be taken down outside, where unobservant bystanders can walk into the takedown, can be grabbed as hostages, or can have stray bullets wound or kill them? I think the unexpected part makes sense, but not the outdoors part.

DM was arrested in the middle of a street, in public, where any number of people could have been injured if things had gone wrong. Luckily he went peacefully and without resisting in any way. I believe that they expected differently with MS and that was why they sent the swat team to his home. His arrest was supposed to take place indoors, where only his own family and friends could be innocent bystanders, in my opinion. It was MS who chose to run out and lead the swat team on a chase that ended in an apparently violent takedown. I think it is more likely that they expected MS to have the barricades in place, in my opinion.

It is likely that police had control of the site in advance, given the number that were there at the arrest. Bystanders could have been kept away and police may have been controlling the traffic lights.

I don't know if the planning and execution of DM's arrest will ever become public knowledge but obviously some will be curious as to why they chose the location they did.

FYI, an episode of "Homicide Hunter", in which retired homicide detective Joe Kenda recounts his cases, shows an arrest of an armed and dangerous suspect similar to DM's (except with fewer LE). Kenda said that a surprise in-car arrest was safest for police and the public. It is difficult for a felon to come out of a car with guns blazing or to drive off if blocked in by police vehicles. Maybe Toronto LE watch Homicide Hunter, or maybe it is preferred police procedure.

I expect that if the arrest sequence had been reversed and MS had been arrested first, the SWAT team would have been sent to DM's house for his arrest.
 
  • #556
So DM had "more than a dozen" guys pointing guns at him, and MS got a home visit by "a ten-man SWAT team" (to handle MS and whoever else was in the house and the dogs)

By the numbers, DM needed more guys...was he the bigger threat?

I don't think thats the case. In Ontario police make dramatic entries into homes where children and grandparents are, they make no distinction. It is what they do !

I wouldn't be trying to suggest its because of a bigger threat, they view everyone as a threat IMO ( without going into greater detail)
 
  • #557
It is likely that police had control of the site in advance, given the number that were there at the arrest. Bystanders could have been kept away and police may have been controlling the traffic lights.

I don't know if the planning and execution of DM's arrest will ever become public knowledge but obviously some will be curious as to why they chose the location they did.

FYI, an episode of "Homicide Hunter", in which retired homicide detective Joe Kenda recounts his cases, shows an arrest of an armed and dangerous suspect similar to DM's (except with fewer LE). Kenda said that a surprise in-car arrest was safest for police and the public. It is difficult for a felon to come out of a car with guns blazing or to drive off if blocked in by police vehicles. Maybe Toronto LE watch Homicide Hunter, or maybe it is preferred police procedure.

I expect that if the arrest sequence had been reversed and MS had been arrested first, the SWAT team would have been sent to DM's house for his arrest.

I think TV shows are for entertainment purposes only JMO
 
  • #558
  • #559
Yes DM had tattoos on both wrists and a few others including a lengthy message tattooed on his right side. I believe it was suggested by another poster some time back, the message is words to a certain song.

OH NO! Not the Sharpie and framing aspect again... :drumroll: :D

Are you suggesting that framing never occurs, ever?

Are you suggesting that no-one has ever partaken in blackmail , revenge or spite?

IMO it would be quite naive for somebody to completely rule out something that most definitely DOES occur and it often involves blackmail, spite or revenge or another vindictive reason. Sometimes its for monetary gain. Either way someone benefits by way of money, assets, delight, power or satisfaction. I find it strange that anyone would want to rule it out totally when it is well within the structure of human nature for such things to occur.
 
  • #560
How would it be safer for the public for armed and dangerous criminals to be taken down outside, where unobservant bystanders can walk into the takedown, can be grabbed as hostages, or can have stray bullets wound or kill them? I think the unexpected part makes sense, but not the outdoors part.

DM was arrested in the middle of a street, in public, where any number of people could have been injured if things had gone wrong. Luckily he went peacefully and without resisting in any way. I believe that they expected differently with MS and that was why they sent the swat team to his home. His arrest was supposed to take place indoors, where only his own family and friends could be innocent bystanders, in my opinion. It was MS who chose to run out and lead the swat team on a chase that ended in an apparently violent takedown. I think it is more likely that they expected MS to have the barricades in place, in my opinion.

Can you provide the source for this info please?
 
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