Timeline Discussion

[wondering1]

Right, BUT, the school spokesperson made a public statement that the last school official to see him was at 8:15. That would rule out the teacher and chaperon. Unfortunately, I would lend more credence to the school spokesperson's statement than a young child.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/police_ask_media_for_footage_o.html

"Authorities are asking media to give them copies of any video interviews with students, parents or others who said they saw Kyron Horman after 8:45 a.m. on June 4.

Investigators initially said that Kyron Horman was seen by someone around 9 a.m. June 4 at the school. They later amended the timeline, saying he was last seen at 8:45 a.m. by his stepmother, Terri Moulton Horman, as he headed to his classroom."

To make that statement, LE must have discounted the child's account, imo. So I agree with you. But none of us have heard why they did that, so it's still a fly in the ointment for me personally. I would LOVE to hear the explanation, but I fear I'm in for a long wait.

 

[SurfieTX]

When I listened to it/read it, it seemed very clear to me that it must have been at the end. I don't remember why, but I think the child specifically said it was at the end. He also said that the "substitute" then left, which also implies to me that it was at the end. I'll have to go look for the link. At this point, I don't even remember what child said it. I think there's only one that talked about this issue, but I'm not even sure of THAT anymore.

It was TP. http://www.examiner.com/x-46795-Missing-Persons-Examiner~y2010m6d14-Search-for-missing-Kyron-Horman-is-now-a-criminal-case

8-year-old TP, a desk mate of Kyron says, "I went downstairs, and that was the last time I saw him and I never seen him after that," TP told KOIN news. Tanner said, the class was regrouping and it was the substitute that noticed Kyron was missing.

"And she was like 'oh no where's Kyron there's only five' and Mrs. Porter was like it's okay calm down, calm down he's probably in the bathroom or getting a drink of water and she said alright I'm going to leave and she left, " says TP

TP said that he noticed that Kyron was not on the school bus when they were going home."

 

[Littleone48]

It was TP. http://www.examiner.com/x-46795-Missing-Persons-Examiner~y2010m6d14-Search-for-missing-Kyron-Horman-is-now-a-criminal-case

8-year-old TP, a desk mate of Kyron says, "I went downstairs, and that was the last time I saw him and I never seen him after that," TP told KOIN news. Tanner said, the class was regrouping and it was the substitute that noticed Kyron was missing.

"And she was like 'oh no where's Kyron there's only five' and Mrs. Porter was like it's okay calm down, calm down he's probably in the bathroom or getting a drink of water and she said alright I'm going to leave and she left, " says TP

TP said that he noticed that Kyron was not on the school bus when they were going home."

Yes but that still doesn't explain why the teacher would say that he may be getting a drink of water or in the bathroon if she thought SM had taken him with her or why she would "mark" him absent if the SM had taken him out of school early. He was there, she saw him.

 

[human]

It was TP. http://www.examiner.com/x-46795-Missing-Persons-Examiner~y2010m6d14-Search-for-missing-Kyron-Horman-is-now-a-criminal-case

8-year-old TP, a desk mate of Kyron says, "I went downstairs, and that was the last time I saw him and I never seen him after that," TP told KOIN news. Tanner said, the class was regrouping and it was the substitute that noticed Kyron was missing.

"And she was like 'oh no where's Kyron there's only five' and Mrs. Porter was like it's okay calm down, calm down he's probably in the bathroom or getting a drink of water and she said alright I'm going to leave and she left, " says TP

TP said that he noticed that Kyron was not on the school bus when they were going home."

to me, that sounds like at the beginning of the tour.

"I went downstairs ..." His classroom is upstairs, not downstairs.

 

[wondering1]

Yes but that still doesn't explain why the teacher would say that he may be getting a drink of water or in the bathroon if she thought SM had taken him with her or why she would "mark" him absent if the SM had taken him out of school early. He was there, she saw him.

I have to agree with that, too. This interview is the one thing about the whole case that I really can't explain and gives me the slightest bit of pause. Other than the fact that the statements were made by a child, so are inherently less reliable, he seems pretty darn credible with the level and apparent consistency of detail, etc.

Again, I would love to hear why LE is discounting him.

 

[human]

Yes but that still doesn't explain why the teacher would say that he may be getting a drink of water or in the bathroon if she thought SM had taken him with her or why she would "mark" him absent if the SM had taken him out of school early. He was there, she saw him.

at the beginning of the tour.

The teacher assigned Kyron to that group, wasn't focused on what the kid was saying, said something just to answer him, and then remembered that Terri had left with him to the doctor.

I answer things sometimes when I am focusing on something else. A wrong answer because I am concentrating on something that needs my focus.

In my mind, "Don't bug me. I am thinking about x".

 

[human]

For example, I spend a lot of time outdoors because I LOVE the outdoors. I have my hubby's lap top out in my gazebo.

I went in the house today and there was his lap top on the table.

He said, "Sit down at the table".

I was ticked as I wanted to go back outside as it was really nice out.

I said, "No. I am going out."

He said, "Go sit at the table."

I went over to the table, and my family had purchased a new lap top for me that had the message scrolling "Happy Birthday!" It's not for a week.

But I was involved in my own drama in my head, and I noticed that the lap top was a little different, but it was of no importance in the scheme of things.

I think that's how this stuff happens.

 

[wondering1]

at the beginning of the tour.

The teacher assigned Kyron to that group, wasn't focused on what the kid was saying, said something just to answer him, and then remembered that Terri had left with him to the doctor.

I answer things sometimes when I am focusing on something else. A wrong answer because I am concentrating on something that needs my focus.

In my mind, "Don't bug me. I am thinking about x".

I don't know if we can post the vid of the interview here. The one I'm finding is on YT. If you listen to the video and the reporter, it's clear they are saying that the re-grouping happened at the end of the fair. So if the reporter is paraphrasing the rest of what the child actually said in the full interview (1) TH last saw Kyron at the beginning of the guided tour of the science fair (8:45 or as late as 9:00ish); (2) Kyron was with his group at the beginning of the tour, but not at the end; (3) the teacher thought he might have just gone to the rest room or water fountain at that time; and (4) it did not occur to the teacher for the entire rest of the day that Kyron never showed up back in the classroom or, if it did occur to her, she recalled a different explanation for why he was there at the beginning of the tour and not the end (oh yeah, Kyron had an appt today ?) or, the teacher is complicit in his disappearance.

just thinking out loud, jmo.

eta: based on Littleone's post below, which is correct I think, the teacher did mark him absent. So my first option under (4) also is off the table.

 

[Littleone48]

at the beginning of the tour.

The teacher assigned Kyron to that group, wasn't focused on what the kid was saying, said something just to answer him, and then remembered that Terri had left with him to the doctor.

I answer things sometimes when I am focusing on something else. A wrong answer because I am concentrating on something that needs my focus.

In my mind, "Don't bug me. I am thinking about x".

This is the last thing I am going to say on this subject until we hear/understand why this is being discounted. I promise.

I too answer things when I am focusing on something else but why didn't she just say "he went with his mother" if in fact that's what she thought. I don't think she knows because at 10am she marked him "absent".

I would hope they are not CYA (this is not the time). I would be interested to know how many times Kryon was taken out of school early by SM. To mark a child "absent" after seeing him at the school and without knowing what happened to him scares me.

 

[Mellen]

to me, that sounds like at the beginning of the tour.

"I went downstairs ..." His classroom is upstairs, not downstairs.

This link has a reprint of the original KOIN article (which is no longer available on KOIN's site) of the interview with TP. This article makes it clearer that he was talking about the end of the tour (BBM):

"... the first person to notice Kyron Horman was missing was a substitute teacher who was taking a head count as the second and third grade class was re-assembling after visiting other classrooms for a science fair at Skyline School last Friday. "And she was like 'oh no where's Kyron there's only five' and Mrs. Porter was like it's okay calm down, calm down he's probably in the bathroom or getting a drink of water and she said alright I'm going to leave and she left ..."

http://www.cafemom.com/group/416/forums/read/11585242/Missing_Oregon_boy_Kyron_Horman_Updated

 

[cluciano63]

LE probably discounted dozens of accounts after they gathered more and more information. I feel that there must be a good reason that LE came out and said that Terri was the last person to see Kyron, since up until then, it was stated that he was seen as late as 9:00 and even "late morning" in one account, if I remember correctly. I do not believe they would rule anyone out simply because it does not fit their theory, or to protect the school, or because a child said it, as I do not believe that they would indicate quite strongly that this (isolated incident) was not something that the community as a whole should fear if they did not have good reason to say that.

If the child'a account was ruled out, it is most likely because a number of adults were able to tell LE exactly when the group was where and maybe the teacher even said Kyron had been long by then. Or maybe this child's version happened before 8:30. We just don't know, and we probably won't unless and until there is a trial.

I wish that was the only thing bothering me about this entire case I am worried that if no one saw Kyron leave the building, no one will ever be charged with whatever has become of him.

 

[Calliope]

LE better have some darn good evidence to refute T's version of events. Because you can bet Houze is planning to use him in Terri's defense.

 

[human]

This link has a reprint of the original KOIN article (which is no longer available on KOIN's site) of the interview with TP. This article makes it clearer that he was talking about the end of the tour (BBM):

"... the first person to notice Kyron Horman was missing was a substitute teacher who was taking a head count as the second and third grade class was re-assembling after visiting other classrooms for a science fair at Skyline School last Friday. "And she was like 'oh no where's Kyron there's only five' and Mrs. Porter was like it's okay calm down, calm down he's probably in the bathroom or getting a drink of water and she said alright I'm going to leave and she left ..."

http://www.cafemom.com/group/416/forums/read/11585242/Missing_Oregon_boy_Kyron_Horman_Updated

I ,too, am flummoxed about this.

But the child is saying he went downstairs when his classroom is upstairs.

 

[human]

LE probably discounted dozens of accounts after they gathered more and more information. I feel that there must be a good reason that LE came out and said that Terri was the last person to see Kyron, since up until then, it was stated that he was seen as late as 9:00 and even "late morning" in one account, if I remember correctly. I do not believe they would rule anyone out simply because it does not fit their theory, or to protect the school, or because a child said it, as I do not believe that they would indicate quite strongly that this (isolated incident) was not something that the community as a whole should fear if they did not have good reason to say that.

If the child'a account was ruled out, it is most likely because a number of adults were able to tell LE exactly when the group was where and maybe the teacher even said Kyron had been long by then. Or maybe this child's version happened before 8:30. We just don't know, and we probably won't unless and until there is a trial.

I wish that was the only thing bothering me about this entire case I am worried that if no one saw Kyron leave the building, no one will ever be charged with whatever has become of him.

I hope that is what has happened.

I pray he doesn't end up being a child that is gone forever with no clue where.

People can smote me if they wish, but I hope that Terri takes up drinking again and says things that she shouldn't.

 

[SurfieTX]

"... the first person to notice Kyron Horman was missing was a substitute teacher who was taking a head count as the second and third grade class was re-assembling after visiting other classrooms for a science fair at Skyline School last Friday. "And she was like 'oh no where's Kyron there's only five' and Mrs. Porter was like it's okay calm down, calm down he's probably in the bathroom or getting a drink of water and she said alright I'm going to leave and she left ..."

Context is everything.

A: Re-assembling is a word used by the writer. One could possibly infer that 're-assembling' meant that the kids were gathering finally in their homerooms/classrooms with the teacher/chaperons and that the initial assembly was with parents/friends before the 8:35 warning bell and the 8:45 final bell.

B: The author of the article said, "substitute," when that has been refuted by the school district and other parents. They were teacher's aides or chaperons.

It'll take a whole lotta' witnesses and statements to back up the inconsistencies reported in the media. I tend to think that LE and adult statements will trump 7 and 8 y/o statements of the events that day, but that's just me.

 

[cluciano63]

I am a little worried that LE might be trying to make their theory work, i.e. it being Terri. Which might be why they are checking and re-checking, just trying to get that one person who can say they saw Terri and Kyron nearing an exit, in the lot, or better yet, climbing into the truck. I think it is pretty clear they have not been told that as yet.

I hope they are not that certain and focused, unless they have more reason than we know. Hoping it is more than guy feelings and some iffy LD tests.

 

[scotslass]

I am a little worried that LE might be trying to make their theory work, i.e. it being Terri. Which might be why they are checking and re-checking, just trying to get that one person who can say they saw Terri and Kyron nearing an exit, in the lot, or better yet, climbing into the truck. I think it is pretty clear they have not been told that as yet.

I hope they are not that certain and focused, unless they have more reason than we know. Hoping it is more than guy feelings and some iffy LD tests.

I believe they must have some more indication than the failed poly's etc. I think the timeline and venue are the key to implicating TH. i'm on the fence but the venue is what has me stuck and the very tight timeline ironically not in that it exonerates Th but in that it implicates her. I also think that is the thoughts of the family perhaps from Briefs from LE as they have stated in the MSM that they feel this has been planned.

JMO

adding this from my post in another thread to help explain myself

I also bolded the question on the venue as when it comes down to it i cannot think of a better alibi than your child being at school in the care of the state. For me it is something that set this whole case apart kids do not vanish from school or let me rephrase by saying no child should ever vanish from school. If we feel our children are not safe in school where are they safe?? If TH is responsible then i feel this fact (the choice of venue) was a very clever choice and shows this was well thought out. It is actually the one point that I cannot just get past. It sets up for some very credible witnesses to where Kyron was that morning and almost makes it implausible that she could have taken him. This truly scares me in either scenario that A) someone could walk in and take a child with no one noticing in one of the places we all feel our children should be safe. B) that TH is that devious.

The time frame is tight and why i think LE are all over it with surveillance videos and re interviewing. Radell Hunter had a good geographical profile on the timeline that really narrows it down. For me going with that profile I would have to go with a well planned event and not an covered up accident in TH is involved.

Link to that profile

http://www.associatedcontent.com/art...eo.html?cat=25

JMO..

 

[BeanE]

KATU - Story Updated: Jul 23, 2010 at 7:17 PM PDT

Sources detail Terri’s timeline day Kyron disappeared

According to multiple sources, Terri Moulton Horman says she left Skyline School at 8:45 in the morning without Kyron the day he disappeared and that between 8:45 a.m. and 10:10 a.m. she ran errands at local grocery stores and can prove it.

snip

Between 10:10 in the morning and 11:39, Terri said she drove her daughter K around on rural roads in the family’s white truck because K had an earache. She said she was trying to soothe the toddler with the motion of the vehicle.

snip

At 11:39 a.m., Terri checked in at a 24-hour Fitness in Beaverton on Waterhouse Avenue and worked out for about an hour until 12:40 p.m.

By 1:21, Terri said she'd traveled home - a distance of nearly 11 miles - and was posting photos on Facebook she'd taken that morning of Kyron standing with his science project and of his friend, K, standing with his.

Sources said she also e-mailed the teacher to find out when she could come pick up the project as she had not taken it home.

http://www.katu.com/news/local/99151549.html

 

[Mamietwo]

KATU - Story Updated: Jul 23, 2010 at 7:17 PM PDT

Sources detail Terri’s timeline day Kyron disappeared

According to multiple sources, Terri Moulton Horman says she left Skyline School at 8:45 in the morning without Kyron the day he disappeared and that between 8:45 a.m. and 10:10 a.m. she ran errands at local grocery stores and can prove it.

snip

Between 10:10 in the morning and 11:39, Terri said she drove her daughter Kiara around on rural roads in the family’s white truck because Kiara had an earache. She said she was trying to soothe the toddler with the motion of the vehicle.

snip

At 11:39 a.m., Terri checked in at a 24-hour Fitness in Beaverton on Waterhouse Avenue and worked out for about an hour until 12:40 p.m.

By 1:21, Terri said she'd traveled home - a distance of nearly 11 miles - and was posting photos on Facebook she'd taken that morning of Kyron standing with his science project and of his friend, Kurtis, standing with his.

Sources said she also e-mailed the teacher to find out when she could come pick up the project as she had not taken it home.

http://www.katu.com/news/local/99151549.html

Oh thank you, you wonderful person you! This makes my night complete!

 

[Kat]

Snipped from link in post #1

Between 10:10 in the morning and 11:39, Terri said she drove her daughter Kiara around on rural roads in the family’s white truck because Kiara had an earache. She said she was trying to soothe the toddler with the motion of the vehicle.

This is the time period I'm curious about. JMHO.