Trayvon's injuries, per the leaked autopsy report

[cityslick]

Trayvon fell on his face with his hands under him because he was standing up with his arms stretched out holding on to Zimmerman's gun hand when he shot him. He died instantly. imo

That means 'John' is lying because didn't he say he saw the two scuffle on the ground?

 

[gxm]

In point of fact, I have never seen a fight, been in a fight, had a broken nose seven times, or even once. I have never been in a situation where a fight broke out and it is unlikely I ever will be. But logic must insist,however, one does not have to personally participate in a fistfight or even witness one to know that if someone beats someone within an inch of their life, the beater will show some physical sign of it. Maybe if a person who was unconscious or a person with no arms was being beaten, but otherwise, no. It would be a reflex to try to defend oneself. I have seen no mention of GZ having defensive wounds. And I certainly have seen no evidence that TM took GZ's head in his hands and beat it against a sidewalk. Two minor wounds which look like puncture wounds? No way. While it is true, which had been mentioned somewhat earlier, that it would be easy to beat a cantaloupe or watermelon against a cement walkway, fruit doesn't have reflexes as humans do, nor do they offer resistance. Any person, no matter who it might be, would offer some defense in a situation as claimed and would have the injuries to show for it.
Unless......Someone approached you from behind, tried to detain you and spun you around and shot you. That would leave little opportunity to defend oneself. And, IMO, that's what happened.

I was attacked in a similar manner as GZ describes and I did not fight back or attempt to hit my attacker. All of my effort was directed toward getting away and sheltering myself from the blows. And, I know I'm a broken record, but: I did not have any cuts on my head, just very painful lumps that made it unbearable to wash or brush my hair.

Other victims of violence have had different experiences. But this was my experience and it's one of the reasons I find GZ's story plausible.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:

 

[tehcloser]

Are these first reports to be ignored now because NBC spoke with Crump?

WFTV

WFTV has learned that the medical examiner found two injuries on Martin’s body: The fatal gunshot wound and broken skin on his knuckles.

NBC spoke with Crump? Well either way, they had the autopsy report. Which I believe is more than the others had so yes, I am ignoring the reports that came out before that didn't have the autopsy report.

 

[believe09]

Then presumably Zimmerman would wiggle out from underneath him, which could explain why Trayvon was face down.

Then I would think GZ had a lot of blood on his shirt...

 

[jjenny]

Then I would think GZ had a lot of blood on his shirt...

Not if the bleeding was mostly internal.

 

[LC446]

I was attacked in a similar manner as GZ describes and I did not fight back or attempt to hit my attacker. All of my effort was directed toward getting away and sheltering myself from the blows. And, I know I'm a broken record, but: I did not have any cuts on my head, just very painful lumps that made it unbearable to wash or brush my hair.

Other victims of violence have had different experiences. But this was my experience and it's one of the reasons I find GZ's story plausible.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:

I appreciate that you've shared this story with us. It does provide me a different perspective. I would like to ask a few questions but completely understand if you're uncomfortable answering. After you were attacked, were the only injuries you sustained the lumps on your head? You describe sheltering yourself. Did your arms have any bruising on them? It would seem a perfectly natural reaction to protect your head so I'm curious if there was any bruising due to the blows glancing off your arms as you protected yourself.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

BBM

This may not be accurate as I know for a fact that during a tachychardia episode I was injected with a medication in my groin and my heart STOPPED.

I know what I said I simply can't repeat it before the heart started beating again.

Right, and half your heart wasn't blown out by a bullet dropping your BP instantly to zero, your circulation system was intact.

 

[K_Z]

--if trayvon was "straddling" george at the time that he shot him, wouldn't trayvon have fallen forward and right on top of george at that point?

From purely a gravity perspective, that does seem likely, if they were in that position. But I sure can't say for sure.

I have read in several places that the impact from a 9mm at close range is not enough to knock a person back. I'll look for the links again.

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stopping_power"]Stopping power - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[i.b.nora]

I agree, the idea that TM was standing when he was shot goes against more than one witness statement of a scuffle. It still also doesn't explain GZ's injuries. How did he get two black eyes?

As written in the report on George's visit to his family doctor, the black eyes are a result of the slightly broken nose.

 

[i.b.nora]

Includes a video of the report and a transcription of the report:

‘Intermediate range’ shot killed Trayvon Martin

"The autopsy report on Trayvon Martin shows he died from a single gunshot wound to the chest fired from “intermediate range.” The official report also found Martin had a small abrasion on his left ring finger below the knuckle. NBC’s Kerry Sanders reports."

 

[IzzyBlanche]

The problem is, no witness AFAIK saw the shot. So we have no way of knowing what position GZ and TM were in at the exact moment. Either one or both could have been partly standing. We just don't know.

 

[Lovelymountains]

And how did you come up with the scenario of Trayvon being "spun around" and then shot?
The witnesses that did see something describe the two of them as "wrestling."
There are screams for help heard for some period of time, which certainly doesn't support the idea of Trayvon being "spun around" and then shot.
And while there might be inconsistencies between witnesses, I don't see any statements that support "spun around" then shot scenario.

Nor did I say there was. What I said was there is no witness to the actual shooting of which we are aware. Witnesses were doing other things, chasing their dog, running up stairs, staying away from windows, etc. So, judging from the position of Trayvon's body, i.e. face down with his hands under his body, there is no way he could have been shot while he was on top of GZ. I think it is possible that he was trying to leave, was spun around and shot, and fell face down. It will be interesting when the complete autopsy is released. I do not believe it happened as GZ said, and apparently neither does the state. We shall see.

 

[i.b.nora]

I could have sworn this was a thread about Trayvon's Injuries per the leaked autopsy report.

 

[beach]

I could have sworn this was a thread about Trayvon's Injuries per the leaked autopsy report.

Locking up.

Will reopen when I remove all the off topic posts.

 

[beach]

Okay you guys, it took 2 mods 2 hours to clean this thread up. We removed about 25% of the posts on this thread. Discussion ranging from SYG laws, GZ's injuries, Frank Taaffe (???), etc, etc etc....

No general discussion threads here anymore. Topical threads only. I realize that is a lot of lost work but if you want your posts to stand, you have got to post them on the topical threads. If you choose to post them off topic, be willing to lose them.

I am going to open a new thread for discussion about the physical altercation between TM and GZ because that seemed to be the point where this thread totally went into the ditches.

 

[jjenny]

Marijuana is one drug, not drugs. No other drugs were found in his system.

Complain to abc, since that is the title they are using.

 

[i.b.nora]

"Reefer Madness"

 

[jaded cat]

Complain to abc, since that is the title they are using.

I don't care, it was posted as factual. It's not. The end.

 

[jaded cat]

"Reefer Madness"

I wonder if I could be declared an expert on marijuana! I have plenty of experience.

 

[beach]

Please....let's just get the discussion in one spot for now. Then we can break out into topics.

We do not want to this info to get lost amongst umpteen threads.

Thanks much for your help.


[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7931365#post7931365"]LINK TO DOC DUMP THREAD.[/ame]


Please link the doc dump thread on any thread here where you see the info being discussed. Thanks for your help! xoxo