Trial Discussion Thread #22 - 14.04.10, Day 20

[Cherwell]

Roux has stated they heard crying but not screaming. The day after Oscar testified he'd never screamed like that before in his life.

Ah, I see - when Roux just made a passing reference. Not the same as reading out the entire statement, which happens sometimes in English courts when a witness doesn't need to appear in person. I expect these unnamed witnesses will appear in due course, but I will wait to hear what they have to say themselves.

 

[soozieqtips]

Hey Trooper - glad to see you back :smile:

Not sure if you ever read this post, but it's very interesting and highlights some very weak points in OP's version of accounts.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Trial Discussion Thread #20 - 14.04.08, Day 20

 

[Britlaws]

Interesting that according to Barry Bateman, OP never ever looks at Nel, just towards the judge.

 

[BritsKate]

Ah, I see - when Roux just made a passing reference. Not the same as reading out the entire statement, which happens sometimes in English courts when a witness doesn't need to appear in person. I expect these unnamed witnesses will appear in due course, but I will wait to hear what they have to say themselves.

Indeed. Either way there's an issue - Oscar maintains it was he who was screaming, not Reeva, yet these neighbors apparently didn't hear any screams - a woman's or not.


Please pardon errors as posted via Tapatalk with a less than stellar user.

 

[soozieqtips]

Why would Nel need to measure a wire that is of an obvious length to the naked eye? But I am sure they did and it is in the forensics report that was put in to evidence; otherwise OP would not have answered with all of his conspiracy theory nonsense that his experts will be proving. And he would not have admitted that with the fan where it is he could not get out on to the balcony to yell help, help, help.

It now appears definite and essential that the DT bring testimony and evidence that the police rearranged the crime scene. Sorry folks, but for me the fairy tale has completely gotten out of hand. Someone please tell me how wrong I am and how the DT is going to pull off this new added miracle. Please, tell me.

I don't really understand the whole thing about the duvet. Where's Nel going with that? Is it that Reeva kicked it off when she ran to escape? And if OP put it there himself for some reason, wouldn't it stand to reason he'd put it back if its position on the floor was incriminating? I'm a bit lost with the whole duvet saga.

 

[turaj]

Boy OP has his own version of "responsiblity"...interesting that his "friends" are sitting there with the father...basically OP is on the stand blaming Fresco and he sits there...must be under pressure of father or something. Pathetic.

 

[04009margaret]

On the right side of the bed we have 2 ipads, the charging system for OP's trimmer & at the bottom r/h side of the bed we have OP's prosthetic legs. Also remember, there was testimony that the 2 ipads were synched together, an ipad 2 & an ipad 3. When you upgrade your ipad to a newer version you synch the 2 ipads together, this is why both were registered as the owner being OP. Why were all these items on the right side of the bed if OP slept on the l/h side of the bed? Because it didn't happen, another thing OP today stated it was Reeva watching the tv. Now with the doona being how it is on the floor, it reminds me of when my children were younger & at school. If I had trouble getting them up I used to rip the doona off them & throw it on the floor, just like the doona is here. I am starting to think that when OP woke up he was agitated at Reeva for not locking the patio doors & he has ripped the doona off Reeva in anger.

 

[emmavoberry]

Leaving aside the question of OP's guilt or innocence, his self-serving theatrics are offensive, certainly to Mrs. Steenkamp. How does he dare? And now moaning he never got a chance to tell Reeva he loved her! Has he no empathy or insight? His lawyers should tell him to tone it down. As tragic as he might consider Reeva's death FOR HIM, her mother must watch this carrying on; there is no comparing his situation to hers.
http://time.com/57127/pistorius-selfish-in-relationship-with-steenkamp/

 

[Insp.Dots]

Why would "police errors" affect sentencing?

Sorry, I didn't make that clear. I mean it could possibly have an affect on the overall outcome. What I mean (sorry I'm tired at mo ) and bothers me is that if the Judge gives him the benefit of doubt in the long run because she can't be sure of some pieces of evidence, it would be a travesty in getting Justice for Reeva and her family.

My reason for pause with regard to this is an Interview that Hilton Botha gave very early on (sorry cannot link) when he said he assumed straight away it was Murder, OP had admitted firing the gun so he saw no reason to worry too much about wearing gloves and collection of evidence.
In his opinion they had there man and he'd admitted killing Reeva, end of story.

He was shortly after kicked off the case and then the charges he faced came out and out of the Police.

Some said he was at the end of his police service, he'd come up against OP before and didn't like his attitude. Some others go as far as saying, that when he realized OP was claiming self-defence, he couldn't believe it and altered certain things at the scene.
I suspect as with most things in this case, there are bits of truth in this mixed with untruths. I hope they call him, he is on the list.

I genuinely hope Reeva gets Justice and was horrified that his or others lacking could have happened at all. ALL MOO, hope it makes sense

 

[kaos]

The bit where I'm struggling to come up with his intent to kill Reeva rather than an intruder is that she had her phone in the bathroom and Nel didn't put forward any evidence of calls made from it at the time of the shooting. That's assuming of course that OP never put the phone in the bathroom himself.

 

[04009margaret]

I got lost with the cord bit.... does Nel have evidence to prove the extention cord socket with the hair trimmer and fan plugs in it could not have moved? OP was saying something like it had plenty of extra cord to be used. It's length would settle it but do you think he has that now? if he got hold of it now and it was too long, he'd look a bit foolish.

I think the answer maybe in yesterdays testimony. I have a feeling OP may have committed to the extension cord was in that position.

 

[turaj]

So father sits there sipping coffee looking very proud of his son and the woman to his right (don't know who she is) smiles and seems very amused as OP is caught in lie after lie. Anyone know what her game is or who she is??? And now I heard that they really have had no relationship...I did not know that...indeed OP has not had a great family life...seems like aunt and uncle are much more engaged.

 

[sleuth-d-]

I don't really understand the whole thing about the duvet. Where's Nel going with that? Is it that Reeva kicked it off when she ran to escape? And if OP put it there himself for some reason, wouldn't it stand to reason he'd put it back if its position on the floor was incriminating? I'm a bit lost with the whole duvet saga.

imo

the duvet highlights part of nel's approach.

he is chopping and changing between small details and large incriminating stuff.

if op is telling the complete truth, he will have no problem with this.

if he if fabricating, he will constantly be trying to 'cover' all of nel's questions... not knowing which are the significant ones.

this is going to be a huge strain if it is the case. and will break op story down eventually.

for instance
the picture of the fans was introduced yesterday, so that nel could get op to say nothing was untoward with it... yet today - now it is significant - he is saying the objects have been moved.

 

[Viper]

I don't really understand the whole thing about the duvet. Where's Nel going with that? Is it that Reeva kicked it off when she ran to escape? And if OP put it there himself for some reason, wouldn't it stand to reason he'd put it back if its position on the floor was incriminating? I'm a bit lost with the whole duvet saga.

Not just the duvet. Pistorius now asserts that almost everything in the bedroom, including the light of the lamp being switched on, was placed where it is by the police - especially the large fan blocking his exit - or in some cases he does not remember placing those things where they are. Nel has just started on the duvet.

Pistorius is telling the court that a conspiracy of bumbling cops moved almost everything in his room before the photos were taken. And on top of that he is telling us that his experts will prove that out. It is just too much really for me at this point. Just too much.

 

[BritsKate]

I don't really understand the whole thing about the duvet. Where's Nel going with that? Is it that Reeva kicked it off when she ran to escape? And if OP put it there himself for some reason, wouldn't it stand to reason he'd put it back if its position on the floor was incriminating? I'm a bit lost with the whole duvet saga.

Nel brought up it being on the floor after Oscar said it was on the bed covering Reeva's lower legs; after he said it was pitch black and he couldn't see her.

Please pardon errors as posted via Tapatalk with a less than stellar user.

 

[Magdalyn]

09.07 On Reeva's claim that she was scared of him sometimes,

Oscar says that she was scared of the feelings she had for him.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...756728/Oscar-Pistorius-murder-trial-live.html

I think it's interesting how OP interpreted the words 'scared of you'to mean 'scared of the feelings I have for you.

That is the most self-serving interpretation of that phrase one could possibly come up with. At least he's consistent.

 

[Insp.Dots]

Okay. I understood that still to mean she was scared of him sometimes, in that his reactions (behaviour?) scared her sometimes. I can understand someone being overwhelmed by feelings for someone else, but not that 'scared of you' and 'scared by my feelings for you' mean the same thing at all.

Not sure what Reeva meant but could well mean his quick temper.
I do however have to admit, I have told someone I'm scared of my feelings for them....meaning I'm scared of falling for them and getting hurt-emotionally!:twocents:

 

[soozieqtips]

The bit where I'm struggling to come up with his intent to kill Reeva rather than an intruder is that she had her phone in the bathroom and Nel didn't put forward any evidence of calls made from it at the time of the shooting. That's assuming of course that OP never put the phone in the bathroom himself.

Maybe there was no signal in the toilet (if she had it in there).
We don't know where it actually was, only that OP said he found it in the toilet.

 

[aa9511]

nel...... if we deal with this scene, evening of 13, 14 feb.. only two people in the house.. one is dead. you are the only one who can tell us .. we have to rely on you for the insight into the relationship...

ive had a look at your relationship.. jan and feb.. how would you describe it??

Oscar.. Ide describe it as good.. we were starting to open up, trust each other. learn more about each other..

Nel. end of jan. beginning of Feb.. that's when there were arguments about what was important to you. all about you.

Oscar.. I think our relationship got stronger. they weren't arguments.. they didn't turn into fights..

Nel. apart from boo boo ba ba... you never seem to write long messages..

Oscar.. I was on my phone for other reasons.. I didn't write, I spoke on the phone to her..

bbm

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

Nel is starting to remind me more and more of my dear Juan

 

[liesbeth]

Roux said something the other day about those who the state never called only being witness to crying IIRC.

The interesting thing would be if these witnesses are all three Sotho speakers. (Sotho is one of the local languages in South Africa.) Because in Sotho the word crying also means "words shouted or screamed" or yelling.

http://glosbe.com/en/st/cry