Trial Discussion Thread #47 - 14.07.8, Day 38

[MeeBee]

Does anybody think Roux actually believed his client or was just doing his job and putting forward his best defence?

I think he believes him.

 

[foxbluff]

The most credible witness imo was private citizen Ms. Burger who testified she heard 4 shots, with a pause after the first, later corroborated by Mangena. I can't remember if Wolmarans agreed re the pause, but his admission that he never asked OP how he held the gun, where in the room he fired it, or anything else, corroborates Ms B's evidence imo. And where's that defense witness Roux told Ms. Burger would testify that OP's screams sound female?

I, too, think Ms. Burger was excellent!

BBM - My guess would be that defense witness is on extended vacation with those people OP said would come and say he was not mean to RS.

Just jumping off Deb's post here with Qs:

If OP fired shots in a dark bathroom, would there have been muzzle flashes? Was that ever mentioned?

 

[G.bng]

BBM

That wasn't clear from your post: "And let's face it every time a witness came in there were frantic attempts here and in other blogs to find a photo, a cv, i.e. glean anything and everything possible about them." I wasn't aware that anyone had tried to post photos of private witnesses anywhere, but I may have missed something.

My reply was not a dig nor me trying to be facetious, and a sincere mea culpa if I didn't explain myself correctly and had you confused. And IMBW, but I do seem to recall people here and elsewhere looking up facebook pages, photos, of private witnesses. In any case, I can assure you I realise the difference between the privacy of an expert witness who earns a living giving evidence, albeit as with Lin I have no qualms with their not wanting to be filmed, and that of some poor b****r who through no action of their own suddenly finds themselves embroiled in a mess like this. I really pity them whatever their testimony, because I maybe naive in this, not much else I might say, but yes probably naive in thinking that most such witnesses genuinely believe what they say and want to get it right even if at times may get it wrong.

 

[Viper]

Quote:

“He initially denied having suicidal thoughts but indicated that he does think that things would be easier if he was dead,” she wrote.


Ms Fernihough wrote that Pistorius had largely stopped exercising and lost 10kg (22lb). She said he was suffering from severe depression and had no direction in life.


“I was someone going somewhere, I was so positive about my future, I was a person who loved being around people, especially my family and friends,” she said the athlete told her, adding: “We had such a bright future and now it is dark.”

BIB. No kidding!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...dcast-of-Steenkamp-shooting-re-enactment.html

 

[foxbluff]

BBM

That wasn't clear from your post: "And let's face it every time a witness came in there were frantic attempts here and in other blogs to find a photo, a cv, i.e. glean anything and everything possible about them." I wasn't aware that anyone had tried to post photos of private witnesses anywhere, but I may have missed something.

BBM - I recall a photo of the Stipps, enjoying a dinner out, that made the rounds.

 

[Viper]

I think he believes him.

That does raise the question of which of OPs stories does Roux believe? There are several.

 

[MeeBee]

The vast majority of us would be lost without their explanations of the SA judicial system and many here would value their opinion above that of joe bloggs so to dismiss their comments isn't fair.

Or to dismiss their comments only when they don't agree with what is being said and keep the rest.

 

[MeeBee]

That does raise the question of which of OPs stories does Roux believe? There are several.

I believe he believes it was an accident. And I believe there has only been one story with much nitpicking to make them sound vastly different.

 

[G.bng]

Anyone know where sent or reply private messages are stored since none of mine are filed so if they were ever there, I never checked until today so it may be they are never stored, they have apparently vamoosed!

 

[MeeBee]

Anyone know where sent or reply private messages are stored since none of mine are filed so if they were ever there, I never checked until today so it may be they are never stored, they have apparently vamoosed!

I had this problem before too and it was because my settings were set to not store sent messages. You can turn it on in your settings, but I forgot exactly how to do it.

 

[Feynman]

Speaking about smoking guns - I thought the gun was supposed to be on the side of the bed near the balcony yet in the video OP gets the gun from the other side?

No, OP's story has always been the gun was under the bed on the left side (as you look at the bed from in front), the side away from the balcony.

 

[G.bng]

I had this problem before too and it was because my settings were set to not store sent messages. You can turn it on in your settings, but I forgot exactly how to do it.

Thanx MB, Now I know there's a setting I can try to find out. I reckon it's since the layout change because I just remembered I did once re-read my reply to a poster a month or so back. Another tip... any idea if there's a way to know if someone replies to one of your posts or replies like the notification box in wordpress?

 

[MeeBee]

Thanx MB, Now I know there's a setting I can try to find out. I reckon it's since the layout change because I just remembered I did once re-read my reply to a poster a month or so back. Another tip... any idea if there's a way to know if someone replies to one of your posts or replies like the notification box in wordpress?

Mmmm, that may be beyond my technical knowledge lol. I remember something where you could see how many replies you got to a post but not sure. I don't know about notifications, I've never got them but some people say they have. A mod will probably be able to help you out there.

 

[kittychi]

Sad that witnesses refused to testify because they did not want to be subjected to the publicity of having their voices heard in the trial

One witness for Prosecution that we know of got a threatening phone call:

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/pi...al-witness-gets-threatening-phone-call-n44651

 

[foxbluff]

Anyone know where sent or reply private messages are stored since none of mine are filed so if they were ever there, I never checked until today so it may be they are never stored, they have apparently vamoosed!

O/T - BBM - G.bng, I haven't checked on mine since new format. However, since the "thanks" button seems to have turned into a magic act of "now you see it, now you don't" perhaps you should try again.:facepalm:

Back on/T: I hope we don't have to wait an entire month with nothing new and exciting to mull over. Have my fingers crossed for a leaky...

 

[MeeBee]

O/T - BBM - G.bng, I haven't checked on mine since new format. However, since the "thanks" button seems to have turned into a magic act of "now you see it, now you don't" perhaps you should try again.:facepalm:

Back on/T: I hope we don't have to wait an entire month with nothing new and exciting to mull over. Have my fingers crossed for a leaky...

Just in case anyone missed it, because I know I did for a bit and was confused (and almost reported several people's posts, lol) the "thanks" button is now over on the right side next to the reply buttons.

 

[Interested Bystander]

I have just been reading some articles about witnesses who refused to testify. No names of course. What still baffles me (and many of us) is that the one witness, who was IN the house at the time, has claimed he heard nothing and so was not called. This, to me, is the most dishonest action anyone can take. He has to know what happened as he obviously was awake and was outside before almost anyone else. If his neighbours heard something, IMO, so did he. There was only a door between him and the rest of the house. This trial could have been over in a week if he had testified. I think absolutely the only reason why he didn't is because he was corrupted by someone. If there was no story to tell, he could have taken the stand and proved it. I know he would have lost his job but who would want to live with a dreadful secret like that forever on their conscience. I hope one day he will come good and tell all but I guess money talks.

We no longer have the double jeopardy rule in the UK. Is it still functioning in SA?

 

[Paysee]

I'm sure I remember people trying to find pictures of Samantha Taylor and researching Mrs Burger's university background. I may be wrong but think that did happen.

I admit it. I did look up information on some of the witness on the internet. I do not feel any shame or remorse about it. I was curious to fix a face to the voices I heard testifying, so I went and googled them.

I did not go visit them in person, phone them or email them. Or even look to see if they had facebook or twitter profiles. All I could find about them was what they themselves had posted on the www or what other websites had posted. I did not stalk them.

This is the age of information and the internet. After all, we can follow this case only because its streaming live on the web, and we are all are here talking with each other only because of the web.

I would say, if some one has to be blamed for this alleged violation of privacy, blame Pistorius. Why did he have to murder his girlfriend in that neighbourhood! Or shoot his gun in that restaurant! But this can happen to anyone of us, anywhere - if we make the news, that info is there for anyone who know how to use a search engine to see.

Its disingenuous to say, "ok watch the trial live, ok come to ws to discuss it, but how dare you look up witness info".

 

[BritsKate]

Sad that witnesses refused to testify because they did not want to be subjected to the publicity of having their voices heard in the trial

Sadder still that lay witnesses who were brave enough to testify in front of an international audience were treated in such a callous, haphazard manner. How many potential witnesses will decide in the future that being belittled to tears or having their phone number publicised - only to be threatened over their testimony - just isn't worth it?

JMO


Please pardon errors as posted via Tapatalk with a less than stellar user.

 

[foxbluff]

I have just been reading some articles about witnesses who refused to testify. No names of course. What still baffles me (and many of us) is that the one witness, who was IN the house at the time, has claimed he heard nothing and so was not called. This, to me, is the most dishonest action anyone can take. He has to know what happened as he obviously was awake and was outside before almost anyone else. If his neighbours heard something, IMO, so did he. There was only a door between him and the rest of the house. This trial could have been over in a week if he had testified. I think absolutely the only reason why he didn't is because he was corrupted by the family. If there was no story to tell, he could have taken the stand and proved it. I know he would have lost his job but who would want to live with a dreadful secret like that forever on their conscience. I hope one day he will come good and tell all but I guess money talks.

We no longer have the double jeopardy rule in the UK. Is it still functioning in SA?

Interesting Q re: if SA has double jeopardy !! I don't know the ans, but look forward to somebody giving one. Btw, am bit surprised it's no longer used in UK. I wonder why? As for the states, it's still the law.

Re: Frank... I really feel sorry for him as he was, imo, in an untenable position. I've been wondering how much money he has already been offered by media. As to him perhaps selling his story after the trial, I have mixed emotions. Cato, who I fully believe lied for OJ during trial, came forth after-the-fact with what I consider to be the truth. That made my blood boil !!

I was disappointed that the Stipps's housekeeper wasn't called to testify. She was, according to Mrs. Stipp, awake at the time of the killing.