TX - Atatiana Jefferson, 28, fatally shot at home, Fort Worth, Oct 2019 *officer charged*

[nrdsb4]

But theoretically if she thought there were intruders in her back yard (not knowing they were police) and they had, in fact, intended to make entry into one of the low and quite accessible windows to steal or kidnap she could then be covered under the castle doctrine law as they made entry into a window. Correct?

Of course. And in Texas, in your own home, there is no duty to retreat when someone forces themselves into your home, unless of course, the tresspasser identifies themselves as law enforcement.

 

[Rocky1]

Under these circumstances, no.
Not that it matters, because she never fired her weapon, but for conversation sake....
The cop was not inside the castle.
The cop was not attempting to break in.
The cop was not attempting to kidnap anyone.
In Tx., you can shoot a thief, but you can't shoot a trespasser.
Nor can you shoot anyone that breaks in to your detached garage, or shed.
The Tx Castle doctrine does not mean you can shoot anyone on your residence.(Property)

Section one, Subsection a. Tx. Penal code 93.1.

 Except as provided in Subsection (b), a person is justified in using force against another when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to protect the actor against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful force.  The actor's belief that the force was immediately necessary as described by this subsection is presumed to be reasonable if the actor:
(A) unlawfully and with force entered, or was attempting to enter unlawfully and with force, the actor's occupied habitation, vehicle, or place of business or employment;

Texas Penal Code § 9.31 | FindLaw
Texas Penal Code § 9.32 | FindLaw

Having said that. I don't believe that cop had any right to shoot her either, and unlike her, he did fire his weapon.
IMO, if he was yelling at her to show her hands, that to me means that he couldn't see her hands, which means he couldn't see a gun. So why would he fear his life was in danger?

But theoretically if she thought there were intruders in her back yard (not knowing they were police) and they had, in fact, intended to make entry into one of the low and quite accessible windows to steal or kidnap she could then be covered under the castle doctrine law as they made entry into a window. Correct?

Yes. Had he broken a window, that would change everything, but as it stands, he didn't, so no, she would not have been able to use deadly force.
Having said that, under Penal code 9,04, she did have a right to display a weapon at the time she saw him outside. She just couldn't use "deadly force."
I just dug this up. It may explain it better than I did.
Scroll down and read the sectioned titled "What about People That Are Only Trespassers.

Understanding the Castle Doctrine - U.S. & Texas LawShield

You still have a legal right to exclude or remove trespassers from your land; however you are limited to only using non-deadly force to do so. The use of force can have many different manifestations, from physical confrontation to displaying a weapon. Texas Penal Code §9.04 states that for defensive purposes the display of a weapon in order to create apprehension in another person is considered a use of force, not deadly force. That means if someone trespasses on your property, you may display your firearm to create apprehension that you will use deadly force if necessary. You will not be legally justified in discharging the firearm, but you will be legally justified in displaying it to “create apprehension” under the law. Only if the trespasser is committing other acts where the law states that you are justified in using deadly force would you be allowed to discharge your firearm legally.

For example, if you are sitting in your living room and see an individual peering in your window, you will probably not be justified under Texas law in using deadly force against the suspicious person. However, if the same fellow breaks a window and climbs through, you will be legally justified in using deadly force under Texas Penal Code §9.32. If you see the same individual scoping out your detached barn, you will not fall under Texas Penal Code §9.32, because it is not considered an occupied habitation. Note under our examples you may very well be justified under another section of the law in the use of deadly force, but not under Texas Penal Code §9.32, or what the media calls the “Castle Doctrine.”

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Fort Worth shooting of Atatiana Jefferson exposes police training failures

 

[imstilla.grandma]

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/local/fort-worth/article236328348.html

 

[Momof4RN]

From the article:

LaRhonda Young, a former Fort Worth police officer from 1992 to 2004 who had once patrolled that neighborhood, said if time permits, officers must adequately scope out a scene before knocking on a door and potentially startling someone.

Young said sensory clues, such as the lights being on inside and it being one of the first cool nights in Fort Worth in days would be signs to assume a burglary wasn't taking place. Walking around the backyard of someone's home in the dark would only escalate the situation, she said.

"I can understand that this is an open structure call and you need to take precaution, but it's just that — take precaution," Young said. "Take in your surroundings."

She said it's less a failure of training that an officer would respond in the way Dean reportedly did and more that Dean, a rookie officer, is likely learning from other rookies with less than five years experience.

Craig Miller, a former deputy chief of police in Dallas, said overnight shifts in larger police departments are typically given to junior officers who have less seniority.

Young said it's incumbent upon all officers to have better relationships in the communities they serve so they can recognize the people who live there, whether they're law-abiding residents or people engaged in criminal activity.

"When I worked out there, we knew all the dope dealers," Young said. "They knew me by my first name. They didn't like me. But we had a mutual respect. Being a rookie is no excuse — you've got to study your neighborhood."

Fort Worth shooting of Atatiana Jefferson exposes police training failures

 

[Safeguard]

Yes. Had he broken a window, that would change everything, but as it stands, he didn't, so no, she would not have been able to use deadly force.

rsbm
She didn't shoot her weapon, so I don't see how this is relevant anyway. She was alone with a child and her sick mom, had men creeping around her home at 2am and yet she showed more restraint than trained law enforcement. That's a crime right there.

Young said sensory clues, such as the lights being on inside and it being one of the first cool nights in Fort Worth in days would be signs to assume a burglary wasn't taking place.

Take note, nosy neighbors!

Young said it's incumbent upon all officers to have better relationships in the communities they serve so they can recognize the people who live there,

Also applies to your neighbors! If you don't know your neighbor enough to surmise that they might be enjoying a cool breeze through the screen door, than you have no business calling the cops because of your paranoia.

 

[Hraefn]

The pair had lost track of time playing Call of Duty — with the open doors of the house letting in a cool breeze — when they heard a noise coming from the back yard. They went to find out what it was.

“His mom tells me that she can see little changes in his character,” he said. “Now when entering a room, he’ll kind of wait and watch the adults go in first. He’ll wait to see if the coast is clear and then he’ll enter.”

Zion — the family didn’t want to reveal his last name — was taken by Texas Child Protective Services early Saturday after his aunt was killed, Merritt said. He had been living with Jefferson in Fort Worth while his mother, a Dallas resident, was going through home occupational therapy after open heart surgery.

Zion’s mother picked him up Saturday from CPS, though she didn’t immediately knew why he was there, Merritt said. She asked him when she arrived.

“He said, ‘Because the cop shot my auntie,’” Merritt said.
https://www.star-telegram.com/news/local/fort-worth/article236321608.html

Oh wow. That’s how she found out?

 

[Momof4RN]

rsbm
She didn't shoot her weapon, so I don't see how this is relevant anyway. She was alone with a child and her sick mom, had men creeping around her home at 2am and yet she showed more restraint than trained law enforcement. That's a crime right there.



Take note, nosy neighbors!



Also applies to your neighbors! If you don't know your neighbor enough to surmise that they might be enjoying a cool breeze through the screen door, than you have no business calling the cops because of your paranoia.

Ouch!

 

[Hraefn]

Under these circumstances, no.
Not that it matters, because she never fired her weapon, but for conversation sake....
The cop was not inside the castle.
The cop was not attempting to break in.
The cop was not attempting to kidnap anyone.
In Tx., you can shoot a thief, but you can't shoot a trespasser.
Nor can you shoot anyone that breaks in to your detached garage, or shed.
The Tx Castle doctrine does not mean you can shoot anyone on your residence.(Property)

Section one, Subsection a. Tx. Penal code 93.1.

 Except as provided in Subsection (b), a person is justified in using force against another when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to protect the actor against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful force.  The actor's belief that the force was immediately necessary as described by this subsection is presumed to be reasonable if the actor:
(A) unlawfully and with force entered, or was attempting to enter unlawfully and with force, the actor's occupied habitation, vehicle, or place of business or employment;

Texas Penal Code § 9.31 | FindLaw
Texas Penal Code § 9.32 | FindLaw

Having said that. I don't believe that cop had any right to shoot her either, and unlike her, he did fire his weapon.
IMO, if he was yelling at her to show her hands, that to me means that he couldn't see her hands, which means he couldn't see a gun. So why would he fear his life was in danger?

I appreciate this analysis. I wonder if there is case law about a fenced yard? Does that go beyond trespassing into breaking and entering?

 

[Momof4RN]

Oh wow. That’s how she found out?

It’s Merritt...grain of salt
imo

 

[Tssiemer]

RSBM

Black isn’t a bad word. I don’t think it’s meant disrespectfully.

ETA: fix broken quote

do you mean like if she wasn’t a black woman people wouldn’t be as outraged?

 

[Tssiemer]

Oh I quoted the wrong one

 

[Safeguard]

At the end of the day, a woman is dead, a young child scarred, an unstable cop removed from "service"...

And the rest of us helpless to to stop those who would use this pain for polical gain. As if this woman and her family mattered at all.

We're truly living in a "psychopathic era" .

 

[imstilla.grandma]

He first refused to be interviewed by the detectives in the immediate aftermath of the shooting, and his attorneys told police that he was going to provide a written statement at a later date, according to the document.

In most police shootings, officers give an oral or written statement about what happened for an internal investigation, either immediately after the shooting or within 72 hours.
Former Fort Worth officer who shot and killed Atatiana Jefferson refuses to speak with detectives

 

[Charlot123]

do you mean like if she wasn’t a black woman people wouldn’t be as outraged?

They would be outraged the same. All of us can put ourselves in the shoes of the victims of police ineptitude. But nowadays, there is more awareness about the statistics of killings of African Americans by the police, and I think, the prevailing feeling is that we all deserve the same, legality and law. Also, it happened too soon after the trial of Botham Jean, and the cases are somewhat similar (two young people, peacefully relaxing in the privacy of their homes...). We all can put ourselves in their shoes. This is what makes these cases powerful.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

At the end of the day, a woman is dead, a young child scarred, an unstable cop removed from "service"...

And the rest of us helpless to to stop those who would use this pain for polical gain. As if this woman and her family mattered at all.

We're truly living in a "psychopathic era" .

I don’t even know how to begin to address this new officer shooting: I don’t have enough info.
CO - Andy Huff, 22, Unannounced* Aurora cop shot man in back through window in home, 10 Oct 2019

 

[Safeguard]

They would be outraged the same. All of us can put ourselves in the shoes of the victims of police ineptitude. But nowadays, there is more awareness about the statistics of killings of African Americans by the police, and I think, the prevailing feeling is that we all deserve the same, legality and law. Also, it happened too soon after the trial of Botham Jean, and the cases are somewhat similar (two young people, peacefully relaxing in the privacy of their homes...). We all can put ourselves in their shoes. This is what makes these cases powerful.

But it's wrong, (I have to say, imo here, on this site.), But it IS wrong, to call out
color, race. It only serves a certain polical agenda, and devalues others families who have suffered the same fate, who do not happen to be black.

 

[Betty P]

rsbm
She didn't shoot her weapon, so I don't see how this is relevant anyway. She was alone with a child and her sick mom, had men creeping around her home at 2am and yet she showed more restraint than trained law enforcement. That's a crime right there.



Take note, nosy neighbors!



Also applies to your neighbors! If you don't know your neighbor enough to surmise that they might be enjoying a cool breeze through the screen door, than you have no business calling the cops because of your paranoia.

This has probably been discussed, but why didn't the officer just ring the doorbell or knock on the front door?

 

[Safeguard]

I don’t even know how to begin to address this new officer shooting: I don’t have enough info.
CO - Andy Huff, 22, Unannounced* Aurora cop shot man in back through window in home, 10 Oct 2019

Imstilla.grandma,
I don't think we've crossed posts before, but I look forward to your use name now.

 

[Safeguard]

This has probably been discussed, but why didn't the officer just ring the doorbell or knock on the front door?

Exactly as he should have. No excuses for not having done that. For the cop or the neighbor! imo (as required).