TX - Five Yates children drowned, Houston, 20 June 2001 *Insanity*

[Jeana (DP)]

Sorry I meant if she's found NG by reason of insanity and put in a private facility and someday the court decides she's better. Probably it would never happen but then again with courts and lawyers involved you never know

I think AY was crazy and was let down in some ways by the health care /insurance system and her husband Rusty ....

I think RY did try and help his wife. But when the doctors advice
conflicted with his plans he ignored it. He wanted another child
even after a psych told him it WOULD bring on another bout of PPP. RY decided he would recognize the signs and start the meds and everything would be fine.

Another doc told him not to leave his wife alone --Dr. had just taken her of Haladol, an anti-psychotic. RY did get his mother to come help but for some reason he decided AY would be OK on her own for an hour every day. That was a huge gamble and one he lost big time.

That's just it. She'll never be in a private facility. She'll go to a state run mental hospital, which to me would be far worse than death. She's indigent. She can't pay for private hospitalization.

 

[TexMex]

That's just it. She'll never be in a private facility. She'll go to a state run mental hospital, which to me would be far worse than death. She's indigent. She can't pay for private hospitalization.

Gotcha....true a state run would be worse than jail IMO

She seems to be doing well in jail recently.....

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Gotcha....true a state run would be worse than jail IMO

She seems to be doing well in jail recently.....

Yes. She's gained a little bit of weight.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

This was interesting

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/special/drownings/4035681.html

An antidepressant that Andrea Yates had been taking before she drowned her five children in 2001 has recently been found to possibly increase the risk of homicidal thoughts, according to a medical watchdog group that says Effexor's manufacturer has not warned the public.

"Homicidal ideation" was added last year as one of the drug's rare adverse events on Effexor XR's label and on the Web site of its manufacturer, Wyeth.

Parnham said Yates suffered from postpartum psychosis and drowned the children in the family bathtub while in a delusional state, which likely was exacerbated after she was suddenly taken off Haldol, a strong anti-psychotic drug.

I read that!!! Very odd though that they say she's still taking it.

 

[TexMex]

I read that!!! Very odd though that they say she's still taking it.

Wonder if she's back on the Haladol?

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Wonder if she's back on the Haladol?

Do they combine them? I know they said she's still taking the Effexor. That stuff scares me.

 

[TexMex]

Do they combine them? I know they said she's still taking the Effexor. That stuff scares me.

I don't know if they combine them.....testimony was that Haladol was the only anti psychotic that had worked for AY
and two weeks before the killings her new Dr. took her off Haladol and upped her dose of Effexor...IIRC Dr. Saeed pulled her off the antipsychotics, but she was on a boatload dose of antidepressants.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004...ain594518.shtml

He'd given her a 300-milligram morning dose of the antidepressant Effexor and, the previous night, a 45-milligram dose of the antidepressant Remeron with a 15-milligram dissolvable Remeron SolTab booster.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

I don't know if they combine them.....testimony was that Haladol was the only anti psychotic that had worked for AY
and two weeks before the killings her new Dr. took her off Haladol and upped her dose of Effexor...IIRC Dr. Saeed pulled her off the antipsychotics, but she was on a boatload dose of antidepressants.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004...ain594518.shtml

He'd given her a 300-milligram morning dose of the antidepressant Effexor and, the previous night, a 45-milligram dose of the antidepressant Remeron with a 15-milligram dissolvable Remeron SolTab booster.

Thanks. I know someone who tried Effexor and in less than two weeks was unable to even hold a pen to write anything down, so he quit taking it. That is bad stuff.

 

[WhiteWolf]

How do you know that? She was hospitalized and treated much of that time. I don't think we've been privy to all of her medical records from those two years, only the testimony of her physicians that she was indeed suffering from a very serious post partum psychosis.

I don't know if she told her doctors she wanted to kill her kids, but if she did tell before why didn't she tell anyone the last time (before she killed the children)? I guess what I'm trying to say is Andrea was aware of these thoughts for two years and she still stayed with the children.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

I don't know if she told her doctors she wanted to kill her kids, but if she did tell before why didn't she tell anyone the last time (before she killed the children)? I guess what I'm trying to say is Andrea was aware of these thoughts for two years and she still stayed with the children.

She's crazy. I don't know how much clearer to say it. If she told doctors and THEY still allowed her with the children and her HUSBAND still allowed her near the children, why aren't they on trial? She was the weapon. The ammo came from somewhere else, whether that be from her mental state, her husband, or her church, or a combination of the three. If she's done the wrong thing time after time after time, how can we then say she knew the difference between right and wrong?

 

[WhiteWolf]

I live not too far from where this happened. Every doctor who has seen this woman says she's sick. But in Texas that's not necessarily legally insane.

IMO the first jury (who were death qualified, btw) knew she was nuts but there's no way a Harris Co. jury was gonna let her 'walk' from such a terrible crime so their 'compromise' was to find her guilty but give her LWOP and not the DP. This new jury is not death qualified but I still think she'll be found guilty....


Until Texas gets a "guilty but insane' type law I think AY should remain in jail for life. What if 5-10 yrs from now someone decides she's 'all better' and the court sends her home and she has flushes her meds down the toilet again (she had done it before ).....what is she capable of when off her meds? I would not be willing to take that chance. I do think she's sick but needs to stay in jail where she can be monitored, receive psych help and yes, be punished for killing five kids.

TexMex, I totally agree with you.

 

[Adalena935]

This was interesting

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/special/drownings/4035681.html

An antidepressant that Andrea Yates had been taking before she drowned her five children in 2001 has recently been found to possibly increase the risk of homicidal thoughts, according to a medical watchdog group that says Effexor's manufacturer has not warned the public.

"Homicidal ideation" was added last year as one of the drug's rare adverse events on Effexor XR's label and on the Web site of its manufacturer, Wyeth.

Parnham said Yates suffered from postpartum psychosis and drowned the children in the family bathtub while in a delusional state, which likely was exacerbated after she was suddenly taken off Haldol, a strong anti-psychotic drug.

Saeed testified 2X, now, that he tapered her off Haldol. NOT suddenly.

It's been in her medical records online at http://www.yateskids.org for 4 years now. Since her 1st trial wherein those med records were evidence in this case.

If you look at the dates of when she heard voices from the tv it was years before she committed this crime. NOT at the time of the commission of this crime.

Some of the news stories are very misleading in their wording. For example you posted a link to one that said she heard voices from her kid's cartoons before the killings.

Yes, YEARS - before. but not at the time of the commission of this crime.

At the time of the commission of these crimes, her med records show that she was depressed. NOT psychotic.

 

[Adalena935]

There is no doubt in my mind that she knew exactly what she was doing when she committed this crime. She said she planned it for two years and hid her intent from everyone around her. And that she didn't drown them another time because adults present in the home at the time would have stopped her from murdering them.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/special/drownings/4043559.html
Wilson's testimony Wednesday gave jurors a stark picture of how the children suffered before they died. Wilson also said Yates had to be very determined and organized to kill five children in the one hour she was left home alone with them.

"This was very organized behavior," Wilson said. "To kill five children in a short period of time is very difficult ... You have to be very determined to do that.

"It was a determined act because it was not quick ... She had to continue what she was doing until the damage was done - not retreat from what she was doing and not try to help the children," he said.

 

[kk's mom]

There is no doubt in my mind that she knew exactly what she was doing when she committed this crime. She said she planned it for two years and hid her intent from everyone around her. And that she didn't drown them another time because adults present in the home at the time would have stopped her from murdering them.
[/color]

I edited your post abit Adalena. I too believe Andrea knew exactly what she was doing when she killed those kids. i was reading some of the testimony from the medical experts and it literally makes me ill to visualize what those babies went through at the hands of their own mother.

She knew the order to kill them. She killed the oldest last because she knew she would have the biggest fight with him and knew that if she was fighting him, one of the other kids could get out.

Insane? I'm just having a hard time buying that though. Too much planning, She methodically killed her children, one by one and knew the order in which to do it, when to do it and how to do it.

There is no one else to blame for the deaths of these children than their own mother. No one else.

I remember reading somewhere that when one of the police officers talked to her at the house on that day, that he had asked her the birthdays of all the children and she gave the officer precise and correct answers. Actually, she seemed to answer all the questions they asked her at the house very straightforward from what I remember reading. An insane person who just murdered her kids I don't think would behave like that. I would think that they would be acting pretty weird. The insanity deal came up the minute they hauled her to jail and she knew she was done. :furious:

I don't know, I just have a tough time with this case. I just think that she needs to pay the price for what she did to her children. Drowing her kids, one by one and doing it in the child she drowned before's vomit and feces pretty much just does it for me.

 

[Adalena935]

I edited your post abit Adalena. I too believe Andrea knew exactly what she was doing when she killed those kids. i was reading some of the testimony from the medical experts and it literally makes me ill to visualize what those babies went through at the hands of their own mother.

She knew the order to kill them. She killed the oldest last because she knew she would have the biggest fight with him and knew that if she was fighting him, one of the other kids could get out.

Insane? I'm just having a hard time buying that though. Too much planning, She methodically killed her children, one by one and knew the order in which to do it, when to do it and how to do it.

There is no one else to blame for the deaths of these children than their own mother. No one else.

I remember reading somewhere that when one of the police officers talked to her at the house on that day, that he had asked her the birthdays of all the children and she gave the officer precise and correct answers. Actually, she seemed to answer all the questions they asked her at the house very straightforward from what I remember reading. An insane person who just murdered her kids I don't think would behave like that. I would think that they would be acting pretty weird. The insanity deal came up the minute they hauled her to jail and she knew she was done. :furious:

I don't know, I just have a tough time with this case. I just think that she needs to pay the price for what she did to her children. Drowing her kids, one by one and doing it in the child she drowned before's vomit and feces pretty much just does it for me.

It's a rough one, alright.

I've read your posts and I agree with you.

I always thought "I brought you into this world & I can take you out." was only a joke.

I'm glad for Socks too for speaking out on behalf of these innocent children. Couldn't agree with both of you more.

 

[TexMex]

Saeed testified 2X, now, that he tapered her off Haldol. NOT suddenly.

It's been in her medical records online at http://www.yateskids.org for 4 years now. Since her 1st trial wherein those med records were evidence in this case.

If you look at the dates of when she heard voices from the tv it was years before she committed this crime. NOT at the time of the commission of this crime.

Some of the news stories are very misleading in their wording. For example you posted a link to one that said she heard voices from her kid's cartoons before the killings.

Yes, YEARS - before. but not at the time of the commission of this crime.

At the time of the commission of these crimes, her med records show that she was depressed. NOT psychotic.

That's right she was having psychotic delusions for two years prior to this. This is why she tried to kill herself twice--to avoid hurting the kids. And Dr S did taper her off Haladol but the fact remains that this was the one drug that helped her....two weeks after she took her last tablet--she kills. IMO the loss of the Haladol combined with the Effexor which produces "homicidal ideation" is a large part of the reason she did this.

I do not want her out running the roads Adalena. I do think she was Looney Tunes when she did this but agree with the first jury. I want her in prison for life with no chance no how for her to get out. She was psychotic...just like the female psych didgnosed (PPP and schizophrenic)
she's the one who warned them both not to have a 5th kid--that it would lead to ANOTHER psychotic episode. RY testified that he thought he would be able to recognize the psychosis this time and put her back on Haladol when he saw the symptoms so 'they' decided to have baby #5.

 

[Adalena935]

That's right she was having psychotic delusions for two years prior to this.

That's not what her medical records show. You have the link. http//www.yateskids.org

 

[fundiva]

I don't believe she's insane (a legal term). Depressed & suicidal, yes. Legally insane, no.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/special/drownings/4042209.html
A deputy who overheard Yates' interview with MHMRA staff the day after she arrived at the jail following the deaths of her children testified she decided to kill the children the night before.

In response to a question from Ferguson, Stephens testified, "she responded by saying that she knew what she was doing was wrong."

I agree. I believe she had mental issues including depression, but I don't think she was legally insane. I can tell you though that if I killed my 5 kids and was insane, I would want to stay insane. I don't she how she can be stable now and live with herself knowing that she has killed all 5 of her children. I couldn't find a reason to live if that was the case.

 

[Texana]

I don't believe she's insane (a legal term). Depressed & suicidal, yes. Legally insane, no.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/special/drownings/4042209.html
A deputy who overheard Yates' interview with MHMRA staff the day after she arrived at the jail following the deaths of her children testified she decided to kill the children the night before.

In response to a question from Ferguson, Stephens testified, "she responded by saying that she knew what she was doing was wrong."

Sorry, I must politely disagree with you. She knew what she was doing was wrong legally for the children's lives here on earth. She believed what she was doing was morally right to save their souls for eternity.

 

[Adalena935]

I agree. I believe she had mental issues including depression, but I don't think she was legally insane. I can tell you though that if I killed my 5 kids and was insane, I would want to stay insane. I don't she how she can be stable now and live with herself knowing that she has killed all 5 of her children. I couldn't find a reason to live if that was the case.

Her crimes were so awful.
My sympathies are with the victims and I do not consider her a victim.

Maybe the best we can hope for is that we each might stand before a higher power one day and give an accounting of ourselves. If that's the case, then I welcome that day with relish.