GUILTY TX - Former Dallas Police Officer Amber Guyger, indicted for Murder of Botham Shem Jean #7

[imstilla.grandma]

During her testimony, Guyger seemed to cast aside race as a factor. The encounter was "not about hate," she said. "It's about being scared."

To prosecutors, Guyger's distraction led to a crime.

"This is a case of first impression, which means we don't have any precedents of this where the mistake of fact defense merges with the castle doctrine," said Peter Schulte, a Texas defense lawyer and former prosecutor.

But in the end, the jury rejected the controversial use of that legal standard as a possible defense. Both Powers and Schulte think the issue will be raised during Guyger's expected appeal.

"Self-defense means you're acting defensively," Hermus said. "She became the aggressor. That's not self-defense."
Ex-Dallas Officer Who Killed Man In His Own Apartment Is Found Guilty Of Murder

 

[MyBelle]

I think if she had been on duty a settlement would happen more quickly and quietly. But since she wasn’t I think DPD will claim “she was acting outside the scope of her duties, and we even have a uniform policy to prevent this from happening! It’s not our fault she looked like she was on duty!” JMO and I hope I’m wrong. I wish the Jean family only ever had to return to Dallas by their own choice, I hate that the lawsuits keep re-traumatizing them.

I will look into any possible immunity clause soon. I hope none will apply here too JMO.

I do, too. The DPD can certainly claim that but because it happened so soon after she was off duty, I think that will fail. The broken systems are what has failed. AG should have never been a police officer. What's scary is to think how many more out there are just like her.

JMO

 

[Seattle1]

Ex-Dallas Officer Who Killed Man In His Own Apartment Is Found Guilty Of Murder

Oct 1, 2019

To prosecutors, Guyger's distraction led to a crime.

Just before Guyger entered Jean's apartment, she had a 16-minute phone conversation with a fellow officer, Martin Rivera. Authorities say the two had a romantic relationship and that they had been swapping sexually explicit messages.

Prosecutors argued that Guyger was so absorbed with those communications that she was too preoccupied to realize she was heading toward the wrong apartment.

In cross-examining Guyger, prosecutors emphasized that her training as a police officer should have informed her to back away from the door, hide and call for backup if she had suspected an intruder.

Guyger had her police radio, and she lives just two blocks from police headquarters, so she could have had other officers arrive quickly, prosecutors pointed out. Had she done that, Guyger was asked, might Jean be alive today? bbm

"Yes, sir," she said.

 

[Rocco]

The defense didn't have much to work with to begin with, but after she took the stand and we found out just how self centered she is, she looked even worse.

With the disclosure of her 'tough girl' social media posts, the impression of what kind of person she is can't get any worse IMO.

I'll take a guess that the jury is going to hand down a much harsher sentence than we're expecting. A quick review of comments suggests a lot of people think 10-20yrs would be about right. I have a feeling she'll be lucky to get only 10-20yrs. MOO

 

[Seattle1]

The defense didn't have much to work with to begin with, but after she took the stand and we found out just how self centered she is, she looked even worse.

With the disclosure of her 'tough girl' social media posts, the impression of what kind of person she is can't get any worse IMO.

I'll take a guess that the jury is going to hand down a much harsher sentence than we're expecting. A quick review of comments suggests a lot of people think 10-20yrs would be about right. I have a feeling she'll be lucky to get only 10-20yrs. MOO

In Texas, both voluntary and involuntary manslaughter are second degree felonies which carry a prison sentence of 2 - 20 years, and fines up to $10,000.

If I recall correctly - it was the grand jury that indicted AG with murder charge, and jury agreed.

It seems to me any lenient sentence was forgone when the indictment stuck with murder charge -- a first-degree felony which can result in anywhere from 5 to 99 years in prison and a fine of no more than $10,000.

Also - since AG previously elected to have the jury decide her punishment (and not the Judge), they will be able to see her social media posts, and hear other negative evidence not allowed during trial. (I believe this is unique to Texas -- learned recently during David Temple trial).

MOO

 

[Weki]

Wait a minute so her family was in court for the first time on Monday?? Well that does make me feel kinda sorry for her. But she did have her brothers in blue so.....but still. I wonder what her upbringing was like, her family situation etc.

ETA: Someone pointed out that no one reached out to touch her when the guilty verdict was read. Not even her attorneys. I didn’t think about it or notice it then; I was busy balling my eyes out. But that’s quite telling to me. In the sense that everyone on her side had to put up a show of support but in their hearts perhaps they don’t have any sympathy for her either. Perhaps they dislike her as well. And I wonder if her fellow officers were giving her false hope and making her feel justified in what she did. I think a person who shows true remorse would be much easier to support in this situation but we know that’s not her.

 

[Seattle1]

While I've never gone to the wrong apartment, I've mistaken other vehicles for my own. Had I opened the mistaken car door, I believe I would know before sitting down that it's not my vehicle.

Just the same, I can certainly understand going to the wrong apartment, and even attempting to unlock the wrong door -- but once the door is open (pushed door open in this case), how do you not recognize this is not your home? It's not like this was a hotel room with identical furnishings.

MOO

 

[CrimeDawg123]

Regarding the apartment complex being liable for faulty door locks, I found one witness testimony about her lock being tricky when it rained (humidity maybe ?). I could be wrong but I think another resident also testified about his lock.

At 26:29

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IIRC the issue with the locks is the way they were installed - the screws were tightened too tight making the metal plate bow out and the latch sometimes not catch. If anyone tried to sue the apartment for that, they'd never win. The apartment just points to the builder, who points to the installers, who point to the manufacturers. Would anyone really want to go that route?

 

[Seattle1]

Wait a minute so her family was in court for the first time on Monday?? Well that does make me feel kinda sorry for her. But she did have her brothers in blue so.....but still. I wonder what her upbringing was like, her family situation etc.

^^SBM

I believe her family has been silent/absent because of earlier accusations. I recall several reports earlier that alleged her family were racists-- citing various photos from 2016 social media -- mainly of AG's brother in law, and one photo of her mom wearing an "All Lives Matter" t-shirt.

Dallas police officer Amber Guyger's family says they aren't racist, deny gestures in photos are white power signs

 

[CrimeDawg123]

I woke up this morning and my first thought (slipping on my slippers in my comfy pj's drinking coffee) is how uncomfortable jail must be for AG. And at the same time BJ's family waking up for the first time knowing AG is in custody. Today is the day she finds out her fate. I pray today is the beginning of much healing for the family of Botham.

 

[Spellbound]

While I've never gone to the wrong apartment, I've mistaken other vehicles for my own. Had I opened the mistaken car door, I believe I would know before sitting down that it's not my vehicle.

Just the same, I can certainly understand going to the wrong apartment, and even attempting to unlock the wrong door -- but once the door is open (pushed door open in this case), how do you not recognize this is not your home? It's not like this was a hotel room with identical furnishings.

MOO

I actually did sit down in the wrong car once. it was identical to mine, and the only reason I realized something was amiss before trying to start it was because they had something sitting in the cup holder that I did not recognize. my brain first went to “where did this come from?” And then to Oh My G.... as I embarrassedly got out, looked around.... and I wanted to apologize so badly. There was no one to apologize to. To this day it really bothers me.

And yesterday I put my hand on the door handle of another car identical to mine, parked where I usually park .... locked, thank goodness. I was parked two cars further down.

I now have a pet sticker on the back that I can identify as my own car .... I might need one near the door handle, too

 

[wyome]

Wait a minute so her family was in court for the first time on Monday?? Well that does make me feel kinda sorry for her. But she did have her brothers in blue so.....but still. I wonder what her upbringing was like, her family situation etc.

ETA: Someone pointed out that no one reached out to touch her when the guilty verdict was read. Not even her attorneys. I didn’t think about it or notice it then; I was busy balling my eyes out. But that’s quite telling to me. In the sense that everyone on her side had to put up a show of support but in their hearts perhaps they don’t have any sympathy for her either. Perhaps they dislike her as well. And I wonder if her fellow officers were giving her false hope and making her feel justified in what she did. I think a person who shows true remorse would be much easier to support in this situation but we know that’s not her.

I was blown away reading that, too. Her parents show up for the first time Monday? I have no words.

 

[mister happy]

Does the jury decision in the penalty phase have to be unanimous?

 

[wyome]

I woke up this morning and my first thought (slipping on my slippers in my comfy pj's drinking coffee) is how uncomfortable jail must be for AG. And at the same time BJ's family waking up for the first time knowing AG is in custody. Today is the day she finds out her fate. I pray today is the beginning of much healing for the family of Botham.

Aren't there other lawsuits out there pending on behalf of the Jean family? I pray for their healing as well, and hope these things can be settled quickly and without them having to relive this day.

I also prayed for Amber. I thought about her discomfort too. And then I read that her family hasn't shown up at all until Monday. Ouch

 

[wyome]

Does the jury decision in the penalty phase have to be unanimous?

Yes, I heard yesterday from a commentator, it does.

 

[mister happy]

Yes, I heard yesterday from a commentator, it does.

Thanks. If the jury hangs, will the judge will render a sentence?

 

[wyome]

Thanks. If the jury hangs, will the judge will render a sentence?

That's a great question. I don't know how that works. Personally, I always thought she would have been better off in the hands of a judge.

I wonder if this will even be over today. I've heard some commentators suggesting the jury could be out for days until a sentence is decided on.

 

[mickey2942]

I am going to bet that she gets all 99 years. This jury doesn't like AG much. They are sending a message. I bet that they decide fairly quickly.

Her wearing blue every day has been a big mistake.

 

[mister happy]

That's a great question. I don't know how that works. Personally, I always thought she would have been better off in the hands of a judge.

I wonder if this will even be over today. I've heard some commentators suggesting the jury could be out for days until a sentence is decided on.

I read somewhere that the defense requested that the jury decide Guyger's sentence. I agree with you, she would have been better off letting the judge decide.

 

[mickey2942]

I read somewhere that the defense requested that the jury decide Guyger's sentence. I agree with you, she would have been better off letting the judge decide.

I have not been impressed by the defense in this case, but I have always thought that they have been playing an end game, with appeal process in mind.

They will hope that the jury decision on sentencing is extraordinarily harsh. That will fit nicely for their appeal package, that the trial should have been moved out of Dallas.

I don't think that the appeal will work well either.