TX - Sandra Bland, 28, found dead in jail cell, Waller County, 13 July 2015 #2

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  • #221
The wheel of abuse is concerning ABUSE. It is possible for someone to wield power and assert control within the proper bounds.

When a woman is being abused by her abuser and she calls 911, does she expect someone to come to her home and be powerful and control the situation?

Powerful is not abusive. Powerful is self confident, not lording it over another person because you can.

I think authoritarian is what another issue is. Some people accept authoritarianism. I guess because it is easy.

Dealing with situations in a authoritative way is different than arrogance.
 
  • #222
Does anyone know if BE was strictly a traffic cop or did he have other LE duties such as being dispatched for crimes?
 
  • #223
No, but I expect a bit more of police officers than merely not breaking the law. In fact, I'd expect more of a burger flipper at McDonald's than merely not breaking the law, never mind a police officer.

He didn't do his job properly, and he should be sacked. A half competent shop assistant could have handled that woman better than he did.

I think he should too. But looking at what cops have gotten away with recently I would be shocked if he loses his job.

Has anyone set up a 🤬🤬🤬 for him yet?
 
  • #224
I don't know if he should be fired or not. I think he should be suspended and demoted. But he did not do anything illegal AFAIK. He lost his temper and allowed himself to be baited and that was weak on his part. But he did not cover up her murder, as many have claimed.

He did if he acted on a false pretense. Of course that can't be proven,but I don't recall during his call in (probably to his supervisor) any mention of fear for his safety as to why he had SB get out of her car.
As much as it would pain me I may have to listen again at a later date. IMO
 
  • #225
That was very convenient. The only camera that would have shown what really happened, didn't have enough memory. :rolleyes: The cover up just keeps going on, and on, and on.

Look back at almost all of the recent cases of death by cop or police brutality cases. Almost all of them had a faulty or broken dash cam or other security cam.
I'm mean seriously. How many times have we heard that?
 
  • #226
rsbm
No offense, but I'm not sure why this offends me. It almost sounds to me like saying "He allowed himself to be seduced, and so he had sex with her", which would seem to be making the man responsible, but it actually makes the woman more responsible.

Let's not make the officer a victim here -- he was the one who had all of the power. He made the choices -- he wasn't seduced, coerced, or conned.

Abuser talk. " She made me do it. She made me hit her because she didn't make my dinner the right way, Or she gave ne lip." Etc etc etc
 
  • #227
I totally agree with you. He was a jerky idiot. But he was not doing anything illegal by asking her a dozen times to exit her vehicle.

Was it legal for him to arrest her without a reason? Do you not have a right to know the reason somebody is taking legal control over your self?
 
  • #228
Look at back at almost all of the recent cases of death by cop or police brutality cases. Almost all of them had a faulty or broken dash cam or other security cam.
I'm mean seriously. How many times have we heard that?

About the same numbers of times we've heard "I feared for my life."
 
  • #229
Abuser talk. " She made me do it. She made me hit her because she didn't make my dinner the right way, Or she gave ne lip." Etc etc etc

“Let's make sure we don't do anything to provoke wrong actions."
 
  • #230
  • #231

Good article. There were 10 qualities listed. Based on the dash-cam video, I think the officer in this case scored a 0/10 (though I think there was inadequate information to judge on a couple of things, so perhaps 0/8 is more accurate). I was tempted to give him a point for 'Respect and Knowledge of Laws', but he wasn't even sure what to charge her with, so I can't give him a half point for knowledge, and considering how abusive the arrest was, I can't even give him an sixteenth-point for respect of the law.

eta -- perhaps he does earn a point for initiative, if racial profiling counts. So, 1/8. Good job.
 
  • #232
From,the FBI. Ideal chracteristics of a police officer

https://leb.fbi.gov/2014/december/perspective-characteristics-of-an-ideal-police-officer

See civility, humility, and controlled temper.

The part about tactical civility stood out to me. Something that's been overlooked in this discussion so far is that if this woman had actually posed a threat to the cop who stopped her, he would likely be dead by now. He wasn't only rude, he was reckless in that traffic stop, she could have shot or stabbed him several times over.

Luckily for him she turned out to be only a danger to herself.
 
  • #233
Good article. There were 10 qualities listed. Based on the dash-cam video, I think the officer in this case scored a 0/10 (though I think there was inadequate information to judge on a couple of things, so perhaps 0/8 is more accurate). I was tempted to give him a point for 'Respect and Knowledge of Laws', but he wasn't even sure what to charge her with, so I can't give him a half point for knowledge, and considering how abusive the arrest was, I can't even give him an sixteenth-point for respect of the law.

eta -- perhaps he does earn a point for initiative, if racial profiling counts. So, 1/8. Good job.

I would perhaps add a thirst for knowledge point because he asked her where she was going and how long she's been in Texas.
 
  • #234
rsbm
No offense, but I'm not sure why this offends me. It almost sounds to me like saying "He allowed himself to be seduced, and so he had sex with her", which would seem to be making the man responsible, but it actually makes the woman more responsible.

Let's not make the officer a victim here -- he was the one who had all of the power. He made the choices -- he wasn't seduced, coerced, or conned.

Sure sounds to me like you are twisting what I said. You are making it sexual and talking about rape victims? um OK--go for it. Nothing to do with what I said though.

MODNOTE: Montjoy was using an analogy about assignment of responsibility outside the specifics of this case, and it appears to have been misinterpreted.
 
  • #235
I would perhaps add a thirst for knowledge point because he asked her where she was going and how long she's been in Texas.

That is good police work. Texas is a hub for gun and drug running into Illinois. he would not be doing his job if he hadn't asked her about it.
 
  • #236
THANK YOU!!!!!
Ok :

"During a traffic stop, a police officer has the right to ask a driver to get out of the car even for a non-arrestable offense, as a way of securing his own safety. The officer has almost complete discretion and the driver is legally obligated to get out when asked. “He has control over the location of drivers,” Mr. Weisberg said. “It is equal to an officer patting you down to see if you have a gun.”


OKAY, I agree with all of the above^^^^

"In this case, Mr. Weisberg said, there is no evidence that Trooper Encinia feared for his safety. He would have to argue that Ms. Bland’s refusal to put the cigarette out gave him the impression that she was violent. If Trooper Encinia had feared for his safety, he would not have walked away from the car for five minutes, Mr. Weisberg said."

The bolded above is just Weisberg's opinion. He does not know if the officer had suddenly begun to feel something was off with her. Not putting out the cig told him she was not cooperative AND it was possibly being used to mask a smell.

When I showed it to the people that I know in LE, they thought he might have begun to wonder if she was hiding the smell of pot or alcohol and the way she was acting seemed like she might be high. At that point he might have decided to investigate further. Especially because she had out of state plates and Texas is a hub of guns/drug running.

SO the officer might have felt unsafe if he thought she was doing something illegal and was trying to hide it.

The first portion is the most vital information. =During a traffic stop, a police officer has the right to ask a driver to get out of the car even for a non-arrestable offense, as a way of securing his own safety.

I just listened to the audio of BE during his call in after the incident. His reason stated to whoever he was speaking with,was he had her get out to sign and so he could explain what was going on. LOL
Very much later close to the end of the conversation he mumbled that he was in the middle of the street but that clearly wasn't true either. IMO
 
  • #237
Sure sounds to me like you are twisting what I said. You are making it sexual and talking about rape victims? um OK--go for it. Nothing to do with what I said though.

Hold on there, good lady -- I never mentioned rape. You're projecting unfairly. I'm talking about a flawed way of distributing responsibility. You said 'he allowed himself to be baited', which is basically a way of saying that she was more responsible than he was, and it would appear that I'm not the only member who read it that way. I would ask that you take back your comment about rape, as it is highly offensive.
 
  • #238
Of course it's not illegal. It still doesn't mean it's the right way to interact with law enforcement. JMO

Yet, you use that as an excuse for him and other LEOs to abuse their power, and at the same time totally ignore the cops rudeness. "I'm going to light you up" is a threat of bodily harm. I never heard her make any threats to him.
 
  • #239
I would perhaps add a thirst for knowledge point because he asked her where she was going and how long she's been in Texas.

He was just being friendly. Got his itty bitty feelers hurt when she wouldn't play along. IMO
 
  • #240
He was just being friendly. Got his itty bitty feelers hurt when she wouldn't play along. IMO

And then he got scared.
 
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