TX - Sandra Bland, 28, found dead in jail cell, Waller County, 13 July 2015 #3

[human]

This is from the Dec 2014 article I posted above

Los Angeles Police Department announced it would spend millions of dollars to outfit all 7,000 patrol officers with body cameras, choosing a system from Taser.

The hope is that a camera system will help build trust and provide accountability for officers and the people they encounter. A camera system costs a lot of money, but it could potentially lower the number of complaints and use-of-force incidents, saving the city money on lawsuits.
But do cameras modify behavior? "Absolutely," said Sgt. Josh Lindsay of the Rialto Police Department. This city of 100,000 east of Los Angeles has been using the AXON system from Taser for three years.

 

[EllieBee]

I don't believe it. Men and women filmed while using the toilet? No. Don't believe

Because it is not true and being touted as fact in order to incite. But that is just MOO.

 

[EllieBee]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/cops-body-cameras-raise-privacy-concerns-article-1.1722969

Reposting my own post (tacky, I know) to show that, in fact, some PDs and LEOs ARE in favor of the body cams. And in fact accredit them to being exonerated.

 

[EllieBee]

True. But it was what the public watchdogs wanted. They did not want the cops to be able to turn off the cams because that has been a big bone of contention.

So are you now saying your previous post about LEOs having to keep body cams on in the bathroom was in error? Because you DID assert that as fact.

 

[Montjoy]

Reposting my own post (tacky, I know) to show that, in fact, some PDs and LEOs ARE in favor of the body cams. And in fact accredit them to being exonerated.

I think that the good LE -- and they are the majority -- are in favor of cams. Mind you, it troubles (but doesn't surprise) me that so many unions/fraternal organizations are opposed to them. And they're cost effective with respect to the lawsuits that they prevent -- much like the programs (usually free of charge) that help LEOs deescalate situations (but seem to be less than popular with many on the job).

 

[human]

I can get lower car insurance if I install a device in my car that tracks everything.

I told hubby about it and he said he was not interested.He had that one time for a job and he said he will not have it voluntarily.

I think people in general do not want their lives under a microscope. But as the teacher above reported and my experience as a teacher also, you get used to it.

Change is scary. There are always objections to something new. It will become an accepted way of life. Can you imagine that people smoked in elevators and stores? Hard to believe. But there was a hullabaloo about it and now it is just a way of life.

 

[Lilibet]

OT--I'm posting this as a cautionary tale. I don't think anyone here wants police to be attacked, or have the attack celebrated. But this is where we are headed in this country IMO. Anarchy isn't any better than police brutality. What's the answer?

Please read the whole article. It explains why this man was pulled over and discusses the reaction of bystanders to the detective being attacked. It is scary and shocking, especially coming on the heels of the death of the patrolman in Louisiana. Why would anyone want to go into law enforcement?!

A Birmingham, Alabama, police detective who was pistol-whipped unconscious said Friday that he hesitated to use force because he didn't want to be accused of needlessly killing an unarmed man.

Police Chief A.C. Roper sees the episode -- as well as the reaction, including celebratory and vitriolic comments posted online alongside images of the wounded officer -- as symptomatic of a larger problem, in which some don't respect law enforcement.

Adding insult to injury: several bystanders, instead of helping, took pictures of the bloodied officer as he was facedown on the concrete and posted the images on social media, where the officer was mocked.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/13/us/alabama-birmingham-police-detective-pistol-whipped/

 

[Lilibet]

I'm bringing forward the comprehensive list of ways to improve LE that BritsKate posted this morning in answer to my questions/challenge. I believe #1 is the only point that has been discussed in much depth. Certainly the other ten are worth discussing. Can we move on to #2 or another point on the list? It's a complex problem that requires an array of solutions. Most cost money, which many communities (taxpayers) don't want to spend. But this entire list is worth talking about. JMO And again, thank you BritsKate and others who came up with ideas.

1. Mandatory body and dash cams on officers at all times.
2. Where and when possible - hire and promote within the community.
3. Better training on mental illness for those in the field and support staff (e.g. dispatchers, intake staff, guards, etc.)
4. Re-examine legislation passed in the '70s and '80s that led to hyper-institutionalization - this has had a knock-on effect of people being ticketed for relatively minor, often non-violent offenses seemingly to generate revenue. I think politicians need to look for other sources of cash.
5. Better training on non-lethal methods of force.
6. Swift and transparent reprimand of officers found to have flagrantly disregarded departmental rules or abused their authority.
7. Change how traffic stops are conducted - in 'problematic' areas two officers could be assigned.
8. A national hiring blacklist. Some officers, when fired for offenses that have led to the injury and/or death of innocent civilians, have simply moved departments.
9. Mandatory, on-going counseling for officers to cope with the stressors of putting their lives at risk for a paycheck.
10. Better mental health screening prior to recruitment.
11. As has been done with the prison telecom industry, limit the profiteering from crime for everyone - to include local government generating revenue in way of fines and court costs all the way up to multi-million dollar corporations who lobby for harsher, lengthier punishments for non-violent crimes. Make sure crime really doesn't pay, for anyone.


This is my pre-coffee list, off the top of my head. Subject to change once caffeine hits my blood stream. :biggrin:

 

[La Louve]

#12. Mandatory training for LE in conflict deescalation and resolution.
#13. Mandatory Civics classes required to graduate from high school (parochial and home schooled included)

 

[Lilibet]

#12. Mandatory training for LE in conflict deescalation and resolution.
#13. Mandatory Civics classes required to graduate from high school (parochial and home schooled included)

Good ideas. Maybe mandatory conflict de-escalation and resolution should also be part of the mandatory Civics classes. Isn't Civics still required? If not, that's a shame.

 

[human]

Mandatory learning about history racism and its effects. What happened to blacks who tried to buy homes after serving in WW2 , for instance,

 

[bluesneakers]

Mandatory learning about history racism and its effects. What happened to blacks who tried to buy homes after serving in WW2 , for instance,

Yes. This.

 

[bluesneakers]

#12. Mandatory training for LE in conflict deescalation and resolution.
#13. Mandatory Civics classes required to graduate from high school (parochial and home schooled included)

I had to take civics in high school. I learned so much about laws and government, all stuff that hadn't been covered in history. I learned about dealing with cops in driver's ed, but it wasn't enough.

I agree civics should be required.

 

[katydid23]

So are you now saying your previous post about LEOs having to keep body cams on in the bathroom was in error? Because you DID assert that as fact.

There are types that livestream and are not turned on and off by individuals but by admin at the station. That is what they tested. They ultimately chose a different type. But some watchdog review boards are asking for the type that cannot be turned on or off by officers. I am sure we will see more of them soon enough.

 

[Montjoy]

I don't believe it. Men and women filmed while using the toilet? No. Don't believe

Still no MSM at all about any of these claims.

 

[KaaBoom]

There are types that livestream and are not turned on and off by individuals but by admin at the station. That is what they tested. They ultimately chose a different type. But some watchdog review boards are asking for the type that cannot be turned on or off by officers. I am sure we will see more of them soon enough.

Link please.

 

[bluesneakers]

No. In LA they were not allowed to turn them off at all. Even in restrooms and with witnesses. They may be changing that policy.
[snip for focus]

BBM. Do you have a source? When did they implement this policy?

 

[octobermoon]

O/T kinda....

Sheriff fires second deputy over incident with Metro driver who wore body camera

snipped...

At Caballero’s request, Shoblom wrote a report, stating that Kirkpatrick yelled and used the profanity, with the same improper grammar.

Caballero and Shoblom were unaware that Kirkpatrick was wearing glasses with a built-in video camera, which showed Kirkpatrick saying, “I’m expressing how frustrated I am at the fact that I got three deputies that don’t do anything when I need help!”


http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...bus-driver-of-profanity-fired-for-dishonesty/

 

[human]

O/T kinda....

Sheriff fires second deputy over incident with Metro driver who wore body camera

snipped...

At Caballero’s request, Shoblom wrote a report, stating that Kirkpatrick yelled and used the profanity, with the same improper grammar.

Caballero and Shoblom were unaware that Kirkpatrick was wearing glasses with a built-in video camera, which showed Kirkpatrick saying, “I’m expressing how frustrated I am at the fact that I got three deputies that don’t do anything when I need help!”


http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...bus-driver-of-profanity-fired-for-dishonesty/

What a mess. The bad apples hurt everyone

 

[Lilibet]

We still seem to be hung up on body cameras. The thoughtful list posted yesterday on this thread of ways to prevent police from behaving improperly is now very long. Body cams are only one small and very complex aspect of the solution. Body cams don't address attitudes. I think we can agree that many other points on the list do address attitudes and deserve discussion too if there is interest on this thread in considering solutions. Of course, it's possible that criticism is more interesting and if so, I'm disappointed but I stand corrected.

Here is a report by the ACLU detailing their concerns about the implementation of body cameras worn by LE. Although they support their use, their analysis shows that body cameras are not a single or simple solution. As is so true of many "fixes" the potential problems associated with this solution are serious. It can be a case of "be careful what you wish for." Thoughts?

https://www.aclu.org/files/assets/police_body-mounted_cameras.pdf