TX - Terri 'Missy' Bevers,45, murdered in church/person in SWAT gear,18 Apr 2016 #30

[Deleted member 172065]

deleted

 

[Tippy Lynn]

Respectfully BBM, MPD has not said shards of glass anywhere, that I am aware of. Only at WS. JMHO

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...n-church-and-video-of-a-man-dressed-as-a-cop/


This is article states "broken glass". Respectably, what's the significance between shards of glass vs. broken glass?

 

[arkansasmimi]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...n-church-and-video-of-a-man-dressed-as-a-cop/


This is article states "broken glass". Respectably, what's the significance between shards of glass vs. broken glass?

For me, the significance is trying to keep factual what has been reported by MPD. Someone reading these threads not knowing will just assume (incorrectly) that MPD said shards of broken glass. Could have very well been, but that not what I have seen reported. JMHO

 

[Razz]

Thanks, Razz (and many other posters). I think I have my head wrapped around that theory now. I can also understand why there are unlinked reports that the campers, once they got up under the awning, could see MB through the glass in that vestibule area. So SP prepped the vestibule by propping open the interior door(s), then SP was lying in wait in the vestibule while MB went around to the main west side high overhang doors, SP knowing MB would enter and then would come down the main hallway to those vestibule doors to exit back to her truck. This theory reinforces targeted for murder and not a burglary because SP could have just pushed those doors and exited himself instead of lying in wait. This contradicts the LE supposition that the SP exited the way they had entered (NE), or contradicts that SP was never seen on camera again (would have gone down some hallway with a camera). I wonder if the dogs were able to track SP's path (LE had no comment on whether the dogs gave any repsonses iirc).

Can anyone see in the upper glass of the propped open interior vestibule door (at mark 1:48) - what is that, a reflection?

Just a few questions about the inner SW vestibule doors.

I don't think the SP propped it open. If you watch the PD film Quote #4 by Camerabug, the door was already propped open when SP appears to make his 1st pass around the building.

There appears to be only 1 door.

In Nin"s quote #20 the picture is confusing. If it is taken from inside the SW vestibule looking out to the main hallway, the door opens into the vestibule. In the other photos, it opens out to the main hall. See Sandy's #7 for still shot of vestibule door.

Am I looking at this right? And why only one door and not 2?

Thanks, Razz (and many other posters). I think I have my head wrapped around that theory now. I can also understand why there are unlinked reports that the campers, once they got up under the awning, could see MB through the glass in that vestibule area. So SP prepped the vestibule by propping open the interior door(s), then SP was lying in wait in the vestibule while MB went around to the main west side high overhang doors, SP knowing MB would enter and then would come down the main hallway to those vestibule doors to exit back to her truck. This theory reinforces targeted for murder and not a burglary because SP could have just pushed those doors and exited himself instead of lying in wait. This contradicts the LE supposition that the SP exited the way they had entered (NE), or contradicts that SP was never seen on camera again (would have gone down some hallway with a camera). I wonder if the dogs were able to track SP's path (LE had no comment on whether the dogs gave any repsonses iirc).

Can anyone see in the upper glass of the propped open interior vestibule door (at mark 1:48) - what is that, a reflection?

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[neesaki]

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but is it possible the SP is wearing camouflage pants? The video is so distorted I know they look solid black, but it's really hard to tell. Also, the thin ankles stand out, I suppose that has to do with the puffed out pants and the fitted boots. I actually wonder if they're using blousing straps rather than the pants being tucked in, like this: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vTHdR1sLa2U

I recall some previous posts about the helmet being a tactical style helmet, versus say a motorcycle helmet. I agree. It just amazes me the detailed and elaborate effort the killer went to here, it seems to add up to and may mean more than mere disguise.... but that's just me. And though the get up is swat / tactical style, the SP comes across, imo, as someone not exactly the athletic or "swat" or military type, Though possibly in their past?

Here's an article that shows the camo pants, bloused out, ( I have no idea if they're using the straps ) and the tactical style helmet. Jmo
http://www.dailygazette.com/photos/2012/sep/11/39850/

 

[arkansasmimi]

Regarding the tempered glass point... Would those doors from the awning entrance be made of tempered glass? Where a struggle of broken glass in that entryway could have been?

I always assumed that the broken glass would have been bathroom mirrors, but curious about the doors?

ETA: or where a gun shot could have also broken the glass?


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Respectfully, But there is clearly no broken/busted windows in that area. Neither that photo I posted from SS I took from news link, or any of the other photos where MSM posted. NOR does there appear a busted door in the WEST FRONT Entrance with tons of Glass windows. JMHO I am not talking about few days later, speaking of April 18. (oops didnt mean that to sound snippy/snarky) JMHO the reason the front doors have crime scene tape, there is again my belief happened somewhere between the door the suspect opened at 358 and up to that Come as You Are foyer where the glass entrance. FYI, there is a huge Mirror under that Come as You Are sign on the wall greeting people for all the mirror thinking folks lol

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

I'm a few threads behind in catching up but wanted to throw out a few things to ponder.

If the campers didn't find MB or didn't realize what tey were seeing was her (not sure which is fact), that does indicate the doors may have still been in the locked position with campers looking in and seeing her. IMO it sounds and looks as if campers see MBs truck but MB never arrives at 5 and is nowhere to be found so they head inside to look for her, doors are locked so they look in and see "something" until one of them realize it's MB. How freightening.

If this were the case (MOO not fact), that indicates MB went to main front entrance, down SW hallway to unlock the SW corner entrance (heading direction SP was), and likely hit or shot and ambushed BEFORE being able to unlock those doors. I feel she was literally found "in the corner" there just inside the doors, the corner behind both camera views and before that outside cameras view.

But can't understand where SP snuck out to avoiding cameras unless there is a purpose in LEs statement of not being seen again or the camera pointing to the awning SW entrance where MBs truck likely was was not working.

That is a typical setup in commercial property with multiple doors to only have main entrance keys (my experience with commercial cleaning of about 10 yrs).

I agree with this scenario. If this is a typical setup, the campers would not be able to open the SW door when they first arrived due to its being a side fire door equipped with panic hardware. With panic hardware, a building's side and rear entrances are always locked from the outside for security purposes during the day, though unlocked and operable from the inside for 'panic' situations and speedy exit in case of fire. If the campers entered the building, unless the SW door was broken, it'd be my guess it was via the main door that Missy had unlocked. (Don't know this for sure, though, just a guess.)

Typically, the main door only of the building will be unlocked in the morning by the janitor or someone else with key and can be set to remain operable from the outside in the mornings, and all the interior doors' panic hardware as well will remain operable until the evening when the janitor closes up.

 

[PibblePal]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...n-church-and-video-of-a-man-dressed-as-a-cop/


This is article states "broken glass". Respectably, what's the significance between shards of glass vs. broken glass?

IMO shards are perceived as multiple smaller tiny pieces.
I've always referred to it as broken glass, per LE. Broken glass could be large pieces, or just one piece of a broken larger area. It covers a lot of meanings. [emoji30]


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[Deleted member 172065]

What part of the building is this hallway in? Got a little confused.

Very nice job. Quick question: Is it possible to give us an approximate location of this camera and/or scene? Thanks in advance!

 

[Tippy Lynn]

For me, the significance is trying to keep factual what has been reported by MPD. Someone reading these threads not knowing will just assume (incorrectly) that MPD said shards of broken glass. Could have very well been, but that not what I have seen reported. JMHO

I understand and agree with you the importance of keeping the facts straight. It's definitely been challenging for me at times to remember what's factual and what's speculation/talk. However, what's the difference between shards of glass and broken glass? IMO shards is an adjective used to describe broken glass, so it's the same thing. Please correct if I'm wrong.

 

[arkansasmimi]

Wasn't the entire scene released by noon? I really need to take some notes.

April 18 2016 MPD Press Conf CID Captain John Spann at very end of press conf

But again, that's ––this happenedat 5:00 [A.M.]this morning. We just cleared the scene about 12:00 P.M. We're still in the process of following down leads and looking at everything we've go http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...eline-*NO-DISCUSSION*&p=12592838#post12592838

 

[tlcya]

Full Definition of shard
1
a : a piece or fragment of a brittle substance <shards of glass>; broadly : a small piece or part : scrap <little shards of time and space recorded by the camera's lens &#8212; Rosalind Krauss>
b : shell, scale; especially : elytron
2
or sherd play
\&#712;sh&#601;rd\
: fragments of pottery vessels found on sites and in refuse deposits where pottery-making peoples have lived
3
: highly angular curved glass fragments of tuffaceous sediments

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/shard

semantics.

 

[arkansasmimi]

Quote Originally Posted by knowthings View Post
Do we know if the helmet SP is wearing is a motorcycle helmet, if so I would say he rode a motorcycle there or ATV, really no other reason to wear it, face was already covered and it would be bulky and restricting, maybe even a scooter as they are much quieter.

LE has been purposely vague as to the perp's getup, refusing to commit to one idea. However a motorcycle helmet seems unlikely from this LE quote:

May 20, 2016

"Surveillance video of the suspect inside the church showed a person wearing what looks like “police tactical gear,” including a helmet, vest and gloves. But police say the clothes aren’t specific to any branch of law enforcement. Assistant Chief Johnson said, “It’s been described as SWAT gear, it’s been described as tactical gear, it’s been described as ballistic gear, we don’t want to commit to anything specific that we don’t know for certain.”

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2016/05/20/...are-suspects-in-murder-of-fitness-instructor/

Respectfully BBM, not sure what they actually have at this point, but only what Asst Chief Johnson said at the May 20 2016 Press Conf: From Transcript provided graciously by WS Member Galadriel http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...eline-*NO-DISCUSSION*&p=12581340#post12581340

Male Reporter:How many people on the investigative team [unintelligible 00:07:42]?

Chief Kevin Johnson:On a daily basis, about a dozen. There's a briefing going on right now, as a matter of fact. We have a daily briefing, intel briefing. We share information. There's about a dozen people in that room this morning

**
Male Reporter:The tactical gear ––does that give you any clues? I mean, I'm sure a lot of that stuff is ––anybody in the public can probably order ––

Chief Kevin Johnson:Sure.

Male Reporter:––it online or buy. But is that an avenue you're trying to [unintelligible 00:12:19]?

Chief Kevin Johnson:Youknow, it's a piece of the puzzle, but it's been [a] very difficult avenue to explore. One reason is because,even when we enlarge the screenshot from that video, they're just not clear enough to tell definitively what that outfit is. It's been described as SWAT gear. It's been described as tactical gear. It's been described as ballistic gear. We don't want to commit to anything specifically that we don't know for certain. Youknow, there's folks in the room that even think it looks like sports gear in some regards. So it's simply just ––it's just not a clear enough videoto follow that avenue, and as we know, that stuff is so readily available. It's not controlled Youknow, you can purchase that at sporting goods store, you can [unintelligible 00:13:01]at gun stores, and, you know, online. A simple Amazon search and, you know, you can get any variety of piecesof equipment that look like, potentially, what's seen on the video. So right now it hasn't been a fruitful avenue. Youknow, obviously once we catch the killer that's something we're going to be looking for, and it might be something that somebody has seen that, you know, coupled with the gait and height and other information might cause them to call in. That's what we're hoping.

 

[arkansasmimi]

Originally Posted by GA_Peach View Post
Wasn't the entire scene released by noon? I really need to take some notes

.

Yes. But where a person has died, assuming some blood and other biological material, perhaps castoff or spatter blood, pool of blood on floor, other damage... it is not that it was released back to CoC, but that it would take time to repair and paint before putting something like a wheelchair back in position. On those broken glass rear doors, they simply applied plywood sheets, and on the kitchen door a small pice of wood, that first day. Nothing looks broken in the porte cochere/vestibule area.

Exactly another reason that I do not think happened there as. That video was taken from a live shot report the night of the Murder April 18. ** which brings up another point. What would that reporter see standing there where he was looking into the main hallway at that time? Looks like the whole property was released to me or that reporter wouldn't be standing in area almost where MB Truck had parked not even 24 hours earlier. This is JMHO

 

[Cannonball3804]

Respectfully BBM

1) Only place I have seen "shards of glass" is here at WS, where Cannonball and others were speaking of those words. Not from MPD or SW. **

Snipped. I don't understand the distinction you're making between "shards of glass" and "broken glass"? They are the same thing. A shard just means a fragment or piece.


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[PoirotryInMotion]

Respectfully, But there is clearly no broken/busted windows in that area. Neither that photo I posted from SS I took from news link, or any of the other photos where MSM posted. NOR does there appear a busted door in the WEST FRONT Entrance with tons of Glass windows. JMHO I am not talking about few days later, speaking of April 18. (oops didnt mean that to sound snippy/snarky) JMHO the reason the front doors have crime scene tape, there is again my belief happened somewhere between the door the suspect opened at 358 and up to that Come as You Are foyer where the glass entrance. FYI, there is a huge Mirror under that Come as You Are sign on the wall greeting people for all the mirror thinking folks lol

There is clearly no broken exterior front door or stationary window (flanking the doors), as we can see the whole front (east) side in various news videos after the murder.

The views we have of the SW exterior doors and flanking stationary windows are incomplete and obscured by columns, so it's hard to say with certainty if any one of those had damage (unless one knows a member who might inform).

In either case, however, the glass doors and stationary side windows are repeated about 6' further inside each vestibule, with a matching, interior set (such as we saw propped open in the SP video). It's possible some of these interior vestibule doors could've been broken during a struggle--particularly if a gun was involved. But we can't see those interior doors from the news reports, so it's unknown to us (without insider info) if any of those were broken.

I believe the crime tape was at both entrances simply because the damage went from north to south, and LE needed to prohibit trespass in general at the church until their investigation was complete.

 

[Camerabug]

NIN, so glad you posted this photo. There are so many things to observe. A very raw inaccurate guess would be that each door is at least 3' wide and glass to either side is at least 3' wide = 3' X 4 = 12 feet width. That round design on the floor would then be about 6' diameter, so the entry depth would be no less than that 6 feet. Total space 12' X 6' meaning only that it is quite a bit of space, enough for a struggle/murder. In the right side, that looks like a wheelchair, too, perhaps folded sideways. Also on the right side is a bit of wall. Mimi(?) told us before that there had been a remodel of the porte cochere vestibule, perhaps that wall is structural and needed to remain. Anyway, that wall could also provide cover for the SP to hide/surprise MB: SP standing in the absolute right bottom corner (of our photo view) behind wall as MB walks from the main hallway right through that propped door into the vestibule, and no one in the covered awning/parking lot to see the action.

In order for a door to allow wheelchair access, it needs to be 36" wide. I don't know if a wheelchair could pass through with just one door open, but I suspect it could. Just an observation after building 3 houses...

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

Snipped. I don't understand the distinction you're making between "shards of glass" and "broken glass"? They are the same thing. A shard just means a fragment or piece.

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There's an important distinction - a glass shard can kill; safety glass (which breaks into a rounded pea-sized crumble) does not. In the last thread some posters were theorizing that maybe she was punctured or killed by "shards of broken glass"...and others of us are posting that that is unlikely if one is referencing the doors and windows of the church. They would not break into shards, as they are made of tempered or safety glass.

 

[arkansasmimi]

Photo#1 - Is this the porte cochere end of the main hallway, or the other end? Is that the little windowless hallway that runs along the SW patio where locals said yes, those are restrooms in that area (plus vent in roof, and no windows on westside exterior)? In this photo, where are the security cameras up high in that corner (too dark to see? ceiling mounted?)?

Photo#2A - In the bottom left corner of photo, the corner turn to the little hallway at the bottom of wall/baseboards can be seen (it isn't shown in all photos).

#2B - at the far end of the main hallway, you can see the double glass doors at that (NW) end (someone was asking).

#3 - Mimi's floorplan is dated May 5. JMO I think the extra little hallway by the bulletin board doesn't belong there - maybe there is a recessed door.

Photo #1 is if you were standing lol where that Squirrel is placed in that photo showing the Glass FRONT WEST Entrance. And you are looking to the LEFT, down THAT WAY toward the NORTH Parking lot Or NW Main Hallway entrance from that side. * The direction the Suspect was walking FROM at 358am.

There IS a hallway just prior to the door the Suspect opened. Same side of the hallway. Also there is a small hallway at the end at the doors leading out to the Covered Awning. that is for Restrooms. JMHO

 

[roadrunnermt]

If I'm understanding your question correctly (?), an attack inside the vestibule would escape the interior building cameras mounted in the halls, because those cams are trained down the length of the halls, not pointed into the vestibule (see Batbrat's colorful diagram upthread).

The outside camera 'covering the door area' was not functioning - none of the exterior cams were.

Yes, correct. Thanks for answering. However, if she were killed in the vestibule (which I find likely), SP slipping out those SW doors, that doesn't fit LEs comments that MB was seen on camera heading to the area SP was...unless maybe she did enter those doors, proceeded to restroom or kitchen for ice and headed back out towards vestibule and SP was last seen also heading towards vestibule? Any other thoughts?