Deceased/Not Found UK - April Jones, 5, Machynlleth, Wales, 1 Oct 2012 #3 *M. Bridger guilty*

[BritsKate]

Personally I believe there is a wealth of forensic information available relating to the death of April. This article may help lend some insight, citing other 'no-body' convictions. As I've stated previously murders of children resulting in no-body cases are far rarer. Prosecutors in those (US) cases relied on a mixture of forensic and other circumstantial evidence (like the last time a victim was seen by a 3rd party; past history of abuse; date reported missing; eyewitness testimony; cadaver dogs; etc.)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-17464298

 

[Cendlaetholwr]

I don't agree. I believe the coastguard team DID search the banks of the River Dyfi as well as further out in the bay too. See caption under image here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-19849552

Yes, I know the coastguard were searching the river - I posted about it a few pages ago. I was correcting the ITV report which said:

The Coastguard is searching the river from Borth to Towyn

It's a coastline (Cardigan Bay) from Borth to Tywyn, not a river. It's a river from the mountains to Aberdyfi where it joins the coast. The river finishes at Aberdyfi. It's the sea from there on west.

 

[George Gently]

The Police have a difficult job that requires a balance between searching for evidence that an unlawful killing has occurred and handling the grief and emotions of an entire close knit community that has had its heart ripped apart.

Very difficult but I think they have responded very well and with sensitivity.

They may have kept their cards close to their chest but that doesn't mean they don't have any. A jury will decide if they have enough.

The allegations could well change by the time of trial.

As per procedure, he will have entered "no plea" at court hearings so far but will have to enter a plea to the charges put to him in January at Caernarfon Court when case management will be initiated depending on his plea.

Even at the point of trial, the prosecution can withdraw or amend allegations and the new ones put to him. An example of this could be a murder charge replaced by manslaughter providing a guilty plea is entered.

 

[Inge Jones]

Oh boy... no parent wants to think their poor lifeless child may be bobbing about in a bay somewhere. How horrible. Somehow the classical "shallow grave" has more serenity.

 

[BritsKate]

i respect your view but having trouble believing it as he doesnt at his age have form, nothing has come out from anyone suggesting anything remotely to suggest a violent character, a child molestor, mental illness, deviant sexual urges, then again maybe they have and told by police to shut up and say nothing, though Im not convinced qnd no rumoura or gossip about him on the many facebook pages

I've shared it here, and often, before. My ex-husband was charged with raping his then 14 year old niece a few years ago. There were absolutely NO warning signs to ever think him capable of such a crime. He was 44 years old at the time he committed the crime against her.

This was a girl whose diapers he'd changed - who was more like a daughter to him than ever a distant relative - and he drugged her, then raped her, then threatened her should she come forward. She bravely did so, eventually, and he plead guilty to avoid a trial and the potential for a far longer sentence.

Everyone who knew my ex (including myself) was dumbfounded. The vast majority of those he knew adored him - thinking he was a nice guy, charming, likeable, helpful, friendly, gregarious, etc. Some of his family members still protest his innocence.

Incidentally I'd filed for divorce just 6 weeks before he raped her. I've often wondered if that wasn't a trigger somehow - though obviously the blame lies squarely with him.

Predators always start somewhere. Some will have a history, some will begin committing crimes younger - but it's the belief that every one must have a history, a look, a pattern, that allows other predators, who don't, to thrive.

MOO and FWIW

 

[Clio]

i respect your view but having trouble believing it as he doesnt at his age have form, nothing has come out from anyone suggesting anything remotely to suggest a violent character, a child molestor, mental illness, deviant sexual urges, then again maybe they have and told by police to shut up and say nothing, though Im not convinced qnd no rumours or gossip about him on the many facebook pages, unless as I have posted before he is involved but not in a murder capacity but by some negligence that led to death and panicked

Not saying this is the case, but if he did have a criminal record how would we know? We would only know if the media went digging and printed something. Bear in mind that this case is very unusual. The police do not name someone on arrest - they only name them once charged.

In this case, the police named him on Tuesday morning and issued a photo of him and his vehicle. Why? Because, after taking legal advice, they felt the possible benefit of finding April outweighed the legal risk they were taking. It's not impossible that the press were asked to exercise constraint over what they printed. The press and police seem to have cooperated very closely in the case IMO

As for no outward signs of anything - well what about Vincent Tabak?

 

[Rutland Girl]

On the same day, (Wednesday 10th Oct) April's parents visited the specialist police search base at Y Plas community hall in Machynlleth.

Supt Ian John
Dyfed-Powys Police said the pair met some of the people trying to find their daughter and were "extremely grateful" for all of the work that was being done.
- - - - - - - - -

I'm Glad April's parents did this in private, they went to show their gratitude & didn't feel the need to have banks of camera's following them.

Think the words to express this action are; quietly dignified.

 

[jigzy]

Yes, I know the coastguard were searching the river - I posted about it a few pages ago. I was correcting the ITV report which said:



It's a coastline (Cardigan Bay) from Borth to Tywyn, not a river. It's a river from the mountains to Aberdyfi where it joins the coast. The river finishes at Aberdyfi. It's the sea from there on west.

Ah, I see what you mean I know the estuary well. I guess they should have reported searching 'the estuary'. So many reporting blunders. Particularly odd pronunciations of Machynlleth - from Mathuncleth, to the inevitable awaited Macuntleth - oh dear, can it really be that difficult to pronounce? Also, one reporter called Y Plas 'La Place' rather awkwardly

 

[Cendlaetholwr]

Ah, I see what you mean I know the estuary well. I guess they should have reported searching 'the estuary'. So many reporting blunders. Particularly odd pronunciations of Machynlleth - from Mathuncleth, to the inevitable awaited Macuntleth - oh dear, can it really be that difficult to pronounce? Also, one reporter called Y Plas 'La Place' rather awkwardly

Radio Five Live - some days after BBC News Channel's presenters had mastered the pronunciation - were calling the town "Mac Inlet". An inlet of the river Mac, perhaps? The other way our family used to (jokingly) refer to the town was "Moch yn llaeth". You have to understand Welsh to understand that one. (Literally: pigs in milk.)

 

[Paulette]

I've shared it here, and often, before. My ex-husband was charged with raping his then 14 year old niece a few years ago. There were absolutely NO warning signs to ever think him capable of such a crime. He was 44 years old at the time he committed the crime against her.

This was a girl whose diapers he'd changed - who was more like a daughter to him than ever a distant relative - and he drugged her, then raped her, then threatened her should she come forward. She bravely did so, eventually, and he plead guilty to avoid a trial and the potential for a far longer sentence.

Everyone who knew my ex (including myself) was dumbfounded. The vast majority of those he knew adored him - thinking he was a nice guy, charming, likeable, helpful, friendly, gregarious, etc. Some of his family members still protest his innocence.

Incidentally I'd filed for divorce just 6 weeks before he raped her. I've often wondered if that wasn't a trigger somehow - though obviously the blame lies squarely with him.

Predators always start somewhere. Some will have a history, some will begin committing crimes younger - but it's the belief that every one must have a history, a look, a pattern, that allows other predators, who don't, to thrive.

MOO and FWIW

IMO, your marriage was probably what stopped him from carrying out the rape sooner. He'd probably fantasized about it long before he carried it out.

 

[Clutchbag]

britskate how shocking and thanks clio, it obviously happens

I just am the type that thinks the best of people without any obvious signs otherwise

 

[George Gently]

britskate how shocking and thanks clio, it obviously happens

I just am the type that thinks the best of people without any obvious signs otherwise

I don't think that's a bad thing Clutchbag.

I think it's sound to keep an open mind regarding any possible motive or intent.

 

[Skigh]

o/t a bit but regarding the kerfuffle above about subject forum placement, I can say that, as one who has posted scores of UK-related threads running the gamut between culture, crime, missing persons, and entertainment, no matter where one places them in the WS forums - Up to the Minute, Crimes in the News, Spotlight on Children, Hot Cases, Cold Cases, Celebrity & Entertainment News - most just don't get many responses. I would that it were not so as I would love to see many more UK (and Irish!) posters.
__________________


Sorry this is totally off topic but I thought I would put it in a thread of interest to u.k posters as several of us have wondered why the Jimmy savile thread has not had more interest as he is potentially connected to the Jersey home and other homes and hospitals.

 

[Amber34]

Hes been there over 22 years, not 15. Re the crb checks, even if it was before they were introduced I would imagine the council would have asked police if he had a record, similar with teachers, bank workers etc. Only guessing though, because I cant imagine noones records were checked out before 2002

Prior to the CRB system coming in, anyone who worked in regular close proximity to children had to have a police record check. This included (but not limited to) teachers, medical profession, pre-school staff and anyone who was employed in a situation where children were residents, but excluding administrative staff who were non residential, such as school receptionists etc.

Whilst this sounds all well and good, in reality it was just another administrative task for the local LE to undertake and could take months to return. As there was no requirement to have this in place prior to the contact with children commencing, very often the person filled in the form, started work and then a couple of months after working there, their clearance came back.

In hindsight, almost totally useless.

ETA: I ran a pre-school for 11 years and dealt with both systems when employing staff.

 

[jigzy]

Radio Five Live - some days after BBC News Channel's presenters had mastered the pronunciation - were calling the town "Mac Inlet". An inlet of the river Mac, perhaps? The other way our family used to (jokingly) refer to the town was "Moch yn llaeth". You have to understand Welsh to understand that one. (Literally: pigs in milk.)

Dwi'n gallu deall

(For Engl: I can understand)

 

[Cherwell]

Skigh, post 993 -
Well, to be frank, I find this forum very hard to navigate. There seem to be so many different sections and I don't really understand the logic to it. Stuff seems to get moved around as well. Sometimes I can't even find a thread I've posted on - I have to look through all my own posts via my profile to get back there!

It might help if there was a "UK & Ireland" section (or "British Isles" might be better) containing everything: missing, trials, awaiting trial, serial killers, everything under one roof so to speak. I just don't have time to go sifting through all those places on the main boards.

 

[wfgodot]

For variety one should occasionally try clicking on "New Posts." Here's the Savile thread:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=186274&page=5

 

[wfgodot]

It might help if there was a "UK & Ireland" section (or "British Isles" might be better) containing everything: missing, trials, awaiting trial, serial killers, everything under one roof so to speak.

Agreed.

 

[George Gently]

Skigh, post 993 -
Well, to be frank, I find this forum very hard to navigate. There seem to be so many different sections and I don't really understand the logic to it. Stuff seems to get moved around as well. Sometimes I can't even find a thread I've posted on - I have to look through all my own posts via my profile to get back there!

It might help if there was a "UK & Ireland" section (or "British Isles" might be better) containing everything: missing, trials, awaiting trial, serial killers, everything under one roof so to speak. I just don't have time to go sifting through all those places on the main boards.

Hi Frank

Good point.

I find it difficult just finding this thread again.

 

[Saturn]

Nid wyf yn deall

But I did learn that llaeth was milk, as our local CoOp sold Llaeth Cymraeg. (Hope that's correct).

Agree with Cherwell, it would be nice to have a UK/Ireland section, but we have to bear in mind we are guests of a US forum, and I reckon a forum like this in the UK would be shut down or hijacked by the courts.

Besides, I do get caught up in several of the US threads as it seems they are privy to more info on a case, whereas in the UK it all goes schtum after a charge is made and we have to wait until the trial, often 6 months plus later.