UK - Huge fire rips through Grenfell Tower, Latimer Road, White City, London, June 2017

[gregjrichards]

Guardian:

The Guardian view on Grenfell Tower: Theresa May’s Hurricane Katrina

I can't believe she never attempted to meet any of the families today she is totally useless.

 

[gregjrichards]

Contractors that worked on the £8.6 million Grenfell Tower refurbishment could have spent just £5,000 more on fireproof cladding, it has been revealed.

Hundreds of Reynobond aluminium coated panels - which are banned in the US over fire safety fears - were last year fitted to the outside of the London high-rise.

The panels come in three types – two with fire-resistant centres selling for £24 per square metre and one with a plastic core - costing just £22 per square metre.

It is thought that contractors chose the cheaper version for the upgrade on Grenfell Tower."

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ding-Grenfell-cost-5k-more.html#ixzz4k7MyzJ4D

Disgusting! They need to be jailed.

 

[MIKAYOYO]

Not a frig, but a dryer fire cuz a belt broke. Never run your dryer while sleeping. Also, dishwashers starting on fire. I had a very high end dishwasher that apparently starts on fire. I found that out when I was looking for a replacement part on the net. Never wash dishes while sleeping.

I know nothing of a frig.

I had a mice problem in my home. I stuffed holes such as around pipes that came in from the basement with steel wool.

My son had a fit. He said steel wool burns easily. I did not believe him. Yup. It does,

There are so many things made out of cheap plastic. They are just like gasoline

My dryer almost caught on fire once. The way our vent is in the laundry room the hose was not straight and it made a sharp turn. We had no idea because we weren't the ones who set up the dryer when we moved. One day I smelled burning and it was coming from the laundry room. Luckily my sh was home and was able to disconnect. Once it cooled we opened the back and there was burnt lint all at the bottom. Now I have it rigged where the hose goes straight to the garage. It's a total redneck set up but as long as we live here I will never hook it back up to the vent in the laundry room.

Sorry for the OT rant.

 

[gregjrichards]

"Trapped and facing death in their 23rd floor flat, Gloria Trevisan and Marco Gottardi made heart-rending final phone calls to their families in Italy.

In their last moments, the devoted couple told their parents they wanted to say goodbye, with Miss Trevisan telling her mother: 'Thank you for what you have done for me.'

Her fiancé Mr Gottardi tried bravely to play down his fears but the couple eventually admitted smoke was rising around them and they could see the flames coming up the stairs"

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ing-final-phone-calls-home.html#ixzz4k7Uf7opB



Terrible tragedy. I hope corporate manslaughter charges are coming.

 

[dotr]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...eath-toll-set-rise-amid-grim-search-grenfell/

Picture taken inside a guted Grenfell Tower flat on Thursday shows the extent of the damage Credit: HANDOUT

Mother saved family by flooding flat

Natasha Elcock Credit: Facebook

A quick-thinking mother caught in the Grenfell Tower inferno saved her family by flooding her 11th floor flat.
Natasha Elcock, 39, was trapped was trapped along with her six-year-old daughter and boyfriend as the building was engulfed in flames.
With the fire sweeping up the building Ms Elcock and her family had been told to stay put.
But she acted swiftly rushing into the bathroom and turning on the taps.
"I let the bathroom flood. It kept the flat damp. It may have saved our lives," she told the Daily Star.

 

[Eloise]

Not a frig, but a dryer fire cuz a belt broke. Never run your dryer while sleeping. Also, dishwashers starting on fire. I had a very high end dishwasher that apparently starts on fire. I found that out when I was looking for a replacement part on the net. Never wash dishes while sleeping.

I know nothing of a frig.

I had a mice problem in my home. I stuffed holes such as around pipes that came in from the basement with steel wool.

My son had a fit. He said steel wool burns easily. I did not believe him. Yup. It does,

There are so many things made out of cheap plastic. They are just like gasoline

I have personally had one friend have his house burn down after a dryer started a fire. He and his kids were very lucky to get out.

I also have a friend whose washing machine blew up - now, I've had one short out but not start a fire, but hers did. Lucky for her the fire was quickly contained to the laundry.

Oh ETA I remember also I've had an almost brand new computer start smoking - a wire that connected the HDD to the motherboard (?) was faulty. If I'd left the computer on while out, and wasn't at home at the time, god knows what would have happened.

TBH with the amount of electrical appliances everyone has now and that are left on for long periods of time, I'm almost surprised more terrible fires don't happen.

 

[LietKynes]

Would rather jump to my death than burn alive. What a choice.

There's more I could say about those who decided flammable cladding was A-o.k. !!
But I'd better not. :furious: ................ :censored:

O/T Brings back memories of the Rhode Island nightclub fire ; and the perfect storm that resulted in the deaths of so many.

 

[gregjrichards]

"Rally for justice to be held on Friday

The Press Association reports that people are planning a rally in Westminster on Friday to call for justice for those caught up in the Grenfell Tower fire.

A Facebook event, Justice for Grenfell!, has been listed as taking place at 6pm on Friday outside the Department for Communities and Local Government in Marsham Street, with more than 1,000 people said to be attending.

The posting said: “At least 12 people have died in the fire at Grenfell Tower. They deserve justice. We demand answers .

“Solidarity with the residents of Grenfell Tower.”

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...ore-fatalities-after-tower-block-blaze-latest

 

[Spellbound]

OMG ... the stories oh all are telling tonight about your fire mishaps or near-mishaps are eye-openers.

The one about the young couple who called family is heartbreaking and painful to read. :tears:

and the mother who flooded her bathroom ---- what a fast-thinking woman. that is something I don't think I would be smart enough to try. kudos to her.

 

[missgulfsouth]

My dryer almost caught on fire once. The way our vent is in the laundry room the hose was not straight and it made a sharp turn. We had no idea because we weren't the ones who set up the dryer when we moved. One day I smelled burning and it was coming from the laundry room. Luckily my sh was home and was able to disconnect. Once it cooled we opened the back and there was burnt lint all at the bottom. Now I have it rigged where the hose goes straight to the garage. It's a total redneck set up but as long as we live here I will never hook it back up to the vent in the laundry room.

Sorry for the OT rant.

If it's a gas dryer that is a very bad idea... you will get carbon monoxide in your garage. If it's electric you'll be okay but have lots of moisture. Not ideal.

 

[MIKAYOYO]

If it's a gas dryer that is a very bad idea... you will get carbon monoxide in your garage. If it's electric you'll be okay but have lots of moisture. Not ideal.

It's electric. We don't have any gas in our home. It bums my dh because he likes cooking with gas but he doesn't do the cooking so..

ETA not my dog my husband though sometimes one in the same

 

[MIKAYOYO]

OMG ... the stories oh all are telling tonight about your fire mishaps or near-mishaps are eye-openers.

The one about the young couple who called family is heartbreaking and painful to read. :tears:

and the mother who flooded her bathroom ---- what a fast-thinking woman. that is something I don't think I would be smart enough to try. kudos to her.

It's so heartbreaking hearing these stories. My heart is with London. They have been through way too much.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

I hope corporate manslaughter charges are coming.

Why prejudge the outcome of the public enquiry?

Or is it pitchfolk and flaming torches time?

 

[MIKAYOYO]

Why prejudge the outcome of the public enquiry?

Or is it pitchfolk and flaming torches time?

I'm far from London but even I can see there was major negligence from the ministers or whatever they are. People lost their lives so someone could save money. Moo. This is how I've interpreted this again moo.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

How are such high temperatures reached? Is this normal in a building fire?

And has it been said what the safety concerns regarding the top floors are? Is this where fire are still being battled, or is there concern over structural safety?

Sorry I have only questions :blushing: But you seem very knowledgeable so I gotta ask.

Sorry, no idea bout these points. They haven't said what the concerns are with the top floors, only that they have accessed the central floor area but not entered any of the flats there.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

I'm far from London but even I can see there was major negligence from the ministers or whatever they are. People lost their lives so someone could save money. Moo. This is how I've interpreted this again moo.

We don't know that there has been "major negligence", and even if there has that's a far cry from being able to bring a corporate manslaughter prosecution let alone getting a conviction under one.

This is a summary of the relevant legislation around corporate manslaughter in the UK:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_Manslaughter_and_Corporate_Homicide_Act_2007

The refurbishment project was in the hands of the board of KCTMO, more than half of whose members are residents:

http://www.kctmo.org.uk/sub/about-us/20/the-board

 

[MelmothTheLost]

I've also read in some articles that fire sprinklers failed to engage while other articles said there were no sprinklers.

The head of the council confirms there were no sprinklers but says it was because many of the tenants didn't want the disruption necessary to fit them.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...s-did-not-want-sprinklers-council-claims.html

That's a bold claim to make, and it would be a stupid claim to make if he is unable to substantiate it. We shall see.

And, like the Ghostship, hazardous material - in this case most likely budget-cutting cladding insulation - spread the fire so quickly that it became impossible for firefighters to control it. 30 minutes!

I'm reserving judgement on this. In a project of this size, the difference of £5,000 seems neither here nor there. I've seen a claim that the more expensive cladding was originally specified but that the spec was later changed to use slightly cheaper materials. From what little I know this seems unlikely - especially as getting the change through the approval process may well have cost more than £5,000 anyway.

 

[MIKAYOYO]

We don't know that there has been "major negligence", and even if there has that's a far cry from being able to bring a corporate manslaughter prosecution let alone getting a conviction under one.

This is a summary of the relevant legislation around corporate manslaughter in the UK:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_Manslaughter_and_Corporate_Homicide_Act_2007

The refurbishment project was in the hands of the board of KCTMO, more than half of whose members are residents:

http://www.kctmo.org.uk/sub/about-us/20/the-board

like I said I'm far from London but everything I've read they were warned for years that this building was unsafe. I've lived in apartments here in Texas and there are codes where each apartment has at least a smoke detector and they even change the battery for you. I hate to stereotype but I thought the U.K. Was all about safety for their people. It's shocking to learn otherwise. But I only learned recently that most of their police didn't even have guns. Equally shocking. My continued prayers go to those affected. We're all humans and I love my fellow man!

 

[Ironside]

"Rally for justice to be held on Friday

The Press Association reports that people are planning a rally in Westminster on Friday to call for justice for those caught up in the Grenfell Tower fire.

A Facebook event, Justice for Grenfell!, has been listed as taking place at 6pm on Friday outside the Department for Communities and Local Government in Marsham Street, with more than 1,000 people said to be attending.

The posting said: “At least 12 people have died in the fire at Grenfell Tower. They deserve justice. We demand answers .

“Solidarity with the residents of Grenfell Tower.”

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...ore-fatalities-after-tower-block-blaze-latest

I saw an interview with someone saying people should riot. It would be pretty hypocritical if they started setting things on fire.

 

[skibaboo]

If it's a gas dryer that is a very bad idea... you will get carbon monoxide in your garage. If it's electric you'll be okay but have lots of moisture. Not ideal.

I never knew there was such a thing as a gas dryer!