UK - Huge fire rips through Grenfell Tower, Latimer Road, White City, London, June 2017

[gregjrichards]

58 people missing and presumed dead including the 30 people already known to be dead- BBC News police update

"Service dogs have joined the grim search for bodies in Grenfell Tower as police confirmed at least 58 people are missing presumed dead.

Speaking to media outside the west London building today, Metropolitan Police commander Stuart Cundy said: 'The fire was truly horrific. For me this is just a human tragedy.'

He said that the force has confirmed 30 people are dead and believe another 28 are missing who they have to 'assume they are dead'.

The commander stressed that this information was based only on the number of people they believed were in the tower when it caught fire in the early hours of Wednesday morning and the actual total may be greater.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...hunt-bodies-Grenfell-Tower.html#ixzz4kH7fwkaE

 

[MsMarple]

"An investigative report into the disastrous Grenfell Tower fire may not be made public for years, it has been revealed.

MPs and protestors alike have called for immediate answers to questions such as why the fire, which led to the death of at least 30 people after the entire 27-storey tower block went up in flames on Wednesday, spread so quickly.

But the London fire service has said the report will not be made public until an inquest is complete - which could take years."

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...er-report-not-public-YEARS.html#ixzz4kFx444p0

Not surprising. If the inquest into the 2009 fire at Lakanal House in south London is any indicator then it will take years to see final reports on the Grenfell Tower fire. In the Lakanal fire, where 6 people died, it wasn't until early this year that the Southwark Council was fined for its part. Ironically, the fire in that case spread because fire-blocking materials were removed during work in the 1980's and never replaced. IOW, another "chimney effect" occurred, although luckily not to the extent of the Grenfell fire.

Even though there is not yet an official reason for the Grenfell Tower fire spreading so quickly - in about 30 minutes the entire building was on fire - it's hard to ignore the pictures of the burnt cladding, with bits of polyethylene insulation hanging off the building and scattered on the ground. Underneath the cladding was a concrete building. Concrete doesn't burn.

Here's a good article about the Grenfell Tower refurbishment project:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...shment-used-cheaper-cladding-tenants-accused/

 

[Ellmau]

Another survivor's story: 66 year old woman carried down from 10th floor by two residents she ddn't know:

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...eir-shoulders-in-act-of-heroism-a3565441.html

 

[Ellmau]

Hammersmith & City and Circle tube lines suspended due to fears of debris from the fire: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...nded-amid-risk-grenfell-tower-debris-falling/

 

[Ellmau]

Good overview of likely failures in the building which contriuted to teh fire's spread and the number of fatalities: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/15/eight-failures-left-people-grenfell-tower-mercy-inferno/

 

[Ellmau]

New PM statement:

The prime minister has promised "immediate action across the board" for victims of the fire at Grenfell Tower, after saying the support on the ground has not been 'good enough'.

Following a meeting with some of the victims at Downing Street, Theresa May said in a statement: "The response of the emergency services, NHS and the community has been heroic.

"But, frankly, the support on the ground for families who needed help or basic information in the initial hours after this appalling disaster was not good enough.

"I have heard the concerns and I have ordered immediate action across the board to help victims' relatives and the survivors.

"People lost everything in the fire and were left in only the clothes they were wearing.

"I can confirm that a £5million emergency fund that I announced yesterday is now being distributed on the ground so people can buy clothes, food and other essentials. If more funding is required, it will be provided."

She has set a deadline of three weeks for everybody affected to be found a home nearby and has requested daily progress reports.
She has ordered more staff to be deployed across the area, wearing high visibility clothing, so they can easily be found, dispense advice and ensure the right support is provided. Phone lines will have more staff.
The costs for providing victims with legal representation for the Public Inquiry will be met by the government.
The inquiry will report back to Theresa May personally.
She has ordered councils to complete urgent safety checks on all high rise buildings. If any further action is required, it will be taken.
NHS London will provide specialist long-term bereavement support for the families who have lost loved ones, and immediate psychological support is being provided by Cruise and Red Cross.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-england-london-40239008

 

[Ellmau]

Definitely confirmed dead:

Isaac Shawo, the 5 year old who was separated from his family while evacuating (so particularly sad although each name is its own tragedy)
Khadija Sayre, the artist who was friends with MP David Lammy and his wife
Mohammed Alhajali, 23 year old student and refugee from Syria

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-402821...n-40239008&link_location=live-reporting-story

 

[Ellmau]

Bishop of Kensington on BBC 24 now - he organised meeting of survivors and other residents and volunteers with PM this afternoon.

 

[Ellmau]

Residents want to be involved in ongoing decisions.

 

[Ellmau]

Bishop said the group felt they were listened to. It was a "robust discussion" with strong emotions expressed.

 

[Elainera]

Looking at the damage from the fire, I would not be surprised if Grenfell Tower collapsed eventually. Either way, the building should be torn down.

I would not be surprised if the death toll will be much higher. The fire looked really bad. It would be a miracle if everyone got out alive.

Unthinkable imo to restore it! Who would wanna live there, even with sprinklers?

It just has to go.

Apparently some of the 999 call handlers also need counselling, having heard people burning to death and desperately screaming for help. It is just horrific.

Uh just imagine you hear something like that and then you have to put that aside and go on and attend to the next call. It takes a strong person to do that.

 

[wfgodot]

Observer:

London fire brigade boss: ‘It was a massive risk, but it’s our job to go in’
Dany Cotton had to decide to send her team into the blazing Grenfell Tower.
She tells how the action saved many lives but left colleagues traumatised

 

[wfgodot]

Observer:

Revealed: the tower block fire warnings that ministers ignored

 

[dotr]

Observer:

London fire brigade boss: ‘It was a massive risk, but it’s our job to go in’
Dany Cotton had to decide to send her team into the blazing Grenfell Tower.
She tells how the action saved many lives but left colleagues traumatised

Very interesting article, thanks.

 

[anya]

Apologies if this has already been discussed but are fire extinguishers not required in individual flats or at least a few placed in the hallways of each floor? It seems that if the fire did in fact start from an appliance such as a fridge or oven, that having access to an extinguisher could have staved off the speed of fire that ensued. Maybe it was already too late though as it happened while most were asleep.


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[gregjrichards]

Apologies if this has already been discussed but are fire extinguishers not required in individual flats or at least a few placed in the hallways of each floor? It seems that if the fire did in fact start from an appliance such as a fridge or oven, that having access to an extinguisher could have staved off the speed of fire that ensued. Maybe it was already too late though as it happened while most were asleep.


Sent from my mobile using Tapatalk

The flats should have had fire extinguishers and fire blankets but given the cost cutting going on in the building I doubt residents had them. The fire couldn't have happened at a worse time of day. Perhaps if it had been during the day more people would have been out of the building or at least awake to react to the fire more quickly. It's an awful tragedy it is awful thinking of the suffering of the men, women and children inside.

 

[MsMarple]

More information on possible factors leading to the spread of the fire:

Safeguards intended to prevent the spread of fire from floor to floor were set to be temporarily removed from Grenfell Tower during a refurbishment, according to documents from the planning application.

http://www.insidehousing.co.uk/gren...y-removal-of-fire-protections/7020464.article

See page 26 of the report: https://www.rbkc.gov.uk/idoxWAM/doc...LUME2&contentType=application/pdf&pageCount=1

Note: the first time I opened the article I had free access but now I'm asked to register to continue. I'm not sure why that is so apologies. The gist of the article was about removing the fire-stopping material temporarily while renovations were under way and the question is whether or not they were replaced after the work was done.

The report itself remains open to read.

 

[dotr]

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/stay-put-deadly-london-fire-puts-scrutiny-on-high-rise-rule-1.3463994

NEW YORK -- A catastrophic blaze at a London apartment tower has brought new scrutiny to a long-accepted, counterintuitive rule for people in tall buildings: If the blaze breaks out elsewhere in the structure, don't automatically run for the stairs. Stay put and wait for instructions.

That's what residents of London's 24-story Grenfell Tower had been told to do, but the strategy failed early Wednesday when flames that began on a lower floor spread shockingly fast and quickly engulfed the entire building.

Many residents were trapped, forcing some on higher floors to jump to their deaths rather than face the flames or throw their children to bystanders below

Despite that outcome, fire experts say "stay put" is still the best advice -- as long as the building has proper fire-suppression protections, such as multiple stairwells, sprinkler systems, fireproof doors and flame-resistant construction materials, some of which were lacking in the London blaze

.

The rules vary from place to place, as does advice about when to evacuate, but fire experts say the "shelter-in-place" directive is usually applied to buildings of 15 stories or more. Floors directly above and below the reported fire are usually evacuated, but others are to stay and use damp towels to block cracks beneath the door unless told otherwise, and call 911 if they have questions.

That's partly to avoid repeated, unnecessary evacuations that cause people eventually to ignore such orders when they really matter. And it also avoids panicked and unsafe evacuations down a long stairwell choked with smoke, which can be just as deadly as the licking flames.

What makes the London fire maddening for fire experts who believe in the "stay put" rule is that the Grenfell may have lacked many of the safety redundancies necessary to make it work

.

New York City Fire Commissioner Daniel Nigro, whose department is among the most practiced in the world at fighting fires in tall buildings, says he believes in the stay-put policy but "what happened in London, in which a fire went from the fourth floor to the 21st floor in what we understand was in 17 minutes, is unprecedented."

 

[gregjrichards]

"Disrespectful gawkers taking selfies at the scene of the Grenfell Tower disaster have sparked fury among locals.

People have come from as far as Devon and Manchester to pay their respects to at least 58 who perished when the west London tower block went up in flames this week.

While most have laid flowers, written heartfelt messages and observed peaceful vigils, some have been accused of turning it into a 'tourist site'.

Several people have been seen posing for selfies in Notting Hill, with the charred White City tower block in the distance behind them.

'This is not the time or place to take selfies - in front of a tower block where my friends passed away,' said Lorraine Warrington, who has lived on the nearby Silchester estate her entire life."

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ies-charred-Grenfell-Tower.html#ixzz4kLBHEeJH

I don't understand why some people have such poor judgement in society today.

 

[Ellmau]

The Red Cross has been asked to provide psychological support to survivors and to coordinate fundraising for the victims (sorry, article is behind the Times paywall)
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...fted-to-help-grenfell-tower-victims-s3720jx39

http://www.redcross.org.uk/About-us/News/2017/June/London-Fire-Relief-Fund