UK - Julia James, 53, murdered, Snowdown, Kent, 27 April 2021 *ARREST*

[Sarahlou]

People who suffer with psychosis/schizophrenia are far more likely to be victims of violence than perpetrators.
And if they are violent the most likely person they will be violent towards is themself.

The assertion is discriminatory and offensive.

I wish the media/people in general would stop thinking every 'bad' thing was done by a 'psycho' it simply isn't true.

It's a fact that there have been random murders like this committed by people who are schizophrenic/suffering psychosis. I don't think it is offensive to suggest that might be the case here. Nobody is saying most people who suffer these conditions would do this. But some do.

 

[Rosegold68]

https://www.geocaching.com/play/map...om=15&asc=true&sort=distance&st=snowdown+kent

heres the map.....the cache is greyed out as its been temporarily disabled due to police on scene.

 

[Jenesaisquoi]

Could she have been bludgeoned with the geocache container? What type of container is it?

 

[Rosegold68]

Could she have been bludgeoned with the geocache container? What type of container is it?

its a canister about the size of a small flask. looks to be metal

 

[JuicyLucy]

People who suffer with psychosis/schizophrenia are far more likely to be victims of violence than perpetrators.
And if they are violent the most likely person they will be violent towards is themself.

The assertion is discriminatory and offensive.

I wish the media/people in general would stop thinking every 'bad' thing was done by a 'psycho' it simply isn't true.

You make a good point, but bear in mind that the low secure unit nearby is specifically for clients who are at risk of harming others.

Its most recent CQC report isn't very confidence-inspiring btw:
Cedar House

I'd like to feel we could assume that LE would be aware if someone had found their way out, but given the history of failings there it wouldn't entirely surprise me if no one had even noticed.

ETA: JMO

 

[lizziginne]

You make a good point, but bear in mind that the low secure unit nearby is specifically for clients who are at risk of harming others.

Its most recent CQC report isn't very confidence-inspiring btw:
Cedar House

I'd like to feel we could assume that LE would be aware if someone had found their way out, but given the history of failings there it wouldn't entirely surprise me if no one had even noticed.

ETA: JMO

If the killer was psychotic or from this unit we would know by now. Psychotic people are not good at covering their tracks, they do not think in a 'logical' pattern. They wouldn't think to change blood splattered clothes. They would likely talk about it in some way or other.
Speaking as someone who has experienced hallucinations on a couple of occasions, and as a doctor who has cared for psychotic patients, I do not believe someone psychotic did this.

 

[SocksKitty]

The dognapping theory is absurd. The dog wasn't taken = it is not a dognapper. Thieves do carry weapons but they tend to be knives over bludgeoning instruments. And yes thieves do attack you if you don't give what they demand but they then take what they demanded anyway.

--

If you read the FBI's material on the various ways killers leave bodies, in particular "pathway #3" on page 36 (body is left where killed), the FBI concludes that it's overwhelmingly likely to be a stranger attack and that ~30% of attackers have a psychiatric diagnosis before the attack.

Serial Murder: Pathways for Investigations — FBI

If you look at what psychiatrists say about frenzied bludgeoning attacks, the truth is these are disorganised offenders. That usually means they don't stray too far from their own area (it's a guess but I'd say <1 mile-5 miles).

Two other observations but no conclusions as yet:

- Snowdown train station literally less than 150metres from where Julia was found, offering a very quick exit on the Chatham mainline toward Canterbury or Dover
- There is a mental hospital with both low-secure and more-secure patients a 2-mile walk across the fields from Snowdown.

I am thinking that maybe someone had a psychotic episode then killed her as in the case of the murderer Daniel Gonzalez who I shared the newspaper report about earlier. In the papers it was later said that Daniel Gonzalez and his family were let down by multiple failures in the mental health services and by those supervising his care in the community. Hopefully lessons were learnt back then but it can still happen and hopefully not the case here. Daniel Gonzalez (spree killer) - Wikipedia

 

[Rosegold68]

I’m wondering if she had arranged to meet someone. Maybe a dv client. They could walk together under restrictions

if so,maybe the client has inadvertently brought along her stalker.... who then, seeing Julia as the one keeping them apart/giving dv advice, has attacked her

I used dv services escaping an abusive ex, and he definitely aimed his anger and disgust more at those people who were helping me escape ( do-gooders,busybodies) than at me

 

[Jenesaisquoi]

I’m wondering if she had arranged to meet someone. Maybe a dv client. They could walk together under restrictions

if so,maybe the client has inadvertently brought along her stalker.... who then, seeing Julia as the one keeping them apart/giving dv advice, has attacked her

I used dv services escaping an abusive ex, and he definitely aimed his anger and disgust more at those people who were helping me escape ( do-gooders,busybodies) than at me

I think it is unlikely that she would meet up with someone from her dv work so close to her home, apart from that, it’s a good point.

 

[SocksKitty]

I’m wondering if she had arranged to meet someone. Maybe a dv client. They could walk together under restrictions

if so,maybe the client has inadvertently brought along her stalker.... who then, seeing Julia as the one keeping them apart/giving dv advice, has attacked her

I used dv services escaping an abusive ex, and he definitely aimed his anger and disgust more at those people who were helping me escape ( do-gooders,busybodies) than at me

I thought Julia was working from home and had just popped out to walk her dog. I would be surprised if she arranged to meet someone in her line of duty and it wasn't logged somewhere. There is some latest news by the way saying that Police are thinking the killer left his/her phone at home. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/14853373/julia-james-killer-left-phone-home-daughter-candle-vigil/

 

[Rosegold68]

That’s the point, no face to face meetings due to covid. We are allowed to walk with a friend though. And yes, not really allowed, hence nobody coming forward to say they had met

far fetched I suppose

 

[VixenLeaf]

People get confused I think between psychosis and psychopath.
Someone suffering psychosis being mentally ill whereas a psychopath isn’t.
It’s psychopaths that tend to kill. Not those suffering with mental illness.

People who suffer with psychosis/schizophrenia are far more likely to be victims of violence than perpetrators.
And if they are violent the most likely person they will be violent towards is themself.

The assertion is discriminatory and offensive.

I wish the media/people in general would stop thinking every 'bad' thing was done by a 'psycho' it simply isn't true.

 

[SocksKitty]

Someone mentioned trains and I have just checked the times of trains in relation to the time the murder took place. Julia took her terrier for a walk at 16:00 hrs and it was not a long distance so say she was murdered at 16.30hrs then the perpetrator may have had time to get the 16.54pm train (next train 17:28) in the direction of Dover. The London train would have been at 16:31pm or 17:01pm. Does anyone know if there is CCTV at the train station in Snowdown.

 

[JuicyLucy]

If the killer was psychotic or from this unit we would know by now. Psychotic people are not good at covering their tracks, they do not think in a 'logical' pattern. They wouldn't think to change blood splattered clothes. They would likely talk about it in some way or other.
Speaking as someone who has experienced hallucinations on a couple of occasions, and as a doctor who has cared for psychotic patients, I do not believe someone psychotic did this.

I've worked in medium- and high-secure psychiatric settings and know exactly how psychotic and delusional people behave. No one is suggesting that such an attack would have been carried out logically or discreetly. Indeed, based on what we know about how Julia was found, it wasn't. That's not to say the killer would necessarily have been found by now. You said yourself that a patient in an acute psychotic state is at elevated risk of self-harm, and if I were leading this investigation I would have in mind that I might be looking for a second body at this point.

As for Cedar House, I personally think a connection with a current patient is unlikely but if you google it you'll find there have been some extraordinary lapses in safety, security and staffing in the past, and many, many cases of patients harming themselves, staff and each other, including ones that resulted in A&E admissions. It's not impossible that bloodstained clothing would fail to ring the alarm bells that it should, and although you would hope that, once Julia's body had been found, two and two would be put together, it's also possible that staff shift patterns might conspire against that. Additionally, Cedar House is privately run as an outsourced NHS facility, which brings with it ethical vulnerabilities. In my experience, staff at such facilities are often nervous about whistleblowing or properly documenting incidents that might jeopardise the status quo, however precarious and unsustainable.

https://www.cqc.org.uk/location/1-280143781/reports
Working at CEDAR HOUSE: Employee Reviews | Indeed.com

'Inadequate' Barham hospital put into special measures
'Visibly unclean' care home put in special measures
'I couldn't have shouted louder': Family seeks answers after care system fails son
Nurse assaulted in 'understaffed' mental health hospital in Canterbury

JMO

 

[tallmansix]

Someone mentioned trains and I have just checked the times of trains in relation to the time the murder took place. Julia took her terrier for a walk at 16:00 hrs and it was not a long distance so say she was murdered at 16.30hrs then the perpetrator may have had time to get the 16.54pm train (next train 17:28) in the direction of Dover. The London train would have been at 16:31pm or 17:01pm. Does anyone know if there is CCTV at the train station in Snowdon.

Julia was seen leaving her house with the dog approx 3pm and was found dead at 4pm.

Train station does have CCTV this is confirmed in an earlier post and the trains themselves mostly have CCTV.

I think it is unlikely the perpetrator would use a train, they are so infrequent from that stop (only 3 departures within the 3pm-4pm window - 15:11/15:17/15:59) and can't see them heading to a place with CCTV to make their escape.

 

[Angleterre]

I hope to goodness that Michael STONE hasn’t been released. He was given a life sentence with a minimum of 25 years in 1995 early 1996 after murdering Lin and Meghan RUSSELL on a countryside path during the daytime and used an implement causing blunt force trauma leading to their deaths in Chillenden Kent only a few short miles from this location
God bless you Julia xx
RIP dear lady
Your tour of duty is now over and you can hang up your handcuffs and rest in peace. The thin blue line has just got thinner and you will be sadly missed x

 

[ApparentlyInDenial]

People who suffer with psychosis/schizophrenia are far more likely to be victims of violence than perpetrators.
And if they are violent the most likely person they will be violent towards is themself.

The assertion is discriminatory and offensive.

I wish the media/people in general would stop thinking every 'bad' thing was done by a 'psycho' it simply isn't true.

In my case it was an analysis based on psychology and statistics, and I would never use the word psycho. People with affective disorders (schizophrenia, bipolar, etc) are more likely to be victims than perpetrators, but the population of violent attackers has a much much higher percentage of disorders than the general population.

I wasn’t generalising and didn’t mean offence.

 

[Angleterre]

I think it is because they are both in the same area.

Michael STONE who was responsible for the murders did so in daylight on a country side path using blunt force trauma. He was given a life sentence with a minimum of 25 years in 1995-early 96
It’s only 2 miles away from the same location

 

[SocksKitty]

I hope to goodness that Michael STONE hasn’t been released. He was given a life sentence with a minimum of 25 years in 1995 early 1996 after murdering Lin and Meghan RUSSELL on a countryside path during the daytime and used an implement causing blunt force trauma leading to their deaths in Chillenden Kent only a few short miles from this location
God bless you Julia xx
RIP dear lady
Your tour of duty is now over and you can hang up your handcuffs and rest in peace. The thin blue line has just got thinner and you will be sadly missed x

According to Wikipedia Stone is still in prison. Quote " On 21 December 2006, a high court judge decided that Stone should spend at least 25 years in prison before being considered for parole, meaning he is likely to remain in prison until at least 2023 and the age of 63"

 

[Grouse]

I hope to goodness that Michael STONE hasn’t been released. He was given a life sentence with a minimum of 25 years in 1995 early 1996 after murdering Lin and Meghan RUSSELL on a countryside path during the daytime and used an implement causing blunt force trauma leading to their deaths in Chillenden Kent only a few short miles from this location
God bless you Julia xx
RIP dear lady
Your tour of duty is now over and you can hang up your handcuffs and rest in peace. The thin blue line has just got thinner and you will be sadly missed x

Not eligible for parole until 2023 according to reports I have read.

His lawyer however has apparently been in contact with Kent Police about this case Michael Stone's lawyer contacts Kent Police over killing of Julia James