Found Deceased UK - Leah Croucher - Emerson Valley - Milton Keynes - #6

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I don't want to type this...

We can't be sure the body was in one piece when moved to the attic.

Sorry for being gruesome but... If a person had gone to that extent, wouldn't someone like NM who was always transiently roaming around the country take the body parts and distribute / bury / burn / throw into lake or sea? So as to avoid discovery. As opposed to the really really hard work of lifting into attic and then fixing them to his known location? Hence I was wondering if she may have been forced up into the attic whilst alive

 

[Officer Dibble]

dbm

 

[infinit]

i just find it hard to believe that no one saw anything. 8:30 or whatever time in the morning, school run/going to work time, I know it was only 500 metres away from where she was last seen but I dunno, somebody must have seen them together going to the address. They MUST have done?

I used to walk down Fulmer Street to work and if I'd skipped breakfast or didn't have lunch would pop into the Tesco Express on the other side of Loxbeare Road to get some food fairly regularly. By the time I came to be aware of the case a couple of weeks after she went missing, I struggled to even remember if I went to Tesco or not that morning, never mind if I saw her.

 

[Willowy]

In relation to 'surely someone must have seen something'... a few weeks ago my neighbour's front door was kicked in and burgled in broad daylight at 5pm. We live on a fairly busy high street. In the background of the CCTV footage you can see various high school kids and commuters walking by, totally oblivious to a huge man battering someone's PVC door in.

 

[Officer Dibble]

What do you mean - that it wasn’t him but someone else and they’ve asked him to get rid of the body? Idk, I think he’s a convicted sex offender, his offending has just got worse.

I was asking you what you meant by what you typed. i put it in bold the sentence i was querying

 

[Plod]

Is that question to me? I was asking a question of the other poster.

Yeah, I thought you were saying he’d been paid by someone else, didn’t see the previous post!

 

[Kinners_D]

Sorry for being gruesome but... If a person had gone to that extent, wouldn't someone like NM who was always transiently roaming around the country take the body parts and distribute / bury / burn / throw into lake or sea? So as to avoid discovery. As opposed to the really really hard work of lifting into attic and then fixing them to his known location? Hence I was wondering if she may have been forced up into the attic whilst alive

It's tricky, because I am applying non-criminal reasoning to a very criminal act.

If this was his first murder he may have been panicked into thinking this was a good idea, maybe he had no idea what to do and it seemed safer to hide things than to take them out into the real world outside of his contained crime scene.

Being forced up seems possible, but seems to create more risk for her fighting back/resisting as it's clearly an enclosed space with no escape other than through the person forcing you up there.

I almost hope we never find out what happened there, just knowing that the right culprit has been found, Leah put to rest and her family given the closure they so desperately need.

 

[Skigh]

It's one thing to have free access to the home and carry tools / ladder in and out, it's quite another to get a body up a ladder into an attic hatch. Also, it's a very specific location that would not enable a killer to evade their crime.

It is possible Leah was alive when she entered the attic.

 

[Plod]

I was asking you what you meant by what you typed. i put it in bold the sentence i was querying

I think what I was saying was that he asked for someone’s help to get body in loft - but unlikely. I think someone’s theory that she was up there before she died is likely, gruesome as it is.

 

[Willowy]

Possibly, I think he definitely felt the net was closing in, but i just don't think the police would have been able to link him to her at the time of her disappearance, especially considering his multiple alias and locations.

I didn't mean police connected him to Leah back then. They said they didn't.

What I'm saying is that NM may have assumed the appeal for info about him (which was actually related to his other crimes) was connected to Leah's disappearance. Which you probably would be paranoid about if you were guilty of a hideous crime that was getting a lot of press coverage.

 

[WiseOwl]

I don't want to type this...

We can't be sure the body was in one piece when moved to the attic.

This is what i fear, that it could have been dismembered.

It would be easier for the perp to hide it this way.

 

[Willowy]

Oh I hadn't seen that, which means that no.4 was the only real place where witnesses would be likely to see anything. If they left for work earlier than 8:30 which is common, even internal driven commuting in MK can take some time in my experience, then there's a good possibility no one was there to see anything.

Sorry, that first sentence in my reply sounded a bit short but wasn't intended like that!

 

[CGMK]

Possibly in the driveway but not at the underpass, that's a quite a distance to grab and take her back to the house in broad daylight and she knows taekwondo. I assume if window was broken at back he had got her into kitchen for a drink with some fake politeness and this is where the assault took place and hence damage to window. Forensics will reveal this.

I don't think it would take much at all for a man to pull someone diagonally into open garage door its literally a couple of yards. He could also have driven to the area on the other side of that underpass after seeing her walk that way. MK has had variety of assaults taking place under the underpasses even in broad daylight. It was a slippery morning I always thought her shoes were not weather appropriate. Police release video after teenage girl was kidnapped in Milton Keynes and dumped in layby Leah also had damage to one of her eyes, which possibly held her back? Her father also said before to remember that she was not a fighter as such. He could have asked for fake help for someone inside, that wasn't really inside. I think the victims of his would hold the key of how he approaches.

 

[Smutty94]

Wow just catching up on today's revelations.
I have to say I didn't see this coming
Tvp are working very fast with this
I must agree with some of you this does seem very convenient.
Does this man have social media has anyone searched for him Perhaps his profile isn't private could see who he's friends with etc.
Long shot.
Perhaps she was alive and he assumed she would be found soon so killed himself.
Gosh there are so many possibilities

 

[SpursGyal]

I didn't mean police connected him to Leah back then. They said they didn't.

What I'm saying is that NM may have assumed the appeal for info about him (which was actually related to his other crimes) was connected to Leah's disappearance. Which you probably would be paranoid about if you were guilty of a hideous crime that was getting a lot of press coverage.

I agree, coupled with her face being everywhere, a high police presence and possibly seeing the calling cards the police posted through the door, he may have thought suicide was his only way of evading capture. If only he could have left a note about Leah tho, her family could have been saved years of heartache, and Hayden may not have taken his own life.

 

[BrianJohnson]

It is possible Leah was alive when she entered the attic.

Unlikely I think

Not entirely impossible - Libby’s killer went from flashing to breaking into womens underwear drawers to rape (which seemingly went horrifically wrong), Wayne Couzens went from flashing to rape and murder so of course it is possible

But i think far more likely if it is him that he tried it on with her, she resisted and fought back and he strangled her or something and in a panic he disposed of her body in the attic

Holding someone hostage for ages in an attic feels unlikely

 

[Kinners_D]

Sorry, that first sentence in my reply sounded a bit short but wasn't intended like that!

Didn't read it like that at all, no harm done!

 

[Plod]

I think that keeping her alive longer would only increase risk of getting caught, idk. I hate that this sort of thing is mentioned by press because it must torture poor parents. Aren’t the police supposed to have knocked on the door and there been no one there - I’d love to know about that in more detail.

 

[Officer Dibble]

Yeah, I thought you were saying he’d been paid by someone else, didn’t see the previous post!

i wondered what you meant.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

It's tricky, because I am applying non-criminal reasoning to a very criminal act.

If this was his first murder he may have been panicked into thinking this was a good idea, maybe he had no idea what to do and it seemed safer to hide things than to take them out into the real world outside of his contained crime scene.

Being forced up seems possible, but seems to create more risk for her fighting back/resisting as it's clearly an enclosed space with no escape other than through the person forcing you up there.

I almost hope we never find out what happened there, just knowing that the right culprit has been found, Leah put to rest and her family given the closure they so desperately need.

I guess he may not have thought it through. To my (hopefully also non-criminal) mind, if a person tried to dismember someone, there'd be an awful lot of mess. If in a state of panic the easiest default way to clear up that mess would be confined to a small area maybe use bin liners and get those bags out of the house and far far away then clean up. The idea of having made that awful mess and deciding to make more of it by traipsing to the uppermost part of the house and needing to travel via a ladder doesn't make a great deal of sense to me.