VERDICT WATCH UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, found deceased, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #24

[ChiCubs2016]

I haven't seen anyone accept that the sex was consensual.

But what you're saying, in effect, is that to believe he didn't murder her he has to admit rape.


I don't see the chances of that being very high. I think the preferred theory is that he asphyxiated Libby during the rape. Who here would really go on to accept him admitting he raped her but is sure he wasn't lying about not asphyxiating her?

The prosecution outlined his 5 versions. IMO PR changed his story to fit evidence as it was presented to the defense. I am glad the prosecution detailed every version to the jury. I just believe as @mrjitty stated the judge should be allowed to give strong, negative direction to the jury in regards to testimony from the defendant that does not match any other version he has told prior to testifying. MOO

 

[Jarvis1969]

Is anyone else sitting constantly refreshing this page to see if there is any word from the jury

 

[Mommysleuth11]

One thing that does confuse me about the not guilty camp is what was PR doing outside the park for all that time. And I'd appreciate your opinion on it.

Locals have said they have no issue with the rape and murder timings.

PR says the rape takes place by the green shed outside the park. He doesn't admit to going into the park. So if we're very, very generous to PR and allow a minute for the rape - what was happening in the rest of that time

PR says he leaves Libby outside the park and he remains outside the park. He is careful to keep himself outside of the park so for misadventure that has to be Libby's start point.

So isn't it important to find a reasonable explanation for what was happening if you believe that? Cos it's a significant amount of time? And PR doesn't allow for an assumption that he left her in the park

Bbm

I see you repeting this like the river not being tidal. With all respect two locals said they didn't have issue with the timing in response to me saying many indeed did.
There were a lot of locals before who said they did have issues and perhaps 1 or 2 since have also said they do, so that definitely seems a matter of opinion.
Moo

 

[marshy73]

Is anyone else sitting constantly refreshing this page to see if there is any word from the jury

Yep
And lawpages website

 

[Alyce]

How do I set an alert as to when they've reached a verdict please?

You could follow the journalist on twitter - or just put Libby's name into twitter, it will be reported by several journalists once the Jury come back in

 

[Alyce]

4pm finish today


Viking FM News
@VikingFMNews
·
1h
A jury's back at #Sheffield Crown Court to continue its deliberations in the Libby Squire murder trial. Pawel Relowicz denies murdering and raping the #Hull student. The jury will deliberate until 4pm today.

 

[Tortoise]

The prosecution outlined his 5 versions. IMO PR changed his story to fit evidence as it was presented to the defense. I am glad the prosecution detailed every version to the jury. I just believe as @mrjitty stated the judge should be allowed to give strong, negative direction to the jury in regards to testimony from the defendant that does not match any other version he has told prior to testifying. MOO

So what would that look like in reality? -

'He lied to police and denied having sex with Libby until he was presented with the forensic evidence', so you must what? find he is more likely to be guilty?

The jurors will have already formed an impression of him through seeing him testifying and hearing what he said in police interviews, and having the prosecution hammering home all his changing versions and adaptations after hearing witness evidence. I just don't think there is anything beyond what the judge already said that could be said about it, because the jurors will have the life experience collectively to assess it themselves. There are reasons people lie, one of which is to avoid being convicted. But what weight to attach to each lie, and why he lied, is a matter for 12 jurors, not a direction from the judge, IMO.

These were her words just for interest, and I imagine they are the carefully worded and the same words used for all cases based on case law -


Jury must consider why Relowicz told lies
During the trial Reolowicz admitted lying about some of the details that night.

Justice Lambert said: “During his evidence he admitted he told a number of lies and said he did not want his wife to know he had cheated on her and what he was up to that night.

"When you’re considering this evidence you must consider why he lied and you must consider that people who are not guilty also lie for other reasons.

"You must not convict him on either offence only because he lied."

Libby Squire murder trial updates as jury consider verdict

 

[Alyce]

Twitter........


Sophie Corcoran
@sophcorcoran
·
2h
The verdicts as soon as they come in will be here

 

[Ruthbullock]

I agree totally. If it was even remotely on her mind that night why not walk under a bus on Beverley road?

If you watch the CCTV she almost did

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I’m finding all the suicide talk a little disrespectful to be honest. I know the defence team mentioned it, but their job is to detract blame from their client. I don’t think anyone who has lived and breathed this case from day one really thinks Libby threw herself in the river. Perhaps we could re-examine it after the verdict, if needs be.

Meanwhile, we’re all rooting for you, Libby; and for your family and friends who have remained so dignified throughout this awful tragedy.

 

[Edinlass]

I’m finding all the suicide talk a little disrespectful to be honest. I know the defence team mentioned it, but their job is to detract blame from their client. I don’t think anyone who has lived and breathed this case from day one really thinks Libby threw herself in the river. Perhaps we could re-examine it after the verdict, if needs be.

Meanwhile, we’re all rooting for you, Libby; and for your family and friends who have remained so dignified throughout this awful tragedy.

Agreed!

 

[jamjim]

12:56
Trial called back on

The trial has been called back on so the judge can deal with a jury note.

Libby Squire murder trial updates as jury consider verdict

 

[MsMiniSleuth]

I voted for the decision taking a few days due to the complexity of the case and the multiple charges. Without speaking specifically, from my experience on a jury, even if it is quickly established that everyone is in agreement on the verdict, the jury will still go through all of the evidence again in the jury room seeing this as their duty and in case anyone has an important insight or comment that affects someone else's decision. They have a lot to go through here.

Absolutely. And bear in mind what we got from the Hull paper reporting, was only a mere fraction of what went on in court.

 

[MsMiniSleuth]

5 men 7 women

Thanks!

 

[jamjim]

12:56
Trial called back on

The trial has been called back on so the judge can deal with a jury note.

Libby Squire murder trial updates as jury consider verdict

Wonder what they're asking...

 

[MsMiniSleuth]

Twitter........


Sophie Corcoran
@sophcorcoran
·
2h
The verdicts as soon as they come in will be here

I hope Sophie is doing it rather than one of her male colleagues. I found one of their reporting at times to be incomprehensible in some places, and had to read through several times to try and get what was meant!

 

[VicBlazey]

Wonder what they're asking...

Omg my heart.. I read 'trial called back' and I thought that was it!!

 

[ChiCubs2016]

Would we hear what the note said?

 

[Newthoughts]

It’s all likely enough to be considered an argument by the defence and that’s all that matters. The jury will decide whether it was likely enough to give doubt about whether she was killed by PR.

I’m not sure what you mean when you say she’s in survival mode to be honest. The argument id put to that is that she had managed to walk a fair distance away from her house (whilst falling and struggling admittedly) and also managed to fight back during the rape and scratch his face. If she was capable of those acts, then I’d suggest she was capable of becoming disorientated and walking into the park too.

As for the car/bus suggestion, again I think we have differing opinions on depression and suicide. I do not see suicide as an impulse decision of “I know, I’ll just jump in the road”. If that’s how you feel suicide goes, then that’s your opinion and you are fully entitled to that.

To reiterate again, I do not believe LS committed suicide. But I am putting across the point that is a perfectly plausible point of discussion for the defence and the jury.

When I say survival mode I am relying on an expert witness who has estimated her body temperature has dropped to 35 degrees and therefore she is hypothermic.

So her body will be focused on preventing further drops in temperature. Human beings function within a very narrow range of a lot of things like body temp and work very hard to remain within that range.

When she left the taxi she was already very drunk. But it is unlikely she had spent enough time in the cold at that point for a significant drop in body temp. So it would be easier to walk along pavements

When PR picks her up the expert has stated he believes she is now hypothermic with a body temp of 35. Her body will have been working flat out to preserve it - breaking down glycogen, shivering, diverting its resources to that

The park is not a flat pavement.

So you're not really comparing like with like.

 

[Alyce]

I hope Sophie is doing it rather than one of her male colleagues. I found onr of their reporting at times to be incomprehensible in some places, and had to read through several times to try and get what was meant!

I know what you mean. It does sound as though Sophie is there today, or at least she is on verdict watch and ready to report, rather than her colleague.