UK UK - Manchester, 'Angel of the Meadow' WhtFem Skeletal, 16-30, buried, Jan'10

[Bit of hope]

The 'pinafore' does look homemade. The buttons seem be an odd choice if on a new (bought) garment and it's doesn't have any labels where I'd expect?
I cut them out myself, that is on t-shirts, dresses but only on stuff when they irritate my neck, so even I wouldn't do that with a pinafore/apron.

The pattern & material is certainly quite unusual?

I've posted pics again as I keep having go back to 1st page to find a link to them.

Did she tried to make it look "sexy" or less stiff by pulling it up in a sort of order on one site? Like in this picture of Coffeeandacing

 

[Keine Engel]

Did she tried to make it look "sexy" or less stiff by pulling it up in a sort of order on one site? Like in this picture of Coffeeandacing

Hi
Yeah - I was wondering about the what looks to be a tied 'bow'
That certainly does match up, does anyone know if that was a common way to be worn back then?

 

[dotr]

Hi
Yeah - I was wondering about the what looks to be a tied 'bow'
That certainly does match up, does anyone know if that was a common way to be worn back then?

Something i might expect to see on a stage costume, imo.

 

[Oriana]

The 'pinafore' does look homemade. The buttons seem be an odd choice if on a new (bought) garment and it's doesn't have any labels where I'd expect?
I cut them out myself, that is on t-shirts, dresses but only on stuff when they irritate my neck, so even I wouldn't do that with a pinafore/apron.

The pattern & material is certainly quite unusual?

I've posted pics again as I keep having go back to 1st page to find a link to them.

What do you think about the convicted murderer's already in prison for other murders being DNA'd by police and ruled out as suspects? That surely means they've got the DNA of the potential killer no? Or at the very least a partial DNA. Obviously a suspect isnt in that DNA database. I'm curious also as to where this poor girls body was dumped after her murder, who would know about that location? A deep gap between two walls? Only someone familiar with the area and surrounding offices and buildings would know that place. I can't see the body's final location being a spur of the moment dumping ground, though of course it may have been, just seems unlikely to me. As it was the location of a car park, it's possible the girl was killed in a car or van in the vicinity and wrapped or covered in carpet remnants dumped nearby, fly tipping in public places was not uncommon back then. Perhaps the victim had accepted a lift home from someone in a nearby public house and found herself attacked near the site? As there were 3 different types of carpet are we looking at a carpet fitter who fits new carpets and removes the old taking them away? A rapist carpet fitter in a van...?? But I feel the police would have gone over old cases and perhaps found potential suspects in that case. My feeling is this killer may have killed before, unsolved cold cases in the North are not rare, and that the suspect is living below the radar, probably as a decent law abiding person above suspicion, but who has raped before for certain. It's just that the police aren't in possession of his DNA because hes never been picked up or arrested for a crime that requires swab testing. Yet.

 

[Bit of hope]

Something i might expect to see on a stage costume, imo.

Or indeed a bar uniform. It also reminds me of a variation of the "dirdnl" dress.

 

[Oriana]

The 'pinafore' does look homemade. The buttons seem be an odd choice if on a new (bought) garment and it's doesn't have any labels where I'd expect?
I cut them out myself, that is on t-shirts, dresses but only on stuff when they irritate my neck, so even I wouldn't do that with a pinafore/apron.

The pattern & material is certainly quite unusual?

I've posted pics again as I keep having go back to 1st page to find a link to them.

The two buttons on the front top section were common back in the 1970s on that pinafore style.

 

[Oriana]

Did she tried to make it look "sexy" or less stiff by pulling it up in a sort of order on one site? Like in this picture of Coffeeandacing

Is it possible that the material has rotted and got stuck into that twisted pattern? The police forensics would have treated it very delicately for fear of destroying evidence. My theory is its rotted into that shape.

 

[coffeeandacig]

The victim was found with stockings, but was naked from the waist down. I took the liberty of removing the underskirt, and adding classic 60's/70's white stockings.

 

[Keine Engel]

What do you think about the convicted murderer's already in prison for other murders being DNA'd by police and ruled out as suspects? That surely means they've got the DNA of the potential killer no? Or at the very least a partial DNA. Obviously a suspect isnt in that DNA database. I'm curious also as to where this poor girls body was dumped after her murder, who would know about that location? A deep gap between two walls? Only someone familiar with the area and surrounding offices and buildings would know that place. I can't see the body's final location being a spur of the moment dumping ground, though of course it may have been, just seems unlikely to me. As it was the location of a car park, it's possible the girl was killed in a car or van in the vicinity and wrapped or covered in carpet remnants dumped nearby, fly tipping in public places was not uncommon back then. Perhaps the victim had accepted a lift home from someone in a nearby public house and found herself attacked near the site? As there were 3 different types of carpet are we looking at a carpet fitter who fits new carpets and removes the old taking them away? A rapist carpet fitter in a van...?? But I feel the police would have gone over old cases and perhaps found potential suspects in that case. My feeling is this killer may have killed before, unsolved cold cases in the North are not rare, and that the suspect is living below the radar, probably as a decent law abiding person above suspicion, but who has raped before for certain. It's just that the police aren't in possession of his DNA because hes never been picked up or arrested for a crime that requires swab testing. Yet.

Hi
I think they do have DNA. That would rule out all convicted killers (British at least).
I imagine they have DNA records going back quite a while, especially for serious offences if not all convicted criminals, late 80s ? definitely early 90's.

...She said: 'Some of these families who have contacted us are from foreign countries and we’ve also made numerous trips to Ireland.

(referring to Tanzania)... 'However, we are having trouble obtaining DNA samples from the authorities over there and these issues can be problematic.'

They must have DNA samples, this thou I think, does sound like they're fairly sure it's from the suspect?

I know the possible time frame is rather wide but I was thinking earlier 70's for some reason - I sure did miss this before - Duh

...An inquest into the woman’s death heard that the woman was killed between 1975 and 1988, according to forensic tests.

This & the "numerous trips to Ireland" has got me back to thinking about the St. Paddy's Day-Guiness connection again?

(I'd thought maybe that wasn't so likely as in the earlier 70's (well all the 70's) 'The Troubles' were BAD so kinda celebrating anything Irish wouldn't have been such a great idea)

The site being a car park previously does make me wonder whether all 3 pieces of carpet found are definitely connect to the murder.

...The blue carpet appeared to have been cut to fit a Ford Cortina, with a hole for the gearstick.

Has Gene Hunt been cleared?

​

Manchester Evening News

 

[Oriana]

Hi
I think they do have DNA. That would rule out all convicted killers (British at least).
I imagine they have DNA records going back quite a while, especially for serious offences if not all convicted criminals, late 80s ? definitely early 90's.

...She said: 'Some of these families who have contacted us are from foreign countries and we’ve also made numerous trips to Ireland.

(referring to Tanzania)... 'However, we are having trouble obtaining DNA samples from the authorities over there and these issues can be problematic.'

They must have DNA samples, this thou I think, does sound like they're fairly sure it's from the suspect?

I know the possible time frame is rather wide but I was thinking earlier 70's for some reason - I sure did miss this before - Duh

...An inquest into the woman’s death heard that the woman was killed between 1975 and 1988, according to forensic tests.

This & the "numerous trips to Ireland" has got me back to thinking about the St. Paddy's Day-Guiness connection again?

(I'd thought maybe that wasn't so likely as in the earlier 70's (well all the 70's) 'The Troubles' were BAD so kinda celebrating anything Irish wouldn't have been such a great idea)

The site being a car park previously does make me wonder whether all 3 pieces of carpet found are definitely connect to the murder.

...The blue carpet appeared to have been cut to fit a Ford Cortina, with a hole for the gearstick.

Has Gene Hunt been cleared?

​

Manchester Evening News

I'm also wondering about the victims hair, if the body had lain unmoved for 40 years was there hair found at the resting site? I read somewhere today that the building where the body was found between the rear wall and the fence, was a Crisis Centre, and there was also student accommodation around that site. However I feel a student would be missed... So, was she a lady of the night, known locally. Someone would have noticed or remembered the girl with the missing tooth, smiling at them somewhere, a pub, a club, a corner shop...and this is an unusual detail as she had fillings so obviously visited a dentist from time to time. I'm also wondering what other information there is that's being with held, like was there any blood staining on her clothing? What other DNA do they have? The police are being a little economic with the detail.

 

[Oriana]

This is Manchester: 99 photos from the 1970s

Some fascinating photos of Manchester in the 1970's, including the CIS Building on Miller Street close to where the Angel's body lay.

 

[dotr]

This is Manchester: 99 photos from the 1970s

Some fascinating photos of Manchester in the 1970's, including the CIS Building on Miller Street close to where the Angel's body lay.

Interesting pics, nice find!

 

[Keine Engel]

...The police are being a little economic with the detail.

I was thinking that when looking for a pic of the pinafore, specifically the pattern. A HD image (to use with whatever 'tools' or other resources) would be so helpful. The police are obviously limited to the time/resources they can spend on these cold cases so that's where the public, like ourselves on here, can really help. Like the 'Guinness measure' a cleaned up pic or of a similar one, even an illustration of it as it was, then people who want to help can use.
It can't exactly hurt at this point in time

I noticed the Manchester Evening News had loads of various 'Manchester Galleries' linked on their site

Here's a starter 1970s nightclub scene in Manchester

Genevieves

 

[dotr]

Apologies for unintended bolding.
https://wikivisually.com/wiki/Pinafore
In popular culture
"A key difference between a pinafore and a jumper dress is that the pinafore is open in the back. In informal British usage, however, a pinafore dress is sometimes referred to as simply a pinafore, which can lead to confusion. Nevertheless, this has led some authors to use the term "pinafore apron", although this is redundant as pinafore alone implies an apron."
"A child's garment to wear at school or for play would be a pinafore. More recently, other types of full or dress-like aprons are also occasionally referred to as pinafores. In particular, this is the case for an apron with a full skirt, bib and criss-cross shoulder straps.

Further confusion results from some foreign languages, which, unlike English, do not have a distinctive term for the pinafore. In German, for example, there is no precise term for pinafore. Schürze means "apron" and thus Kinderschürze is used to describe a child's apron or pinafore (in contrast to the German word "Kittelschürze", which refers to an adult garment, typically worn by older women for housework tasks and cleaning)."

• H.M.S. Pinafore, a comic opera by Gilbert and Sullivan, uses the word in its title as a comical name for a warship.
• At the Lowood School in Jane Eyre, the students are forced to make and wear their uniform which includes a pinafore.
• Alice, the eponymous heroine of Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, wore a white pinafore over a blue dress in John Tenniel's illustrations.
• A song and album title by the English art rock group Stackridge is called Pinafore Days.
• Swedish author Astrid Lindgren, known for the Pippi Longstocking series, created a character, Madicken, who is often portrayed wearing a pinafore.
• Granville, the errand boy of the British TV series Open All Hours, frequently complains about his having to wear a pinny and his being unable to acquire a modern look because of the pinny.
• United Kingdom television programme Sugar Rush describes one of the main characters, Nathan, as "Half man, Half pinny."
• The song "Emmy Lou", by U.S. Acoustic Americana band The Gravy Boys contains the lyrics, "Emmy Lou, I've been watching you, with your pinafore and custom shade".

 

[Keine Engel]

...In popular culture
"A key difference between a pinafore and a jumper dress is that the pinafore is open in the back.

• Granville, the errand boy of the British TV series Open All Hours, frequently complains about his having to wear a pinny and his being unable to acquire a modern look because of the pinny.

LOL Granville...

Nurse Gladys Emmanuel wears one as well.

 

[Al Ka]

View attachment 205764 1960's salt and pepper shakers with the same logo.

Thank you Coffeeandacig for finding this. I have spent days (some time ago) searching for anything even slightly similar to guiness chart style and this is absolutely spot on. Our chart was definitely made in the same marketing campaign as those shakers you have found.

It has also cross my mind that measuring chart could be just that, measuring chart, not associated with pub at all, just an item made bearing their logo but used for measuring something (anything).

When you look on the right side of the chart you can actually see little blue triangles on the chart used for measuring.

 

[Al Ka]

Is it possible that the material has rotted and got stuck into that twisted pattern? The police forensics would have treated it very delicately for fear of destroying evidence. My theory is its rotted into that shape.

That is my thought too, bottom part got tangled. It is also visible that upper part of dress was protected from elements so probably laid under something or was under/in the carpet and bottom half was sticking out as is much more deteriorated, also in colour.

Also on some portion of bottom part of dress which is lifted and entangled you can see that stiches at the end are not there, they became loose or were just not done properly, so probably dress was made at home.

I have flipped photo for easier viewing

 

[Al Ka]

View attachment 206857
The victim was found with stockings, but was naked from the waist down. I took the liberty of removing the underskirt, and adding classic 60's/70's white stockings.

I am not sure about correct English term, but for me stockings are those sexy ones covering only up to the tigh of the leg. But to be clear, Angel when still alive, was wearing tights (not stockings).

When found, she wore only blue 'skinny-rib' jumper and blue bra. Tights and dress were found near her.

This is remnants of bra found still on her. I can't unscramble what is the part next to it on the left. If it is remnants of the remaining bra/corset or jumper or ripped part of pinafore dress.

I have flipped original image so anyone can double check from different angle what that 2nd part of clothing could be.

 

[Al Ka]

I'm also wondering about the victims hair, if the body had lain unmoved for 40 years was there hair found at the resting site? I read somewhere today that the building where the body was found between the rear wall and the fence, was a Crisis Centre, and there was also student accommodation around that site. However I feel a student would be missed... So, was she a lady of the night, known locally. Someone would have noticed or remembered the girl with the missing tooth, smiling at them somewhere, a pub, a club, a corner shop...and this is an unusual detail as she had fillings so obviously visited a dentist from time to time. I'm also wondering what other information there is that's being with held, like was there any blood staining on her clothing? What other DNA do they have? The police are being a little economic with the detail.

This is Manchester: 99 photos from the 1970s

Some fascinating photos of Manchester in the 1970's, including the CIS Building on Miller Street close to where the Angel's body lay.

Thank you for the link Oriana. I went through million historic photos of the area for days in the past. Thankfully there are more out there due to CIS Building being somewhat local attraction. I was trying to find photos of that building in car park which she was found next to so could see how the area looked in 70' - 90's or even any later years up to 2010 when she was found.

Unfortunately, the area was heavily developed and changed drastically every few years. The best photo I coud find is from 1966. Not luck yet of any good photo later then that.

Wider crime scene area on the photo is that car park and 2 buildings near it. I am not sure though that those are the buildings she was found next to or even if there were still standing in 2010 when she was found. It would be great if anyone could find any photos from some later years.

You mention that building was Crisis Centre - as far as I am aware building was abandoned and car park was actually wasteland but used by many for parking.

Area was known to many people as of course it was just opposite to CIS building. There was student house near by, also woman shelter, many pubs and night clubs. Someone who commented on my FB appeal mentioned that that car park was also known in 70'- 80's for men taking prostitutes there but also girls after nights out.

Attaching crime scene photo, even though it does not help much to pinpoint exact area where she was found or how it looked before demolition. I am sure those wooden pillars would be visible on the photos if we find any from years prior to demolition.

 

[Oriana]

I am not sure about correct English term, but for me stockings are those sexy ones covering only up to the tigh of the leg. But to be clear, Angel when still alive, was wearing tights (not stockings).

When found, she wore only blue 'skinny-rib' jumper and blue bra. Tights and dress were found near her.

View attachment 206974

This is remnants of bra found still on her. I can't unscramble what is the part next to it on the left. If it is remnants of the remaining bra/corset or jumper or ripped part of pinafore dress.

I have flipped original image so anyone can double check from different angle what that 2nd part of clothing could be.

View attachment 206975

Looks like the back strap and clasp of the bra itself.