UK - Nurse Lucy Letby Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #16

[katydid23]

Yet, we hear elsewhere, they spent the next 11 months trying to get her reinstated on the ward...

I think the union rep was pressuring the admins to reinstate her. And management was probably testing the waters.

 

[katydid23]

Tortoise compiled some gestation data. I added 'Cause of Deaths' and dates of deaths to her data:


Murder Cases: In every case, but one, there was evidence that air had been injected into the babies, either through their feeding tubes or into their tummies.[according to Dr Maneredes]


June 8, 2015
A -born @ 31 wks - died @ 1 day old
COD= A’s death was explicable on the basis of air embolism because air had been injected into Baby A’s blood stream.


June 14, 2015
C - born @ 30 wks -died @ 4 days old
COD=Baby C died as a result of having an excessive quantity of air injected into his stomach and that air led him to being unable to breathe and suffering cardiac arrest


June 22, 2015.
D - full term - died @ 2 days old
COD=Dr M told the jury that the presence of air around the tip of the catheter indicated what he called the intentional injection of air into her bloodstream.

August 4, 2015
E- born @ 29 wks - died @ 6 days old
COD= [The allegation is that a tube or a medical instrument was shoved down his throat, causing an internal bleed before injecting him with air. —but no post-mortem for expert to review]


October 23, 2015.
I - born @ 27 wks - died @ 11 wks old
COD=Dr Maneredes said his examinations of the record showed that her bowel was expanded like a partially inflated balloon. .. the findings would strongly indicate that Baby I died due to unnatural causes having been injected with air into her stomach and intestines.


June 23, 2016.
O - born @33+5 - died@ 2 days old.
COD=In my view the cause of death was inflicted traumatic injury to the liver, profound gastric and intestinal distention following acute excessive injection/infusion of air by a nasogastric tube and air embolism into a venous line


June 24, 2016.
P - born @ 33+5 - died @ 3 days old
COD=profound gastric and intestinal distention following acute excessive injection/infusion of air by a nasogastric tube and air embolism into a venous line



CODS were from the following podcast, by Dr Maneredes

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[Rizlabear56]

I doubt it would be patient emails. It would revolve around assessing risks to ensure patients are safe, I suppose.

U

What exactly is this "Risk@Safety Office"?

I think she mentioned dealing with emails.
Patients' emails?

Oh well...

I work in patient experience /risk. We deal with complaints/pals/incidents etc. We have on occasion had clinical staff seconded to us for periods, while they are not able to work with patients for whatever reason. We are not told why and they usually go back after a period of time. Not surprised tbh that that's where LL was placed.

 

[katydid23]

U

I work in patient experience /risk. We deal with complaints/pals/incidents etc. We have on occasion had clinical staff seconded to us for periods, while they are not able to work with patients for whatever reason. We are not told why and they usually go back after a period of time. Not surprised tbh that that's where LL was placed.

Welcome to WS and thank you for the info.

What kind of tasks would you give a nurse to do, while seconded to your division? I am very curious to hear how she might have been spending her time.

 

[Parker Knoll]

Welcome to WS and thank you for the info.

What kind of tasks would you give a nurse to do, while seconded to your division? I am very curious to hear how she might have been spending her time.

Endlessly FB messaging I would assume !

 

[Phoenix Lazarus]

Welcome to WS and thank you for the info.

What kind of tasks would you give a nurse to do, while seconded to your division? I am very curious to hear how she might have been spending her time.

She'd have been doing basic clerical stuff, like filing and data entry, and maybe some bits of typing, I would imagine.

 

[esther43]

She'd have been doing basic clerical stuff, like filing and data entry, and maybe some bits of typing, I would imagine.

There's also the possibility that she was asked to carry out admin tasks from home remotely, to avoid her coming into contact with children.

 

[Rizlabear56]

Welcome to WS and thank you for the info.

What kind of tasks would you give a nurse to do, while seconded to your division? I am very curious to hear how she might have been spending her time.

Possibly answering pals calls and emails, maybe helping with complaint responses and investigation. I work in mental health so slighty different but would imagine it would be similar, it's good to have qualified staff in the team as they can be a resource of clinical knowledge for non clinical more junior staff who have queries.

 

[marynnu]

Just a small point, but I see the other seconded nurse was sent to the dialysis unit. I wonder if she expressed an interest in this. There is no way LL would be given a choice as she couldn't be sent to a clinical area, which as a nurse she would definitely prefer. So having thought about it I can see why she was fuming!
JMO

 

[Dotta]

Possibly answering pals calls and emails, maybe helping with complaint responses and investigation. I work in mental health so slighty different but would imagine it would be similar, it's good to have qualified staff in the team as they can be a resource of clinical knowledge for non clinical more junior staff who have queries.

Looks similar to my school's team (3 ppl: a school nurse+2 teachers) who deal with accidents among students & teachers - writing post accidents protocols mainly for school management and insurance companies

When accident happens at workplace, ppl can get insurance money.

 

[Phoenix Lazarus]

If she was found guilty, I wonder how much documentaries and books about her would include those ridiculous photos of her pulling stupid faces!

 

[Dotta]

Just a small point, but I see the other seconded nurse was sent to the dialysis unit. I wonder if she expressed an interest in this. There is no way LL would be given a choice as she couldn't be sent to a clinical area, which as a nurse she would definitely prefer. So having thought about it I can see why she was fuming!
JMO

I guess her "fuming" was for an obvious reason - if you know what I mean.

JMO

 

[Marantz4250b]

There’s another one that caught my eye earlier too with this greys anatomy; the calling of the priest to baptise a baby.

Is there some sort of religious line running through all of this, I wonder? The UK is by no means a particularly religious country, as far as Christianity goes, but there have been a few mentions in this trial of priests and "emergency" batlptisms, etc which, to me, seems hughly unusual.

From my own experience, I personally don't really know anyone who's particularly religious and plenty of people, myself included, who actively avoid it. I can't speak personally as I don't have kids but I can't think of anyone I know who does who would strike me as the type who would be concerned about keeping their dying child under resus long enough for a priest to arrive apart from maybe one mother although her husband would think the opposite.

It will be interesting to find out if LL is religious, if guilty, or what the demographic in that regard is among her alleged victims. Also, the talk of "priests" suggests Catholicism, rather than Church of England. That is quite prevalent, though, in that general area, especially Liverpool.

All MOO

 

[squish]

Yet, we hear elsewhere, they spent the next 11 months trying to get her reinstated on the ward...

Yes exactly, they thought she was innocent, and were going out of their way to protect her reputation with this clever wording announcing her move off the ward.

 

[marynnu]

Is there some sort of religious line running through all of this, I wonder? The UK is by no means a particularly religious country, as far as Christianity goes, but there have been a few mentions in this trial of priests and "emergency" batlptisms, etc which, to me, seems hughly unusual.

From my own experience, I personally don't really know anyone who's particularly religious and plenty of people, myself included, who actively avoid it. I can't speak personally as I don't have kids but I can't think of anyone I know who does who would strike me as the type who would be concerned about keeping their dying child under resus long enough for a priest to arrive apart from maybe one mother although her husband would think the opposite.

It will be interesting to find out if LL is religious, if guilty, or what the demographic in that regard is among her alleged victims. Also, the talk of "priests" suggests Catholicism, rather than Church of England. That is quite prevalent, though, in that general area, especially Liverpool.

All MOO

Just from my own experience, it's very common to have neonates baptised if they're probably not going to make it. You'd always ask the question. JMO.

 

[Marantz4250b]

So it seems that Dr Choc was messaging Lucy into July, at least. And by that time she had been removed from the floor and Dr Choc would have known about the alleged accusations.

It helps me understand why LL was so upset when she first heard his name as he came to testify in her trial. At one time he was very close to her and she trusted him very much.

I am so curious what he thinks about the situation now. Does he believe the prosecution is mistaken?

She was arrested the first time on 3rd or 4th July so any messages from him would have been barely into July as the police would have had her phone from the time of the arrest. It may well be that she had had no communication from him until the point at which he spoke in court. Guilty or not I can totally understand how upsetting that must have been. Extremely upsetting if innocent

Edit: ignore - I think I'm on the totally wrong year here!

 

[ColourPurple]

If she was found guilty, I wonder how much documentaries and books about her would include those ridiculous photos of her pulling stupid faces!

I think, if guilty, any book would have the pic of her in her nurses uniform from 2013 on the front cover. I think she's been quite "lucky"in that respect. It's probably the most flattering photo of her, and was five years old , even at the time of her arrest, (so now ten years old) yet it's the one most articles use. It ticks too many boxes for them not to really, she's wearing her nurse's uniform, holding a baby grow, looks pleasant, kind, smiling, normal.

And guilty or innocent, from stuff I've read from the early days when nobody knew anything about LL, that pic alone was enough to convince a lot of people that she could not possibly be guilty. It also seemed to win her quite a few male supporters who refused to believe that somebody they perceived as attractive may have the desire, ability or "need" to harm babies.

All IMO

 

[Marantz4250b]

With the nature of this case we rarely get a laugh, but having your 'this stays between us email' exposed for everyone to see does make me laugh, what a moron Dr Choc is, lovesick fool!

Also I wonder if Dr B's email even mentioned Lucy, or was just asking for details of the collapses, because Dr Choc forwarding an email like that to her if she wasn't even mentioned in it was odd, he's jumping to her defence before she's even been 'accused' really.

So, is the real reason there is a reporting ban on his name because he's under professional investigation - or worse - I wonder and theh don't want to prejudice that?

 

[Dotta]

I think, if guilty, any book would have the pic of her in her nurses uniform from 2013 on the front cover. I think she's been quite "lucky"in that respect. It's probably the most flattering photo of her, and was five years old , even at the time of her arrest, (so now ten years old) yet it's the one most articles use. It ticks too many boxes for them not to really, she's wearing her nurse's uniform, holding a baby grow, looks pleasant, kind, smiling, normal.

And guilty or innocent, from stuff I've read from the early days when nobody knew anything about LL, that pic alone was enough to convince a lot of people that she could not possibly be guilty. It also seemed to win her quite a few male supporters who refused to believe that somebody they perceived as attractive may have the desire, ability or "need" to harm babies.

All IMO

This photo was taken by professionals - it was a publicity photo (fundraising).

No wonder it looks perfect.
Too perfect if you ask me haha

 

[Phoenix Lazarus]

I think, if guilty, any book would have the pic of her in her nurses uniform from 2013 on the front cover.

If they did, I think they'd put her police mugshot beside it, which I think would be released if she was convicted.