UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #22

[notsure]

Interesting to how one min she says she can’t speak for others etc, but here she says if others are honest- they on their phones too.
Makes great sense, not.
Moo

I suppose she meant she couldn't speak for others on certain things that she didn't personally witness, but she knew others were using their phones, because she saw them doing it.

 

[Cluedoneit]

As all this new information is being introduced by Letby that wasn’t in her previous interviews, I wonder if the Judge is going to allow rebuttal witnesses? If so expect a long line of staff confirming that all of the things she said were what ‘everyone‘ did was in reality, just what she did.

 

[katydid23]

I suppose she meant she couldn't speak for others on certain things that she didn't personally witness, but she knew others were using their phones, because she saw them doing it.

But a couple of hours ago she totally denied using her phone 'in the clinical areas.'
Then she changed it to "never use it in nurseries "

And finally admitted to using it in all nurseries including ICU....and then threw everyone else under the bus as well.

 

[Tortoise]

Posted at 14:4114:41

The scene inside the courtroom this afternoon​

Judith Moritz
Inside the courtroom
Nick Johnson KC is standing with his arms folded.
He is looking across to his right, and down, at Lucy Letby who's wearing a black pinstriped suit in the witness box. Two female prison officers are with her.
Lucy Letby speaks fairly quietly.
She's sitting very still, with her hands clasped below the table of the witness box.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-65602988

 

[notsure]

As all this new information is being introduced by Letby that wasn’t in her previous interviews, I wonder if the Judge is going to allow rebuttal witnesses? If so expect a long line of staff confirming that all of the things she said were what ‘everyone‘ did was in reality, just what she did.

Regarding use of mobile phones, I don't think they ever asked any of the other nurses about what they did. I did post on here back at the very beginning of the trial that it would be interesting to know how LL's texting compared with that of other nurses/doctors, but other posters commented that was irrelevant to the current case, as it's LL on trial, not them.

 

[ColourPurple]

Letby says she can't remember how she was alerted to Child B's collapse
Nick Johnson KC asks Lucy Letby if she recalls telling the jury that it was another nurse that alerted her to Child B's collapse in the early hours of 10 June 2015.

She says she was unsure what way around events happened.

"My memory is that she alerted me but I can't say for definite now, that was my memory at the time."

"So she was wrong about that?" Mr Johnson asks.

"Potentially yes... I can't sit here now and say definitively which way it happened."

"You injected Child B with air didn't you?" asks Mr Johnson.

Letby replies: "No I didn't."

Lucy Letby trial: Facebook searches of nurse accused of murdering babies read out in court

Lucy Letby, a former neonatal nurse, has been back in court for another day of cross-examination by the prosecution on Friday. She is accused of the murder of seven babies and the attempted murder of 10 others, and denies all the charges.

news.sky.com

 

[Tortoise]

2:45pm

Letby says she was "unsure" whether she or a colleague had alerted the other to Child B's deterioration.
LL: "I can't sit here and say definitively which way now, no."
NJ: "You injected [Child B] with air, didn't you?"
LL: "No I didn't."
Mr Johnson asks about Child B's appearance - Letby had earlier told her defence Child B "becoming quite mottled", "dark", "all over".
Letby was asked if she had seen that mottling before. "Yes, it was like general mottling that we do see on babies," adding: "It was not unusual" but it was a concern, in light of Child A's decline the night before.
Letby tells the court the mottling was more pronounced than usually found.
In police interview, Letby had said the mottling was more than seen on Child A, who was pale centrally.
"It was darker". Letby also said there was a "rash appearance".
Letby tells the court it was a "more pronounced mottling", but was still mottling.
NJ: "Are you saying this was normal?"
Letby says it was not normal, but something which would be seen. It was "more pronounced than general mottling". She says it "came very quickly", and in the context of Child A, everyone "acted very quickly".
Mr Johnson asks why a doctor asked for someone to get a camera.
LL: "In view of what had happened to [Child A] the night before...we did not want to take any chances."
Child B's mother describes the mottling event, and the consultant had "never seen this before", and the mother was "surprised" at this.
"Do you accept what [Child A and B's mother] said?"
LL: "I accept there was mottling, yes."
She says she does not recall the consultant saying that, as she was not there when it was said.
Letby tells the court she went "immediately" to get a camera, and when she returned, the mottling had gone.

2:49pm

A doctor had said Child B was a "very pale, dusky colour", and then developing widespread blotches...patches of a purpley-red colour.
Letby said she was not there at that point, as she may have been getting the camera. She says she did not see that on Child B. She says no conversation was ever had about that.
The judge asks if there was anything that could have led the doctor to be mistaken in her description.
Letby: "No, I just saw mottling."
Letby says the mottling was purpley-red.

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, May 18 - prosecution cross-examines Letby

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more,…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[Marie Bell]

As all this new information is being introduced by Letby that wasn’t in her previous interviews, I wonder if the Judge is going to allow rebuttal witnesses? If so expect a long line of staff confirming that all of the things she said were what ‘everyone‘ did was in reality, just what she did.

I think it's for the prosecution to prove that nobody else texted from work, if that's what they are alleging. Not for the Defence to prove it. It's notable that there hasn't been any received texts saying 'you're not texting at work, are you'? I daresay the defence re-direct will deal with this, amongst other things.

 

[katydid23]

Dan O'Donoghue

Mr Johnson is focusing now on testimony from doctors earlier in the trial who described seeing a purply/red blotches across her. Ms Letby says this was 'mottling' which is seen a lot in babies

Ms Letby said it was 'more pronounced that just general mottling', but mottling nonetheless. A doctor who cannot be named said she said at the time 'I've never witnessed this before' - Ms Letby says she cannot recall that comment

 

[ColourPurple]

DBM

 

[Marantz4250b]

She says she does not recall Child B's father lying on the floor following Child B's collapse.

A text message from Letby includes:...'Dad was on the foor crying saying please don't take out baby away when I took him to the mortuary, it's just heartbreaking.".

just WOW.

I distinctly recall that from months back! How could she not?

 

[katydid23]

Looks like it's a female with the use of "she".

Thanks---I edited my post, lol

 

[katydid23]

Dan O'Donoghue

Ms Letby said it was 'more pronounced that just general mottling', but mottling nonetheless. A doctor who cannot be named said she said at the time 'I've never witnessed this before' - Ms Letby says she cannot recall that comment

Mr Johnson is quoting a nurse's evidence, who also saw the mottling - she said in evidence that Child B was 'pale white with this purple blotchy discolourisation'. The nurse said she looked like her brother, Child A, had the night before

Ms Letby says 'no, I do not agree with that, that is not what I saw'

 

[Tortoise]

Posted at 14:5014:50

Letby asked to go back over police interviews​

Judith Moritz
Inside the courtroom
Nick Johnson KC asks Lucy Letby to look at the lever-arch file which contains some of her police interviews.
He takes her to the section which includes an interview she did with detectives about baby B.
They asked her about the appearance of the baby's skin. She told police that it had a "rash appearance".
She now says she accepts there was skin "mottling".
Nick Johnson KC asks the nurse if she accepts it wasn't normal.
She answers: "It was more pronounced mottling, yes, and in view of what had happened with baby A we were very keen to act".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-65602988

 

[ColourPurple]

Letby questioned on colleagues' accounts
Lucy Letby is asked about her description of Child B's appearance as "mottled and dark" as she collapsed - a description she previously gave to the court.

Asked if the mottling was "remarkable", she says she "can't recall specifically" but it was "more pronounced" than she had seen before.

Prosecutor Nick Johnson KC puts to Letby the accounts of other staff, including doctors, who had been present at the time.

One doctor previously told the court they had not witnessed the colouration Child B had before.

Asked if she accepts this, Letby says "yes, but it was not said to me". She says she agrees it was said but does not remember the conversation happening.

Mr Johnson asks why she's prepared to accept this happened even though she doesn't recall it, but has disagreed with colleagues' recollections of other events.

The defendant says she is relying on her colleagues' statements being accurate.

Lucy Letby trial: Facebook searches of nurse accused of murdering babies read out in court

Lucy Letby, a former neonatal nurse, has been back in court for another day of cross-examination by the prosecution on Friday. She is accused of the murder of seven babies and the attempted murder of 10 others, and denies all the charges.

news.sky.com

 

[Cluedoneit]

I think it's for the prosecution to prove that nobody else texted from work, if that's what they are alleging. Not for the Defence to prove it. It's notable that there hasn't been any received texts saying 'you're not texting at work, are you'? I daresay the defence re-direct will deal with this, amongst other things.

The rebuttal witnesses would be if the Judge allows the prosecution to reopen their case in the light of the new information Letby has given on the stand verses what was said in prior evidence. The prosecution aren’t expected to mind-read what the defendant might say, and may argue successfully that as her barrister on cross examination of the prosecutions witness did not mention any of these New memories , they can recall her colleagues to find out just how normal her behaviour was for the unit at that time.
it’s the same if Myers has allowed certain things as agreed evidence and now Letby is saying they are not true.

 

[Tortoise]

3:00pm

Another doctor had described a blotchiness "to one side".
Lety says she did not "take over care" of Child B, from a senior nurse of 20 years experience. She says the senior nurse was busy with the family.
The court is shown Letby is co-signer for a number of medications following Child B's collapse, with the senior nurse.
Letby denies suggesting antiphospholipid syndrome was a cause of Child B's death.*
Mr Johnson asks if Letby accepts Child A and Child B had air administered.
LL: "No."

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, May 18 - prosecution cross-examines Letby

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more,…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

* I think this should read Child A's death

 

[Anxala]

I think it's for the prosecution to prove that nobody else texted from work, if that's what they are alleging. Not for the Defence to prove it. It's notable that there hasn't been any received texts saying 'you're not texting at work, are you'? I daresay the defence re-direct will deal with this, amongst other things.

My impression from this line of questioning is more to show LL in an unprofessional light ie. not showing due care and attention to her charges and essentially, to drive a truck through her claims of being the highly professional, conscientious nurse she said she was. And also of course to highlight all the contradictions.

Essentially, it's to show her as being both unreliable and untrustworthy.

I don't think it's really to do with anyone else or with what was regarded as general practice within the unit.

JMO

 

[katydid23]

Dan O'Donoghue

@MrDanDonoghue
Mr Johnson is quoting a nurse's evidence, who also saw the mottling - she said in evidence that Child B was 'pale white with this purple blotchy discolourisation'. The nurse said she looked like her brother, Child A, had the night before

Ms Letby says 'no, I do not agree with that, that is not what I saw'

Mr Johnson asks Ms Letby if she accepts 'all the people who saw the skin discolourisation say they hadn't seen this sort of thing before' Ms Letby says 'I have to accept what they say, yes'

Mr Johnson asks, in case of Child A and Child B, if Ms Letby accepts she 'had the opportunity to have access to IV lines of both children just before they collapsed' Ms Letby responds 'Yes but I didn’t access the lines'

 

[Tortoise]

Posted at 15:0015:00

Letby shown medical notes relating to baby B​

The court is shown a neonatal intensive care chart, a blood gas record, and medication forms relating to baby B.
Lucy Letby was not the baby's designated nurse at that time, but her signature is on these documents.

Posted at 15:0715:07

Prosecution asks Letby if she put air into babies' IV lines​

Judith Moritz
Inside the courtroom
Nick Johnson KC says: "Do you accept that all the people who saw the skin discolouration, say they hadn’t seen that sort of thing before?"
Lucy Letby says: "I have to accept what they say, yes."
Johnson then adds: "Do you accept air was put into the IV lines of both children?" (Babies A and B).
Letby says: "No".
Johnson replies: "Or either of them?
Letby responds: "No".
Johnson asks: "Do you accept that you had the opportunity to access the lines of both children?"
Letby says: "Yes but I didn’t access the lines".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-65602988