GUILTY UK - Rebecca Watts, 16, Bristol, 19 Feb 2015 #14

[Tortoise]

I don't think the jury will believe anything SH has said - how many of us believe her?

 

[YidArmyRach]

I dont think we'll find out who did that if neither of them ever spoke about it, but we should find out any evidence that was deemed inadmissable

Judging from the evidence we did hear, I'm guessing the conclusive stuff which proves everything was inaddmissable. I just can't believe the defence put forward the best they had, as it seems like so much was missing.

 

[Alyce]

So when it is all said and done, will we find out about stuff that was unmentionable during the trial? Or will there be stuff kept secret forever?
We still never heard who removed her Tampon. I know it is gros to harp on about it, but I cannot bear to think that someone would do it and not be an abuser.

I would expect someone to write a book about it and probably be able to include all the info we did not hear about

 

[Alyce]

Only her being there... which apart from his bloody fingerprint is all they'd have to tie NM to the killing had he not confessed. Thank God he never noticed that

I would have thought the sheer implausibility of NM being able to do what was done in that short space of time ( allegedly ) and given his medical condition, would, by definition, tie SH to the crime.
Not to mention the cover up activity which could not have been done either alone or without SHs knowledge.
But that's just my opinion.

 

[Clio]

BIB So this charge includes helping to dismember and cover up the crime ?

No That's covered here


3. Whether Shauna Hoare is guilty of perverting the course of justice. The crown must prove:

Knew that Becky's body had been hidden, dismembered, then hidden again, and lied to police saying she did not know about it.
Her lie had a tendency to pervert the course of justice because it prevented the police from investigating the unlawful killing of Becky.
She intended to pervert the course of justice.


4. Whether Shauna Hoare is guilty of preventing a lawful burial. The crown must prove:

Hoare took part, with Matthews, in the dismemberment and hiding of Becky.

http://www.itv.com/news/west/2015-11-09/becky-watts-trial-what-the-jury-must-decide/

 

[Edinlass]

I don't think the jury will believe anything SH has said - how many of us believe her?

I sincerely hope so. I don't believe her that's for sure.

 

[ColourPurple]

BIB So this charge includes helping to dismember and cover up the crime ?

No that'll be the separate perverting th ecourseof justice an dpreventing burial charges. I think that just means the actual kidnap part.

 

[Insp.Dots]

I can't make myself believe that if you are faced with charges like these (conspiracy to kidnap, murder/manslaughter/, etc) that it really works to DENY, DENY, DENY and that you'll get off scot free. My head will spin off if this is the case with SH.

ETA: Yes, I know that if your are innocent and are being railroaded then, yes, you should DENY, DENY, DENY. It's just that I really feel that SH was completely complicit in what happened to BW :tantrum:

I think she may possibly get off on it all apart fron 'perverting the course of Justice' as they have her lying about the kidnap texts and her sudden visit to her Mum's just doesn't fit either.
FWIW I think NM will get Guilty but on Manslaughter not Murder, SH Guilty on Perverting, JI and DD not Guilty

 

[Clio]

UK & Eire saying probably not going to be able to report any more live stuff this afternoon

 

[ColourPurple]

I would have thought the sheer implausibility of NM being able to do what was done in that short space of time ( allegedly ) and given his medical condition, would, by definition, tie SH to the crime.
Not to mention the cover up activity which could not have been done either alone or without SHs knowledge.
But that's just my opinion.

Her covering up can't be used to say she was involved with the actual kidnap/killing, but yeah I reckon implausibility of him being able to do it all on his own, and chosing to do it while she was there can.

 

[Insp.Dots]

I don't think the jury will believe anything SH has said - how many of us believe her?

I do agree it is hard to believe anything she says but on the otherhand, I wish they had some more solid evidence against her, most of it is circumstantial and the precise reason the Judges comments may be telling!! :gaah:

 

[ColourPurple]

I think she may possibly get off on it all apart fron 'perverting the course of Justice' as they have her lying about the kidnap texts and her sudden visit to her Mum's just doesn't fit either.

And even lying to the police about being away all night, which allowed the body to be moved.

 

[Crazy Mama]

I find it hard to wonder what the jury made of SH. Since NM only physically abused her (pulling hair etc) twice in a 7 year relationship I am having difficulty thinking that the jury would see her as a trapped partner.
Going by her voice and tone in the police interview tapes, I wouldn't believe her.
I bet she is going down.

 

[Alyce]

UK & Eire saying probably not going to be able to report any more live stuff this afternoon

I wonder if Judge has set this restriction simply because he cant do all the summing up today.
So he doesn't want just a few parts reported today - prefers to have everything reported as one statement.

 

[Clio]

Heart West News ‏@HeartWestNews · 42s43 seconds ago
Judge's summary covering background of lives and relationship of NM and SH as previously heard in court #beckywatts

 

[Clio]

Murder and manslaughter conviction options laid out to jury

Nathan Matthews and Shauna Hoare both deny murder - but Matthews has already admitted killing Becky.

Mr Justice Dingemans has told the jury the basis on which the jury can find the couple guilty of murder, or Hoare guilty of manslaughter.
•If the jury believe Matthews intended to kill Becky or cause her grievous bodily harm they must convict him of murder.
•If the jury believe Hoare took part in a kidnap plot with the intention of killing Becky or causing her grievous bodily harm to prevent her escape and Matthews intended to kill her or cause her grievous bodily harm in the attack, they must convict her of murder.
•If the jury believe Hoare took part in a kidnap plot reasonably believing Becky would come to some harm, they must convict her of manslaughter.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/becky-watts-murder-trial-live-6797039

 

[Clio]

Other points prosecution must prove against Hoare

Shauna Hoare has also pleaded not guilty to perverting the course of justice, preventing Becky’s lawful burial and possessing two stun guns.

The judge tells the jury the prosecution must have proved the following for them to convict.
•Perverting the course of justice - that Hoare knew Becky’s body had been hidden and that she lied to police about it with the intention of perverting the police investigation.
•Preventing lawful burial - that Hoare participated in the dismembering and hiding of Becky’s body.
•Possessing stun guns - that she knowingly stored the weapons, in the knowledge they were stun guns.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/becky-watts-murder-trial-live-6797039

 

[ColourPurple]

Murder and manslaughter conviction options laid out to jury

Nathan Matthews and Shauna Hoare both deny murder - but Matthews has already admitted killing Becky.

Mr Justice Dingemans has told the jury the basis on which the jury can find the couple guilty of murder, or Hoare guilty of manslaughter.
•If the jury believe Matthews intended to kill Becky or cause her grievous bodily harm they must convict him of murder.
•If the jury believe Hoare took part in a kidnap plot with the intention of killing Becky or causing her grievous bodily harm to prevent her escape and Matthews intended to kill her or cause her grievous bodily harm in the attack, they must convict her of murder.
•If the jury believe Hoare took part in a kidnap plot reasonably believing Becky would come to some harm, they must convict her of manslaughter.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/becky-watts-murder-trial-live-6797039

Looking at that again I think she might get manslaughter. They'd just have to prove she was involved in the kidnap plan and if she was I reckon it'd be obvious that Becky would come to "some harm" even if she didn't think she'd be killed.

 

[ColourPurple]

Other points prosecution must prove against Hoare

Shauna Hoare has also pleaded not guilty to perverting the course of justice, preventing Becky’s lawful burial and possessing two stun guns.

The judge tells the jury the prosecution must have proved the following for them to convict.
•Perverting the course of justice - that Hoare knew Becky’s body had been hidden and that she lied to police about it with the intention of perverting the police investigation.
•Preventing lawful burial - that Hoare participated in the dismembering and hiding of Becky’s body.
•Possessing stun guns - that she knowingly stored the weapons, in the knowledge they were stun guns.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/becky-watts-murder-trial-live-6797039

Does it have to be dismembering AND hiding, surely hiding alone would be enough to prevent burial?

 

[jessie]

Looking at that again I think she might get manslaughter. They'd just have to prove she was involved in the kidnap plan and if she was I reckon it'd be obvious that Becky would come to "some harm" even if she didn't think she'd be killed.

Exactly my feeling - was just writing the same but you beat me to it. !