UK - Sabina Nessa, 28, found murdered in park, SE London, 18 Sep 2021 *Arrest*

[Sherlockhames]

I came here after reading about this case in the papers. I live in SW London but happen to have visited very close to this park at the end of lockdown (when looking for “different” outdoor places to take our kids to break the monotony!!). So while I find all deaths of young women tragic, this one struck a chord once I realised I was aware of the area. There has been very little information released however so there isn’t much speculation/sleuthing to be done since we heard about the body before we were aware she was missing (less than 24 hours after supposed time of death).
I just wanted to point out as others have that there is often a asymmetry in reporting of these cases and it can appear to come down to race. However, this was not a missing a persons case (unlike Sarah Everard and Gabby Petito) and so the media noise generated is bound to be smaller. But I wouldn’t be surprised if it now gain’s more traction if it turns out the police really don’t have any leads (although agree the initial arrest and then release is surprising, but good for the police this was kept quiet assigning that man arrested and released had nothing to do with her death or his life would be raked over now!!).
I am alarmed by the crime as ever - 8.30pm in a busy urban park in London (it’s barely dark at that pint so doesn’t feel dangerous with many people around) and in a busy-ish new park of Greenwich with lots of home and “life” about is truly shocking. But I am also intrigued by a few things -
1. Assuming time of death must have been arrived by circumstances surrounding her disappearance rather than post mortem (so was she reported missing by friends who were expecting her out? Or did she live alone and was on her way to meet a singular person but was maybe spotted on CCTV and then did it reappear on a path somewhere so they can identify time of death).
2. Seems a long time between her supposed time of death and her body being found if she was being looked for - but then perhaps she was never actually reported missing (on her way to meet a single individual who then never reported her missing but could verify timings of expected meet up and the police could count back from then/and from when she was reported as having left from home?).
Maybe the 40 yr old was a quickly identified potential date who was arrested as being due to meet her but was able to prove they never met. So he would be a suspect but current story is they never actually met and he thought she just ghosted him?

I am trying to think through all the possibilities but we don’t have much information to work from.

I am heartbroken and devastated for Sabina’s family and friends. It must be horrific what they are going through now, especially with an inconclusive post mortem so very little information to even begin to process.

ETA - I was writing and posting this before I saw the article about going to meet pal in a pub. So scrap a load of my spitballing theories above. That’s how police could identify her time of death.
Also - I think the reason this case has been slightly lower profile is that maybe police have quite a lot of evidence/timeline it’s not all such a mystery so they are plodding on with an investigation but maybe not looking for a mass amount of external interference or “theories” from strangers. So they aren’t really making this case bigger. Although it should be. Beautiful young successful woman goes missing before a night out - she’s basically another “perfect” victim. I think we might see this get bigger traction. Particularly if there is and arrest soon (or maybe it will be bigger news if someone is identified who then goes on the run - then it will really blow up).

 

[Sherlockhames]

Disappearing on a 5 min walk between ones home and the pub before a night out. That is so, so shocking. (Even more shocking than most of awful stuff we hear about as women being attacked). All that excitement and anticipation about going out. And not making it. And a 5 minute journey (I literally don’t want to hear a single comment in the press about “she should have stuck to busy roads etc etc!! 8.30pm it wasn’t even dark, she had a five minute trip). This should be another teachable moment about the women’s safety in general. How can this have happened again. So terrifying, but it also make my blood boil that we are just not safe!

 

[Skigh]

'Murdered' Greenwich primary school teacher was 'minutes' from home when she was killed family claim | Daily Mail Online



Primary school teacher Sabina Nessa, 28, 'was murdered by a stranger during five-minute walk through park to meet her friend in a local pub', say detectives - as fury grows over failure to make streets safe for women

• Police said she left her home on Astell Road and walked through Cator Park last Friday towards The Depot bar
• She was attacked in the park at around 8.30pm, and her body found on Saturday hidden under a pile of leaves
• Det Insp Joe Garrity said: 'Sabina's journey should have taken just over five minutes but she never made it'
• Tragedy comes amid growing anger about violence against women following murder of Sarah Everard, 33
• On June 6 last year, sisters Nicole Smallman, 27, and Bibaa Henry, 46, stabbed to death in a Wembley park

 

[Dotta]

Disappearing on a 5 min walk between ones home and the pub before a night out. That is so, so shocking. (Even more shocking than most of awful stuff we hear about as women being attacked). All that excitement and anticipation about going out. And not making it. And a 5 minute journey (I literally don’t want to hear a single comment in the press about “she should have stuck to busy roads etc etc!! 8.30pm it wasn’t even dark, she had a five minute trip). This should be another teachable moment about the women’s safety in general. How can this have happened again. So terrifying, but it also make my blood boil that we are just not safe!

Unfortunately, despite our outrage, it is just common sense for a lone woman to avoid walking through the park after dark.
Not that it always helps - vide Sarah E, but still.
A good idea is to carry an alarm - I read that women in the area got over 200 of them.
Kudos to those who thought about it - actions speak louder than words.

 

[Distant Observer]

Some clarification. London sunset on 17th September was 19.10. Therefore at 20.30 it would have been dark save for the light of the moon. Leaves are still on trees in London potentially obscuring the moon as she walked. I don't know the Kidbrooke area at all so I don't know if there is lighting in this park. However I do know that at that time of night it won't be that busy. It is wrong to think there will be dog walkers and joggers running past like it is the Central Park you see on TV. I live in London about 10 miles away and often I go out around this time to complete my steps and I don't see anyone - passing cars yes but generally not other walkers. This case is very reminiscent of the poor girl who was murdered in Finsbury Park, Iuliana Tudos in December 2017 in almost identical circumstances. I would say we are looking for a similar suspect to her murderer.

 

[MsMiniSleuth]

Some clarification. London sunset on 17th September was 19.10. Therefore at 20.30 it would have been dark save for the light of the moon. Leaves are still on trees in London potentially obscuring the moon as she walked. I don't know the Kidbrooke area at all so I don't know if there is lighting in this park. However I do know that at that time of night it won't be that busy. It is wrong to think there will be dog walkers and joggers running past like it is the Central Park you see on TV. I live in London about 10 miles away and often I go out around this time to complete my steps and I don't see anyone - passing cars yes but generally not other walkers. This case is very reminiscent of the poor girl who was murdered in Finsbury Park, Iuliana Tudos in December 2017 in almost identical circumstances. I would say we are looking for a similar suspect to her murderer.

I agree. It is dusk around 7.30pm, and by 8-8.30pm in an area with no lights, the visibility would be poor. From pictures on Google, there does appear lighting on some paths through the park, if she had kept to the paths. It was probably a walk she had done before, but I still don't know if I would do it at night.

 

[Sherlockhames]

Unfortunately, despite our outrage, it is just common sense for a lone woman to avoid walking through the park after dark.
Not that it always helps - vide Sarah E, but still.
A good idea is to carry an alarm - I read that women in the area got over 200 of them.
Kudos to those who thought about it - actions speak louder than words.

Except it wasn’t dark - it was 8.30pm last Friday night so was dim, but not completely dark. And it wasn’t some massive park. It’s an open, grassy community area surrounded by high density housing. She was walking 5 mins from home to a pub. 5 mins. By this logic women shouldn’t walk anywhere alone. Are we each going get our own chaperone (vetted of course) to allow us to move about safely? Am I any safer walking 5 minutes round the corner in a built up area if I could be bundled off the street? I think the conclusion is that women are just not safe. The circumstances are irrelevant.

 

[Sherlockhames]

Also, if you look at where she was supposedly found - around the One Space community hub, this suggests she was actually possibly just walking along the main road (and that is opposite a David Lloyd fitness Centre which may have had people coming and going - despite being 8.30pm on a Friday night!!) have the police released info of where she was walking from? I understand from the press she was supposedly headed to The Depot on Pegler Square. So was she walking from further south than one space, or did she maybe live to the east of the main Cator Park and was just heading down one of those footpath across the grassy areas to hit the main road and turn left up to Pegler Square. Whichever it was, that still means at some point she was v likely on the Kidbrooke Park Road which, while not massive would have been busy enough that whoever did this was incredibly brazen.

 

[Sherlockhames]

Cops reveal final walk of ‘murdered’ teacher, 28, on her way to meet pal

Her final route now released.

 

[Sherlockhames]

I think this route might need to be taken with a pinch of salt too. All the police seem to have released are her start and end points. This supposed “route” could just be literally the sun joining the dots. She could have been walking along the main road and dragged off it into the trees surrounding the One Space centre. Unless we get CCTV footage from dashcams or a fixed camera (which will be tricky as how does one prove a route with absence of info unless there is a camera right there she never appears on) I think her route is possibly still guess work.

Interestingly there is a lot of live building work going on in that area. So although a lot of those operators will have gone home, it may be the area is usually pretty much a hive of activity, hence not presenting as a particularly dangerous feeling place.

ETA (it is also literally the google maps route which takes you that way if you type Astell Road to Pegler Square. So either she follows this - which would take her directly round the back of One Space, or she knew the area and had her own route but for all we know she might have headed along Cambert Way (I don’t use google maps for my local area as I have my own preferred routes to take).

 

[Pinkizzy]

I guess she was followed from when she crossed the road on Cambert Way

 

[JosephineRobert]

Just to chime in as a local-ish person to the area. I drove past on Sunday night around 7.30pm and it was really dark (albeit it was a rainy, horrible night). I don't think the park is particularly well lit.

It's one of those odd parts of London where there's been a lot of development over the past few years (lots of flats have gone up) but it still somehow feels a bit empty? Not sure if that makes sense.

 

[Pinkizzy]

I agree. It is dusk around 7.30pm, and by 8-8.30pm in an area with no lights, the visibility would be poor. From pictures on Google, there does appear lighting on some paths through the park, if she had kept to the paths. It was probably a walk she had done before, but I still don't know if I would do it at night.

She may have avoided walking along the main road (near Cambert Way) to avoid being abducted like Sarah Everard

 

[Sherlockhames]

I guess she was followed from when she crossed the road on Cambert Way

Possibly. There is a lot of building work going on in that area at the moment. So potentially a lot of lone men around who could possibly take a chance and over power her (not wanting to stereotype here obviously but is there anyone on here who does not seriously believe this murder was carried out by a man?!).

Also interested in the friend she was supposedly meeting. I wonder whether this was a man in his 40s (we haven’t been told gender or age of the friend). I am only thinking aloud/MOO but maybe as the person who was “expected” to have been the last person to see her this person might have been hauled in for questioning. But seems this would be a strange crime to carry out if that was the case. So a stranger attack does seem most likely. And her being followed for a bit does seem most likely. I shudder at the thought. Do we know if her disappearance was noted and alerted the same night (just surprised it too nearly 24 hours for her to be found. But guessing she wasn’t missing all that long so police give people a bit of time to “appear” before going on high alert).

 

[MsMiniSleuth]

The person they initially hauled in and then released hasn't been ruled out, just not enough information to hold them, I presume, and they were still under 'further investigation'. Won't be the first time a suspect has been released and then later re-arrested and charged.

 

[Lod76]

Seems to be the top story on every news site now that it can possibly be assumed that her killer is at large. I think initially when it made the news and they had said a man in his 40s had been arrested, there wasn't really much to report on until further details were released. I too assumed the man arrested was whoever she was meeting. Maybe they have been able to rule him out or are looking for more evidence.

Is there a lot of CCTV in the area? Hard to believe there wouldn't be and it wouldn't be solved very quickly.

 

[Marulinka]

The person they initially hauled in and then released hasn't been ruled out, just not enough information to hold them, I presume, and they were still under 'further investigation'. Won't be the first time a suspect has been released and then later re-arrested and charged.

Yes it could go both ways but they have not been cleared yet for sure...obviously their identity and reasons for getting them arrested initially wont be made public. Innocent until proven guilty. Also police might be keeping cards very close to their chest and know more than it seems..?

 

[JosephineRobert]

Are we to assume that SN wasn't reported missing and that the discovery of her body was the first the police knew of anything?

I keep coming back to the fact that they arrested someone on suspicion of murder in what I would consider to be a very short timeframe for what they are saying was a 'stranger murder'? Suggests CCTV footage or eye witness?

I get the sense maybe the person arrested IS the correct person but they need more evidence to build a case to take to the CPS in order to charge him?

 

[Pinkizzy]

Possibly. There is a lot of building work going on in that area at the moment. So potentially a lot of lone men around who could possibly take a chance and over power her (not wanting to stereotype here obviously but is there anyone on here who does not seriously believe this murder was carried out by a man?!).

Also interested in the friend she was supposedly meeting. I wonder whether this was a man in his 40s (we haven’t been told gender or age of the friend). I am only thinking aloud/MOO but maybe as the person who was “expected” to have been the last person to see her this person might have been hauled in for questioning. But seems this would be a strange crime to carry out if that was the case. So a stranger attack does seem most likely. And her being followed for a bit does seem most likely. I shudder at the thought. Do we know if her disappearance was noted and alerted the same night (just surprised it too nearly 24 hours for her to be found. But guessing she wasn’t missing all that long so police give people a bit of time to “appear” before going on high alert).

She looks really young on her LinkedIn page, maybe someone thought she was a teenager and it was an attack by a paedophile

 

[Dotta]

I seem to remember reading about "a man loitering" in this park and Police asking the public for help in identifying him.