Understanding The Anthony's Parenting Style

[BetsyB]

Probably, and yet it seems to me it would be a tremendous relief to just face the truth and live with it. I know it's horrible, but the course they're on may be even more horrible.

It is very freeing to let go of the denial. However, right now, denial is a useful tool for them. It's frustrating for observers, but it allows them to keep putting one foot in front of the other each day.

I think we've seen glimpses of their realization that Casey is responsible for Caylee's death. When we see Cindy Anthony, her hands pressed tight against her mouth, rocking back and forth with her harms held so close to her body that it seems as though she's afraid that if she lets go, she will come apart, I think we are seeing her knowledge of the reality of the situation.

Right now, the horror is still so great that they probably can only tolerate the realization that their daughter is a monster in very small doses. Over time, it will become their reality. Right now, they can't let it. It's too terrifying.

Rookie, I agree that society contributes to a sense of entitlement in its members. But Casey Anthony was not created by society. Her self-indulgent friends may have been--but Casey Anthony is what she is because---she is.

I know we all crave answers to the WHY? WHY? WHY DID CAYLEE DIE? that weighs heavily on us. But there is simply not a rational explanation. We can't attribute this to anything other than the existence of a supremely evil young woman.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

While I don't believe the Anthonys have parented in a way that best benefits their family, I understand what they've done and why.

Casey was not created by their parenting. She is a sociopath. She was born a sociopath.

True, a different style of parenting may have resulted in a sociopathic adult child with a greater ability to channel her impulses in socially accepted ways.

But it would not have magically created a conscience or appropriate affect or ability to empathize---or any of the things we accept as "normal" in a person.

Casey Anthony is personality disordered. She would be personality disordered no matter how she was raised.

Cindy and George Anthony did not know they spawned a sociopath. They likely first relied on their previous parenting experience to care for her and, as her tantrums and rage and bad behavior manifested, parented reactively.

If you watch their interactions now, you can see that every effort is made to placate Casey. Why? Because the alternative is unbearable to live with. She is scary. Her rage is terrifying.

Imagine being in the position of being scared of your child.

It's very difficult to imagine this scenario unless you've had exposure to a sociopath. Conversely, it's extremely easy to say, "What that kid needs is ..." But the things you and I think would be appropriate, in terms of interacting with Casey Anthony, would have no impact whatsoever.

She is a empty shell of a human. She lacks a conscience. She lacks empathy. She cannot form meaningful relationships. She cannot interact normally with others. Therefore, normal approaches do not work.

Cindy and George have done the best they can in an impossible, impossible situation. I do not agree with many, many of the things they've done during the course of this investigation. But I cannot fault them for their parenting.

NO ONE is prepared to raise a sociopath. NO ONE gets it right. There is no way to do it.

I have no education in mental health but you explained things so well that I could follow you easily and agree. I especially agree with you, after having viewed the last jail visit that was released, about George and Cindy being afraid of KC. When I watched the video I even felt a little bit sorry for them. But, I hope that if I were afraid of my daughter, I would be brave enough or smart enough to not allow her to take my granddaughter away with no supervision for any period of time, without calling in the authorities. If George and Cindy were/are afraid of her can you imagine how Caylee must have felt? It makes me heartsick!

 

[TxLady2]

I found lots of great comments to think about while reading this thread. It seemed I could agree with at least a little bit of what every poster said. But then I realized that we have no idea what George and Cindy's parenting style was. Casey is now an adult and now all we are able to see is the results of their style (or lack thereof). We can guess at what it might have been but that's without merit -- what's to gain from guesses?
They are not "parenting" now. Their child is an adult -- They were just trying to manage living with an adult child and grandchild. . . IMO that's completely different than "parenting" a youngster. We have no clue but I sure wish we did -- and then we'd know to run like the wind from doing what ever it was that they did.

But then I keep remembering that old movie, "The Bad Seed."

I agree with you. It may not have had as much to do with their parenting skills as it did with her personality disorders. Many times parents do not see the same things in their child that someone outside the family does.
I think it's just wrong to put the blame on the Anthonys because Casey had a choice, she was an adult... a mother with a child. She should have protected that child with her own life.... not take it.
Sometimes parents can raise a whole dozen kids and every one of them will turn out decent, respectful, law-abiding, and successful. And other parents can have two and one turns out to be an axe-murderer. You never know.
I did not vote in this poll, because to me, it's impossible to judge someone else as a parent unless I know them. And I hate putting labels on someone I don't know either.

 

[TxLady2]

I found lots of great comments to think about while reading this thread. It seemed I could agree with at least a little bit of what every poster said. But then I realized that we have no idea what George and Cindy's parenting style was. Casey is now an adult and now all we are able to see is the results of their style (or lack thereof). We can guess at what it might have been but that's without merit -- what's to gain from guesses?
They are not "parenting" now. Their child is an adult -- They were just trying to manage living with an adult child and grandchild. . . IMO that's completely different than "parenting" a youngster. We have no clue but I sure wish we did -- and then we'd know to run like the wind from doing what ever it was that they did.

But then I keep remembering that old movie, "The Bad Seed."

I agree with you. It may not have had as much to do with their parenting skills as it did with her personality disorders. Many times parents do not see the same things in their child that someone outside the family does.
I think it's just wrong to put the blame on the Anthonys because Casey had a choice, she was an adult... a mother with a child. She should have protected that child with her own life.... not take it.
Sometimes parents can raise a whole dozen kids and every one of them will turn out decent, respectful, law-abiding, and successful. And other parents can have two and one turns out to be an axe-murderer. You never know.
I did not vote in this poll, because to me, it's impossible to judge someone else as a parent unless I know them. And I hate putting labels on someone I don't know either.

 

[TxLady2]

If you watch their interactions now, you can see that every effort is made to placate Casey. Why? Because the alternative is unbearable to live with. She is scary. Her rage is terrifying.

I don't see that rage in these jailhouse videos... all I see is a childish tantrum with some angry words... nothing like the kind of rage that would be scary or terrifying. She just sounds like a spoiled brat that has had whatever she wanted all her life, and is now in a situation she can't slide out of. Literally.

 

[OneLostGrl]

~snip~


Fine, that's their position, and I respect the fact they HAVE a position, however, I am part of a society that doesn't agree.

Saving her from her consequences stops her from learning that her actions, lies, etc DO have consequences.

~snip.

..As a parent myself, that's a tough thing to do, but I see it to be the right thing to do. It will build character, and a sense of personal responsibility. You don't support the lying and misdirection, you support the good, positive efforts towards getting the lies and misdirection cleared away, right? Then DO that!

Think about it: if you had a magic device that removed all pain from a child even as it occurs, would it be a good idea to always use it? Or do you think the child will eventually set themselves on fire not realizing that it consumed them? They NEED that "oops" moment that hurts them.. if they don't get it, they'll never learn. It's called feedback; no feedback, no growth.

Seems like perhaps this is how Casey's life has possibly always been.. a little sheltered by parents who allowed her to do bad things without real consequences. She has now set herself on fire as a result.

~snip~

It feels to me as though they're doing this so they can say "well we tried everything we could to support our daughter, but it couldn't change who our daughter was."

I defy their right to EVER say that.

~snip~

...If there is to be any healing, it requires the wound to stop being created. Just look at the daughter "well I can see that calling here was a waste of time". ...

~snip~

Daaamn! Where did you come from.. and where have you gone?! I agree with so much of what you have written here!

 

[OneLostGrl]

I don't see that rage in these jailhouse videos... all I see is a childish tantrum with some angry words... nothing like the kind of rage that would be scary or terrifying. She just sounds like a spoiled brat that has had whatever she wanted all her life, and is now in a situation she can't slide out of. Literally.

I agree.

 

[magic-cat]

I agree.

Ditto. Her behavior is so far removed from adult behavior that I would have to place her, developmentally, in about the 14 to 15 age range. Isn't that the key time when the sociopathic personality will show some "signs"? Perhaps she liked it there so much she decided she would just stay at that developmental stage...an egocentric teenager with no thought for anyone but her own sick self.

 

[zadari]

i voted awhile back but realized now i shouldnt have .. we are judgeing thier parenting style under a very tragic situation .. the only people that have spoken up are family members of theirs and some friends of caseys
.. family cannot always be trusted they say nasty things about eachother all the time . and the friends may not be truthful either
id like to see an actual person who knew the whole family for years, was close good friends with them step up on their behalf and tell us how they have really been over the years .someone objective .now with caylee being missing then dead and this whole fiasco is when we "meet them " bottom line is we dont know them as people in a regular situation or lifestyle .. it doesnt matter that they brought it on themselves that isnt what im trying to say ..this situation was brought onto them because casey was too immature and selfish to have a baby .. her parents didnt make her that way that is just the way she is .i know alot of kids that were raised in good homes with love rules and with fairness.. well let me just say some of them you would swear are casey and some of them are wonderful people with kids of thier own .

 

[BetsyB]

I don't see that rage in these jailhouse videos... all I see is a childish tantrum with some angry words... nothing like the kind of rage that would be scary or terrifying. She just sounds like a spoiled brat that has had whatever she wanted all her life, and is now in a situation she can't slide out of. Literally.

You're right. It's not rage. But it's a response disproportionate to the situation. If she pitches a fit because her parents speak sweet baby-talk to her, tiptoeing around the real questions that require answers, I am willing to wager that rage is not hard to elicit.

 

[jujube]

When I see the interviews, I see parents who are treating their daughter with kid gloves because they probably know that this is the only way to get information they need. I don't think this classifies them as any particular type. The Casey of the past few years is an adult. It would be very hard for them to clamp down on her because if they put her out, they know that it would not be a good thing for their granddaughter and not because they thought CA would kill Caylee but because CA is not responsible.

There's no way that I can judge the Anthony's parenting style. You can't judge them by Casey. She seems to have a personality disorder. Any one of us who has had or will have a child can have a child born with this disorder. It wouldn't be our fault but a quirk of nature like most other birth defects.

All in all, I think they did the best they could with their damaged daughter. They never thought that Casey would kill Caylee.

 

[kiki the parrot]

When I see the interviews, I see parents who are treating their daughter with kid gloves because they probably know that this is the only way to get information they need. I don't think this classifies them as any particular type. The Casey of the past few years is an adult. It would be very hard for them to clamp down on her because if they put her out, they know that it would not be a good thing for their granddaughter and not because they thought CA would kill Caylee but because CA is not responsible.

There's no way that I can judge the Anthony's parenting style. You can't judge them by Casey. She seems to have a personality disorder. Any one of us who has had or will have a child can have a child born with this disorder. It wouldn't be our fault but a quirk of nature like most other birth defects.

All in all, I think they did the best they could with their damaged daughter. They never thought that Casey would kill Caylee.

(bold mine) And just why is she damaged...? Did they ever respond to the red flags? Did they care enough to really try to figure it out? Or better yet, to seek help--for their whole sick family? KC's behavior didn't just begin w her arrest or what we can observe in jail. It isn't a "quirk" or the result of a birth defect--and she wasn't simply "born" knowing how to exploit, manipulate or deceive, any more than she was "born" w a sense of entitlement or missing the empathy chip. It was learned, throughout her lifetime. A process over the years of perpetual enabling, excusing, enmeshment, failures to ever once hold her accountable, overcontrolling and other parental extremes. There may be genetic predispositions in some cases--where learned factors are not so clearly evidenced as in this family), but merely acting outraged at the tragedies that result w/out being willing to acknowledge the role of parenting, only dooms this cycle to replay.
:shakehead:
We all have lightbulb 'moments' as parents, but some of us choose to intervene and do something--as others simply look the other way naively believing it's "just a stage." Our children all reach an age when as teens they begin "hating," so some of us endure the hating--while others are afraid not to be their kid's best friend instead of acting like a parent. We've all had the opportunity to glimpse our children thru someone else's (a teacher's, a principal's, a neighbor's) eyes, and some of us are willing to hear, and appreciate, those insights--while others react defensively and make it all about them. We all have a chance as parents to admit, hopefully to ourselves if no one else, that what we've been doing is not working and wake up before it's too late--as others go on stubbornly clinging to denials and excuses. Where there is deception there is continual conflict. Yet the A's avoided doing anything about it, never once holding KC accountable even after her lying became compulsive and her stealing victimized everyone in their entire family--and beyond. And to any parents w a similarly cavalier approach to rearing children to be accountable, truthful and responsible; or equally casual response to red flags, I would caution them they're just gambling the odds, w very high risk stakes, that the perfect storm conditions will not also occur in their own or their childrens' lives.

Last I knew every parent still reserves the right to examine and to admit what is--and isn't--working, and where existing methods are failing, to exercise the option at any time of examining their heart, reconsidering their values, reordering their priorities, restrategizing, seeking out new skills, tools--and intervention if necessary. Or we have the option of excusing, looking the other way, ignoring the warning signs, scapegoating, shifting blame or perpetuating the patterns. Sadly this can be rather easily accomplished by the most "well intentioned" of parents--who before they will recognize or admit any fault by looking inward to do any self-evaluation, choose to minimize their own responsibility and to blame the child when their child is to an overwhelming extent a reflection of the quality of their parenting. What I see in this particular family is an awful lot of covering up--and without a doubt, a really poor working definition of love, in deadly motion. Every parent who loves their child disciplines them. And where our own consistent discipline or appropriate boundaries fail, we need to have the compassion and humility to seek outside counsel or intervention. I'm unaware to date of any attempts by the A's to impose any consequences nor anything more than idle threats for KC's unruly, irresponsible, reckless behavior nor any reports of seeking outside help (which would expose laundry or skeletons w/in family), nor bring her under authority. Instead, even as this pattern culminates in tragedy, we see CA failing to follow thru and still insisting as usual on "handling" it as she always has... by scurrying to wash the dirty laundry, denying any problem ("There was an old pizza rotting in that bag, you know how hot it's been!") and perpetuating her daughter's victimhood.

Hopefully some of us w children can learn from these grievous egs of parenting mistakes, and not have to make them all ourselves. IMO unselfish parents w compassion and humility get over themselves and respond promptly and swiftly to small warning signs early on--while others simply shake their heads years later after everything has imploded and wonder, "Where did we go wrong?" (Or in GA's own famous words, "Maybe we shouldn't have been so domineering..." Yep, that's it GA... you've got it all figured out... sigh...)
:banghead:
"CA's parenting style is, in a word, narcissistic--a combination of both permissiveness, as well as authoritiarianism. The child's learned narcissism in turn is rooted in a needy, controlling parent's over-indulgence or excessive smothering and lack of any consequences or accountability (licentiousness) simultaneously with overly harsh or critical inacceptance of a child's failures or mistakes. It results from parenting extremes based not on the child's needs but instead on the parent's own neediness. Because it is always about the parent, the child is likely to be given leniency when they most need limits, and condemnation when they most need grace and empathy--and is viewed by the parent as merely an extension of themselves. This narcissism in turn is passed on as a child is deprived of both of necessary boundaries AND permission to fail, taught neither a realistic sense of self in relation to others nor appropriate correction or consequences--ie unconditional love." ~kiki the parrot
arrot:

 

[eddeva]

while i don't believe the anthonys have parented in a way that best benefits their family, i understand what they've done and why.

Casey was not created by their parenting. She is a sociopath. She was born a sociopath.

True, a different style of parenting may have resulted in a sociopathic adult child with a greater ability to channel her impulses in socially accepted ways.

But it would not have magically created a conscience or appropriate affect or ability to empathize---or any of the things we accept as "normal" in a person.

Casey anthony is personality disordered. She would be personality disordered no matter how she was raised.

Cindy and george anthony did not know they spawned a sociopath. They likely first relied on their previous parenting experience to care for her and, as her tantrums and rage and bad behavior manifested, parented reactively.

If you watch their interactions now, you can see that every effort is made to placate casey. Why? Because the alternative is unbearable to live with. She is scary. Her rage is terrifying.

Imagine being in the position of being scared of your child.

It's very difficult to imagine this scenario unless you've had exposure to a sociopath. Conversely, it's extremely easy to say, "what that kid needs is ..." but the things you and i think would be appropriate, in terms of interacting with casey anthony, would have no impact whatsoever.

She is a empty shell of a human. She lacks a conscience. She lacks empathy. She cannot form meaningful relationships. She cannot interact normally with others. Therefore, normal approaches do not work.

Cindy and george have done the best they can in an impossible, impossible situation. I do not agree with many, many of the things they've done during the course of this investigation. But i cannot fault them for their parenting.

No one is prepared to raise a sociopath. No one gets it right. There is no way to do it.

amen!

 

[kiki the parrot]

While I don't believe the Anthonys have parented in a way that best benefits their family, I understand what they've done and why.

Casey was not created by their parenting. She is a sociopath. She was born a sociopath.

True, a different style of parenting may have resulted in a sociopathic adult child with a greater ability to channel her impulses in socially accepted ways.

But it would not have magically created a conscience or appropriate affect or ability to empathize---or any of the things we accept as "normal" in a person.

Casey Anthony is personality disordered. She would be personality disordered no matter how she was raised.

Cindy and George Anthony did not know they spawned a sociopath. They likely first relied on their previous parenting experience to care for her and, as her tantrums and rage and bad behavior manifested, parented reactively.

If you watch their interactions now, you can see that every effort is made to placate Casey. Why? Because the alternative is unbearable to live with. She is scary. Her rage is terrifying.

Imagine being in the position of being scared of your child.

It's very difficult to imagine this scenario unless you've had exposure to a sociopath. Conversely, it's extremely easy to say, "What that kid needs is ..." But the things you and I think would be appropriate, in terms of interacting with Casey Anthony, would have no impact whatsoever.

She is a empty shell of a human. She lacks a conscience. She lacks empathy. She cannot form meaningful relationships. She cannot interact normally with others. Therefore, normal approaches do not work.

Cindy and George have done the best they can in an impossible, impossible situation. I do not agree with many, many of the things they've done during the course of this investigation. But I cannot fault them for their parenting.

NO ONE is prepared to raise a sociopath. NO ONE gets it right. There is no way to do it.

(bold mine) Agree w bolded only. And while she sadly appears to have eventually become an empty shell... now...

"The fact that abnormal physical changes have been found in the brains of sociopaths does not mean that they were born this way. Things like not having a father during pre-adolescence or of being raised by non-loving parents or foster parents can cause a re-organization of brain functions and structural changes that are evident in adulthood.

The lack of loving parents has been shown to have sociopathic consequences in primate studies. Further, these characteristics appear to be transmitted from one generation to another, as sociopaths lack the capacity to love their own offspring...

Brain growth and changes can occur in the developing human because of environmental and social factors. The fact that abnormal physical changes have been found in the brains of sociopaths does not mean that they were born this way. Things like not having a father during pre-adolescence or of being raised by non-loving parents or foster parents can cause a re-organization of brain functions and structural changes that are evident in adulthood.

The lack of loving parents has been shown to have sociopathic consequences in primate studies. Further, these characteristics appear to be transmitted from one generation to another, as sociopaths lack the capacity to love their own offspring.

An estimated 3% of all adult males have this sociopathic disorder. (The antisocial personality disorder is uncommon among women.) Only a small fraction of this percentage actually develop into violent criminals. Most sociopathic individuals are able to control their disorder within the boundaries of social tolerability.

They are considered only 'socially obnoxious' or hateful personalities, and every one of us knows of someone who fits the description. Corrupt and callous politicians, social or career fast climbers, authoritarian leaders, abusing and aggressive persons, etc., are among them


...What should be done?

We need to address this problem from many sides. Poverty, although a contributing factor in "loveless" childhoods, is not the primary factor. Many loving and moral people come from impoverished environments. Many times, this environment contributes to an individual's character. The main problem seems to be in the process of parenting itself.

We teach many things in our schools: carpentry, housekeeping and cooking, computer skills... These are all great for future employment. But what do we teach about being a good parent? Perhaps a mandatory curriculum in our schools should include exposure to the benefits of loving and caring parental skills. This type of exposure to "parental psychology" might prevent future sociopaths and it also might alter budding sociopaths before their neurological hardware becomes hardwired for a life of emotionless pain.

~Dr. K. Dillard


http://www.viewzone.com/sociopath.html

 

[Texas Mist]

I don't see that rage in these jailhouse videos... all I see is a childish tantrum with some angry words... nothing like the kind of rage that would be scary or terrifying. She just sounds like a spoiled brat that has had whatever she wanted all her life, and is now in a situation she can't slide out of. Literally.

It's scary to me too, TxLady because I see how removed she is from her parents' pain & rage vs anger. I see too much of it in her eyes, nostrils & mouth. I suppose this comes from past experience with an abusive ex-husband. When he was just 'angry', he would go off on me verbally with his mental & emotional abuse. But when he was 'raging', his face completely changed -- the wild eyes, flaring nostrils, tense mouth, clenched fists. And then the physical abuse.

I shudder thinking of any possibility that KC could ever walk the streets again, and even scarier, hook up with another sociopath.

 

[stilettos]

I don't see that rage in these jailhouse videos... all I see is a childish tantrum with some angry words... nothing like the kind of rage that would be scary or terrifying. She just sounds like a spoiled brat that has had whatever she wanted all her life, and is now in a situation she can't slide out of. Literally.

It may appear to be a childish tantrum to us. If (and I say IF only because I am not a professional) Casey is personality disordered, and I believe she is; we have NO idea what it was like to live with her. Their fear of her response may be quite justified and NO ONE but those living in the home would understand that. This does NOT leave CA and GA without culpability for their own actions. ie - washing pants and cleaning car.

 

[stilettos]

Also called learned helplessness. With her family as the enablers. But I do believe its more than this.
My sister is just like KC. NOt as young and 'pretty', but the lack of emotion, and maternal instinct is just the same.
The way they say the words they think we want to hear, but with zero emotion or passion behind it. They just dont feel it.
In the beginning, I gently tried to help my sister.The whole family did. I booked a psych appt for her and went along for support and she sat there and lied through her teeth.
I had custody of her 3 children for several months, at the age of 21 when she was 27. She got them back after doing a parenting course.
Then we tried tough love. that didnt work either.
Nothing worked because its not something they can learn. The only thing that could possibly make a difference is medication, to get their brain chemistry where it needs to be.
My sister has now not seen any of her older kids in years, and doesnt even rememeber their birthdates.And the last baby she had 3 yrs ago was taken away before she even left the hospital. She is not a drug addict, or alcoholic.She never beat them.she was just completely absent and self focused. She has borderline personality disorder and wont do what she needs to do to get better.

My point is, that it cannot be blamed entirely on her upbringing, lack of boundaries and the enabling her family did.(thats not what you said, but what many posters do)
My sister and I grew up under the same roof in the same dysfunctional circumstances, and we are two completely different people.I have a mental illness too, not the same one, but i take my meds, talk with my psychologist honestly, and I try my hardest not to let it affect my children.
I know people dont like to go down the mental illness route, but by exploring it and understanding it, it may just prevent the same thing happening in the future....jmo

Butwhatif...I :blowkiss: you and I understand. Been there, done that and burned the t-shirt

 

[Oakley]

I don't see that rage in these jailhouse videos... all I see is a childish tantrum with some angry words... nothing like the kind of rage that would be scary or terrifying. She just sounds like a spoiled brat that has had whatever she wanted all her life, and is now in a situation she can't slide out of. Literally.

Ditto. Her behavior is so far removed from adult behavior that I would have to place her, developmentally, in about the 14 to 15 age range. Isn't that the key time when the sociopathic personality will show some "signs"? Perhaps she liked it there so much she decided she would just stay at that developmental stage...an egocentric teenager with no thought for anyone but her own sick self.

I agree.

ITA as well. I also don't believe anyone is born a sociopath.

 

[jujube]

(bold mine) And just why is she damaged...? Did they ever respond to the red flags? Did they care enough to really try to figure it out? Or better yet, to seek help--for their whole sick family? KC's behavior didn't just begin w her arrest or what we can observe in jail. It isn't a "quirk" or the result of a birth defect--and she wasn't simply "born" knowing how to exploit, manipulate or deceive, any more than she was "born" w a sense of entitlement or missing the empathy chip. It was learned, throughout her lifetime. A process over the years of perpetual enabling, excusing, enmeshment, failures to ever once hold her accountable, overcontrolling and other parental extremes. There may be genetic predispositions in some cases--where learned factors are not so clearly evidenced as in this family), but merely acting outraged at the tragedies that result w/out being willing to acknowledge the role of parenting, only dooms this cycle to replay.
:shakehead:
We all have lightbulb 'moments' as parents, but some of us choose to intervene and do something--as others simply look the other way naively believing it's "just a stage." Our children all reach an age when as teens they begin "hating," so some of us endure the hating--while others are afraid not to be their kid's best friend instead of acting like a parent. We've all had the opportunity to glimpse our children thru someone else's (a teacher's, a principal's, a neighbor's) eyes, and some of us are willing to hear, and appreciate, those insights--while others react defensively and make it all about them. We all have a chance as parents to admit, hopefully to ourselves if no one else, that what we've been doing is not working and wake up before it's too late--as others go on stubbornly clinging to denials and excuses. Where there is deception there is continual conflict. Yet the A's avoided doing anything about it, never once holding KC accountable even after her lying became compulsive and her stealing victimized everyone in their entire family--and beyond. And to any parents w a similarly cavalier approach to rearing children to be accountable, truthful and responsible; or equally casual response to red flags, I would caution them they're just gambling the odds, w very high risk stakes, that the perfect storm conditions will not also occur in their own or their childrens' lives.

Last I knew every parent still reserves the right to examine and to admit what is--and isn't--working, and where existing methods are failing, to exercise the option at any time of examining their heart, reconsidering their values, reordering their priorities, restrategizing, seeking out new skills, tools--and intervention if necessary. Or we have the option of excusing, looking the other way, ignoring the warning signs, scapegoating, shifting blame or perpetuating the patterns. Sadly this can be rather easily accomplished by the most "well intentioned" of parents--who before they will recognize or admit any fault by looking inward to do any self-evaluation, choose to minimize their own responsibility and to blame the child when their child is to an overwhelming extent a reflection of the quality of their parenting. What I see in this particular family is an awful lot of covering up--and without a doubt, a really poor working definition of love, in deadly motion. Every parent who loves their child disciplines them. And where our own consistent discipline or appropriate boundaries fail, we need to have the compassion and humility to seek outside counsel or intervention. I'm unaware to date of any attempts by the A's to impose any consequences nor anything more than idle threats for KC's unruly, irresponsible, reckless behavior nor any reports of seeking outside help (which would expose laundry or skeletons w/in family), nor bring her under authority. Instead, even as this pattern culminates in tragedy, we see CA failing to follow thru and still insisting as usual on "handling" it as she always has... by scurrying to wash the dirty laundry, denying any problem ("There was an old pizza rotting in that bag, you know how hot it's been!") and perpetuating her daughter's victimhood.

Hopefully some of us w children can learn from these grievous egs of parenting mistakes, and not have to make them all ourselves. IMO unselfish parents w compassion and humility get over themselves and respond promptly and swiftly to small warning signs early on--while others simply shake their heads years later after everything has imploded and wonder, "Where did we go wrong?" (Or in GA's own famous words, "Maybe we shouldn't have been so domineering..." Yep, that's it GA... you've got it all figured out... sigh...)
:banghead:
"CA's parenting style is, in a word, narcissistic--a combination of both permissiveness, as well as authoritiarianism. The child's learned narcissism in turn is rooted in a needy, controlling parent's over-indulgence or excessive smothering and lack of any consequences or accountability (licentiousness) simultaneously with overly harsh or critical inacceptance of a child's failures or mistakes. It results from parenting extremes based not on the child's needs but instead on the parent's own neediness. Because it is always about the parent, the child is likely to be given leniency when they most need limits, and condemnation when they most need grace and empathy--and is viewed by the parent as merely an extension of themselves. This narcissism in turn is passed on as a child is deprived of both of necessary boundaries AND permission to fail, taught neither a realistic sense of self in relation to others nor appropriate correction or consequences--ie unconditional love." ~kiki the parrot
arrot:

How do you know all of this? MosA lot of what I read here on the forums is conjecture. No one really knows how they may have tried to help Casey. They guess that CA is narcissistic. Unless they've personally done counseling with CA or with any the Anthony famly, a diagnosis cannot be made. Even the talking head psychologists on the news programs cannot know.

We've only seen the Anthony family ubder extreme circumstances. Who knows what they were really like? We have Casey putting words in her parent's mouths, ex. CA hates Hispanics but we truly don't know.

 

[kiki the parrot]

How do you know all of this? MosA lot of what I read here on the forums is conjecture. No one really knows how they may have tried to help Casey. They guess that CA is narcissistic. Unless they've personally done counseling with CA or with any the Anthony famly, a diagnosis cannot be made. Even the talking head psychologists on the news programs cannot know.

We've only seen the Anthony family ubder extreme circumstances. Who knows what they were really like? We have Casey putting words in her parent's mouths, ex. CA hates Hispanics but we truly don't know.

The topic of thread is what style of parenting, re the subject of this forum the A family. I have as valid an opinion and right to respond as others--and took time to patiently lay out in detail the reasoning for that opinion. You are certainly not obliged to share that, yet you yourself characterized this family as personality disordered. Acccording to Dr. Sam Vaknin, psychologist and author of Malignant Self-Love on the subject of narcissism, "it is narcissism which underlies all personality disorders. Different attributes and traits are emphasized in each of the personality disorders. But they all share the foundation of a failed psychological and psychosocial evolution. They are all the lamentable end results of stunted and compensatory trajectories of deformed growth and development." Like everyone here jujube, I can only observe the patterns of behavior, read the accounts and reports by others who knew them, do my best to sort fact from rumor, develop insights--and otherwise defer to the experts in this field. I did not arrive at my opinion hastily. JMO