VA - Amy Bradley - missing from cruise ship, Curacao - 1998 #4

Status
Not open for further replies.

Rapid Tourist

New Member
Joined
Feb 6, 2022
Messages
2
Reaction score
17
  • #1
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #2
Many posts were removed from the last thread for bickering, debating whether a source should or should not be allowed, and telling others how to post.

Please RESPECTFULLY continue the discussion here.
 
  • #3
1753290616648.webp

Interesting.
 
  • #4
  • #5
Here is the thing, if the FBI believed that JAS was AMY, then why don't we? The FBI is one of the most revered intelligence agencies in the world. Other countries contact our FBI to help them solve crimes. I believe them. Was Amy Bradley Ever Found? Unpacking the Theories About Her Disappearance and Alleged Sightings Over the Years
This is a fair question. I believe the FBI analyzed the "Jas" photo back in 2005 and has not reexamined it since. The language they used is important. I recall the wording from the Netflix series by SA Sheridan was -A forensic analyst looked at the photo and believed that it was AB, but also said, The difficult part is back then... you cannot tell when they’re altered. That kind of caution matters. If they analyzed the same photo today with modern tools and reached that conclusion, it would carry more weight. But I doubt they have probable cause to pursue that lead now. Without a source or supporting evidence, the trail went cold. As far as we know, that was the end of it. IMO only
 
  • #6
Here is the thing, if the FBI believed that JAS was AMY, then why don't we? The FBI is one of the most revered intelligence agencies in the world. Other countries contact our FBI to help them solve crimes. I believe them. Was Amy Bradley Ever Found? Unpacking the Theories About Her Disappearance and Alleged Sightings Over the Years
I agree about FBI being highly regarded and I think the FBI’s stance is that she did NOT commit suicide. Or, at least one agent said as much on the Netflix documentary. I don’t think they would waste their time all these years if they thought it was an accident or suicide. But what do I know?
Myself, I always thought something nefarious happened but I just can’t buy that she was sex trafficked. And I certainly don’t think if she was trafficked, she would be alive today. The fact that both college age women spoke to both Amy and Douglas earlier in the evening, makes me think their eye witness account in the early morning might have some merit. However, they had been up all night and probably drinking … the additional witness in the disco does strengthen the morning sighting for me, as does the fact that at least 2 witnesses swore at a grand jury hearing. Now, IF the FBI believes these 3 women, after all of their investigations, I would also.
Regarding, the AAV pix, I thought, and correct me if I’m wrong, that the face recognition was done using FBI technology (not necessarily a team of FBI experts that all agreed 100% it was Amy). It was carefully worded in the NF show to make it sound as if the FBI concluded it was Amy - but not really - the transcript is on the prior thread.
 
  • #7
So, her Birkenstocks were left on the deck but no mention of any other footwear missing.
Did she leave the cabin barefoot?

And do we know how much money Yellow's daughter was paid to cast her father in such a bad light?

Either intentionally or accidently, I think she went over the balcony
 
  • #8
So, her Birkenstocks were left on the deck but no mention of any other footwear missing.
Did she leave the cabin barefoot?
Her brother recently said that she had other shoes on board but they don’t know exactly how many pairs so they don’t know what’s missing.
 
  • #9
So, her Birkenstocks were left on the deck but no mention of any other footwear missing.
Did she leave the cabin barefoot?

And do we know how much money Yellow's daughter was paid to cast her father in such a bad light?

Either intentionally or accidently, I think she went over the balcony
100%. Same. My brain can't make a leap to anything else.
 
  • #10
So, her Birkenstocks were left on the deck but no mention of any other footwear missing.
Did she leave the cabin barefoot?

And do we know how much money Yellow's daughter was paid to cast her father in such a bad light?

Either intentionally or accidently, I think she went over the balcony
The family said she packed more than one pair of shoes but they didn’t know how many or if any other pair was missing.
Interesting about the daughter…. I would assume that IF he was an absent father and IF he was a serial cheater, she would harbor some resentment. But you never know what goes on in others relationships. It did sound like she was receiving some blowback, via social media, based on his alleged involvement.
 
  • #11
So, her Birkenstocks were left on the deck but no mention of any other footwear missing.
Did she leave the cabin barefoot?

And do we know how much money Yellow's daughter was paid to cast her father in such a bad light?

Either intentionally or accidently, I think she went over the balcony
Her brother Brad posted on his Twitter that Amy brought many pairs of shoes and could have changed them out.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #12
This is a fair question. I believe the FBI analyzed the "Jas" photo back in 2005 and has not reexamined it since. The language they used is important. I recall the wording from the Netflix series by SA Sheridan was -A forensic analyst looked at the photo and believed that it was AB, but also said, The difficult part is back then... you cannot tell when they’re altered. That kind of caution matters. If they analyzed the same photo today with modern tools and reached that conclusion, it would carry more weight. But I doubt they have probable cause to pursue that lead now. Without a source or supporting evidence, the trail went cold. As far as we know, that was the end of it. IMO only
The case is still open with the FBI. Perhaps they have used the advanced tech and we aren't privy to it? I think it is uncanny that even though Amy was declared legally dead, the FBI continues to ask for tips. Presumably they suspect fowl play. Imo
 
  • #13
I want to see what more of Rebekah Aliff says about Jaz. She's adamant its a different person
 
  • #14
Apologies in advance for the lengthy post. I am admittedly relatively new to this case and have not yet watched the documentary, but I went through the newspaper archives to see what officials said about the case back then. Most of the media coverage relied on the information relayed by Amy's family, but I did manage to find a few official statements.

In the last thread, a few commenters stated that the FBI would not be involved in the case if there was no evidence of foul play. Shortly after Amy's disappearance, FBI spokeswoman Sara Lema told the media that FBI has jurisdiction because the ship operates from U.S. territory (Roanoke Times, 28 March 1998). IANAL but this seems to be in line with 18 U.S. Code § 7 which states that "special maritime and territorial jurisdiction of the United States" applies to "any vessel belonging in whole or in part to the United States or any citizen thereof, or to any corporation created by or under the laws of the United States, or of any State, Territory, District, or possession thereof." IIRC Royal Caribbean Ltd is based in Miami, FL -- thus "special maritime and territorial jurisdiction of the United States" would seemingly apply to Rhapsody of the Seas because Royal Caribbean is a "corporation created by or under the laws of the United States."

Initially, FBI spokeswoman Sara Lema told reporters that the agency had no evidence of foul play in Amy's disappearance (Free Lance-Star, 27 March 1998). Later statements by other FBI officials did not rule out any possibilities and seemingly pointed to a lack of evidence pointing towards foul play, accident, suicide, etc. ––

  • J. Perry Smith, assistant special agent in charge of the FBI's San Juan Division said in April 1998 that "the investigation is very thorough, and we're not done yet. We have an unexplained disappearance, which may be a crime on the high seas ... And we will investigate until we're satisfied as to what happened." (Times-Dispatch, 2 April 1998)
  • James K. Weber, special agent in charge of the FBI office in San Juan, said that "we've pursued every angle, from whether there was foul play, a suicide or an accident, and we have basically not gotten anywhere." (New York Times, 16 November 1998)
Very few official statements provide any insight into the investigation into Amy's disappearance. FBI spokeswoman Sara Lema said FBI agents interviewed crew and passengers at the cruise's next stop in St. Maarten (Roanoke Times, 28 March 1998). Lema also said that agents with trained dogs searched the ship for two days but found no trace of Amy (Miami Herald, 31 March 1998).

A 1999 Style Weekly article which covered Amy's disappearance discussed competing claims about the presence of Amy's footprints on the table on the balcony (Style Weekly, 27 April 1999). According to the article, Royal Caribbean spokesman Rich Steck said that the FBI told Royal Caribbean that the agency found Amy's footprints on top of the deck table. The Bradleys claimed the opposite –– that the FBI told them that Amy's footprints were not found on the table. The author of the Style Weekly article said that when asked about this discrepancy, the FBI said they would not have disclosed any information about the investigation to Royal Caribbean but the FBI also would not confirm that Amy's footprints were not found on the table on the balcony.

A 2001 article in People stated that "the FBI found marks on the ship’s balcony railing consistent with someone having sat on it" although the statement is not attributed to a specific FBI spokesperson (People Magazine, 13 July 2001).

Based on these statements, I believe Amy likely went overboard. The FBI may or may not have evidence of an accident, depending on whether Amy's footprints were found on the balcony table (with respect to this, I find it interesting that the FBI refused to confirm that Amy's footprints were not found on the table).

On the other hand, beyond the circumstantial evidence raised by the family, the FBI has not pointed to any concrete evidence of foul play. In fact, the FBI initially stated there was no evidence of foul play (Free Lance-Star, 27 March 1998) and did not find any trace of Amy despite 2 days of searching the ship with trained dogs (Miami Herald, 31 March 1998). MOO but if Amy was abducted and taken off the ship as the family claims, surely the dogs would have picked up some trace of her during that two day search. On the other hand, if she went overboard, the lack of a scent would make complete sense as in that case she would have never left the cabin that night.

I truly feel for Amy's family -- I can't imagine spending decades living in limbo not knowing what happened to their daughter -- but IMO the abduction theory is not backed up by any concrete evidence. Even based solely on the FBI statements listed above, and not taking into account other circumstantial evidence such as Amy's drinking or her family's apparent disapproval (MOO) of her being lesbian, I think it is far more likely she went overboard (MOO but I believe she likely fell over the railing accidentally).
 
Last edited:
  • #15
Apologies in advance for the lengthy post. I am admittedly relatively new to this case and have not yet watched the documentary, but I went through the newspaper archives to see what officials said about the case back then. Most of the media coverage relied on the information relayed by Amy's family, but I did manage to find a few official statements.

In the last thread, a few commenters stated that the FBI would not be involved in the case if there was no evidence of foul play. Shortly after Amy's disappearance, FBI spokeswoman Sara Lema told the media that FBI has jurisdiction because the ship operates from U.S. territory (Roanoke Times, 28 March 1998). IANAL but this seems to be in line with 18 U.S. Code § 7 which states that "special maritime and territorial jurisdiction of the United States" applies to "any vessel belonging in whole or in part to the United States or any citizen thereof, or to any corporation created by or under the laws of the United States, or of any State, Territory, District, or possession thereof." IIRC Royal Caribbean Ltd is based in Miami, FL -- thus "special maritime and territorial jurisdiction of the United States" would seemingly apply to Rhapsody of the Seas because Royal Caribbean is a "corporation created by or under the laws of the United States."

Initially, FBI spokeswoman Sara Lema told reporters that the agency had no evidence of foul play in Amy's disappearance (Free Lance-Star, 27 March 1998). Later statements by other FBI officials did not rule out any possibilities and seemingly pointed to a lack of evidence pointing towards foul play, accident, suicide, etc. ––

  • J. Perry Smith, assistant special agent in charge of the FBI's San Juan Division said in April 1998 that "the investigation is very thorough, and we're not done yet. We have an unexplained disappearance, which may be a crime on the high seas ... And we will investigate until we're satisfied as to what happened." (Times-Dispatch, 2 April 1998)
  • James K. Weber, special agent in charge of the FBI office in San Juan, said that "we've pursued every angle, from whether there was foul play, a suicide or an accident, and we have basically not gotten anywhere." (New York Times, 16 November 1998)
Very few official statements provide any insight into the investigation into Amy's disappearance. FBI spokeswoman Sara Lema said FBI agents interviewed crew and passengers at the cruise's next stop in St. Maarten (Roanoke Times, 28 March 1998). Lema also said that agents with trained dogs searched the ship for two days but found no trace of Amy (Miami Herald, 31 March 1998).

A 1999 Style Weekly article which covered Amy's disappearance discussed competing claims about the presence of Amy's footprints on the table on the balcony (Style Weekly, 27 April 1999). According to the article, Royal Caribbean spokesman Rich Steck said that the FBI told Royal Caribbean that the agency found Amy's footprints on top of the deck table. The Bradleys claimed the opposite –– that the FBI told them that Amy's footprints were not found on the table. The author of the Style Weekly article said that when asked about this discrepancy, the FBI said they would not have disclosed any information about the investigation to Royal Caribbean but the FBI also would not confirm that Amy's footprints were not found on the table on the balcony.

A 2001 article in People stated that "the FBI found marks on the ship’s balcony railing consistent with someone having sat on it" although the statement is not attributed to a specific FBI spokesperson (People Magazine, 13 July 2001).

Based on these statements, I believe Amy likely went overboard. The FBI may or may not have evidence of an accident, depending on whether Amy's footprints were found on the balcony table (with respect to this, I find it interesting that the FBI refused to confirm that Amy's footprints were not found on the table).

On the other hand, beyond the circumstantial evidence raised by the family, the FBI has not pointed to any concrete evidence of foul play. In fact, the FBI initially stated there was no evidence of foul play (Free Lance-Star, 27 March 1998) and did not find any trace of Amy despite 2 days of searching the ship with trained dogs (Miami Herald, 31 March 1998). MOO but if Amy was abducted and taken off the ship as the family claims, surely the dogs would have picked up some trace of her during that two day search. On the other hand, if she went overboard, the lack of a scent would make complete sense as in that case she would have never left the cabin that night.

I truly feel for Amy's family -- I can't imagine spending decades living in limbo not knowing what happened to their daughter -- but IMO the abduction theory is not backed up by any concrete evidence. Even based solely on the FBI statements listed above, and not taking into account other circumstantial evidence such as Amy's drinking or her family's apparent disapproval (MOO) of her being lesbian, I think it is far more likely she went overboard (MOO but I believe she likely fell over the railing accidentally).
That is the weird part, but IMO I lean more towards the FBI not having disclosed the footprints on the table to The Royal Carribean. I think the TRC just said that to play it off as an accident and divert the attention away from foul play, e.g sex trafficking, you know because of a bad rep and all. If somebody would stand on a table and then fall over, it could be more seen as an accident out of a sincere mistake that wouldn't fault the TRC. But, the fact that the FBI indeed didn't want to disclose whether/that no footprints were found on the table is interesting. But at the same time, this could be a tactic on their part to keep the investigation more ''open'' e.g less assumptions about AB falling overboard by the public, which would bring less attention to the case. Then, people would be paying less attention if the FBI created an ''accident'' narrative.

In addition to this, I think that the FBI really can't make up their mind, whether it was an accident or foul play and therefore AB'S disappearance is still on the FBI'S page, waiting for maybe some groundbreaking evidence that might go either the way of an accident or indeed foul play, sex trafficking etc. The FBI is privy about what they share and definitely choose what to share and what not as IMO it could ''make'' or break a case.

Then again, there has only been the witnesses that stated they saw Amy, yet it cannot be proved fully, cause where is Amy? versus no witnesses that saw Amy indeed go overboard. So, I suppose they are still open to the idea of both narratives.
 
Last edited:
  • #16
  • #17
Should we assume that if the FBI has seen the one photo of Jas, that they have seen all the photos of Jas? I feel that this is the elephant in the room, so to speak< that no one is addressing. We have to assume that the FBI knows more and has seen more than we, the public, have been made privy to.
 
  • #18
ADMIN NOTE:

The amybradleyismissing site is a forum and as such is not an approved source. As we know, people can claim to be anyone and post anything on a forum, so it is not a reliable source of information. That is why Websleuths is fact based and not an "anything goes" type of forum.

Also, opinion articles are not allowed. WS members need to form their own opinions based on known facts and not ride on opinions of others out there in the big www.
 
  • #19
I just watched the Netflix series, entertaining, but ultimately failed to come to the most obvious Occam's razor conclusion. And that is that she simply got back to the cabin after drinking and partying, she felt sick, took off her shirt, took off her shoes on the balcony, pushed aside the table, leaned over the railing to vomit, and fell overboard into the dark water. Perhaps drunk, perhaps in an altered mind state. I don't think she committed suicide.
The absurdity of the series claiming that she could have swam to shore, or a body has to wash up according to some no name local policeman simply made the whole series not credible in my opinion.
This poor family needs grief counseling, because they seem unwilling to move on. Keeping her car, personal stuff etc. And not chasing these red herrings which only makes the pain worse instead of healing and accepting the most logical conclusion.
As far as the alleged eyewitness accounts, people see what they want to see. I don't think any of these people are purposely lying, but none of the accounts in the series can be verified by LE for a reason. Now as far as the kidnapped into sex trafficking theories, the fact of the matter is sex traffickers target vulnerable, low IQ, and usually foreign women. Not athletic, well spoken white women on a cruise ship with their family. That makes for good drama in a Netflix series, but really isn't reality in the real world. I was especially disturbed by the bad photoshopped escort pics in the series. Which now I've read have been debunked as belonging to a known 🤬🤬🤬🤬 star. Now one thing I will say is that if Amy was a drug addict by chance, then that shoves her into the vulnerable target wheelhouse of sex traffickers. But I highly doubt that is the case here.
The "she could've swam to shore" argument does feel like a non-starter, IMO. I'm no physicist, but I assume that if you fall over a railing like that, you're pretty likely to hit the water head-first. Given the height of the balcony, I don't think such a fall would leave a person in any condition to be swimming anywhere, to put it lightly.

I have to say, I'm inclined to think that this would be the best-case scenario for what happened in this case, because at least it would have been quick.
 
  • #20
The "she could've swam to shore" argument does feel like a non-starter, IMO. I'm no physicist, but I assume that if you fall over a railing like that, you're pretty likely to hit the water head-first. Given the height of the balcony, I don't think such a fall would leave a person in any condition to be swimming anywhere, to put it lightly.

I have to say, I'm inclined to think that this would be the best-case scenario for what happened in this case, because at least it would have been quick.
I don't think Amy fell overboard but a person can fall overboard and survive. Here is a case that shows that.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
113
Guests online
1,755
Total visitors
1,868

Forum statistics

Threads
632,351
Messages
18,625,142
Members
243,101
Latest member
ins71
Back
Top