VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #6

[blouAngel]

Therefore, it is no surprise that Sam was from Castro Valley and that he killed in Farmville. Not a coincidence at all.

So it was mathematics that you majored in?

 

[dangrsmind]

So it was mathematics that you majored in?

Indeed I did.

 

[blouAngel]

Where the hell is Berrysville? yes, the county of prince edward had a guy that killed his girlfriend and her friend. The town of Farmville had some nutcase kill 4 people. Two people killed 6 people.

I've been trying to figure out where Berrysville is myself.

 

[peace_gurl]

That " YOU ARE WRONG ! " statement kinda struck me the wrong way.

Anyone ever hear that preacher scream that ? The local rock station has played that sound bite for years.

It is usually accompanied by " YOU ARE GOING TO HELL !"

how about 'you are incorrect?' rather than you are wrong? Sorry

 

[dangrsmind]

I've been trying to figure out where Berrysville is myself.

Excuse my typo, it is Berryville with no "S". I think it is in eastern Virginia, and not near Farmville. But one of the persons involved in a murder case there was from Farmville. Hence why I did not include this murder in my count but I did note the relationship to the the town of Farmville again.

See http://www.nvdaily.com/news/2009/11/fourth-man-arrested-in-smith-murder-case.php

 

[dangrsmind]

how about 'you are incorrect?' rather than you are wrong? Sorry

I don't mind being told I am wrong or incorrect. FWIW.

 

[dangrsmind]

Where the hell is Berrysville? yes, the county of prince edward had a guy that killed his girlfriend and her friend. The town of Farmville had some nutcase kill 4 people. Two people killed 6 people.

The point is that this is an unusual number of murders for such a lightly populated area.

 

[blouAngel]

Excuse my typo, it is Berryville with no "S". I think it is in eastern Virginia, and not near Farmville. But one of the persons involved in a murder case there was from Farmville. Hence why I did not include this murder in my count but I did note the relationship to the the town of Farmville again.

See http://www.nvdaily.com/news/2009/11/fourth-man-arrested-in-smith-murder-case.php

There is a Berryville in the far Northern part of the state. I'm not seeing why a murder there is relevant in any way though unless you are suggesting that there is also something about Berryville that encourages people from elsewhere to murder.

 

[dangrsmind]

There is a Berryville in the far Northern part of the state. I'm not seeing why a murder there is relevant in any way though unless you are suggesting that there is also something about Berryville that encourages people from elsewhere to murder.

Just another murderer/accomplice from Farmville like the guy with the bloody axe. No other relevance here.

It comes up when you search for crimes in Farmville.

 

[dangrsmind]

Some might recall this article which was posted way back when...

I didn't write it and IIRC I didn't even post it first. Don't shoot the messenger.

http://www2.godanriver.com/gdr/news...farmville_no_stranger_to_grisly_crimes/14377/

 

[blouAngel]

Some might recall this article which was posted way back when...

I didn't write it and IIRC I didn't even post it first. Don't shoot the messenger.

http://www2.godanriver.com/gdr/news...farmville_no_stranger_to_grisly_crimes/14377/

Yeah, I remember that article. My bolding.

“It really struck me: nice people being killed. That’s not normal for Farmville.“

"Melissa Seamster, who runs the Sunnyside Farms fruit and vegetable stand in town, said many residents have remarked that the killings taught them that horrible things can happen even in Farmville, and that parents should caution their children about meeting people online."

 

[dangrsmind]

Yeah, I remember that article. My bolding.

“It really struck me: nice people being killed. That’s not normal for Farmville.“

"Melissa Seamster, who runs the Sunnyside Farms fruit and vegetable stand in town, said many residents have remarked that the killings taught them that horrible things can happen even in Farmville, and that parents should caution their children about meeting people online."

I understand that the locals feel this crime was an aberration; something out of the ordinary for their sleepy little town. This doesn't make it true.

San Francisco is safer than Farmville. The murder rate in San Francisco looks to be about 5.5/100,000 this year, down from about twice that. Compare this with any reasonable murder rate estimate for Farmville and you'll see why I posted this stuff today.

See http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local/san_francisco&id=7193070

 

[wadahoot]

But I am sure you can find a reason why these deaths don't count either.

AKA "wearing blinders" & "rose colored glasses" , etc.............

Come on, boys ... play nice! :trout:

And Em, I warned Pax to stay here at home on this thread ... shame on him for straying again :silenced:

Calm and peace to all (yeah, right.)

 

[blouAngel]

The point is that 6 people at least have been killed in this vicinity this year, 4 in this case and 2 others at the night club. Do you dispute that number?

And I didn't even count the guy that was involved in the murder out in Berrysville.

You seem to be blinded by the conclusion you've already reached and are really twisting logic to convince yourself and the rest of us that it makes sense. That conclusion, from what I understand, being that something about Farmville causes people to murder.

Starting with incorrect data makes it impossible to arrive at meaningful results. You are incorrect about the number of murders in Farmville in 2009. There were 4, not 6. That makes your original calculations about the per capita rate way off statistically speaking.

One more comment about Farmville's per capita murder rate...

In 2009 there were 6 homicides in Farmville that I know about.

The population of Farmville was approximately 7396 people in 2008. Therefore the 2009 murder rate per 100,000 citizens for Farmville VA is approximately (6/7,396)*100,000 = 81.1/100,000. That's higher than New Orlean's murder rate for 2008 which was 64/100,000 and New Orleans is the current murder capital of the U.S.

Thank you for correcting my date error, you are correct the other axe murder was in 2000. The axe murderer lived in Farmville despite his victims living elsewhere.

That body by the lake was recovered in 2008 which is why I made the mistake above.

More here on the body found at Sandy River Resevoir: http://www.vsp.state.va.us/News/2008/NR-58 Help Needed To Solve Six Month Case.pdf

In 2008 Farmville had a higher per capita murder rate than New York City and San Francisco and it will have one of the highest per capita rates in the U.S. in 2009 as well. Remember this is the number of murders per 100,000 residents.

The per capita murder rate in Farmville is higher than Mexico's national rate. Sure it is only a few people murdered, but all of this is happening in a town with less than 10,000 people total. And I guess they don't count the murders in nearby Rice or over the bridge in Cumberland in this total.

Check out other small towns with a similar population and you won't find anything like this. I guess maybe people in the area don't find this surprising, but personally I was surprised.

The figure you used for Farmville's population may be correct in your first calculation, but in response to peace_gurl's comment, you recalculated to come up with a figure that may accurately reflect Prince Edward County's per capita murder rate, but which still doesn't speak to the question of what Farmville's rate is.

Even using the entire county population, you'd still have a very high murder rate. And I expect there might be a another murder or two that would need to be included counting the entire county. But even using my number of 6 murders you would have the following:

(6/21,823)*100,000 = 27.4939

That's still a very high rate and higher than a lot of other places, for example San Francisco. It is approaching the rates seen in some places I expect you'd be likely to try and avoid i.e. Washington D.C. (34.1) and Baltimore MD (36.9).

Washington D.C., a small city with a river at it's edge, is at least as inseparable from its surrounding areas on both sides of that river as you argue Farmville is from Prince Edward County and parts of Cumberland County. Its situation within the state of Maryland but separate from it is not entirely analogous to that of Farmville's relationship to Prince Edward county, but it's very close.

D.C. is anything but homogeneous. It has parts where you would be hard pressed to get mugged at 4 in the A.M. and plenty of places I wouldn't go on foot in broad daylight. All of present day D.C. borders either the river or Maryland. Most of the dangerous parts of the city are near the Maryland border and spill over it. For the most part, you wouldn't be able to tell if you crossed the line between Maryland and the District and criminals certainly aren't going to stop at an imaginary line.

Statistical data about crime though would be recorded and spoken of as though the (formerly complete) square that is called Washington D.C. existed in isolation. Events in Maryland would not affect the statistics re: per capita anything in D.C. and vice versa. The same holds true for Arlington, although it is right across the bridge. I find it puzzling that you are willing to isolate D.C. from its surroundings for statistical purposes, but not Farmville. Arlington was even once a part of the district, just as the area where Farmville is today may have once been a part of a plantation named Bizarre

Certain areas and demographics in Washington suffer a much much higher rate of murder per capita than Farmville, and some consequently enjoy a relatively low rate which is far below that which you've calculated for Farmville. For someone to conclude, as you suggest that peace_gurl might, that a trip to D.C. should be avoided because one risks murder would be foolish. At least if statistical data is the sole basis for that conclusion. The numbers reveal no actual truth about the situation in the city because there is no situation. Rather, there are numerous situations, some benign and some not so.

What you've ended up with is a textbook example of how statistics can be misused, innocently I honestly believe in your case, to argue for a conclusion that they simply don't support. It may be possible, but so far you have derived no accurate relevant statistics. You have no set of other places that we can accurately and reasonably compare Farmville to, which I think would be pretty difficult actually. You have demonstrated that difficulty yourself as I've hoped to show, with your reference to Washington D.C..

So far the murders in Prince Edward County including Farmville for 2009 total 6 as far as we know. Two of those people, a man and a woman were shot by the woman's husband as they exited a night club together. One of those people was a young girl very likely killed by a man who one or both of them thought was her boyfriend. He may have killed an additional 3 people as part of the spree that took her life. Sadly, there is nothing unusual here if you look at some highly relevant statistics.

"According to the U.S. Department of Justice, between 1998 and 2002:
Of the almost 3.5 million violent crimes committed against family members, 49% of these were crimes against spouses.
84% of spouse abuse victims were females, and 86% of victims of dating partner abuse at were female.
Males were 83% of spouse murderers and 75% of dating partner murderers
50% of offenders in state prison for spousal abuse had killed their victims. Wives were more likely than husbands to be killed by their spouses: wives were about half of all spouses in the population in 2002, but 81% of all persons killed by their spouse."
http://www.abanet.org/domviol/statistics.html

edited to add from the same source quoted above..........
The couple that was murdered at the nightclub was African American. The number one killer of African-American women ages 15 to 34 is homicide at the hands of a current or former intimate partner.
Africana Voices Against Violence, Tufts University, Statistics, 2002, www.ase.tufts.edu/womenscenter/peace/africana/newsite/statistics.htm
............................

Far more relevant than any question about what's in the air in Farmville, or what Californian parents are doing wrong with their children is what can be done to keep women from being hurt or killed by men whom they love, trust, and believe they are safe with.

 

[emeraldeyes85]

Come on, boys ... play nice! :trout:

And Em, I warned Pax to stay here at home on this thread ... shame on him for straying again :silenced:

Calm and peace to all (yeah, right.)

LOL yea I remember reading the post when you told him to stay out of the other threads and he did for a while but he ended up straying out again and got himself in to trouble again. No big deal he will be back soon and hopefully learn his lesson hehe.

 

[Kano]

You have to wonder what Sam thinks now, that hes not a part of the community, the vists, calls and people accepting phone charges coming to an end.. The daily barrage of negative input from his music no more, wonder if the guilt has set in on the guy.. Wonder if he really gets it yet.
:shakehead:

 

[claudicici]

"According to the U.S. Department of Justice, between 1998 and 2002:
Of the almost 3.5 million violent crimes committed against family members, 49% of these were crimes against spouses.
84% of spouse abuse victims were females, and 86% of victims of dating partner abuse at were female.
Males were 83% of spouse murderers and 75% of dating partner murderers
50% of offenders in state prison for spousal abuse had killed their victims. Wives were more likely than husbands to be killed by their spouses: wives were about half of all spouses in the population in 2002, but 81% of all persons killed by their spouse."
http://www.abanet.org/domviol/statistics.html
...as interesting as it is to explore other possibilities I do think this statistic is much more relevant to this case...I wished they would break down that statisitic in what kind of music did these guys listen to and I bet the result would be,all kinds

 

[claudicici]

http://trac.syr.edu/immigration/detention/200803/PMREGVA/tran/

....then again,for such a small place there's a lot of immigration stuff going on also...

 

[claudicici]

http://www.southernstudies.org/2009...ns-about-immigration-detention-practices.html

...the comments here are really interesting....

 

[blouAngel]

http://trac.syr.edu/immigration/detention/200803/PMREGVA/tran/

....then again,for such a small place there's a lot of immigration stuff going on also...

Keep in mind the situation that Farmville is in. It's on a bend in the river where historically tobacco was collected and then sent to Petersburg to be shipped out all over the world. Farmville was the upper end of the system that fed Petersburg. Tobacco went from wagons to river transport there. Warehouses were built by the river and a town developed on slightly higher ground.

Petersburg, like Richmond and many other important East Coast cities is on the fall line. There's a good description of that here, so look it up if you don't know what that means. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fall_line Shipped goods were transfered at the fall line from flat bottom boats to steam or other power driven boats. During the Civil War, the Northern army destroyed Petersburg as a port and it went in to permanent decline with effects upriver.

As the river trade died out the trains moved in and Farmville survived. Look at a map of the town and you will see lots of evidence of train yards with warehouses for some manufactured goods and farm products, particularly tobacco, going out and trade goods coming in.

Now, if you look closely at the map, you can see the railroad is gone and the highway rules. Farmville is growing towards the highway now. That is where all the new development seems to be happening. The pattern is the same as in the past.

The problem this time is that manufacturing jobs have all gone overseas and the tobacco farming economy in Southern Virginia has been almost completely destroyed. Twenty years ago, there were tobacco farms everywhere down there. A lot of people relied on tobacco income to make ends meet. Now there are empty tobacco barns everywhere instead. If you look at the google street view of the road where Sam was found, you can see a few.

Stuff that comes into town still costs money. They produce less of value there to trade. Having two colleges employs some people, but a lot of other people needs jobs too. To bring jobs and money in, some towns build trash facilities and take trash from NYC. Some fight with other towns for WalMart distribution facilities or something similar and "win" one. Some build prisons and take people from NYC. Farmville chose the latter.