VA - Grateful Dead Fan - Unidentified male, 26 June 1995 - #2

[dotr]

Has Canadian David Nixon ever been considered in this case?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...n-Ontario-6-July-1984&p=10845762#post10845762

 

[Roselvr]

Thanks you Rose! You are so organized! :loveyou:

I wish I had more time to go through all of the possibles to make a list on who has been suggested then ruled out & how were they ruled out; like what I have for Cali. I really do not understand how they are taking names off of the NamUs rule out list; if they were already compared. I know they rule out via dentals, fingerprints or DNA. They do not just look at the MP's photo to say they do not resemble GDF; so we're not going to bother going any farther.

Has Canadian David Nixon ever been considered in this case?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...n-Ontario-6-July-1984&p=10845762#post10845762

I think he is too old. He was 23 in 1984; would make him 35 in 1995
David Nixon Age at Time of Disappearance: 23 years old
Missing since July 6, 1984 from Hamilton, Ontario Canada.
Date Of Birth: February 10, 1961

 

[carbuff]

It sounds like they must have found that some of the people were ruled out on less than decisive grounds.

 

[Natbark]

This case is the foremost reason I joined this site. I have been following this case for quite some time now, and will put all the free time I have in this case. I am still catching up with latest news though

 

[dotr]

This case is the foremost reason I joined this site. I have been following this case for quite some time now, and will put all the free time I have in this case. I am still catching up with latest news though

Welcome to Ws Natbark, glad you decided to join the search for the identity of "Jason"!
P.S. there are many intriguing cases/threads here !.

 

[TopBrass]

First off, hi everybody! I am new to WS. A couple days ago, I read about this Grateful Doe guy and it captivated me. After looking and sorting through many missing persons/does yesterday, I really feel most curious about Alan Lee Morse:

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/morse_alan.html

The side by side comparison with the latest computer-generated image is an overall good match with photos, his eye/natural hair color are correct, and he was missing (presumed AWOL) in 1995 and would've been 25 years old. The biggest negative is that his height is off by 4-5". Otherwise we can explain his curly (red-dyed) hair with a potential perm for fashion or disguise purposes. I cannot find Alan on any exclusion list.

Speculation: If Alan went AWOL from the military in 1989 - as he never boarded the plane to Bermuda for duty - he could've lived a nomadic lifestyle in this country for six years before being killed in the car accident. He may not have had ID with him, because he only had a fake one (if any), and could have left it at "home" by mistake or on purpose to avoid potentially being flagged and outed. Of course, he could've had his wallet or a backpack stolen at the concert, but would not have reported it to avoid police. We should not be thrown by the "Jason" note, because if that was even intended for him that would've been a fake name he was using.

Alan Lee Morse did not officially become a missing person until 2007 because he was considered a military deserter (AWOL). That could explain years of him not being matched to GD. However, the government issued a promise to not prosecute in order to encourage Alan to come forward around that time. His parents have been missing him dearly and his family loves him and has publicly pleaded for him to return since then. So if he hasn't left the country, then it seems likely he is deceased due to murder or an accident...like Grateful Doe. Once Alan had a Navy pardon, there seemed little reason to not even simply call home, since he supposedly was close to his parents and was likely just avoiding government prosecution and prison time.

Perhaps the height difference is the reason everyone has avoid checking this guy out. However, it would seem prudent to do a DNA test to conclusively rule Alan out as GD. Mistakes happen - could height have been measured/recorded wrong or some anomaly occur due to the injuries sustained? I know I'm reaching a bit, but when everything else fits, it just seems like Alan should be checked again GD as many others have been.

What do you think? Other than the slight cleft in his chin, which could've been destroyed in the accident, it such a good resemblance even down to the slight dimple/fold on the left side of his smile. Even his teeth appear to be a match.



I'd love to hear if anybody knows of any previous comparison of Grateful Doe to Alan Lee Morse. Thanks!

:moo:

 

[musicaljoke]

First off, hi everybody! I am new to WS. A couple days ago, I read about this Grateful Doe guy and it captivated me. After looking and sorting through many missing persons/does yesterday, I really feel most curious about Alan Lee Morse:

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/morse_alan.html

I'd love to hear if anybody knows of any previous comparison of Grateful Doe to Alan Lee Morse. Thanks!

:moo:

I don't know of any previous comparison, but he's about as close as I've seen. I wouldn't let the height difference stop you from calling it in. Mistakes and typos in the details are common.

I just checked Namus and Alan Lee Morse has never been eliminated.

https://identifyus.org/en/cases/6095

Let us know if you contact NAMUS, so that this doesn't slip through the cracks.

 

[TopBrass]

Okay, I'll contact them and post an update afterward. This is a first for me.

:tyou:

 

[dotr]

Okay, I'll contact them and post an update afterward. This is a first for me.

:tyou:

Welcome to Ws TopBrass, thanks for the suggestion!
Although your potential match has been previously suggested, iirc, you are right to double check!

ALM has a thread here, but it is closed?
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...=5671905&highlight=alan+lee+morse#post5671905

 

[Roselvr]

First off, hi everybody! I am new to WS. A couple days ago, I read about this Grateful Doe guy and it captivated me. After looking and sorting through many missing persons/does yesterday, I really feel most curious about Alan Lee Morse:

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/morse_alan.html

The side by side comparison with the latest computer-generated image is an overall good match with photos, his eye/natural hair color are correct, and he was missing (presumed AWOL) in 1995 and would've been 25 years old. The biggest negative is that his height is off by 4-5". Otherwise we can explain his curly (red-dyed) hair with a potential perm for fashion or disguise purposes. I cannot find Alan on any exclusion list.

Speculation: If Alan went AWOL from the military in 1989 - as he never boarded the plane to Bermuda for duty - he could've lived a nomadic lifestyle in this country for six years before being killed in the car accident. He may not have had ID with him, because he only had a fake one (if any), and could have left it at "home" by mistake or on purpose to avoid potentially being flagged and outed. Of course, he could've had his wallet or a backpack stolen at the concert, but would not have reported it to avoid police. We should not be thrown by the "Jason" note, because if that was even intended for him that would've been a fake name he was using.

Alan Lee Morse did not officially become a missing person until 2007 because he was considered a military deserter (AWOL). That could explain years of him not being matched to GD. However, the government issued a promise to not prosecute in order to encourage Alan to come forward around that time. His parents have been missing him dearly and his family loves him and has publicly pleaded for him to return since then. So if he hasn't left the country, then it seems likely he is deceased due to murder or an accident...like Grateful Doe. Once Alan had a Navy pardon, there seemed little reason to not even simply call home, since he supposedly was close to his parents and was likely just avoiding government prosecution and prison time.

Perhaps the height difference is the reason everyone has avoid checking this guy out. However, it would seem prudent to do a DNA test to conclusively rule Alan out as GD. Mistakes happen - could height have been measured/recorded wrong or some anomaly occur due to the injuries sustained? I know I'm reaching a bit, but when everything else fits, it just seems like Alan should be checked again GD as many others have been.

What do you think? Other than the slight cleft in his chin, which could've been destroyed in the accident, it such a good resemblance even down to the slight dimple/fold on the left side of his smile. Even his teeth appear to be a match.

View attachment 57229 View attachment 57230 View attachment 57231

I'd love to hear if anybody knows of any previous comparison of Grateful Doe to Alan Lee Morse. Thanks!

:moo:

He's been brought up a few times; see my post here
He was also submitted by Grateful Doe FB page; it says submitted 2013. The owner of the page has been really busy; has not had time to run the page. I assume they submit direct to the medical examiner. I suggest someone submitting to both GD's case worker at NamUs as well as Alan's contact.

 

[Roselvr]

Welcome to Ws TopBrass, thanks for the suggestion!
Although your potential match has been previously suggested, iirc, you are right to double check!

ALM has a thread here, but it is closed?
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...=5671905&highlight=alan+lee+morse#post5671905

His post is part of the Missing Children in America - A Profile. They're all closed. Anyone is free to make a regular post to sleuth

 

[DrDMike]

First off, hi everybody! I am new to WS. A couple days ago, I read about this Grateful Doe guy and it captivated me. After looking and sorting through many missing persons/does yesterday, I really feel most curious about Alan Lee Morse:

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/morse_alan.html

The side by side comparison with the latest computer-generated image is an overall good match with photos, his eye/natural hair color are correct, and he was missing (presumed AWOL) in 1995 and would've been 25 years old. The biggest negative is that his height is off by 4-5". Otherwise we can explain his curly (red-dyed) hair with a potential perm for fashion or disguise purposes. I cannot find Alan on any exclusion list.

Speculation: If Alan went AWOL from the military in 1989 - as he never boarded the plane to Bermuda for duty - he could've lived a nomadic lifestyle in this country for six years before being killed in the car accident. He may not have had ID with him, because he only had a fake one (if any), and could have left it at "home" by mistake or on purpose to avoid potentially being flagged and outed. Of course, he could've had his wallet or a backpack stolen at the concert, but would not have reported it to avoid police. We should not be thrown by the "Jason" note, because if that was even intended for him that would've been a fake name he was using.

Alan Lee Morse did not officially become a missing person until 2007 because he was considered a military deserter (AWOL). That could explain years of him not being matched to GD. However, the government issued a promise to not prosecute in order to encourage Alan to come forward around that time. His parents have been missing him dearly and his family loves him and has publicly pleaded for him to return since then. So if he hasn't left the country, then it seems likely he is deceased due to murder or an accident...like Grateful Doe. Once Alan had a Navy pardon, there seemed little reason to not even simply call home, since he supposedly was close to his parents and was likely just avoiding government prosecution and prison time.

Perhaps the height difference is the reason everyone has avoid checking this guy out. However, it would seem prudent to do a DNA test to conclusively rule Alan out as GD. Mistakes happen - could height have been measured/recorded wrong or some anomaly occur due to the injuries sustained? I know I'm reaching a bit, but when everything else fits, it just seems like Alan should be checked again GD as many others have been.

What do you think? Other than the slight cleft in his chin, which could've been destroyed in the accident, it such a good resemblance even down to the slight dimple/fold on the left side of his smile. Even his teeth appear to be a match.

View attachment 57229 View attachment 57230 View attachment 57231

I'd love to hear if anybody knows of any previous comparison of Grateful Doe to Alan Lee Morse. Thanks!

:moo:

Both Alan Lee Morse and Grateful Doe have DNA in NAMUS so it would be very unlikely that they would be a match.

 

[Classito]

If you feel it is a match go for it...Age, Height and hair color have been known to be off...and both having DNA completed does not mean it has been checked..

In this recent match the the age was off, height was way off, hair color was off..and both had DNA submitted and complete...

NM - Pagosa Springs, WhtFem 55UFNM, 25-35, @ San Juan River, Sep'82 *Margaret Walden*

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?85682-NM-Pagosa-Springs-WhtFem-55UFNM-25-35-San-Juan-River-Sep-82-*Margaret-Walden*

Estimated age: 25 - 35 years old
Margaret's age: 39

Estimated height: 5'2
Margaret's height: 5'10

Estimated hair color: Brown
Margaret's hair color: Blonde

Margaret Walden NamUs DNA Sample submitted - Tests complete
NamUs UP # 5326 DNA Sample submitted - Tests complete

Classito

 

[DrDMike]

If you feel it is a match go for it...Age, Height and hair color have been known to be off...and both having DNA completed does not mean it has been checked..

In this recent match the the age was off, height was way off, hair color was off..and both had DNA submitted and complete...

NM - Pagosa Springs, WhtFem 55UFNM, 25-35, @ San Juan River, Sep'82 *Margaret Walden*

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?85682-NM-Pagosa-Springs-WhtFem-55UFNM-25-35-San-Juan-River-Sep-82-*Margaret-Walden*

Estimated age: 25 - 35 years old
Margaret's age: 39

Estimated height: 5'2
Margaret's height: 5'10

Estimated hair color: Brown
Margaret's hair color: Blonde

Margaret Walden NamUs DNA Sample submitted - Tests complete
NamUs UP # 5326 DNA Sample submitted - Tests complete

Classito

That's not exactly true. They had Margaret Ann Walden's DNA as a Jane Doe but not as a missing person.

 

[Classito]

Maybe an error in the data input...but NamUs says DNA Submitted and test complete for both

Margaret
https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/9850/0/

UID
https://identifyus.org/en/cases/5326


Classito

 

[bakerlady]

Has there every been any mention of dental isotopes being examined for Jason? It can certainly narrow down a geographic location of where he lived. I think that should be a standard test in all UIDs.

 

[Roselvr]

That's not exactly true. They had Margaret Ann Walden's DNA as a Jane Doe but not as a missing person.

They had Margo's DNA as a Jane Doe; also had a DNA sample from her mother & sister. If you look at the post when Stewart was ID'd; I went straight to NamUs; grabbed both Margo & the Jane Doe's NamUs links; both showed DNA submitted & complete. I kept asking what am I missing? Why haven't they been confirmed match yet?
According to the newest article; (if I am reading it right) it sounds like NM held Jane Doe's sample but refused to test against Margo's relatives.

What am I missing? Both say DNA Sample submitted - Tests complete. This isn't a case I've followed so am unsure
Margaret Walden NamUs DNA Sample submitted - Tests complete
NamUs UP # 5326 DNA Sample submitted - Tests complete

Second victim in 1982 double homicide identified

An amateur and a lead

The lead that ultimately led to the identification of both Simmons and Walden came to Barter through email from an amateur sleuth, Barter explained.

The unidentified sleuth, Barter explained in February, is part of a group of amateur sleuths who pore over websites filled with missing persons and cold cases, such as The Doe Network and NamUs (National Unidentified and Missing Persons System).

“I’ve spent literally hours and hours and hours in those databases,” Barter said after Simmons was identified in February, adding he believed the tip from the sleuth because other investigative work led him to believe the victim was in the Navy in California.

Simmons was identified through dental records on file with the Navy.

A second identification

Simmons, who went AWOL (absent without leave) from the Navy, had mentioned to his parents that he had met a woman, a waitress known as Margo, shortly before leaving California.

The amateur sleuth also pointed Barter to Walden as a possible identification for the female victim and Barter was able to make contact with the missing woman’s family and retrieve DNA samples from a missing persons file on her.

It was also revealed that Simmons and Walden, who often went by the name Margo, had gone missing from the same town in 1982 and, working with Walden’s family, Barter was able to learn that Walden had left town with a younger sailor.

Walden’s sister recalled that Walden was dating a younger sailor and the pair had gone on a camping trip together. Shortly before his disappearance, Simmons had rented camping equipment at the local Navy base.

Those stories also aligned with an old witness statement, Barter said.

Further adding to the idea that Walden was in fact Barter’s Jane Doe, Barter showed items found on the body to Walden’s sister — who identified both a coat she had seen Walden wear and jewelry the sister had given to Walden in 1973.

While Walden, who had been reported missing after she left California, was once married to a sailor, Barter said no dental records were found for her, either with the Navy or elsewhere, ruling out an identification via dental records.

What did exist, however, were DNA samples from Walden’s mom and sister

 

[laughin]

My absolute fear is that this kid came from a place where no one wanted him. Still, I would love to give him a name.

 

[Jerri Blank]

that is my fear, as well.... and what i think is ultimately why he has yet to be ID'd. my hope is that SOMEONE remembers him, that he crosses someone's mind now and again, and that someone finds his or her way here at some point.

 

[DrDMike]

They had Margo's DNA as a Jane Doe; also had a DNA sample from her mother & sister. If you look at the post when Stewart was ID'd; I went straight to NamUs; grabbed both Margo & the Jane Doe's NamUs links; both showed DNA submitted & complete. I kept asking what am I missing? Why haven't they been confirmed match yet?
According to the newest article; (if I am reading it right) it sounds like NM held Jane Doe's sample but refused to test against Margo's relatives.



Second victim in 1982 double homicide identified

Yes that is what I meant. But they did not have DNA from Walden's family until she was suggested as a potential match.