GUILTY VA - Noah Thomas, 5, Pulaski County, 22 March 2015 #3

[lonetraveler]

Full press release here:
http://www.wsls.com/story/28653572/sheriff-noah-thomas-autopsy-complete-but-results-take-longer

Not surprising at all.

 

[Tillicum]

After this release, the only way this could still be considered an accident is if every septic tank in the area has been inspected and child safety proofed over the weekend IMO.

 

[YidArmyRach]

They would know by now that Noah had fluid in his lungs from drowning.

Is the idea that there was no fluid in his lungs and now they are reaching out to "certain tests" to determine the cause of death?

Not sure how accurate this is:

Indeed there may well be occasions when it proves difficult to establish whether or not the deceased was alive when they entered the water; this is because that even if an individual is deceased when they enter the water, providing the body remains submerged for a period of time, then the lungs will fill up anyway.

Taken from: http://www.exploreforensics.co.uk/drowning.html

So, perhaps finding liquid in the lungs doesn't mean as much as I thought it would?

 

[lonetraveler]

They didn't say what the cause of death was. Hmmm. Was it drowning or blunt force trauma,etc? I understand it takes time for the toxicology to come back. I guess I thought we might hear a little more. Poor Noah.

An accident would have been announced as soon as the coroner learned it. I'm taking this as confirmation that no sludge was found in Noah's lungs.

 

[krig101]

They would know by now that Noah had fluid in his lungs from drowning.

Is the idea that there was no fluid in his lungs and now they are reaching out to "certain tests" to determine the cause of death?

Exactly my thoughts. ...and the "no one is in danger" makes me think they have a POI but can't say anything until test results come in.

 

[matou]

Though the initial autopsy on five-year-old Noah Thomas is complete, Sheriff Jim Davis said it could be weeks until a final determination is made about Noah's cause of death.
In a news release on Monday, Davis said that "certain tests take a long time to complete and the final cause of death is dependent on those results."

http://www.roanoke.com/news/local/p...cle_40376fe1-9ad9-5719-b2f0-866c889a1296.html

 

[matou]

When asked if Abigail is still with Noah's parents, Assistant Pulaski County Administrator Anthony Akers, who has been serving as a spokesman on the case, said that's part of the ongoing investigation and that he could not comment.

http://www.roanoke.com/news/local/p...cle_40376fe1-9ad9-5719-b2f0-866c889a1296.html

 

[winterrose]

Well, if we hear it's turned to a criminal investigation, we'll know for a fact it wasn't an accident. So maybe the reason he doesn't want the rumors out is because people that might know something should be quiet, or it might jeopardize the investigation?

 

[kaen]

I wonder if there are other factors to holding back information. For example, the death of Owen Collins had lots of leaks and every moment wassailed with vitriol and awful accusations. With no information, the funeral is peaceful ad focused on Noah.

 

[winterrose]

When asked if Abigail is still with Noah's parents, Assistant Pulaski County Administrator Anthony Akers, who has been serving as a spokesman on the case, said that's part of the ongoing investigation and that he could not comment.

http://www.roanoke.com/news/local/p...cle_40376fe1-9ad9-5719-b2f0-866c889a1296.html

Oh my, part of the investigation is if the baby's with the parents?

 

[blue22]

They would know by now that Noah had fluid in his lungs from drowning.

Is the idea that there was no fluid in his lungs and now they are reaching out to "certain tests" to determine the cause of death?

I am not an expert here, but I remember certain things from following cases here.

What I remember, is that there are preliminary tests done first. They draw blood from the body and look for certain drugs. If they are found, they then look for how much and what kind. (For example, a person tests positive for opiates in the preliminary draw, they would then need to fin what opiates and how much.) After the preliminary, to figure out the next step, they actually have to go into the blood and tissues and separate it from that. From my understanding, these tests are not just done once and repeated. They can also examine
other parts for crystallization, like in cases where someone is poisoned with antifreeze, etc.

IMO, they have either already done the preliminary tests and are further investigating those results...or they are waiting on those to come back, in order to know how to proceed (or not) with their theory. I think they have a theory and it likely hinges on the tox report.[modsnip]

 

[krig101]

I would think that it means that he was dead before he was in the septic. It indicates that he did not get in there himself. I assume that there was not indications of physical trauma. So, drugs? Indicators of illness or heart attack?

This is just so sad.

I hope this is not another case where the parent wanted the child to sleep so gave them cough syrup scenario. The thought of that makes me absolutely ill.

 

[YidArmyRach]

Oh my, part of the investigation is if the baby's with the parents?

Tests on the baby, along with toxicology tests during the autopsy? To see if both children have something in their system perhaps? Maybe I'm over-analysing, but the press release, unlike other statements, no longer talks of the parents cooperating, not being suspects and needing the rumours to stop.

 

[Luvrosco]

P

When asked if Abigail is still with Noah's parents, Assistant Pulaski County Administrator Anthony Akers, who has been serving as a spokesman on the case, said that's part of the ongoing investigation and that he could not comment.

http://www.roanoke.com/news/local/p...cle_40376fe1-9ad9-5719-b2f0-866c889a1296.html

So I'm assuming she may not be with her parents. Otherwise wouldn't he just have answered yes?

 

[iamnotagolem]

Just to get into the mind of a 5 y/o we are walking to the sports shop for a fishing license we walked by a septic cover my 5 y/o ran and jumped on it, it's plastic, it's broken. I gasped in shock and screamed "nooo".

Eta: just walked by another one that was unscrewed and laying askew.

 

[wendybtn]

The medical examiner can do a "quick test" on body fluids to see if there is the presence of 5-10 standard drugs that should not be in his system. The exact amounts and the potential effects on Noah would need the full toxicology report interpreted by an ME. That will take time. But I believe the police are aware of what has happened, they just want their ducks in a row.

 

[krig101]

My thoughts on the painfully slow way that information is being released to the public is that we will not hear the details until after the funeral is done. I have a very heavy feeling that a deal was agreed to in order for Noah's body to be found and removed from the septic tank. JMO and nothing more.

Good point!!!!!!!

 

[FindHG]

"As Sheriff, I want the citizens of Pulaski County to know that at no time during this investigation have authorities suspected there was a lingering danger to your children."

From here the full statement here:

http://www.wsls.com/story/28653572/sheriff-noah-thomas-autopsy-complete-but-results-take-longer



Thank you for the links, WSers. I'm just catching up. From what I've learned through other drowning cases here, there are bio-chem test done on levels of certain chemicals (am very short on sci), but that may determine when young Noah may have perished that do take an awful long time, which may seem like torment for those closest to his loss.

*Pardon in my mistake with the screen caps removed.

 

[WillenFan21]

I don't see at all how this could have been an accident unless the lid was already off it and he fell in. It i just my opinion I don't think this is an accident because if he did just fall in then there would be evidence that he drowned. They would find remnants of the sewage etc in his lungs that would in my opinion be indicative of him drowning down there and there is nothing like that mentioned. This makes me wonder if he was injected with something that caused him to die and then someone threw him down there. This would explain why they would be waiting on toxicology reports. IMO they would know right away if he drowned. I hate to say this but right now I am having real red flags towards the parents. I mean if this was some work of a sexual predator he probably would have been found farther away, no clothes on him, and I'm sure there would be some DNA on him from the suspect if it was a sexual abuse type of thing. Also if it was a male predator they'd probably know right away just from looking at the body. I'm not trying to get gruesome but I'm juts simply saying that all signs to me are pointing that he could have been injected with something and that the suspect is close to the victim which is why they are saying there is no danger to the public. If they thought that this was work of a predator they'd not say that, IMO.

 

[wendybtn]

Exactly my thoughts. ...and the "no one is in danger" makes me think they have a POI but can't say anything until test results come in.

To me, no one in danger means LE does not think Noah' s parent(s) will grab someone else's kid and do this to him/her.