VA - Scott Fricker, 48, & Buckley Kuhn-Fricker, 43, slain, Reston, 22 Dec 2017 *daughter’s bf charged*

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  • #481
vmmking said:
Interesting that the autistic 16 year old in NJ who killed his family last night is being charged as an adult while this 17 year old is not.

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If I recall correctly, Virginia has a very defined way that charges are brought and upgraded. I think the charges can be changed to adult from juvenile under three circumstances. Each circumstance requires a juvenile court hearing. The prosecutor can't just make that determination.
 
  • #482
vmmking said:
Interesting that the autistic 16 year old in NJ who killed his family last night is being charged as an adult while this 17 year old is not.

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NJ 16 y.o. is not unconscious
 
  • #483
  • #484
vmmking said:
Interesting that the autistic 16 year old in NJ who killed his family last night is being charged as an adult while this 17 year old is not.

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I don't think they believe he'll live, and have initially charged him to allow the family to possibly seek a civil suit, if he should pass ( and after the investigation closes). Also, if net rumors are correct, I think he'd been placed in a "ward", previously, so his mental state may also be at play, and, of course they likely can't question him, at this point in time. The other boy is awake, verbal, and able to be questioned, like that McCroskey kid.
 
  • #485
  • #486
rsd1200 said:
This is odd wording.
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Yes it is, they may have only one side of the story, the daughter. or maybe even just the grandparents if the daughter under doctor care. The father and mother yelling at b/f to get of house is not cause for him to fear for his life, thereby negating any claim of self-defense, fear for own life. Perhaps the b/f not able to be questioned - already lawyered up?
 
  • #487
rsd1200 said:
I don't think they believe he'll live, and have initially charged him to allow the family to possibly seek a civil suit, if he should pass ( and after the investigation closes). Also, if net rumors are correct, I think he'd been placed in a "ward", previously, so his mental state may also be at play, and, of course they likely can't question him, at this point in time. The other boy is awake, verbal, and able to be questioned, like that McCroskey kid.
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Given he tried to commit suicide, he very may have been placed in psychiatric ward as "danger to himself and others" which would make him unavailable for questioning.
 
  • #488
kaen said:
If I recall correctly, Virginia has a very defined way that charges are brought and upgraded. I think the charges can be changed to adult from juvenile under three circumstances. Each circumstance requires a juvenile court hearing. The prosecutor can't just make that determination.
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Yes, in Virginia cases must start in juvenile court before being transferred to adult.

ETA
Under Virginia law, anyone who stands accused of certain enumerated crimes and is at least 14 years old, could either be certified or be transferred to circuit court for trial as an adult, with the possibility of adult sentencing to include incarceration in the adult penitentiary system. "Certification" to circuit court for trial as an adult is automatic for serious violent crimes, for example, murder, robbery, malicious wounding or various firearm offenses, if the prosecutor simply requests it and can show probable cause at a preliminary hearing in juvenile court.*

BBM

https://www.quicklegal.net/Articles...eniles-being-charged-punished-as-adults.shtml

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  • #489
courtney2662 said:
Given he tried to commit suicide, he very may have been placed in psychiatric ward as "danger to himself and others" which would make him unavailable for questioning.
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Again, rumor, but it seemed they spoke from some knowledge that he'd been in one prior.
 
  • #490
  • #491
strawberry said:
This article now says the NJ boy was charged as a juvenile, I’m thinking because he has autism.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...teen-kills-4-family-members-article-1.3731274


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It was reported by them earlier that he would be tried as an adult (and someone on his thread mentioned that would be a mistake to do because of the autism).

"The 16-year-old gunman will be charged as an adult later Monday with four counts of murder as well as one count of possession of a weapon for unlawful purposes."

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...ew-jersey-new-year-shooting-article-1.3730427


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  • #492
vmmking said:
It was reported by them earlier that he would be tried as an adult (and someone on his thread mentioned that would be a mistake to do because of the autism).

"The 16-year-old gunman will be charged as an adult later Monday with four counts of murder as well as one count of possession of a weapon for unlawful purposes."

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...ew-jersey-new-year-shooting-article-1.3730427


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I know...I wonder if it changed after interacting with him


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  • #493
vmmking said:
It was reported by them earlier that he would be tried as an adult (and someone on his thread mentioned that would be a mistake to do because of the autism).

"The 16-year-old gunman will be charged as an adult later Monday with four counts of murder as well as one count of possession of a weapon for unlawful purposes."

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...ew-jersey-new-year-shooting-article-1.3730427


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I'm not sure why that would be a mistake to charge him as an adult. I would think it would be according to what range of the spectrum he was on. My friend's son has autism and is extremely high functioning. I only mean to say, that he's a smart kid, and he'd definitely know right from wrong, especially when it came to murder. Maybe this boy is very low functioning? However, my seven year old understands hurting others is wrong.

From our family's experiences, my wayward one was not cut any slack, in courtrooms, because of any of his diags. One of his was Tourette's, combined with lack of impulse control (a big challenge, especially for young kids, through their teens, and into early 20s). He is not unintelligent, he knew right from wrong, so he was charged accordingly.
 
  • #494
  • #495
rsd1200 said:
I'm not sure why that would be a mistake to charge him as an adult. I would think it would be according to what range of the spectrum he was on. My friend's son has autism and is extremely high functioning. I only mean to say, that he's a smart kid, and he'd definitely know right from wrong, especially when it came to murder. Maybe this boy is very low functioning? However, my seven year old understands hurting others is wrong.

From our family's experiences, my wayward one was not cut any slack, in courtrooms, because of any of his diags. One of his was Tourette's, combined with lack of impulse control (a big challenge, especially for young kids, through their teens, and into early 20s). He is not unintelligent, he knew right from wrong, so he was charged accordingly.
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Sympathetic jury and preconceived notions about autism could make it harder to convict a 16 year old as an adult? IDK. Just a guess.

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  • #496
vmmking said:
Sympathetic jury and preconceived notions about autism could make it harder to convict a 16 year old as an adult? IDK. Just a guess.

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Possible, idk either, for sure, but education about autism has come a long way. I'm sure a jury would be selected very carefully. Some autistics have a lot of trouble with impulse control too but unless the firearm was just lying out there in front of him, and he grabbed it and started shooting, he had to have gone and retrieved it, then started shooting, and if that is the case, that would take impulse off the table for me.
 
  • #497
  • #498
Betty P said:
I just started one. Of course, messed up the title, forgot to include the date. :gaah: :shame:
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You did just fine, Betty P -- thanks!
 
  • #499
courtney2662 said:
Yes it is, they may have only one side of the story, the daughter. or maybe even just the grandparents if the daughter under doctor care. The father and mother yelling at b/f to get of house is not cause for him to fear for his life, thereby negating any claim of self-defense, fear for own life. Perhaps the b/f not able to be questioned - already lawyered up?
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He was trespassing in their house - no self defense here. I do live in Texas (not from here) but here you have a right to shoot an intruder into your home - I'm not a gun fanatic, but its too bad in this case the parents didn't know he was armed , too bad they didn't have a weapon to use against him. Others may disagree, but I do blame the daughter as well - I doubt she was unaware he had a gun and I'll bet she had seen the gun before. Did she ever share this with her parents? She could have at least told them to give them an opportunity to realize how dangerous he might be. Did he break a window or a lock to get in? I doubt it, I'll bet she let him in. This whole business with him entering the house at night again and again bothers me - again, I'm not blaming the parents, but how did they sleep at night knowing this creep is coming in? After the first time it would have been time for video monitoring, alarm system and a weapon.
 
  • #500
vmmking said:
It was reported by them earlier that he would be tried as an adult (and someone on his thread mentioned that would be a mistake to do because of the autism).

"The 16-year-old gunman will be charged as an adult later Monday with four counts of murder as well as one count of possession of a weapon for unlawful purposes."

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...ew-jersey-new-year-shooting-article-1.3730427


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I believe the important thing to note is that the state should have been slow in announcing how they would charge in the first place. I am sure that the interviews with family/witnesses will bounce the prosecutor back and forth as they move to charging.
 
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