VA - Virginia Tech Shooting, 32 murdered, 23 injured, 16 April 2007

[reb]

WHAT!!!!? so a special justice declared him mentally ill just 2 yeas ago, and an "IMMINENT DANGER TO OTHERS"-- not to himself in this case, but to OTHERS.. and not just a danger, but an IMMINENT danger. and to say that about someone is a lot more serious than saying they might be suicidal. so...... excuse my language,, but what the F*CK WAS HE DOING IN SCHOOL...???? wasn't ANYONE on top of this?? i am sorry... but the ball was MAJORLY dropped here. everyone can say 'oh, it wasn't his parents' fault, it wasn't the school's fault, it wasn't this or that person's fault'.., well, DUH- of course he was ultimately responsible. but the guy was labelled seriously MENTALLY ILL!! and an imminent danger to others. that's like saying he is a ticking time bomb about to go off! what about this did his parents not understand....??? how was this not clear to them?? and why did the courts (or hospital) let him return to school, where he was at risk to cause harm to others?? and don't anyone tell me 'there's no way anyone could have predicted this..' obviously, the guy DID predict it, right there!! it sounds to me like EVERYONE dropped the ball. however, it appears the professors- those who saw him every day- tried the most to do something. and i can't help but wonder if the stuff you all are saying about colleges not wanting bad publicity has a lot to do with it. in fact, i wonder if the professors tried to do more and were told to keep their mouths shut, or something to that effect.

he fact is that everyone who saw this guy was just creeped out by him and no one wanted anything to do with him.. he was someone else's problem. i applaud all the teachers who raised concern and tried to get him help... including the one who threatened to quit if he was not removed from her class. DUH,, shouldn't that have told the school officials that something was seriously WRONG here?

those professors should have called a meeting with the VT officials and the guy's parents about this. and i know that 23 is grown up, but it's not THAT grown up. besides, his parents were probably still either paying for at least some of his schooling &/or supporting him financially. and no it would not have been over-reacting. there is a difference between 'cutting-edge literature' and things like he wrote. and that, along with his bizarre severely anti-social behavior and extreme 'flat effect'.. i'm sorry, but more could and SHOULD have been done.

 

[Albert18]

I agree. I wish some posters would stop comparing this to the war.
That's like comparing Katrina to the Tsunami.
They each can have their own stories and touch people differently. It doesn't have to be one or the other.

Let the rest of us grieve about the VT shootings without bringing politics into this
PLEASE!



Thank you.

You have to love clear thinking.

 

[Floh]

WHAT!!!!? so a special justice declared him mentally ill just 2 yeas ago, and an "IMMINENT DANGER TO OTHERS"-- not to himself in this case, but to OTHERS.. and not just a danger, but an IMMINENT danger. and to say that about someone is a lot more serious than saying they might be suicidal. so...... excuse my language,, but what the F*CK WAS HE DOING IN SCHOOL...???? wasn't ANYONE on top of this?? i am sorry... but the ball was MAJORLY dropped here. everyone can say 'oh, it wasn't his parents' fault, it wasn't the school's fault, it wasn't this or that person's fault'.., well, DUH- of course he was ultimately responsible. but the guy was labelled seriously MENTALLY ILL!! and an imminent danger to others. that's like saying he is a ticking time bomb about to go off! what about this did his parents not understand....??? how was this not clear to them?? and why did the courts (or hospital) let him return to school, where he was at risk to cause harm to others?? and don't anyone tell me 'there's no way anyone could have predicted this..' obviously, the guy DID predict it, right there!! it sounds to me like EVERYONE dropped the ball. however, it appears the professors- those who saw him every day- tried the most to do something. and i can't help but wonder if the stuff you all are saying about colleges not wanting bad publicity has a lot to do with it. in fact, i wonder if the professors tried to do more and were told to keep their mouths shut, or something to that effect.

he fact is that everyone who saw this guy was just creeped out by him and no one wanted anything to do with him.. he was someone else's problem. i applaud all the teachers who raised concern and tried to get him help... including the one who threatened to quit if he was not removed from her class. DUH,, shouldn't that have told the school officials that something was seriously WRONG here?

those professors should have called a meeting with the VT officials and the guy's parents about this. and i know that 23 is grown up, but it's not THAT grown up. besides, his parents were probably still either paying for at least some of his schooling &/or supporting him financially. and no it would not have been over-reacting. there is a difference between 'cutting-edge literature' and things like he wrote. and that, along with his bizarre severely anti-social behavior and extreme 'flat effect'.. i'm sorry, but more could and SHOULD have been done.

I'm with Reb on this one. :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[mrsjonnob]

WHAT!!!!? so a special justice declared him mentally ill just 2 yeas ago, and an "IMMINENT DANGER TO OTHERS"-- not to himself in this case, but to OTHERS.. and not just a danger, but an IMMINENT danger. and to say that about someone is a lot more serious than saying they might be suicidal. so...... excuse my language,, but what the F*CK WAS HE DOING IN SCHOOL...???? wasn't ANYONE on top of this?? i am sorry... but the ball was MAJORLY dropped here. everyone can say 'oh, it wasn't his parents' fault, it wasn't the school's fault, it wasn't this or that person's fault'.., well, DUH- of course he was ultimately responsible. but the guy was labelled seriously MENTALLY ILL!! and an imminent danger to others. that's like saying he is a ticking time bomb about to go off! what about this did his parents not understand....??? how was this not clear to them?? and why did the courts (or hospital) let him return to school, where he was at risk to cause harm to others?? and don't anyone tell me 'there's no way anyone could have predicted this..' obviously, the guy DID predict it, right there!! it sounds to me like EVERYONE dropped the ball. however, it appears the professors- those who saw him every day- tried the most to do something. and i can't help but wonder if the stuff you all are saying about colleges not wanting bad publicity has a lot to do with it. in fact, i wonder if the professors tried to do more and were told to keep their mouths shut, or something to that effect.

he fact is that everyone who saw this guy was just creeped out by him and no one wanted anything to do with him.. he was someone else's problem. i applaud all the teachers who raised concern and tried to get him help... including the one who threatened to quit if he was not removed from her class. DUH,, shouldn't that have told the school officials that something was seriously WRONG here?

those professors should have called a meeting with the VT officials and the guy's parents about this. and i know that 23 is grown up, but it's not THAT grown up. besides, his parents were probably still either paying for at least some of his schooling &/or supporting him financially. and no it would not have been over-reacting. there is a difference between 'cutting-edge literature' and things like he wrote. and that, along with his bizarre severely anti-social behavior and extreme 'flat effect'.. i'm sorry, but more could and SHOULD have been done.

Oh, but the Libs will love to say he was just mentally ill, not evil (see the playground chemincal burn thread).

Sorry, being snarky, but this pisses me off.

When do we (we as in a society) draw the line and hold people accountable for their actions?

Is it a huge crime to kill a dog? No... but we all know serial killers usually start by killins animals. Ok, I have 2 dogs and a cat and I think it IS a horrific crime, but judicially speaking, it isn't a big deal.

Why are we (again, as a society) so afraid to deal with young offenders??

This makes me sick.

 

[Floh]

Lookie here: the blame game simply must be played with what happened. answers must come and action must be taken.

there are too many people in the world (much of the problem). and too many nutters ready to take aim and fire at you and yours.

 

[Shadow205]

NBC nightly news will show some of the materials shooter sent to them tonight. The package arrived in this mornings mail.

 

[Paladin]

Be careful - Imus got fired for that.

Damn, you beat me to it.

 

[reb]

exactly. all this 'don't blame anyone' thing will get us nowhere. sometimes people MUST take some of the blame-- as they deserve it. obviously we HAVE to learn from this (and other similar occurances) in order to have better foresight in the future, if we ever want to prevent it from happening again (and to be fair, i'm sure school shootings ARE being prevented all the time, by teachers who call parents and say 'your son needs to see a counsellor NOW'.. etc.). and no, this doesn't mean we need to go on a witchhunt and persecute every kid who's a loner, depressed, or wears back clothes. but with what they are saying about THIS kid, it is all so obvious-- and it is outrageous that it was allowed to happen.

and i don't think this has anything to do with 'libs' or 'cons'. bottom line-- he was mentally ill AND he was evil. it WAS his fault, obviously-- but since he was mentally SICK- and others KNEW VERY WELL about it, and he was even legally declared so--- and others stood by and did not do enough to prevent the worst from happening-- then they are to blame also.

the thing is, the law probably tied some peoples' hands too. for instance, could the special justice give notice to the school about his mental condition? that could open a whole can of worms if that law were reversed. but how else would they know? they SHOULD have known!! there must be SOME WAY to get around this, in extreme cases like this- esp when someone is deemed s threat to the public!!!

also if i were the guy's roomates i would be extremely pissed that i was not made aware of it.

 

[reb]

floh-- exactly. i'm looking more and more forward to a world-wide killer plague every day.. even though many of us might not survive.. it would solve much of humanity's problems just to get rid of about 90% of us. less people= less problems! that is, if there's anything let to live on by that time.

harsh, but true.

 

[Paladin]

floh-- exactly. i'm looking more and more forward to a world-wide killer plague every day.. even though many of us might not survive.. it would solve much of humanity's problems just to get rid of about 90% of us. less people= less problems! that is, if there's anything let to live on by that time.

harsh, but true.

Wouldn't there still proportionally be the same amount of problems?

 

[reb]

proportinally, but still less overall. plus the planet might be able to recover, well, a little bit anyway. of course less of us would be around to witness that.

i do believe though that there is a significant increase in mental illness (not just proportionately) with overcrowding. don't know if that's true, but until i see otherwise, that's my hunch.

 

[nanandjim]

...I wasn't sure from Cho's McBeef play whether the child abuse mentioned was supposed to be actual or was just an accusation from the boy who thought his stepdad had murdered his father.)

I read it that the boy in the play was just trying to cause problems with his mother and the stepfather. The mother always sided with the son. The son hated his stepfather and thought that he had killed his father.

Anyway, it wasn't really that. It was just the topic of sexual abuse was introduced in both plays--real or alleged. That, coupled with extreme rage, is what jumps out at me.

 

[mrsjonnob]

Reb,

I agree. I realize my comment above was snotty, but I am so tired of people notbeing held accountable for their actions.

I have a big family (7 kids) and if my son expressed a desire to kill fellow students, I would A) Not send him to school B) get him in a hospital

 

[panthera]

Oh, but the Libs will love to say he was just mentally ill, not evil (see the playground chemincal burn thread).

Sorry, being snarky, but this pisses me off.

When do we (we as in a society) draw the line and hold people accountable for their actions?

Is it a huge crime to kill a dog? No... but we all know serial killers usually start by killins animals. Ok, I have 2 dogs and a cat and I think it IS a horrific crime, but judicially speaking, it isn't a big deal.

Why are we (again, as a society) so afraid to deal with young offenders??

This makes me sick.

I couldn't agree with you more. I would also like to see more severe punishment for the sick individuals who kill animals and those whose actions cause harm to others (such as dousing the playground equipment with acid). Anyone who has a mind to harm others in any manner will only escalate in their level of violence, imo.

 

[MaxMoMom]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/

 

[Paladin]

A picture of Cho wielding two guns is up on the front page of msnbc.com

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/

 

[Taximom]

I'm not sure if it's been mentioned before but these two plays were NOT read by the same women professor/dept chair that removed him from the class. So there were other papers written by him that we haven't been able to analyze that caused her and others alarm.

 

[Shadow205]

 

[dhchick04]

Sorry if this has been discussed, I know he killed himself, but I believe I heard he shot himself in the face. Can anyone verify this for me please?

 

[panthera]

A picture of Cho wielding two guns is up on the front page of msnbc.com

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/

Thanks ~ I was just about to post that. They're also showing it on msnbc-tv. This guy wasn't "depressed" imo. He was of the same genre as Kleibold, Harris, and the DC snipers. :furious: