WA - Lindsey Baum, 10, McCleary, 26 June 2009 - #3

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  • #321
Thanks, Eyes! As I read that...I saw a couple of things already addressed as to your questions. Good job!

I have to wonder if we put ourselves in Lindsey's head...what was going through her mind? In order to decide where she would have gone or how she would have reacted in any given circumstance, we have to guess at what went on with her at the time prior to the abduction (which I have never believed she went missing on her own).

I like doing time-lines..

What things have been addressed that already have been answered? I'm looking for times and dates that are more clear. Please let me know on this thread if you will. Thanks.
 
  • #322
Please don't feel this way on my account. I agree and 2nd everything SS and Steadfast have said in regards to this. I have not labeled KK, at least not yet. I am keeping an open mind about her, but am also trying to remember all I have learned here over the last couple of years. Everything is not always what it seems, and that goes both ways. Sometimes someone cries - but they cry for themselves and sometimes someone cries and they are actually crying for the missing.

If that makes any sense? :blowkiss:

Salem
It makes perfect sense, Salem. We have seen it time after time where the guilty party sobs for the fact they were caught when at the time they should be grieving for the victim. And you are correct that everyone IS a suspect until this child is found and they have evidence to bring the perp to justice. It could be someone she knows and trusted. LE seems to think so.
 
  • #323
Great Job EYES! I also would like to see some more accuracy with these reports. In particular, along with the times and dates you would like to see - I would also like to see the places. I would like to know exactly where the kids were when Josh was sent back home. Had they made it to KK's house yet? Or were they still on the way?

And exactly where Lindsey was when last seen. None of the descriptions are consistent. The intersection of 6th and Maple is only 1 block from KK's house - NOT 2/3's of the way or half way or whatever. I lean towards this being where she was last seen because it has actually been named and because it appears to be consistent with the witness who was driving to work timewise - but it is still inconsistent with any of the other descriptions we have of the last seen spot.

How hard would it be for LE to confirm the last seen time and place?

Salem
 
  • #324
I probably should've started apologizing earlier.

I have a terrible sense of humor & sometimes I come off a bit 'thick skinned.

I may have already offended people on another post.

You're right it's not funny.

Specifically the # sequence (code) is what i found humorous.

I don't find humor in the 7ft barbed wire fence of a religious school i live near either. Only irony.

It reminded me of a certain (comedic) movie. '1, 2, 3, 4' - 'Ah so the code is 1 2 3 4'

Actually it was the fence that upset me, not any reference you made to it. Since you didn't put the fence up, imo, you have nothing to apologize for.
moo
 
  • #325
I was watching a news report about Lindsey the other day when the search was first going on and they were "checking" all the residences along her supposed route. They had some video of the police "searching" a residence, and it consisted of the police standing on the porch and asking the homeowner to be sure to check all their outbuildings. If they happened to be talking to the perp, it's not as if he/she would say, "I wasn't going to tell unless you asked, but she's in my tool shed." I'm not confident that LE has searched inside many homes or even inside the outbuildings. They'd need search warrants for all those places.
Anyone know whether they have actually searched inside the homes along her route? I mean information besides that coming from KK? (Still not considering her credible yet.)

Well, we know from jvk that they didn't search the beehive, which is within a few feet of where she disappeared.
moo
 
  • #326
Why did school get out on June 16th at 10:00 a.m.? Is that weird to anyone but me? I would have thought it would have been at least a 1/2 day ending around noon or so. It hardly seems worthwhile to get everyone up and off to school so they can come home 2 hours later?

Salem
Schools are part of the biz. They are not geared towards teaching children as much as they are towards money. You have to have butts in the seats to collect the cash. ;)
 
  • #327
Great Job EYES! I also would like to see some more accuracy with these reports. In particular, along with the times and dates you would like to see - I would also like to see the places. I would like to know exactly where the kids were when Josh was sent back home. Had they made it to KK's house yet? Or were they still on the way?

And exactly where Lindsey was when last seen. None of the descriptions are consistent. The intersection of 6th and Maple is only 1 block from KK's house - NOT 2/3's of the way or half way or whatever. I lean towards this being where she was last seen because it has actually been named and because it appears to be consistent with the witness who was driving to work timewise - but it is still inconsistent with any of the other descriptions we have of the last seen spot.

How hard would it be for LE to confirm the last seen time and place?

Salem

Thanks Salem...it's a work in progress and with the help of the sluethers here, it will increase in validity.

Seems there were 3 people who may have seen her at different times. Kayla watched her walk to the end of the street (I think)...a friend who knows Lindsey and another witness to her walking. I don't know what's so hard except maybe people aren't sure of times. When you aren't expecting anything traumatic to happen, why document times...you give round abouts.
 
  • #328
Why did school get out on June 16th at 10:00 a.m.? Is that weird to anyone but me? I would have thought it would have been at least a 1/2 day ending around noon or so. It hardly seems worthwhile to get everyone up and off to school so they can come home 2 hours later?

Salem


I don't know about that school but our High School lets out after Semester exams. It seems like a waste to me.
 
  • #329
Actually it was the fence that upset me, not any reference you made to it. Since you didn't put the fence up, imo, you have nothing to apologize for.
moo
Off topic: I have to ask...Have you had the circumstance where it was relevent before? Not trying to be sarcastic or anything, but until then it is hard to understand. I respect that many would not appreciate such a barrier. It does seem barbaric.
 
  • #330
I don't know about that school but our High School lets out after Semester exams. It seems like a waste to me.
Again...butts in the seats = money for the school. I think the reason they run so late there (and correct me if I am wrong) is that they have to take into consideration the snow days and other inclimate weather. This means they will have longer sessions which are planned in advance due to the climate.
 
  • #331
Teekah Lewis' mom offers advice for McCleary family
03:55 PM PDT on Saturday, July 4, 2009
<snipped>
It's another holiday, and another birthday missed for one local family.

Teekah Lewis turned 13 today.

"It gets harder by the year," says Theresa Lewis.

Teekah disappeared January 23, 1999 as she played at a Tacoma bowling alley. Police later believed the then 2-year-old was abducted

Today, Theresa returned to the spot where Teekah was last seen. She put up signs and 13 balloons in honor of her birthday.

She also says she's trying to avoid coverage of the disappearance of another young girl, Lindsay Baum. The 10-year-old McCleary girl vanished more than a week ago.

Grays Harbor County Sheriffs' Deputies said Saturday that there are no new clues in the disappearance, and it's becoming more likely the girl was taken away from the town, because they've now searched most of McCleary.

Lewis shares the pain the Baum family is going through, and offers her own advice: "Don't never give up, you know she's out there somewhere. My heart goes out to you, being that I've been dealing with it for 10 years, and there isn't one that day doesn't go by that I don't think about my daughter."


Teekah Lewis at age 2 - shortly before her disappearance.
M_IMAGE.10a642fdd3f.93.88.fa.d0.75948d61.jpg


VIDEO: Teekah Lewis' mother still looking for answers
http://www.king5.com/video/news-index.html?nvid=377346

Jan. 23, 2009: No clue in 10-year disappearance of Tacoma girl
http://www.king5.com/localnews/south/stories/NW_012309WAB-teekah-lewis-ks.216a09d8.html

Article:
http://www.king5.com/localnews/stories/NW_070409WAB-teekah-KS.b27ceb4.html
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Here's another case, that I think we all should take the time to remember today too! Sending her family strength & prayers on such a difficult day for them today! :praying:

Tacoma Family Remembers 4th of July Tragedy
It's been two years since 12-year-old Zina Linnik of Tacoma was kidnapped and murdered.
July 3, 2009
<snipped>
On the 4th of July, it will have been 2-years since 12-year-old Zina Linnik was kidnapped behind her Tacoma home and murdered.

Terapon Adhahn, a convicted sex offender, was arrested and led police to her body. He pleaded guilty to rape and murder and got life in prison.

Zina's family is satisfied with his sentence, but Kalchik wants even tougher laws to keep people like Adhahn off the streets.

Meanwhile, police in the town of McCleary in Grays Harbor County are still trying to find 10-year-old Lindsey Baum who vanished a week ago. They fear she was kidnapped. Zina's father says, "I understand what they're going through because we had to go through exactly the same thing."

Plans are in the works to build two memorials for Zina in Tacoma. One will be at Wright Park and will feature a playground and community plaza. The other will be at the new McCarver Park and will also have a playground, along with Ukranian art and a wall that's inscribed with a poem that was read at Zina's candlelight vigil.

Kalchik says, "Yes, we are glad the city is working on the park and that they want to remember Zina."

Here's how to learn more about the park memorials for Zina Linnik: Http://www.metroparksfoundation.org/zina-linnik-project-at-wright/


VIDEO: Tacoma Family Remembers 4th of July Tragedy
http://www.q13fox.com/videobeta/watch/?watch=879e9072-b507-45a6-85a1-c281a4fdb57b&src=front

Article:
http://www.q13fox.com/news/kcpq-070309-zinalinnik,0,5829069.story

:angel:
 
  • #332
I cant seem to gt this straight;
Neighbor sends brother home with bike or without bike at like 8:45, Is this true?
Nieghbor sees Lindsey walking at 9:15, is that true?
So is there any witnesses seeing the brother actually go home?

Perp prob had a weapon if there was no struggle.
Was Lindsey wearing any kind of jewelry? Metal detectors should be used up and down Maple.
 
  • #333
Seems there was an effort to dismiss the principal in 2006: http://cache.zoominfo.com/CachedPag...7+11:26:14+AM&firstName=Dan&lastName=Bolender

Salem


It appeared to me that he was dismissed, but apparently not.
KK's daughter appears to be biracial.
Lindsey may have missed a lot of school due to nightmares, and/or not sleeping at night. The myspace was created at 4 am, after all.
Did the mom work while the kids were in school?
Did she work at that dollar store mentioned?
Does the Baum family own that store?
Does the mom have relatives nearby?
Are they staying out of sight?

Since LB had slip ons on her feet, unless the perp took the time to pick them up, she may have willingly gotten in a car.
A relative?
A friends parent, or sibling?
just throwing stuff out there.
 
  • #334
Jntexas.....the landlord issue had me going insane last night all to no avail.
It seems he has at least one criminal case where there was a jury trial, then he changed his plea to guilty. Was ordered to pay victims, and then held on a bench warrant for something else. I am unable to find anywhere what this case is for.
There are a few civil suits of those attorneys then suing him for their fees.
There are a few cases that appear to be misdemeanors, or maybe MAYBE small felonies. Lastly, there is a more recent one (2005 iirc) that has he and his wife both as defendants.
I am interested in that also, but it appears it is not "pertinent".
So I moved to JM, hit a brick wall there, too, and went to bed :)

alot of times you can have a RSO living right next to you and you don't even know unless YOU search for it.

:( :(
 
  • #335
I'm posting the time-line with the hopes posters on WebSleuths can help make it better...TIA

This is a rough time-line and was posted by eyes on Lindsey thread #1 using information from Post #173 & post #233 (Angel who cares), post #223 (kat), June 30th update posted by Angel Who Cares. Articles, interviews etc. Please note: This time-line has contradictions and is being updated and subject to change at any time. Latest update July 4th.

MAY 29th - Lindsey wrote....
I've been getting a lot of nightmares lately and I have this bad feeling that something bads gonna happen...
Her mood - scared (eyes asks: what on earth causes a 10yo to have nightmares?)

June 16th - Last day of school, ended about 10:00am (information from locals)

JUNE 26TH - 9:15PM....LAST TIME LINDSEY WAS SEEN BY ANYONE

June 26th, Friday day hours - K said daughter Kayla was swimming with Lindsey and a group of girls before returning to the Maple street residence...(eyes asks: where were they swimming)

8:15? - Friday evening hours - Kayla and Lindsey seen in video store with group of friends - laughing & joking!
(eyes asks: did they rent videos? Where and when were they going to watch them?)

8:25 - Lindsey and Kayla walked to Lindsey's home - Lindsey showered, changed clothes. Mom Baum said Lindsey left without cell phone, money or clothes.(eyes unable to figure out if video store was before or after walk to Lindsey's home)

8:45? - Lindsey, K, and brother (pushing bike) leave for friend's house to inquire if Lindsey could stay the night. Neighbor saw Lindsey and brother squabbling over brother's bike and sent brother home (eyes asks: where did this altercation take place?)

9:00? - Lindsey arrived at friend's home and was told by mom and dad she could not stay the night and needed to leave due to impending darkness - Lindsey left to walk the 4 blocks home.

9:15 - a woman on her way to work (car) saw Lindsey walking on Maple between 5th & 6th street...about 1/2 way between the two homes.
Taken from Angel Who Cares post #233 (thread 1)

OR (another version) - Lindsey was leaving her friend’s home between 9 p.m. and 9:30 p.m. Friday, traveling from Maple Street to Mommsen Road. Scott said a neighbor spotted her “two-thirds of the way home,” still on Maple Street.

AND - a 2nd witness has come forward saying Lindsey was seen walking

Quote taken from the article by Angel Who Cares:

“We have her coming back from the residence alone consistent with the friend and friend’s family,” Scott said. “We cannot put her to the main street here or to the street in front of her house. This wasn’t somebody who said she saw someone who looks like (Lindsey) or might have been; she was very confident it was Lindsey because she knew her and was on her way to work.”

The “main street” is South 3rd Street and it is a busy thoroughfare near City Hall, connecting to freeways in multiple directions. The police station is within sight of the intersection. The street requires a crosswalk and pedestrian control walking signals. On Friday, the streets were lighted. The sun was still out.

There is a Shell gas station at the intersection and a bus station with a bench that looked like it was in regular use at least on Monday. Scott said video surveillance at the Shell station are being reviewed. (a later update posted by by Angel Who Cares says Lindsey was NOT seen on the surveillance of the Shell gas station)
...snipped for space

10:00 - Lindsey's mom (car broken down) begins to search for Lindsey. She joined friend's parents by car for the search.

10:45 - police called

Bold by me
HELP PLEASE: Please feel free to correct, enhance, and clarify the info. TIA

Posted by Angel Who Cares update - June 30th article
...Kempen said her daughter Michaela had spent Friday with Lindsey and a group of other girls, swimming at a friend’s pool before they returned to the home on Maple Street. Kempen said her daughter and Lindsey were “almost inseparable” and loved to spend time together talking about “10-year-old girl stuff, boys and music, school occasionally.”...

Excellent job.

My one concern (in red above) is that we have seen media articles that say the reverse was the case, i.e. that they were asking if K could stay the night at Lindsey's. I lean more towards believing that to be the case because one article specifically quoted MB (Lindsey's Mom) saying so.

IMO, it is an important detail, because it does explain SS's earlier questions on the last thread as to why Lindsey didn't have any clothes with her like pj's for an overnight and why MB was still expecting Lindsey home by 10:00 and also why Josh was planning to walk home with Lindsey from K's.

Thoughts?
 
  • #336
Why did school get out on June 16th at 10:00 a.m.? Is that weird to anyone but me? I would have thought it would have been at least a 1/2 day ending around noon or so. It hardly seems worthwhile to get everyone up and off to school so they can come home 2 hours later?

Salem

I'm in WA State as well. Our last day was dismissed at 10:30 a.m. - I thought that was very strange since they cleaned out their desks the day before.
 
  • #337
What possible differnce does it make if KK's daughter is biracial or not?! In this case it has not EVER become an issue and to me it should not. I am actually offended it was offered up as anything. GRRRRR! :furious:
 
  • #338
So i was reading this and it made me think of a different case.
I wrote about it a little bit on another thread, but i had a mod delete it cuz i didn't really know any of the people in the thread and i felt uncomfortable.
I wanna share it w/ you guys in this thread though cuz i hang out in this one all the time.
It's O/T from Lindsey's case, but it's just an example kinda of how you don't know what cases about sometimes and how they can be misleading.
Just this year, i decided to go to the police finally and tell the police that i was sexually abused for like 7 years by my stepfather.
It was the hardest thing to do ever.
But i coudln't live w/ the guilt anymore of not saying anything and i knew i could never live w/ myself if it happened to someone else.
I thought parents deserved to know what he was capable of so they could keep their children away.
His whole family are Christians and some even pastors. Even he was a pastor for a long time. :(
Anyway, i don't need to go into the whole thing about me right now, but while i was at the police station during some of my interviews, i told them about another family member of mine that had accused him of doing stuff to her too. I told them that eventually the charges were dropped and that family member moved away and that as far as we knew the charges weren't true. This particular case happened about 12 or 13 years ago.
Now when i told them about this, they looked into it and found out that the case WASN'T dropped!!! We were lied to about it the whole time. Instead he had "pled out" very quietly and it just kinda went away. We found out that he pled guilty to "simple assault" which is kinda like what you would get if you got in a fight and hit someone or something. Because there was no proof of the sexual assault, he was able to plead out to only simple assault. I was able to read the police report from way back then and i just sat there shaking and in tears. It sounded so much the same what she was told and stuff. That's when i learned the word "grooming" I had never heard of it until then and i'm almost 33 years old now.
Anyway i was just in shock that we thought all these years the charges were dropped and then we found out that he had pled out. And then finding out he was able to plead guilty to only simple assault is upsetting too, because it was more than that, but people won't really know that will they? :(
I think people have the right to know.
I mean alot of times you can have a RSO living right next to you and you don't even know unless YOU search for it.
He wasn't even required to register as a SO cuz it was only simple assault he pled guilty to.
I'm hoping after my case is done that AT LEAST he will have to register as a sex offender if nothing else.
Okay i'm done.....just wanted to add that. :( :(
I am so sorry with what you had to deal with and what you have gone through. I respect you being so brave to come out with it. It is what people need to know in order to protect their loved ones. It can and does happen to everyone no matter the circumstances.

It could play a role here. No one can say for certain that someone in her immediate area did not take her away. When there is little evidence of an abduction...you have to rely on past history and what is iknown. This certainly implies that anyone she came into contact with prior to her abduction is suspect. However, there is no indication it was from a church or someone of that authority.
 
  • #339
This is a rough time-line and was posted by eyes on Lindsey thread #1 using information from Post #173 & post #233 (Angel who cares), post #223 (kat), June 30th update posted by Angel Who Cares. Articles, interviews etc. Please note: This time-line has contradictions and is being updated and subject to change at any time. Latest update July 4th. at 8:00pm.

MAY 29th - Lindsey wrote....
I've been getting a lot of nightmares lately and I have this bad feeling that something bads gonna happen...
Her mood - scared (eyes asks: what on earth causes a 10yo to have nightmares?)

June 16th - Last day of school, ended about 10:00am (information from locals)

June 25th - Kayla had an overnight at Lindsey's home

JUNE 26TH - 9:15PM....LAST TIME LINDSEY WAS SEEN

June 26th, Friday day hours - K said daughter Kayla was swimming with Lindsey and a group of girls before returning to the Maple street residence...(eyes asks: where were they swimming - public pool?)

8:15? - Friday evening hours - Kayla and Lindsey in video store with group of friends - laughing & joking!
(eyes asks: did they rent videos? Where and when were they going to watch them?)

8:25 - Lindsey and Kayla walked to Lindsey's home to ask Mom Baum if Lindsey could stay the night with Kayla OR if Kayla could stay the night again - Lindsey showered, changed clothes. Mom Baum said Lindsey left without cell phone, money or clothes.(eyes unable to figure out if video store was before or after walk to Lindsey's home)

8:45? - Lindsey, Kayla, and brother (pushing bike) leave for friend's house to inquire if Lindsey could stay the night. Neighbor saw Lindsey and brother squabbling over brother's bike and sent brother home (eyes asks: where did this altercation take place?)

9:00? - Lindsey and Kayla arrived at Kayla's home and was told by mom and dad she could not stay the night and needed to leave due to impending darkness - Lindsey left to walk the 4 blocks home.

9:10? - Kayla watched Lindsey walk down Maple not knowing where she turned

9:15 - a woman on her way to work (car) saw Lindsey walking on Maple between 5th & 6th street...about 1/2 way between the two homes.
Taken from Angel Who Cares post #233 (thread 1)

OR (another version) - Lindsey was leaving her friend&#8217;s home between 9 p.m. and 9:30 p.m. Friday, traveling from Maple Street to Mommsen Road. Scott said a neighbor spotted her &#8220;two-thirds of the way home,&#8221; still on Maple Street.

AND - A 2nd witness has come forward saying Lindsey was seen walking

Quote taken from the article by Angel Who Cares:

&#8220;We have her coming back from the residence alone consistent with the friend and friend&#8217;s family,&#8221; Scott said. &#8220;We cannot put her to the main street here or to the street in front of her house. This wasn&#8217;t somebody who said she saw someone who looks like (Lindsey) or might have been; she was very confident it was Lindsey because she knew her and was on her way to work.&#8221;

The &#8220;main street&#8221; is South 3rd Street and it is a busy thoroughfare near City Hall, connecting to freeways in multiple directions. The police station is within sight of the intersection. The street requires a crosswalk and pedestrian control walking signals. On Friday, the streets were lighted. The sun was still out.

There is a Shell gas station at the intersection and a bus station with a bench that looked like it was in regular use at least on Monday. Scott said video surveillance at the Shell station are being reviewed. (a later update posted by by Angel Who Cares says Lindsey was NOT seen on the surveillance of the Shell gas station)
...snipped for space

10:00pm - Lindsey's mom (car broken down) begins to search for Lindsey. She joined friend's parents by car for the search.

10:45pm - Mom Baum called police - reported daughter Lindsey missing

Bold by me
HELP PLEASE: Please feel free to correct, enhance, and clarify the info. TIA

A special 'thanks' to Angel Who Cares and those who have posted many great links, pics, and updates....Thanks to those of you with suggestions

Posted by Angel Who Cares update - June 30th article
...Kempen said her daughter Michaela had spent Friday with Lindsey and a group of other girls, swimming at a friend&#8217;s pool before they returned to the home on Maple Street. Kempen said her daughter and Lindsey were &#8220;almost inseparable&#8221; and loved to spend time together talking about &#8220;10-year-old girl stuff, boys and music, school occasionally.&#8221;...
 
  • #340
Hi guys
i know i asked this question before, but i missed it if anyone answered..
i'm sorry...
i admit i haven't watched any of the interviews...sometimes they're just too hard to watch...
but i'm just wondering....
has anyone seen lindsey's mom cry?
i've only seen pics of her and she's not crying in them
so i'm just curious....


I didn't think I'd be able to help with this question, but I kept it on my mind just in case. As I was watching NG about 5 minutes ago I saw MB speaking and she was crying. It was while she was saying that the perp needs to just give LB a chance and let her go.
 
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