WARNING:GRAPHIC PHOTOS Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #8

[otto]

I do believe Amanda is Guilty, I Do Not believe however that she was the one who struck the fatal blow ( or any blows for that matter).

I do believe she WAS at the cottage that night and KNEW what was going down.

warning: graphic description

It is believed that Amanda, Raffaele and Rudy restrained Meredith before she was murdered. She had over 40 injuries, including bruises and cuts. Some of the cuts were little nicks in the upper chest area. There was very little in terms of defensive wounds, although there were a couple. The larger of the two knives used was used to stab her in the neck. That knife has been connected to Amanda through finger prints. A small amount of Meredith's DNA was found on a grove of the blade. That DNA evidence is under appeal with the question being whether it could be a result of contamination ... but in the mean time it looks like the fatal blow came from the knife connected to Amanda.

 

[otto]

Nova, there has been much discussion about the size of Meredith's bedroom; whether it's the size of a bedroom, a bathroom, or a postage stamp. It was a decent sized bedroom, not unlike many bedrooms found in North America: about 10 feet wide, and 11 or 12 feet long (door being on the longer wall). There is a bed, probably 3x6, and then nothing between the bed and the outer wall. There is a wardrobe and chest along one wall. They cut into the room about 18 inches for a total span of about 4 feet. The desk on the opposite wall cuts in about 2 feet. The span of the desk and the door is about 6 feet. I built a model of the house some time ago, and saw your post about what it might look like. This reconstruction is built to scale.

 

[otto]

You've seen the same video we all have of the bra clasp being passed around and then placed back on the floor. If you trust someone who deems that to be "legit" collection of evidence, I don't know else to say on the subject.

The knife is being reviewed for lab contamination. I don't think it's possible to dispute that it's Meredith's DNA, regardless of how it was tested. The markers are consistent, but the knife DNA has lower peaks. It's still her DNA.

The bra clasp, on the other hand, is being reviewed for process & handling. The question is whether it was contaminated in the field, whereas the knife is being tested for contamination in the lab. We still have to figure out how Raffaele's DNA got into the bedroom in the first place, then we can try to connect that to the bra clasp. If the only place we should find Raffaele's DNA is in the kitchen, we have to believe that someone else collected a spec of Raffaele's DNA from a cigarette butt in the kitchen and left it on the bra clasp in the bedroom. What are the odds of that?

 

[otto]

I think this is a good time to consider that contamination is alleged in both the lab and the field. This suggests that both crime scene analysts and forensic experts were incompetent in their fields. We also have allegations that the prosecutor is a satanic witch hunter with Amanda Knox in his sites - a prosecution he is doing for kicks because he's anti-american. The police are violent torturers and bumbling fools for several reasons; no need to regurgitate the details. We must not forget the accusations of the unsequestered jury even though it was a high profile case, just like the current Brad Cooper case.

Everyone associated with the prosecution of this murder has been accused (without proof, I might add) of doing something other than their jobs. I think that's a bit farfetched. I could understand that one person is not doing his or her job, like the recent problems in North Carolina, but not that everyone associated with the investigation, prosecution and conviction is not doing the job right.

 

[otto]

This is a scaled reenactment with the camera placed in the opposite corner. I hope you appreciate that I have represented Amanda as a nice young woman. Same with Rudy and Raffale ... all nice young people convicted of murder.

 

[missyjane77]

Do you really think that a retired mechanical engineer that specialized in accident reconstruction is a better expert than a crime scene analyst?

I know several mechanical engineers that went on to become doctors. Just saying...

 

[otto]

I know several mechanical engineers that went on to become doctors. Just saying...

Mechanical engineers, specializing in math and physics, that went on to become doctors specializing in biology and chemistry? Interesting. That doesn't strike me as a natural or common switch in terms of career interests.

 

[otto]

This is how it might look standing in the doorway:

 

[Salem]

Does Italy have an Innocence Project, like we have in the US?

Just wondering how their numbers look.

Salem

 

[ziggy]

Otto - nice job on the pictures but you are failing to add Meredith as a person, as a body taking up space, therefore it appears there is more space for people to move around than there actually would be if you had four adults in that space. This would be, of course, in considering that four human bodies were present in that space when one of them was assaulted, stabbed and killed. All four would have to be in the area in front of the wardrobe with the desk area behind them, judging by where the blood was aspirated and where it fell in determining Meredith's original position in the room when her throat was cut.

Otto - do you think Rudy just left and only A and R cleaned up? Did all three of them try to clean up in that room at once? What are your theories on that?

 

[ziggy]

Mechanical engineers, specializing in math and physics, that went on to become doctors specializing in biology and chemistry? Interesting. That doesn't strike me as a natural or common switch in terms of career interests.

More natural than doctors going into law and we have that in our school quite frequently. (It's a common joking aside by our professors that the reason we are in law school is because we can't do science and math).

 

[Allusonz]

True, but there's no evidence that RS ever knew RG. So if you exclude AK, then you have RS meeting RG for the first time and immediately helping him to kill MK, all within about 12 minutes.

This is why I speculate that if pressed, the prosecution will cut loose RS and produce a new theory in which AK and RG killed MK together. Still nonsense, of course, but I think Mignini is wedded to a theory of AK as evil mastermind.

Like pieces to a puzzle, one has to believe the preceeding pieces in order for this to become an issue

First off I would have to believe that this was a Satanic drug fueled sex orgy presented by a very Catholic prosecutor, whom consulted with a psychic, with unprecidented authority and absolutely no checks and balances within an ILE system from what I have been able to determine, whom has now been convicted of abuse of office

I must also then believe that they then carried a 12 inch kitchen knife while stumbling through the streets of Perugia in a drug induced state without falling and killing or injuring themselves (including accidental bruises, cuts etc.) with the explicit plan of meeting RG of whom they had not been in contact with

I must also then believe that they performed a satanic sex ritual, while stoned and drugged without leaving any uncontaminated DNA of theirs in the room in which MK was killed at least for 46 days till the bra clasp was found

Then I must be able to believe that they killed her while still in this drug induced state without receiving any wounds or any blood on their clothes and without leaving any hair folicles etc. thus in their drug induced state they figured out a way to either fly through the air or;

I must believe that they were able while still stoned out their minds to selectively clean up DNA which is invisable to the naked eye of which I know of no one able to do this

Even more absurd, while still stoned out of their minds I must believe they had the forthought to stage a breakin (similar to other breakins of RG) by going outside, getting a rock coming back in and throwing it out the window without it going out the window from the inside and falling to the ground below but instead it bounced backwards even though the inside and outside shutters were open whilst going against all rules of ballistics, gravity etc. known

If i was that stoned i would certainly not care about a rock let alone know if in my stoned state be able to throw it without giggling uncontrolably as i am sure i must by now in my drugged state find this highly amusing allowing for no one around the cottage to hear or see me

RG simply ran out of the front door but in their drug induced state they must of been fumbling around thus stumbled out the front door after staging the break in

Still in their drug induced state i have to believe that ooops they forgot to steal the rent money so stumbled back, took a lamp from AK's room (so they could see) without leaving any blood or DNA of MK in AK's room as they had not had an opportunity to clean up yet, move the body, and still be able to avoid all the blood, get the rent money out of her purse without leaving any DNA, decide in their drug induced state to be even greedier and take her cards and cell phones, leave the premises again to dispose of the cell phones in a garden as well as cards that were never found

Prior to stumbling back to RS's, and still in their drug induced state decided to shower without leaving any blood on the shower walls but left a partial footprint on a bathmat must be theirs even though RG admitted going to the bathroom to get towels ( i know this is suppose to make sense i just cant vision it in my mind) It simply must be my tunnel vision or someone else's overactive imagination

While stoned out of their minds, they were able to make it back to RS's carrying a 12 inch knife, without hurting themselves and without anyone seeing them where they by now must simply be starved thus fix a meal, using of course the now cleaned knife, make love etc, and shower

Even crazier, I am suppose to then assume that once RS was arrested, put in solitary confinement, not allowed to see a lawyer till his first hearing, did not name RG to Mignini

Then I am to believe that RS, whom had never met RG, but had committed a murder with him protected RG by not naming him as an accomplice, while sitting in solitary confinement, without being allowed legal representation, yet stated that AK left the apartment at 9pm. How incredible!

Then I am suppose to believe that they are going to let RS off of this charge even though he is the only one with any significant assets that could be siezed from the civil litigation of which AK and RG do not have

I am quite certain that Conspiracy Theories are not my forteit!!! Perhaps someone that does not deal in real evidence could come up with a better one

 

[Allusonz]

Hasn't the innocence project dropped Knox from their website?

To my knowledge she was never on it

 

[Allusonz]

I found that interesting too. I guess the other seven wanted their names removed from the document.

Then you must not be discussing the letter sent to the defense requesting the release of all the .fsa files by the prosecution so that they could complete in full there reviews. The 9 consisted of 2 from the UK. The prosecution did not comply with the Court Order for release of all of these files

 

[Allusonz]

If there's a car crash, he's a good guy to bring in to give an opinion about who swerved, or who hit the breaks. How does that translate to an expertise in blood spatter analysis?

I guess that would be the same as stating that a ballistics expert cannot testify about rock throwing as he is not an expert in rock throwing

My question still stands...When will people realize the problem is not the defense experts but the ILE

Ron Hendry - Forensics Engineer

same techniques police use to reconstruct a homicide. He has analyzed upwards of 2,000 cases and has interfaced with and reviewed the work of police investigators on many of them

Nobody asked Ron to get involved in this case, and he is not being compensated

http://www.examiner.com/headlines-i...attacker-killed-meredith-kercher-explains-why

Walter Patumi

When Walter Patumi one of the most experienced coroners in Italy. The concept is simple, with a little blade you can make a long cut. And everything in the murder of Meredith suggests that a little blade was used. Even the larger wound, since two waves are detectable on the margins of the cut, as if the offender stroked three times there.

http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/20...or-amanda.html

Vincenzo Pasquali Forensic Expert

His testimony was disregarded as he is only an expert in ballistics not rock throwing

Mr Vincio tesified that the sizes and shapes did not match. video and ballistic measurements to tell the court the window was smashed from the outside and was not simulated.

Medical examiner Carlo Torre

Torre told the court there is not a single element that leads one to think more than one person could have comitted the crime

Francesco Introna,

Sollecito's consultant, told the court last month that Kercher was knifed from behind, a lone killer holding her chin with one hand and the knife in the other. The prosecutors also believe she was attacked from behind, but think she was held by Sollecito and Guede, with Knox wielding the knife.

ETA Ron Hendry is now consulting for the defense, at that time he was not

 

[Allusonz]

Does Italy have an Innocence Project, like we have in the US?

Just wondering how their numbers look.

Salem

They do not need one they have Mignini. When a you have a prosecutor, that is accountable to no one, and that prosecutor is convicted of abuse of office yet still consulting on a case in which, under Italian law he cannot be involved, does it matter in the bigger picture whether they have an Innocence Project or equivalent?

I believe that i sent you Salem the UN stats. I believe I have previously posted or sent to you the percentages of the various EU countries as well as the information with respect to gangs and the 4 main mafia groups in Italy

ECHR

Human rights violations....Turkey barely edged out Italy out of 46 countries

Turkey topped the chart with 18.81 percent of all violation judgments, followed by Italy with 16.57 percent and Russia 6.34 percent. Within this timeframe, 2,295 judgments were entered for Turkey and only in 46 cases did the court find no violations. The most common human rights violation committed by Turkey was the denial of the right to a fair trial. Italy scored second with 2,021 judgments against it

http://ecohr.wordpress.com/2011/01/11/human-rights-violations-in-turkey/

The legal system grinds very slowly and it takes years for a case to come to court; the average time between indictment and a court judgement is ten years

http://www.justlanded.de/english/Italy/Articles/Visas-Permits/Legal-System

Spezi's wife, Miriam, told CPJ that authorities showed no warrant when they took her husband on April 7, nor did they explain why or where they were taking him. News reports say the journalist is now under criminal investigation for allegedly defaming Perugia prosecutors through the media

http://cpj.org/2006/04/crime-journalists-imprisonment-raises-alarm.php

Ask anyone who's been unfortunate enough to be caught up in Italy's legal system and they'll tell you it's one of the world's most corrupt. With bribes and deals being the name of the game, if you're Italian and 'know the right people', your chances in Italy's legal system are good

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/5564722/amanda_knox_and_parents_being_harassed.html

Paolo Onofri called the police: sued. Amanda and Raffaele called the police: jailed. Alberto Stasi called the police: jailed. Filippo Pappalardi called the police: jailed. Sabrina Misseri called the police: jailed. The two Romanians were interrogated: jailed. Enrico Tironi went to testify: sued. Salvatore Marino was interrogated: dead. Federico Aldrovandi met the police: dead. Giusepppe Uva was arrested: dead. Aldo Bianzino was arrested: dead. Stefano Cucchi was arrested: dead. A girl last week was arrested: raped. The justice system had relied on them: killed. When I recently opened my door to the police: arrested and accused of having beaten them

http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/

 

[otto]

Otto - nice job on the pictures but you are failing to add Meredith as a person, as a body taking up space, therefore it appears there is more space for people to move around than there actually would be if you had four adults in that space. This would be, of course, in considering that four human bodies were present in that space when one of them was assaulted, stabbed and killed. All four would have to be in the area in front of the wardrobe with the desk area behind them, judging by where the blood was aspirated and where it fell in determining Meredith's original position in the room when her throat was cut.

Otto - do you think Rudy just left and only A and R cleaned up? Did all three of them try to clean up in that room at once? What are your theories on that?

I thought it was more respectful not to put a victim on the floor. There is enough space in the room for a person to be attacked by the other three.

The evidence suggests that Rudy ran in one direction, and the other two went in the other direction. The phones were probably disposed of by the lovebirds. Rudy went home to change, and then he went dancing. The lovebirds then returned to the cottage, stripped down, cleaned up, staged the break in, and returned to Raffaele's apt. Activity on the computer and Raffaele's cell phone occurs at 6 AM but the lovebirds lied and said that they slept until 10. It's possible that they went to sleep at 6 AM and woke up again at about 10.

 

[otto]

Does Italy have an Innocence Project, like we have in the US?

Just wondering how their numbers look.

Salem

I have no idea, and looking up the phrase Innocenti Progetto Italia doesn't produce any results.

 

[otto]

I guess that would be the same as stating that a ballistics expert cannot testify about rock throwing as he is not an expert in rock throwing

My question still stands...When will people realize the problem is not the defense experts but the ILE

Ron Hendry - Forensics Engineer

same techniques police use to reconstruct a homicide. He has analyzed upwards of 2,000 cases and has interfaced with and reviewed the work of police investigators on many of them

Nobody asked Ron to get involved in this case, and he is not being compensated

http://www.examiner.com/headlines-i...attacker-killed-meredith-kercher-explains-why

Walter Patumi

When Walter Patumi one of the most experienced coroners in Italy. The concept is simple, with a little blade you can make a long cut. And everything in the murder of Meredith suggests that a little blade was used. Even the larger wound, since two waves are detectable on the margins of the cut, as if the offender stroked three times there.

http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/20...or-amanda.html

Vincenzo Pasquali Forensic Expert

His testimony was disregarded as he is only an expert in ballistics not rock throwing

Mr Vincio tesified that the sizes and shapes did not match. video and ballistic measurements to tell the court the window was smashed from the outside and was not simulated.

Medical examiner Carlo Torre

Torre told the court there is not a single element that leads one to think more than one person could have comitted the crime

Francesco Introna,

Sollecito's consultant, told the court last month that Kercher was knifed from behind, a lone killer holding her chin with one hand and the knife in the other. The prosecutors also believe she was attacked from behind, but think she was held by Sollecito and Guede, with Knox wielding the knife.

ETA Ron Hendry is now consulting for the defense, at that time he was not

Ballistics is the study of projectiles ... so who better to discuss the projectile rock than a ballistics expert? That is entirely different than a mechanical engineer that studies vehicle accidents claiming to be an expert in crime scene analysis and blood spatter.

Is there anyone that would want the crime scene of a loved one analyzed by a traffic accident resconstructionist? I doubt it.

 

[otto]

They do not need one they have Mignini. When a you have a prosecutor, that is accountable to no one, and that prosecutor is convicted of abuse of office yet still consulting on a case in which, under Italian law he cannot be involved, does it matter in the bigger picture whether they have an Innocence Project or equivalent?

I believe that i sent you Salem the UN stats. I believe I have previously posted or sent to you the percentages of the various EU countries as well as the information with respect to gangs and the 4 main mafia groups in Italy

ECHR

Human rights violations....Turkey barely edged out Italy out of 46 countries

Turkey topped the chart with 18.81 percent of all violation judgments, followed by Italy with 16.57 percent and Russia 6.34 percent. Within this timeframe, 2,295 judgments were entered for Turkey and only in 46 cases did the court find no violations. The most common human rights violation committed by Turkey was the denial of the right to a fair trial. Italy scored second with 2,021 judgments against it

http://ecohr.wordpress.com/2011/01/11/human-rights-violations-in-turkey/

The legal system grinds very slowly and it takes years for a case to come to court; the average time between indictment and a court judgement is ten years

http://www.justlanded.de/english/Italy/Articles/Visas-Permits/Legal-System

Spezi's wife, Miriam, told CPJ that authorities showed no warrant when they took her husband on April 7, nor did they explain why or where they were taking him. News reports say the journalist is now under criminal investigation for allegedly defaming Perugia prosecutors through the media

http://cpj.org/2006/04/crime-journalists-imprisonment-raises-alarm.php

Ask anyone who's been unfortunate enough to be caught up in Italy's legal system and they'll tell you it's one of the world's most corrupt. With bribes and deals being the name of the game, if you're Italian and 'know the right people', your chances in Italy's legal system are good

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/5564722/amanda_knox_and_parents_being_harassed.html

Paolo Onofri called the police: sued. Amanda and Raffaele called the police: jailed. Alberto Stasi called the police: jailed. Filippo Pappalardi called the police: jailed. Sabrina Misseri called the police: jailed. The two Romanians were interrogated: jailed. Enrico Tironi went to testify: sued. Salvatore Marino was interrogated: dead. Federico Aldrovandi met the police: dead. Giusepppe Uva was arrested: dead. Aldo Bianzino was arrested: dead. Stefano Cucchi was arrested: dead. A girl last week was arrested: raped. The justice system had relied on them: killed. When I recently opened my door to the police: arrested and accused of having beaten them

http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/

What makes you think that prosecutors are accountable to no one?