WARNING:GRAPHIC PHOTOS Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #9

[SMK]

You lost me SMK???

I meant, how does this evidence prove murder? could the same evidence have been left if they, horrified to find what Rudy had done, and feeling guilty because they somehow directed Rudy to rob, and to try and score sexually, ran around in a panic, attempting to make it look like a random robber/murder? Just want to know, how is THAT scenario ruled out by the evidence??? Not so much thinking legally, as wanting to know if it is still POSSIBLE that AK & RS tampered with the crime scene, but were not directly involved in the murder???:waitasec:

 

[wasnt_me]

It was Amanda's DNA, not blood in Filomena's room. Part of the appeals requests were to reexamine the findings of mixed blood and DNA because, they claim, there were unknown female DNA traces in those samples too. Had ILE taken reference DNA samples of the roommates it would have cleared up a lot of these mysteries.

What?

You have got to be kidding me. Are you seriously saying they didn't collect DNA from the roommates?

 

[wasnt_me]

Yes, but in Italy they give different 'weight' to different pieces of evidence.
Some point more towards guilt, some less. But the problem is when trying to explain/excuse away one piece of evidence... there are still SO MANY others.
It is not reasonable IMO to have to explain so many different aspects showing guilt, but have literally nothing that even resembles evidence of innocence.

I understand this reasoning, but I am not sure what giving different weights to different pieces of undisputable evidence have to do with reasonable doubt. If the evidence is in doubt, why is weight given it to?

 

[dgfred]

What?

You have got to be kidding me. Are you seriously saying they didn't collect DNA from the roommates?

Important parts of that post to note:

'appeals requested to reexamine'
and
'they claim'

Off course they want and claim, that is their job. But that doesn't mean it was granted or true.

 

[dgfred]

What?

You have got to be kidding me. Are you seriously saying they didn't collect DNA from the roommates?

I don't think it was in 'doubt', but offered some other possibilities no matter how remote or unlucky.

 

[Allusonz]

Yes, but in Italy they give different 'weight' to different pieces of evidence.
Some point more towards guilt, some less. But the problem is when trying to explain/excuse away one piece of evidence... there are still SO MANY others.
It is not reasonable IMO to have to explain so many different aspects showing guilt, but have literally nothing that even resembles evidence of innocence.

This is incorrect. More weight is placed on some items rather than others and we both know it

 

[Allusonz]

I don't think it was in 'doubt', but offered some other possibilities no matter how remote or unlucky.

no DNA from the roommates remember they had this cased closed before they had even collected all the forensics

 

[wasnt_me]

yes, I saw all that, but it doesn't answer my question.

My question is:

Are you telling me that they NEVER at any point collected DNA from the other roommates?

The other poster said:

Had ILE taken reference DNA samples of the roommates it would have cleared up a lot of these mysteries.

This statement leads me to believe they never DNA typed the roommates, other than AK and MK.

Thanks, Aullsunz, who has answered the question as I was posting. So the other 2 roommates' DNA was not taken. This is a fact.

 

[Allusonz]

Important parts of that post to note:

'appeals requested to reexamine'
and
'they claim'

Off course they want and claim, that is their job. But that doesn't mean it was granted or true.

does not mean that it won't be granted either

 

[ziggy]

Hi Claudi!! That's an interesting take and it's good to see you.

Funny that I'm over here, the one who is usually saying "they are guilty" in so many other cases with one leg further down the defense fence. Those who don't know me have called me a conspiracy theorist for the defense of AK and RS; which to me is amusing. It's more like a perfect storm than a conspiracy if anything. The investigation just seems to have failed to prove beyond a reasonable doubt and the police work and CSI was shoddy.

Speaking of conspiracies - it comes to mind that there is no proof that one existed between RG and the others - zip. This conspiracy would have to have been made before AK and RS went back to the flat because otherwise the knife that AK allegedly took from RS's to murder MK would not fit into the scenario.

No evidence of a conspiracy to commit anything or even meet.

 

[Allusonz]

yes, I saw all that, but it doesn't answer my question.

My question is:

Are you telling me that they NEVER at any point collected DNA from the other roommates?

The other poster said:



This statement leads me to believe they never DNA typed the roommates, other than AK and MK.

They never collected DNA, foot measurements from the roommates.

 

[dgfred]

That would be up to the 'other poster' to verify, not me.

 

[dgfred]

does not mean that it won't be granted either

We shall see.

 

[dgfred]

This is incorrect. More weight is placed on some items rather than others and we both know it

What???
Isn't that exactly what I posted? :waitasec:

 

[Allusonz]

yes, I saw all that, but it doesn't answer my question.

My question is:

Are you telling me that they NEVER at any point collected DNA from the other roommates?

The other poster said:



This statement leads me to believe they never DNA typed the roommates, other than AK and MK.

Thanks, Aullsunz, who has answered the question as I was posting. So the other 2 roommates' DNA was not taken. This is a fact.

Remember that one of the first calls both Filomena and Laura made were to lawyers

 

[otto]

Otto, you are willing to make the assumption that those inside shutters were open? Because that would support the possibility that the rock could have been thrown from outside (assuming that the person first climbed up to pull open the green shutters.) Whether anyone actually climbed in from there is another matter.

I wonder what the opposite glass looks like. Because if that mark on the shutter (beside the digital number 7 in the 2007 date) in your blown up picture is the rock hitting the window, would the other pane on the opposite side be broken?

The inside shutters had to be open to break the glass from the inside.

Filomina's window testimony per court conclusions:

"Filomena Romanelli stated (cf. declarations at the hearing of February 7, 2009) that when she left the house in via della Pergola 7 on the afternoon of November 1, 2007 she had closed the shutters of her window (p. 68); she had pulled them in (p. 95); "the wood was slightly swelled, so they rubbed against the windowsill" (p. 26), adding that "it was an old window...the wood rubbed". And on the day she went away, she recalled "having closed them because I knew that I would be away for a couple of days" (p. 96). She later added, when noting what she had declared on December 3, 2007, that "I had pulled the shutters together, but I don't think I closed them tight" (p. 115).

[36] It must be held that when Filomena Romanelli left the house in via della Pergola, she had pulled the shutters towards the interior of her room, although she did not think that she had actually closed them; furthermore, because they were old and the wood had swelled a bit, they rubbed on the windowsill; to pull them towards the room it was necessary to use some force ("they rubbed on the windowsill"); but in this way, once they had been pulled in, as Romanelli remembered doing, they remained well closed by the pressure of the swelled wood against the windowsill."

Ref: pg 48

It cannot be assumed - as the Defence Consultant did - that the shutters were left completely open, since this contradicts the declarations of Romanelli, which appear to be detailed and entirely likely, considering that she was actually leaving for the holiday and had some things of value in her room; already she did not feel quite safe because window-frames were in wood [38] without any grille. Also, the circumstance of the shutters being wide open does not correspond to their position when they were found and described by witnesses on November 2, and photographed (cf. photo 11 already mentioned)."

Ref: pg 50

"As for the presence of glass in Romanelli's room, the violence of the blow, the characteristics of the glass (which was rather thin as indicated by Romanelli and Pasquali), the large rock used, and finally the shield effect caused by the inner shutter hanging half-open behind the glass pane [41] (a position of the inner shutter which corresponds to the scratch on it visible in the photos) give an adequate explanation of the distribution of the glass."

Ref: pg 52

 

[Allusonz]

Some clear pictures here:

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/RonHendry------2.html

I get what you are seeing. One theory is that they were not completely shut but partially open, the rock made impact which is supposedly visible in one picture and that the impact site on the so called inner shutters has crushed glass in it. The impact caused the shutter to fly open and allow the glass to spray inwards into the room as is illustrated in the photo of the blue throw rug - the inward spray went that far - it was a pretty darn big rock.

Also noted is that had it been thrown from inside, there would have been some type of impact site on the outer dark green shutters which seems to be lacking and in addition, this theory fails to explain how the trajectory from and object travelling from inside to out causes a spray of glass that looks to be consistent with an outside/in trajectory. I have no idea if I spelled that right

As well how would a rock thrown from the inside hit the window and do a complete 180 and turn BACKWARDS INTO THE ROOM .....

 

[otto]

Remember that one of the first calls both Filomena and Laura made were to lawyers

Did they call their employer (lawyer) and make notification of the situation, or were they calling lawyers to represent them?

 

[otto]

As well how would a rock thrown from the inside hit the window and do a complete 180 and turn BACKWARDS INTO THE ROOM .....

Open the window from the inside, put a rock through the window.

 

[Allusonz]

@wasn't me
That would be kind of terrible luck, to go along with ALL the other things... for Meredith's blood to mix with AK's dna in Filomena's room wouldn't it?
But even if you take that away, it doesn't explain the other things pointing at her/their guilt.

not if MK's blood was tracked in by the forensic teams or ILE