Warren Jeffs FLDS compound in Texas surrounded by police

[Leila]

Leila, don't forget that there are children with substantial medical needs included in the group. It's also probable that the foster care system will be unable to shoulder the burden. I think that there were way more children in the compound than authorities anticipated. This will certainly be a huge financial strain on Texas. I almost wonder if it will be eligible to be declared a national disaster.

They may need federal assistance.

 

[golfmom]

http://www.sltrib.com/polygamy/ci_8864530

She said the women and children who have been rounded up and sent to Fort Concho or the Wells Fargo Pavilion are unlikely to share the sort of information sought by authorities - names of fathers, dates of births, ages.
"First of all, they are all terrified they are going to hell if they talk to anybody," she said. "They've been taught their entire lives not to reveal who their mother is, who their father is. It's part of the culture of secrecy. And secrecy breeds isolation."
She believes many of the children at the ranch were sent there by parents in other states and claims they were taken from those families and given to "more worthy" ones. The 16-year-old girl whose call to a family shelter triggered the investigation said as much in her phone calls for help to an unnamed family shelter in Texas.

Texas authorities said Tuesday during a press conference that many of the children do not appear to have parents there.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Leila, don't forget that there are children with substantial medical needs included in the group. It's also probable that the foster care system will be unable to shoulder the burden. I think that there were way more children in the compound than authorities anticipated. This will certainly be a huge financial strain on Texas. I almost wonder if it will be eligible to be declared a national disaster.

I also belong to an adoption foster care message board and apparently CPS has been in contact with foster homes all over the state of Texas. Including specialized medical foster homes.

 

[Leila]

I actually wondered if the probation officer is affiliated with the sect. Remember that a Barlow was mayor at one time.

http://extras.sltrib.com/specials/polygamy/Timeline.asp

On July 26, under the direction of Colorado City Mayor Dan Barlow, a museum and monument commemorating the 1953 Short Creek raid are dedicated without approval of FLDS Prophet Warren Jeffs.

In August, FLDS leader Warren Jeffs orders museum closed and monument destroyed.

I think the probation officer's surname is Loader. In one interview he stated that he spoke with Dale Evans Barlow every day. I thought at the time that was excessive considering that probation officers usually see their clients on a weekly or monthly basis.

 

[txsvicki]

Most of these women probably won't even have their kids taken away. A certain amount of kids will be taken and sent to various homes and agencies. These women will probably move back to another state where there's better welfare payments. Anyone expecting to be able to live on welfare in Texas better forget it. There's no cash payments and no help with utilities either. They might get a small stipend of cash each month which wouldn't be over $83 for one child, foodstamps, and low rent housing which requires a person to work and look for work.

 

[Leila]

ETA: PLEASE READ THE FOLLOWING ARTICLE. Lots of Information to discuss!

http://www.sltrib.com/polygamy/ci_8864530

SAN ANGELO, Texas - Flora Jessop wishes she was wrong.
She wishes authorities hadn't found dozens of young girls at a polygamous sect's ranch in West Texas who were already mothers or pregnant. That rumors of abuse were unfounded. That no one had to experience the upheaval that now has beset members of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
But she also wishes someone - Utah and Arizona authorities, specifically - had acted long before now to stop the sect's practice of arranging marriages between young girls and older men.
"Do I wish it on them? Absolutely not," said Jessop, who lives in Arizona. "But if a child is being hurt, the authorities need to be there for the children. They deserve the right to be free from abuse, just like their parents."
Utah and Arizona authorities have said they will not prosecute polygamous relationships that involve adults - a position taken because such prosecutions would likely fail on constitutional grounds. But the two states have attacked the sect's practice of underage marriages with some success.

I don't know why the authorities won't prosecute adult polygamous relationships. People who commit bigamy, two wives or two husbands are prosecuted. Bigamy is illegal in all 50 states. So what's the difference between polygamy and bigamy?

 

[golfmom]

The sects Mr. SmartyPants Lawyer spouts off. You know, they wouldn't have to worry about persecution if they followed the law, quit marrying children and committing incest.


http://www.kvoa.com/Global/story.asp?S=8142293&nav=HMO6HMaW
And that's partly why Piccarreta says their reputation is often misunderstood. "The mainstream media has focused on the sexual aspect or the titillation aspect of it, without even recognizing that that's a basic tenet of their belief."
..........
"This religion has a long history of being persecuted by the government," Piccarreta says.

"This is a real religion, it's being persecuted and it's not right what's going on," he says.

 

[SuziQ]

I actually wondered if the probation officer is affiliated with the sect. Remember that a Barlow was mayor at one time.

http://extras.sltrib.com/specials/polygamy/Timeline.asp

On July 26, under the direction of Colorado City Mayor Dan Barlow, a museum and monument commemorating the 1953 Short Creek raid are dedicated without approval of FLDS Prophet Warren Jeffs.

In August, FLDS leader Warren Jeffs orders museum closed and monument destroyed.

We have a Judge, Mayor and cops, why not a PO too? Hmmmm. BTW, Steed is another sect name.

 

[Pepper]

I don't know why the authorities won't prosecute adult polygamous relationships. People who commit bigamy, two wives or two husbands are prosecuted. Bigamy is illegal in all 50 states. So what's the difference between polygamy and bigamy?

Because it's not illegal for consenting adults to live together without marriage. These plural marriages took place only within the "church" and no marriage license was issued by the county & state, so in the eyes of the law they are not legally married. No marriage, no bigamy or polygamy for the purposes of prosecution.

That is also how the women get welfare checks which they turn over to their husbands. Again, in the eyes of the law they are unwed mothers with children to support.

 

[SuziQ]

The sects Mr. SmartyPants Lawyer spouts off. You know, they wouldn't have to worry about persecution if they followed the law, quit marrying children and committing incest.


http://www.kvoa.com/Global/story.asp?S=8142293&nav=HMO6HMaW
And that's partly why Piccarreta says their reputation is often misunderstood. "The mainstream media has focused on the sexual aspect or the titillation aspect of it, without even recognizing that that's a basic tenet of their belief."
..........
"This religion has a long history of being persecuted by the government," Piccarreta says.

"This is a real religion, it's being persecuted and it's not right what's going on," he says.

Grrrrr. I just want to wring Mr. Smarty Pants neck.

 

[Pepper]

The sects Mr. SmartyPants Lawyer spouts off. You know, they wouldn't have to worry about persecution if they followed the law, quit marrying children and committing incest.


http://www.kvoa.com/Global/story.asp?S=8142293&nav=HMO6HMaW
And that's partly why Piccarreta says their reputation is often misunderstood. "The mainstream media has focused on the sexual aspect or the titillation aspect of it, without even recognizing that that's a basic tenet of their belief."
..........
"This religion has a long history of being persecuted by the government," Piccarreta says.

"This is a real religion, it's being persecuted and it's not right what's going on," he says.

Like I've said before, you just can't go invent a religion that breaks the law, and claim religious persecution. If someone's new religion believed that every adult male had to go successfully rob a bank and give that money to the church, the tenets of that religion would not hold up. What if some religion advocated child murder?

 

[cheko1]

The sects Mr. SmartyPants Lawyer spouts off. You know, they wouldn't have to worry about persecution if they followed the law, quit marrying children and committing incest.


http://www.kvoa.com/Global/story.asp?S=8142293&nav=HMO6HMaW
And that's partly why Piccarreta says their reputation is often misunderstood. "The mainstream media has focused on the sexual aspect or the titillation aspect of it, without even recognizing that that's a basic tenet of their belief."
..........
"This religion has a long history of being persecuted by the government," Piccarreta says.

"This is a real religion, it's being persecuted and it's not right what's going on," he says.

He is apaperntly trying to get himself a job with the cult men!!!!!!
Or he is flipping nuts.......why wouldn't it all be legal??? The church is the church ( term used lightly) if the church owns it aLL THEN THE WARRANT IS FOR IT ALL!!!!

 

[golfmom]

Like I've said before, you just can't go invent a religion that breaks the law, and claim religious persecution. If someone's new religion believed that every adult male had to go successfully rob a bank and give that money to the church, the tenets of that religion would not hold up. What if some religion advocated child murder?

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[golfmom]

He is apaperntly trying to get himself a job with the cult men!!!!!!
Or he is flipping nuts.......why wouldn't it all be legal??? The church is the church ( term used lightly) if the church owns it aLL THEN THE WARRANT IS FOR IT ALL!!!!

I just googled him, he is Warren Jeffs attorney. :crazy:

 

[Leila]

Because it's not illegal for consenting adults to live together without marriage. These plural marriages took place only within the "church" and no marriage license was issued by the county & state, so in the eyes of the law they are not legally married. No marriage, no bigamy or polygamy for the purposes of prosecution.

That is also how the women get welfare checks which they turn over to their husbands. Again, in the eyes of the law they are unwed mothers with children to support.

I was thinking it had to be something along the lines of a legally/licensed marriage vs. church marriage. It's not bigamy if a man has a wife, whom he's legally married to in, let's say New York, and also has a "wife" in Virginia, with whom he doesn't have a marriage license. It's only when he has a valid marriage license to two different women at the same time.

So, in a polygamist marriage, it may be only one wife that the man is legally married to, and the other wives are only through the church, or perhaps all wives are only through the church.

 

[golfmom]

http://deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,695268920,00.html

SAN ANGELO, Texas — Attorneys for the FLDS Church and some of its leaders reached an agreement in court with prosecutors Wednesday over evidence seized at the YFZ Ranch.

During a two-hour court hearing the attorneys agreed to sift through the evidence with the assistance of an unbiased third party to determine what information collected at the ranch is pertinent to the case involving alleged sexual abuse and neglect of children.
................
The FBI is now at the ranch serving a third search warrant signed by a federal judge. Because of the recent warrant, the attorneys arguments to put a stop to the two previous warrants is now considered moot. "It seems to me that there is another work (warrant) in progress that whatever we ask the court for today is really now a moot point," Goldstein said.

 

[Lola]

ETA: PLEASE READ THE FOLLOWING ARTICLE. Lots of Information to discuss!

http://www.sltrib.com/polygamy/ci_8864530

SAN ANGELO, Texas - Flora Jessop wishes she was wrong.
She wishes authorities hadn't found dozens of young girls at a polygamous sect's ranch in West Texas who were already mothers or pregnant. That rumors of abuse were unfounded. That no one had to experience the upheaval that now has beset members of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
But she also wishes someone - Utah and Arizona authorities, specifically - had acted long before now to stop the sect's practice of arranging marriages between young girls and older men.
"Do I wish it on them? Absolutely not," said Jessop, who lives in Arizona. "But if a child is being hurt, the authorities need to be there for the children. They deserve the right to be free from abuse, just like their parents."
Utah and Arizona authorities have said they will not prosecute polygamous relationships that involve adults - a position taken because such prosecutions would likely fail on constitutional grounds. But the two states have attacked the sect's practice of underage marriages with some success.

How PC of the Salt Lake Tribune, but what one might expect given the churche's "official" stance on polygamy. Why doesn't someone in Utah grow some? This church with their special underwear has serious problems and until they deal with them, the sects (and oh yes, FLDS isn't the only one) will continue while they continue their misogynistic attitude. No wonder Utah has the highest rate of use of anti-depressants in the country. This makes me furious.

 

[trixie]

I just googled him, he is Warren Jeffs attorney. :crazy:

Good! 'Cuz we all know how well everything worked out in court for Warren Jeffs!:behindbar

 

[golfmom]

Photo of Levi Jeffs at link:


http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/5688012.html
.............
The lawyers agreed to set up a procedure to protect confidential matters involving attorney-client privilege before the state examines computer records and other items seized during the search. A special master will be appointed and all seized items will be sealed.
............

 

[Leila]

http://deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,695268920,00.html

SAN ANGELO, Texas — Attorneys for the FLDS Church and some of its leaders reached an agreement in court with prosecutors Wednesday over evidence seized at the YFZ Ranch.

During a two-hour court hearing the attorneys agreed to sift through the evidence with the assistance of an unbiased third party to determine what information collected at the ranch is pertinent to the case involving alleged sexual abuse and neglect of children.
................
The FBI is now at the ranch serving a third search warrant signed by a federal judge. Because of the recent warrant, the attorneys arguments to put a stop to the two previous warrants is now considered moot. "It seems to me that there is another work (warrant) in progress that whatever we ask the court for today is really now a moot point," Goldstein said.

Hmmmmmm...........the FBI now has a search warrant, so they're now looking for something that is federal - something that crosses state lines. In order to obtain that warrant, the FBI had to present a federal judge with some sort of probable cause or evidence.