Weekend Discussion Thread 3/24-26/2012

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  • #441
Oops, cross-posted with Dilbert.

I just read through that last part of the transcript. This part is rich:

Rafferty tells story about a guy with bloodshot eyes coming up to him in Canadian tire and asking about TLM, saying it "threw him for a whirlwind". He continues:

(punctuation added, p. 40)

:aktion1:

I wondered about that too. MR claims he didn't know the guy, it will be interesting to find out if this comes up in his defence. What was his (bloodshot eyes guy) motive for approaching MR? To threaten him perhaps?

For the record, not all people in Woodstock are scary. I have lived here for 30+ yrs (aside from going to University in another city) and the only scary people I see are those hanging around the methadone clinic. (I have, although not recently, seen a few young men with blue bandanna's hanging from their back pocket, so I do think there is a gang presence here as well.)

Considering MR was new to town and that TLM and her mom were of the few people he knew here, then I'd tend to agree with him, those two are very scary people indeed.

MOO
 
  • #442
Oops, cross-posted with Dilbert.

I just read through that last part of the transcript. This part is rich:

Rafferty tells story about a guy with bloodshot eyes coming up to him in Canadian tire and asking about TLM, saying it "threw him for a whirlwind". He continues:

(punctuation added, p. 40)

:aktion1:

With the talk about the crazy-looking guy and the one he met at home depot and all the girls he talked about and TLM and this and that, doesn't it give you the impression he is trying steer LE from asking him questions and maybe responding to questions about Tori? He appears very uncomfortable (keeps calling her 'that girl") around questions about Tori.
 
  • #443
Had lunch with a friend today and was discussing the forensic evidence. She brought up a great point, and was really doubtful too that the Crown has much more DNA evidence than two types of blood identified as being on the gym bag. The term "mixture" is a strange one - to my mind mixture means "combination" like a cake batter. I think that the Crown may have used the word "mixture' for its effect on the jury so that they form in their minds that bliood from each party was mixed with that of the other.

I would take it to mean that the blood of two people was mixed before it was deposited on the gym bag, as opposed to blood deposited by one person, then more blood deposited by another on top of it. I.e., whoever touched the gym bag would have had two types of blood on their hands.
 
  • #444
LMAO! Didn't TM say too about Carol that she was all wierd and "twitchy'? No wonder she didn't want to breed her dog with theirs ... goodness knows what the result would have been. Oh My!!!

From the pictures I've seen with CM's dog, they appeared to be a bit neglected and very dirty. Who knows if they had fleas, or whatever other thingies, and also they may not even have been full breed.
 
  • #445
:woohoo: If that was the case, thank goodness for a woman scorned. JMHO. As much as I loathe TLM, I'm elated she had some decency to help LE to bring Tori home and capture the instigator of this case. JMHO again. :rocker:


I thought that TLM testified that she and MR hadn't had the "exclusivity talk" so it wouldn't have been that much of a shock to her that he was seeing someone else IMO. Whether it ticked her off is another question tho ... enough to blame him for her evil deed for the next two years? Enough to go to her own trial and be sentenced on an Agreed Statement of Facts that was totally untrue??? Nothing worse would have happened to her at that time - she still got the maximum sentence. No matter which way you cut it, MR sat in custody for two years while she clammed up about what she had done - she could have straightened that part out at any time prior to her admitting that she and not MR murdered that tiny little girl! That doesn't make her any more decent in my book - still just a self-serving liar that took revenge from her cell by accusing MR of kidnapping she was recorded doing and a murder she herself committed. Still the same two-faced little witch that spoke at her own trial about how remorseful she was, how she would give her own life to have TS back, and how much she enjoyed the time the two of them spent togtether??? Oh no, I am not prepared to allow her any decency or gratitude at all since I am convinced that LE would have been successful finding TS utilizing other methods.

JMO
 
  • #446
I find it a little troublesome believing that MTR (alleged my TLM to be the manipulator) deliberately chose TLM because of her shady criminal past, unstable life, and drug addiction, as his confidante and partner in a crime this horrendous...............and then would "hope" he could count on her silence for the rest of his life..........especially when it was apparent he wanted nothing to do with her after the terrible event.

Wouldn't he worry she would be arrested "yet again" for something and reveal the sordid story.......perhaps even in a plea bargain?

He wouldn't worry she might confide in a jailhouse pal?

Or she might find religion and confess?

If he believed all that, he was not only evil...........but really, really, stupid.
 
  • #447
Had lunch with a friend today and was discussing the forensic evidence. She brought up a great point, and was really doubtful too that the Crown has much more DNA evidence than two types of blood identified as being on the gym bag. The term "mixture" is a strange one - to my mind mixture means "combination" like a cake batter. I think that the Crown may have used the word "mixture' for its effect on the jury so that they form in their minds that bliood from each party was mixed with that of the other. We will not know until the forensics report comes in if perhaps TS blood was found on the outside of the bag, and blood from MR found in a different place on the bag? Or the amount of blood found from each donor? In any case, with all the pulling and shoving of clothes and shoes in and out of the gym bag (if what TLM said is true) then transference is always an option. It may well be that while LE found the gym bag in the "back" of MR's car (since there was no back seat) that the bag would normally have resided in the trunk of that car. TLM never did mention anything about a gym bag being back there - only water bottles. What if MR cut himself taking out the backseat and some of this blood got on the gym bag at that time??? Now if the Crown had noted that two types of blood were found on each of the gym bag and the black coat, I might be more convinced that there was additional forensic evidence to be seen.

I do not think that too much evidence by way of DNA etc would have been found on TS' remains (the poor baby!) ... it was way too long til she was found. The length of time also makes me doubt that there will be any evidence of sexual abuse as TLM described or semen.

JMO

That's exactly what I am afraid of. There is still more to come, but right now I'm not sure if will have anything beyond TLM's word that MTR raped Tori.
 
  • #448
With regards to the "recent" drug debt theory by the defense, if memory serves me correctly a similar theory was the focus of LE in the early days of the investigation..............so the theory isn't new or unusual as some may believe.
 
  • #449
Don't gangbangers adhere to a no snitching policy in general? Maybe he thought she would never rat on him. JMO
 
  • #450
That's exactly what I am afraid of. There is still more to come, but right now I'm not sure if the Crown will have anything beyond TLM's word that MTR raped Tori.

That is what I'm afraid of. Theres still more to come, but right now it doesn't look like the Crown has much to support the rape charge beyond TLM's testimony.
 
  • #451
I would take it to mean that the blood of two people was mixed before it was deposited on the gym bag, as opposed to blood deposited by one person, then more blood deposited by another on top of it. I.e., whoever touched the gym bag would have had two types of blood on their hands.

I agree with your interpretation of "mixture" as well - thanks. I still wonder if the Crown worded it that way for effect (every single word in opening statements is carefully thought out and chosen before hand) to give that impression when, in fact, there may have been two drops of blood - one from each - on opposite ends of the gym bag? Perception is not always reality.
 
  • #452
What was the reason given for no Amber Alert being issued?

LE believed the situation would be resolved, IIRC.

I also recall in the aftermath of questions on the lack of an Amber Alert, LE saying that an Amber Alert would have been ineffective because VS died almost immediately upon entering the car. Where did that theory come from?

<modsnip>.

IMO...............there is more to this story than is being revealed. It seems like everyone involved is covering up something.

Sadly, RS may be right and the truth may never be fully known.

JMO
 
  • #453
What was the reason given for no Amber Alert being issued?

LE believed the situation would be resolved, IIRC.

I also recall in the aftermath of questions on the lack of an Amber Alert, LE saying that an Amber Alert would have been ineffective because VS died almost immediately upon entering the car. Where did that theory come from?

<modsnip>.

IMO...............there is more to this story than is being revealed. It seems like everyone involved is covering up something.

Sadly, RS may be right and the truth may never be fully known.

JMO

this did not meet the criteria for an amber alert..

-no car
-no description of a possible abductor

the only info they had was a description of VS
 
  • #454
I would take it to mean that the blood of two people was mixed before it was deposited on the gym bag, as opposed to blood deposited by one person, then more blood deposited by another on top of it. I.e., whoever touched the gym bag would have had two types of blood on their hands.
That's what I think too, but only because I've heard of mixtures of blood being entered into evidence in other cases.
 
  • #455
I<modsnip> I wonder if the defence will bring any of that up as a means to create reasonable doubt?

MOO

No doubt the Crown will do all they can to discredit the "drug theory" of the defense, so I suspect the defense may present information that shows LE had at least one similar theory early in the investigation. JMO
 
  • #456
That's exactly what I am afraid of. There is still more to come, but right now I'm not sure if will have anything beyond TLM's word that MTR raped Tori.

I'm thinking there was some evidence on TS's body. The charge is sexual assault with bodily harm, right? If there was no evidence of the harm and they only had TLM's word, I don't think they would have charged the "bodily harm" part.

Salem
 
  • #457
Don't gangbangers adhere to a no snitching policy in general? Maybe he thought she would never rat on him. JMO

I am thinking it is more than likely he thought that she would never rat on herself! As it turns out, TLM murdered TS with a hammer (I still shudder at that) - he may have thought that the chances of her confessing that she is a murderess were slim to none. As it turned out, he didn't smell a rat lol.
 
  • #458
TLM confessed as if she was a naive young girl victimized by a muliputive child predator.

&#8220;He knew what he was doing,&#8221; says McClintic on the tape. &#8220;There was no, like, blood splatter.&#8221;

We now know she was more likely the aggressor, it doesn't mean he is innocent but he may not be the evil hunter of children she once lead us to believe.




http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/03/22/terri-lynne-mcclintic-tori-stafford-video/
 
  • #459
Checking with wreckers to find a backseat could be just what he was doing swedie. He knew that LE had already seen the car in his driveway, it was mentioned in that interview.

According to his friend and his girlfriend who were posting on here at the beginning of the case, the backseat was missing within a couple of weeks of the abduction.

I believe his friend Wendell indicated that it was not there on May 7th when she saw him for the first time after the abduction. And his girlfriend never knew the car to have a backseat.

Remember that is bench only. The back of the seat was still intact.

MOO

Does anyone think it is possible MTR was on WS giving mis-information? IMO or perhaps other popular websites?
 
  • #460
this did not meet the criteria for an amber alert..

-no car
-no description of a possible abductor

the only info they had was a description of VS

A description of VS was all they needed.........and a description of the victim is often all there is.
 
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