What makes you think Terri Horman is innocent?

[SleuthyGal]

Guilty of what, exactly?

Do we know if Kyron is deceased? No we don't.

Do we know what happened to Kyron? No we don't.

Do we know that TMH is involved in Kyron's disappearance? No we don't. We may suspect, but we don't know for sure.

The title of this thread is misleading. TMH is 'innocent' by the very virtue of the fact that:

- Kyron has not been declared dead
- No one is able to say with certainty and knowledge what happened to Kyron
- Proof of TMH trying to hire a hitman to kill her husband has not been accomplished by LE
- There are more rumors than facts in this case, by an order of magnitude!

How about 'convicting' on facts instead of rumors? Which means....we'll have to wait for the facts to emerge.

 

[CarmelEyesD]

Again. it seems to me that everyone is so focused on TH, that -if there were another suspect-he/she has gotten away. I cannot rule out a predator who took advantage of a busy hectic school morning. It seems the finger has been pointing to TH from the first, and I am not sure why, as we have seen no concrete evidence. Rumors of cell phone pings, saying she wasn't where she said? Might convince me she has a 'secret' friend-doesn't convince me of murder.
A landscaper saying 'she wanted to hire me as a hitman"? Could be a set up, could be a plant, and absolutely is a he said/she said.
Some posting on Facebook people didn't like? She wasn't talking to us-she was communicating to friends. We don't know anything of what was in her mind, or the reasons for her comments, other than communicating with her friends. To communicate with them. Not to please the world. She closed her FB pretty quick-I don't think she realized how many people would be jumping to it, and dissecting her pics, her comments, and everything else about her. ( I know if anything ever happened in my family, the first thing I would do is close my FB and advise everyone in my family to do the same. Reasons as shown above.)
Being the last one to see him? I would hate to think I could take my 6 year old grandaughter to school, and if she happened to be kidnapped by a SO or predator that morning...maybe from the playground, maybe from the children's bathroom-that I would be considered a suspect in her death/disappearance, simply because I took her to school. As predators become more desperate, there may be more children kidnapped from busy school days or playgrounds or field trips. We already know they can be kidnapped from shopping malls. We already know that if a predator has a chance, he will take it-and a crowded busy chaotic location is the best place for them to do it. Summer lakes and ponds, swimming pools, playgrounds and parks, and yes-school functions. Where else would you be if you are a predator? You will be where the children are, preferably on the busiest most chaotic day there is.
Granted, there must be info we don't have. But if it is of the nature we have already seen, I am not convinced that TH is a prime suspect.
If someone is going to accuse me of a crime, you bet I am going to hire a criminal attorney right away. Even if I am innocent.
It just seems 'too pat'...too easy. All the fingers pointing at TH, right from the beginning, with nothing to truly stand out as evidence or proof. The way she talks, walks, stands, or blinks is not enough for me to accuse and convict someone as a murderer. A mom who kept a clean home, raised children, appeared to be loving and caring-all of a sudden thrown away in the collective opinion she is guilty, before any evidence at all was shown...doesn't make sense to me. It still doesn't.

And if it wasn't her, who was it? Where is he now? Where is Kyron?
JMO

 

[cluciano63]

I think many people would like to think Terri has some degree of involvement, as that might gie Kyron a slightly better chance of being found alive. If a stranger took him, the odds are against him.

But I can't buy into the accomplice theory after nearly 5 weeks; LE has at their disposal all kinds of resources, techology we don't even know about and I find it hard to comprehend that they would not be able to track down this person, who must have had some contact with Terri prior to June 4. And I also don't see that anyone (alleged accomplice) would be prepared for this, whatever it is, to go on for so long, to be able to maintain and contain a living child old enough to ID his captor.

So I kind of want it to be Terri, if that gives Kyron a better chance of survival.

 

[cypress]

Guilty of what, exactly?

Do we know if Kyron is deceased? No we don't.

Do we know what happened to Kyron? No we don't.

Do we know that TMH is involved in Kyron's disappearance? No we don't. We may suspect, but we don't know for sure.

The title of this thread is misleading. TMH is 'innocent' by the very virtue of the fact that:

- Kyron has not been declared dead
- No one is able to say with certainty and knowledge what happened to Kyron
- Proof of TMH trying to hire a hitman to kill her husband has not been accomplished by LE
- There are more rumors than facts in this case, by an order of magnitude!

How about 'convicting' on facts instead of rumors? Which means....we'll have to wait for the facts to emerge.

Having followed this case from the beginning, there is already an overwhelming conviction by public opinion. The title of this thread is in response to that widely expressed belief.

Having said that, I don't mind changing the title of the thread if some feel it is misleading.

 

[rosiebean]

There is a huge difference between engaging in a witch hunt and being so lazy that they dont even lift the rug to see what is under it.
I am just saying that LE has made so many errors in so many classes. EXAMPLE: KC Anthony's car should have been confiscated by LE immediately. Case and point.

I do not think they are always right ether, I do not automatically think they are cops so they are ethical and diligent.
I wait, I look, and I read. So far I can't say TH is guilty or innocent. I DO say I dont want to see them have a person of interest and stop looking elsewhere too.

I do not see LE being lazy in this investigation. In the first two plus weeks of the investigation, LE was very publicly pursuing multiple avenues. There were the searches around the school just in case Kyron had wandered off. I forget the number of detectives I read were assigned to the case, but it was a ridiculous (i.e., huge) amount...and they were tasked with checking leads and tips. Nothing I've seen or heard has lead me to think that the investigators were less than thorough OR that the sheriff's department tasked with coordinating everyone has a reputation for shoddy LE work.

Should evidence arise that LE has been less than thorough, I'll be the first to question everything they have said and done about this case. But until then, I am not going to assume that they've been lazy or sloppy just because some investigators were in other cases. For every mistake made in one case, I can point you to twenty things done right in other cases.

Given what is in the public domain, I would not convict TH. However, given what is in the public domain, I likewise do not think it fair to think that TH is being scapegoated or that LE's looking into her is unjust.

 

[cypress]

Mods, I apologize if this is not a palatable thread title, but it is in response to the widely held belief Terri is guilty and the public expression of that belief. Feel free to change this thread title to a more palatable title if you see fit.

Perhaps, "Why you don't believe Terri is involved in Kyron's disappearance?"

 

[cluciano63]

PS- to be fair, the thread title just asks a question...it does not state anything.

 

[CarmelEyesD]

I think many people would like to think Terri has some degree of involvement, as that might gie Kyron a slightly better chance of being found alive. If a stranger took him, the odds are against him.

But I can't buy into the accomplice theory after nearly 5 weeks; LE has at their disposal all kinds of resources, techology we don't even know about and I find it hard to comprehend that they would not be able to track down this person, who must have had some contact with Terri prior to June 4. And I also don't see that anyone (alleged accomplice) would be prepared for this, whatever it is, to go on for so long, to be able to maintain and contain a living child old enough to ID his captor.

So I kind of want it to be Terri, if that gives Kyron a better chance of survival.

A strong male predator who blended in, or was known and considered safe, would not have needed an accomplice. He could also have done what he needed to do, disposed of the child and not ever have been noticed...in his current life (returned to work, home etc) ( ETA also strong female. )

A stranger might normally stand out, but perhaps not on a parent visit daay-aunts uncles family friends etc...but someone who appeared to be local, or even is local..not so much. "Who was that guy? Wasn't that Evan's grandpa? NO? Oh maybe it was Sally's grandpa" etc...

 

[Jaxson]

I think we could replace Terri with any number of people as the last to see him and they would be just as guilty because of the way they acted, didn't act, what they said or didn't say, where they were or were not. All I can see as evidence against Terri is that SHE was the last one to see him (according to?) If a person left Medford in the am and hit Portland at 5 hrs later Kyron could be back in Medford by 2 or 3 in the afternoon. How guilty would we see Desiree appearing (like over doing the emotion) if that were the case. I am in NO way thinking this is the case. I just wanted to give an example.

 

[T-Rex]

Good point: Big coincidence that it happened on the one day when the school was filled with unmonitored strangers.

 

[mrsjonnob]

I was largely Team Terri until the story of hit for hire broke. If that is proven false, then I will resume my support for Terri... but with a murder for hire sub story, it just doesn't look good for Terri

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Having followed this case from the beginning, there is already an overwhelming conviction by public opinion. The title of this thread is in response to that widely expressed belief.

Having said that, I don't mind changing the title of the thread if some feel it is misleading.

I think it's fine.

 

[rosiebean]

ETA: Also, having a "deceptive" answer on the polygraph doesn't do it for me either.. There are a number of reasons why she could have lied about where she was that day... maybe she WAS trying to hide something that she didn't want made public... not necessarily anything to do with Kyron.

This is one thing I cannot get my mind around...why on earth would anyone lie about where they were when a child is missing? Sorry, no matter what the relation of the child to me, no matter how embarrassing my actions (and I've done some embarrassing stuff) I just cannot fathom lying...and continuing to lie, given that LE seems to still not have an accurate timeline of her morning...when that lie is distracting LE from finding that child. Nope, just can't fathom it. That's one of the main sticking points in all of this for me.

If my child were missing, I'd be balled up on the floor screaming.. or running to the end of the Earth to find them... BUT, if it were my stepchild, sadly, I must admit that I wouldn't be quite as upset. I'd be upset.. don't get me wrong. Maybe I'm a sociopath too...

This is one thing I can agree on. Early on, I said that it was unfair to compare TH's behavior with Kyron's natural parents. I've known stepparents who loved their children as their own. I've known stepparents who didn't have the same attachment (even those who were involved with stepchildren from an early age), but still did their absolute best to be a loving parent to them. Not having the same attachment to a stepchild as to a natural child is very normal IMO. There's a strong bond, sometimes, but it's not something that can be assumed.

I feel absolutely horrible for Terri... and I hope they can find Kyron and clear Terri so she can get her little girl back.

I don't. Maybe that makes me mean or whatever, but with what I know now...knowing that LE is having a hard time with her story and knowing that she is a focus of their attention, I am withholding any pity for her...and for most of the players in this mess. The main person I feel absolutely horrible for is Kyron.

 

[CarmelEyesD]

We need to remember everyone handles, processes, and shows grief and panic in different ways. Some people don't cry-it doesn't make than sociopathic..in my case it was beaten out of me when I was little. I simply do not cry in front of anyone, never mind camera's. I cry alone, in private. Some people scream, run pull out hair etc. Some people get very quiet and introspective. We have no idea what kind of fear, panic or grief TH felt, simply by watching the PC(s). She may have been intimidated by the camera's the media and they eyes of the world. She may have been concentrating totally on comforting the others. If that is her 'normal' personality. (Some people give, some people take". ) She may have been advised to keep her emotions tightly controlled or concealed. We just don't know. She may have been afraid to 'crack' a little bit, to give in to any panic or fear or grief, for fear of it overtaking her. As some have pointed out, she already knew fingers were being pointed at her...that would make me very uncomfortable. especially if I knew I was innocent.(I have claustrophobia-I can tell you how uncomfortable I would look if I was up there, especially in a small room.) It wouldn't make me guilty. To me, Terri looked very worried...but was she worried for herself? Or was she mentally going over every aspect of the day Kyron disappeared, every friend she knew, every person she had talked to in the past few weeks? Was she worried because this was becoming real? unable to be denied, as is the first instinct? Was she quiet because she had been asked not to talk? Was she quiet because she was guilty? Was she quiet because she thought if she spoke, it might hinder Kyron returning? If I recall correctly, they were ALL quiet the first couple if weeks. If Terri did this, I just want more concrete evidence-I want a smoking gun...


ETA Do we know absolutely that she had deceptive answers on her LDT? Or is that rumors? Has LE confirmed that? ( Although I must add, she may have thought Kyron would turn up, and IF she had a secret-a friend or whatever) that she didn't want anyone to know about (as in 'ruining her marriage' it may have been her first instinct to lie...not saying that is ok, just that people do that...JMO

 

[sorrell skye]

Having followed this case from the beginning, there is already an overwhelming conviction by public opinion. The title of this thread is in response to that widely expressed belief.

Having said that, I don't mind changing the title of the thread if some feel it is misleading.

I don't find the title of the thread misleading at all.

 

[DairyGirl]

I think many people would like to think Terri has some degree of involvement, as that might gie Kyron a slightly better chance of being found alive. If a stranger took him, the odds are against him.

But I can't buy into the accomplice theory after nearly 5 weeks; LE has at their disposal all kinds of resources, techology we don't even know about and I find it hard to comprehend that they would not be able to track down this person, who must have had some contact with Terri prior to June 4. And I also don't see that anyone (alleged accomplice) would be prepared for this, whatever it is, to go on for so long, to be able to maintain and contain a living child old enough to ID his captor.

So I kind of want it to be Terri, if that gives Kyron a better chance of survival.

The only way Kyron could be alive would be if TH had an accomplice. And like you I can't buy into the accomplice theory. They located a landscaper that she had talked to 7 months earlier. I am sure if there was an accomplice they would have found him.
As to this thread, like I said, I believe TH is innocent, legally. That doesn't mean I don't think she was involved, just that legally there is no way she could be convicted with what they have.

 

[sorrell skye]

A strong male predator who blended in, or was known and considered safe, would not have needed an accomplice. He could also have done what he needed to do, disposed of the child and not ever have been noticed...in his current life (returned to work, home etc) ( ETA also strong female. )

A stranger might normally stand out, but perhaps not on a parent visit daay-aunts uncles family friends etc...but someone who appeared to be local, or even is local..not so much. "Who was that guy? Wasn't that Evan's grandpa? NO? Oh maybe it was Sally's grandpa" etc...

ITA, it could have been anyone who had a legitimate reason for being @ the school that day - or even someone who had no reason to be there whatsoever.

The "profile" of a child predator has been inaccurately sensationalized by the media - leading some to believe that a predator has to be a creepy stranger lurking in the shadows. Sometimes it is, but more often it's not. A predator can be anyone - but statistics have shown that they often seek out occupations/settings/events/locations that give them easier access to their victims.

A child predator can also be a friend/acquaintance/family member/or otherwise "trusted" person.

TH was only one of the many people @ the school that day.

I wonder how thoroughly LE has looked into everyone else who was on that campus on June 4th.

 

[Lavender]

Thank you for this thread. Here are the reasons why I think it's possible that TH is not involved:

1. No witnesses saying they saw her leave alone, without Kyron. She could have “created” witnesses by making sure people saw her leave alone. This holds true for an accomplice situation or a DIY situation. This seems like the #1 thing you'd want to do in order to remove suspicion from yourself, and it would have been within her control to make sure people saw her leave alone.

2. No photos from the expo of Kyron with lots of other adults, or TH with Kyron. She could have created a lot of photographic evidence that he was seen by others, and when he was seen, when she was seen, etc. The photos I've seen don't look like "alibli" photos.

3. If TH harmed Kyron, it seems that she has to be shoe-horned into motives where TH is made out to be a narcissistic, greedy, heartless, psychopathic, vengeful person. And evil, to boot. I don’t see any evidence of that.

4. Didn’t lawyer-up until KH took Baby K and was served with divorce papers and RO. Voluntarily took polygraphs without a lawyer, cooperated with LE by all LE accounts.

5. Too many situations created by LE that make her look guilty. Not saying it was purposeful. But I think it has happened, imo, and has created circular reasoning. Examples:

LE: Tells the family to get out and do normal things (And I don’t think they did this for their health. LE was living with people they might later arrest and they needed them to leave the house in case a defense attorney later tried to claim the family didn’t feel free to leave the presence of LE.)
Public: TH is doing normal things, therefore she must be guilty.

LE: Tells KH about a plot to kill him. KH takes Baby K and gets RO, presumably based on plot to kill him.
Public: Judge granted RO, therefore TH must be dangerous.

LE: Wires up lawn boy for a sting and it gets leaked to press.
Public: TH tried a MFH plot, therefore is capable of anything, even murdering a child.

LE: Distributes a flyer with TH’s picture and her truck.
Public: TH must be a suspect because LE distributed this flyer.

LE: Appears to believe TH is guilty, so LE tells public that this was an isolated incident.
Public: If it’s isolated, then it must be a family member. Therefore TH must have done it.

6. Connect the dots…but only use these dots. I think there are too many early statements regarding where TH and Kyron were spotted at the school that aren’t mentioned anymore. (The 9:00 sighting by the South door, Little T’s accounts to the press, etc.) If we’re being asked to connect the dots, I wish LE would tell us why certain dots have been removed.

I'm sure that LE has dots we don't know about, but I can't help but doubt many of the dots that we have been given and asked to connect together.

 

[Chili Fries]

This is one thing I cannot get my mind around...why on earth would anyone lie about where they were when a child is missing? Sorry, no matter what the relation of the child to me, no matter how embarrassing my actions (and I've done some embarrassing stuff) I just cannot fathom lying...and continuing to lie, given that LE seems to still not have an accurate timeline of her morning...when that lie is distracting LE from finding that child. Nope, just can't fathom it. That's one of the main sticking points in all of this for me.

Yeah me too. It seemed to me like the hunt for Kyron changed from mostly a SAR operation to a definitively criminal investigation very abruptly. I think LE uncovered something they think significantly called her story into question (cell pings?), which shifted the focus directly on Terri.

Like others have talked about I think it's important to proceed from an assumption of total innocence toward guilt. What we know about the investigation makes me take the possibility of her guilt seriously but my mind is open.

 

[gibby207]

i dont know. i thought casey was guilty of killing caylee the minute the story broke.

and caylee wouldnt be found for another 5 months yet.

i just dont know if anything is certian about this case at all

The first day Kyron was missing, I said "stepmother." I dunno why I said that... maybe it's the last couple of years I've spent on WS but it was more of a gut feeling I think. Nothing is certain, of course... and I'm not a big vilifier. I DO see where the dominos are lining up. And I appreciate the science of it all: Look at the person who last saw the victim and branch out. It's not always cut and dry like that, but usually is. There are no absolutes in crime, there are no absolutes in abduction/kidnapping, and there are no absolutes in murder. I would say, based on a layman's opinion such as I, it's not looking good for Terri at this moment.