What steps should be taken to protect kids from being left in a car.

[CHERIE.T]

Thanks for your reply. I see that your proposed law would make it a felony to not look to see if a child is left behind in a car. You don't mention if any physical harm must occur to the child for it to be a felony only that the person didn't look.

What about people who get caught speeding with small children on board, should that be a felony? How about unsafe lane changes or failure to make a complete stop at a stop sign with small children on board? All of those acts are dangerous and could cause great bodily harm to kids. Should they become felonies also, regardless of any actual harm done to a child.

I'm not sure how far we should go with this. JMO.

Not that far.

 

[gngr~snap]

I think it would be good for society if we took a NO EXCUSES stance on kids dying in cars. Sorry, no excuses allowed. Automatic penalty. Does not matter WHY you forgot. Too bad, too late, JAIL TIME. :jail:

I am on board with this.

ANYONE caught gets arrested. Kids taken away.
Child deceased, automatic sentence no excuse.
Leaving a child locked in a carseat... unable to escape is just like throwing them over a bridge into the river.

Only 1 difference, it is death in slow-mo.

If there is no law, then there are no consequences.

Laws perk me right up.

For instance, when I get a speeding ticket, it sure makes me drive the speed limit for years later.

If people hear there are convictions for leaving a child in a car, I bet there will be more care taken to make sure that does not happen.

Obviously no law stops anything, but I bet in some cases it helps.

If I knew I was going yo jail PERIOD if I leave a child in my car, I'm checking it 3x.

All posts are MOO

 

[krkrjx]

Thanks for your reply. I see that your proposed law would make it a felony to not look to see if a child is left behind in a car. You don't mention if any physical harm must occur to the child for it to be a felony only that the person didn't look.

What about people who get caught speeding with small children on board, should that be a felony? How about unsafe lane changes or failure to make a complete stop at a stop sign with small children on board? All of those acts are dangerous and could cause great bodily harm to kids. Should they become felonies also, regardless of any actual harm done to a child.

I'm not sure how far we should go with this. JMO.

No, we cannot legislate against every possible situation where a child could be harmed.

But forgetting a child in a car is totally preventable. Look before you lock. It's really that easy.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

I think it is kind of like what has slowly happened in society, concerning pool deaths. When I was a kid, in the 50's and 60's, if a child died in the pool, people thought, OH WELLL, too bad. What a shame. But no one was expected to have pool covers, alarms, locked gates on their pools, or be prosecuted. Now we expect that you will be sued civilly or arrested if a child dies in your pool or jacuzzi or pond.

I hope that happens with car deaths as well. It should not be tolerated. It is not that hard to turn your head to check the car seat. It really isn't. SMH

If a child is killed or harmed then yes, there should be severe penalties that correspond to the crime. It doesn't matter to me if it's forgetting you left your child in the car or you forgot to check if it was safe to make a lane change. If a child is hurt or killed it's a serious matter. JMO.

 

[gngr~snap]

But people who do this on purpose and try to say it was an accident won't have employed any self-initiated safeguards. In fact they are counting on crying "whoops" and getting away with it because the precedent has been set.

However, a law which assures prosecution for "forgetting" may just cut down on the car death "epidemic".

You can bet it will.
Didn't requiring helmets when kids ride bikes change the death rates from bike wrecks?

It dropped 20%-60% depending on the state IIRC.

All posts are MOO

 

[Deleted member 39678]

No, we cannot legislate against every possible situation where a child could be harmed.

But forgetting a child in a car is totally preventable. Look before you lock. It's really that easy.

I think that driving at unsafe speeds is easily preventable because all car have speedometers. You simply look at it and see that your going the speed limit or not. I thought that the idea of your new law was to make the not looking before you lock a felony so that it would be a deterrent. Why not make all dangerous behaviors felonies? MOO.

 

[gngr~snap]

For over a month I've been racking my brain. I can not give into this FBS.
No.
No way. If a PARENT "forgets" their child long enough for them to die, they need to do the time.
I was taught from day 1 to keep a neat car. We always empty the car out every time we stop. I have always checked the back seat and floor before locking it.
Back in the day having to physically lock all 4 doors helped.

All posts are MOO

 

[al66pine]

krkrjx --- thx for the great idea for the thread.
Thought it might be helpful to post about -----Scope of Issue, how many children affected
then State Laws re Leaving Child in Car, coming up in next post
al66pine
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Heatstroke Deaths of
Children in Vehicles
by Jan Null, CCM
Department of Earth & Climate Sciences
San Francisco State University
Updated July 25, 2014

STATISTICS​

• Total number of U.S. heatstroke deaths of children left in cars, 2014: 18
• Total number of U.S. heatstroke deaths of children left in cars, 2013: 44
• Total number of U.S. heatstroke deaths of children left in cars, 1998-present: 624
• Average number of U.S. child heatstroke fatalities per year since 1998:38
• See Monthly Statistics
• See Per Capita Deaths by State

Circumstances

• • 
    An examination of media reports about the 606 child vehicular heatstroke deaths for an fourteen year period (1998 through 2013) shows the following circumstances:
    • 51% - child "forgotten" by caregiver (312 Children)
    • 29% - child playing in unattended vehicle (177)
    • 18% - child intentionally left in vehicle by adult (111)
    • 1% - circumstances unknown (6)
• Demographics of Persons Responsible for Heatstroke Deaths of Children Forgotten in Vehicles.
• 
  Ages
  The children that have died from vehicular heatstroke in the United States (1998-2013) have ranged in age from 5 days to 14 years. More than half of the deaths are children under 2 years of age. Below are the percentage of total deaths (and the number of deaths) sorted by age.
  [TABLE="width: 948"]
  [TR]
  [TD="class: style9"]
  • Less than 1 year old = 31% (184)
  • 1-year old = 22% (134)
  • 2-years old = 20% (118)
  • 3-years old = 14% (84)
  • 4-years old = 6% (35)
  [/TD]
  [TD]
  • 5-years old = 3% (19)
  • 6-years old = 2% (9)
  • 7-years old = < 1% (3)
  • 8-years old = 1% (3)
  • 9-years old = < 1% (2)
  [/TD]
  [TD]
  • 10-years old = 1% (3)
  • 11-years old = < 1% (2)
  • 12-years old = < 1% (1)
  • 13-years old = < 1% (1)
  • 14-years old = < 1% (3)
  • Unknown = < 1% (2)
  [/TD]
  [/TR]
  [/TABLE]

. How can I use your statistics on my own website?The information and statistics from this website ( http://ggweather.com/heat ) may only be used if full attribtuion is given to the source, plus a link back to the original data. This data changes frequently and it should be ensured that users can gain access to the most accurate and up-to-date information. Please use "Source: Jan Null, CCM, Department of Geoscience, San Francisco State University, [url]http://ggweather.com/heat/[/URL] ".

 

[Donjeta]

So what if someone fails to look before they lock, and it's a felony, is it automatic jail time even if they haven't forgotten a child in, and never transport children?

 

[CHERIE.T]

For over a month I've been racking my brain. I can not give into this FBS.
No.
No way. If a PARENT "forgets" their child long enough for them to die, they need to do the time.
I was taught from day 1 to keep a neat car. We always empty the car out every time we stop. I have always checked the back seat and floor before locking it.
Back in the day having to physically lock all 4 doors helped.

All posts are MOO

DAM m'am , tell it like it is.
You know this is not a joking matter ..... like some are trying to make it!

 

[Deleted member 39678]

DAM m'am , tell it like it is.
You know this is not a joking matter ..... like some are trying to make it!

I hope that no one here at WS is trying to make this a joking matter. That sounds like what happens on Facebook which I despise.

 

[al66pine]

more from http://ggweather.com/heat/index.htm, a virtual encyclopedia on this sad subject

child hyperthermia deaths in cars

ETA: Seems like some of the text, tables, maps are not copying properly. visit the above link for a ton of info.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

LEGAL

Only 20 states have laws specifically addressing leaving a child unattended in a vehicle.
(ETA: Go to link and click for state laws on subject).
​

[TABLE="width: 1027"]
[TR]
[TD]

• Only 20 states have laws specifically addressing leaving a child unattended in a vehicle.

The remaining 30 states do not have laws specifically against leaving a child unattended in a vehicle

• Another 14 states have had previously proposed unattended child laws
• An Associated Press (AP) study "Wide disparity exists in sentences for leaving kids to die in hot cars" examined both the frequency of prosecutions and length of sentences in hyperthermia deaths
  - Charges were files in 49% of all the deaths. 81% resulted in convictions.
  - In cases with paid caregivers (i.e., childcare workers, babysitters) 84% were charged and 96% convicted
  - Only 7% of the cases involved drugs or alcohol
  
  Good Samaritan Laws may protect persons who see a child in a car and take action to render assistance.
  
  ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  . How can I use your statistics on my own website?

The information and statistics from this website ( http://ggweather.com/heat ) may only be used if full attribtuion is given to the source, plus a link back to the original data. This data changes frequently and it should be ensured that users can gain access to the most accurate and up-to-date information. Please use "Source: Jan Null, CCM, Department of Geoscience, San Francisco State University, http://ggweather.com/heat/ ".

 

[krkrjx]

I think that driving at unsafe speeds is easily preventable because all car have speedometers. You simply look at it and see that your going the speed limit or not. I thought that the idea of your new law was to make the not looking before you lock a felony so that it would be a deterrent. Why not make all dangerous behaviors felonies? MOO.

Actually, I think a look before you lock law would be not so much a deterrent but more a reason for people to get into the habit of looking.

Not all laws are oppressive. Some are actually good for us. Most parents will adopt the look before you lock practice on their own; many probably already have. There needs to be consequences for those who don't and then "forget" their child in a car and it needs to happen even if there is no proof of intent. JMO.

 

[CHERIE.T]

I hope that no one here at WS is trying to make this a joking matter. That sounds like what happens on Facebook which I despise.

I don't do FB crime or missing pages
thanks.
Seriously Your above post with all the examples wasn't to be taken as factual conditions for laws was it?
I took it as being said with a bit of sarcasm/ wit.

 

[krkrjx]

So what if someone fails to look before they lock, and it's a felony, is it automatic jail time even if they haven't forgotten a child in, and never transport children?

Only if you park and leave a child or pet in a locked vehicle. Obviously people without kids or pets who never transport either are never going to find themselves with some explaining to do.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Actually, I think a look before you lock law would be not so much a deterrent but more a reason for people to get into the habit of looking.

Not all laws are oppressive. Some are actually good for us. Most parents will adopt the look before you lock practice on their own; many probably already have. There needs to be consequences for those who don't and then "forget" their child in a car and it needs to happen even if there is no proof of intent. JMO.

That sounds like a deterrent to me. It helps to prevent people from leaving small children in their car because they will be charged with a felony and put into prison. That's some serious consequences. But then again, the ultimate penalty,death,doesn't seem to prevent murders.

I'm just wondering about prosecuting people for felonies where there isn't any physical harm done to anyone. JMO.

 

[gngr~snap]

I didn't realize that it wasn't against the law to leave a small child unattended in a car. Is this in all states or just some? I'm not understanding the forgetting part. If someone forgets to feed their baby does that mean that there was no child abuse? I don't think so.

Or are you talking about prosecutors not prosecuting cases where the parent allegedly forgot a small child in a car? What will make prosecutors pursue cases with a new law vs what's already on the books? MOO.

Tonight on the news I heard them say in Georgia it's against the law to.leave a child in the car for more than 15 min,
hence the cops wait until the 16th min arrest the mother today for leaving her 4 children in the car.
I think they had the kids out, but mom didn't appear until 16 min....
I didn't know GA had a law!
Mom is in jail, kids 6,4,2,1in DFACS custody.


All posts are MOO

 

[Deleted member 39678]

I don't do FB crime or missing pages
thanks.
Seriously Your above post with all the examples wasn't to be taken as factual conditions for laws was it?
I took it as being said with a bit of sarcasm/ wit.

I'm being totally serious in my posting.

 

[Donjeta]

Only if you park and leave a child or pet in a locked vehicle. Obviously people without kids or pets who never transport either are never going to find themselves with some explaining to do.

Oh but then I don't think the law will work very well to instill habits of locking. if everyone is required to look and check in order to pass a driving test but then it could be years before they drive kids or pets and there is never any consequences for this felony they get out of the habit easily. It's a dead letter until someone leaves a child in a car but it is already illegal to leave kids in danger, it just needs to be prosecuted.

I am not a fan of laws that make something a felony for everybody but the majority get away with the felony all the time. If the law applies only after a hot car death make the law about hot car deaths. Jmo

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Tonight on the news I heard them say in Georgia it's against the law to.leave a child in the car for more than 15 min,
hence the cops wait until the 16th min arrest the mother today for leaving her 4 children in the car.
I think they had the kids out, but mom didn't appear until 16 min....
I didn't know GA had a law!
Mom is in jail, kids 6,4,2,1in DFACS custody.


All posts are MOO

That's what I like to see. Thanks for bringing it to us. I sure hope that most states already have common sense laws like this. If they don't then that needs to be addressed. JMO.