Where the Avery Conspiracy Theory Falls Apart

[MysticJynx]

I just want to be clear I do not think the Police killed poor Teresa. But someone did. And that call to run her plates is suspicious. They had the means now to railroad him with Physical and DNA evidence something they did not have in the 1985 case against Steven for the Penny Beertsen Rape and attempted murder.

I do think they did in deed plant evidence to rid themselves of a COUNTY wide problem, Steve Avery was suing the whole County. Manitowoc County. They had fear of paying out 36million dollars. Had he won that case against the Old Sheriff and DA and County, there was probably possibility that Steven could then sue others. Such as the officers who are now having their own names dragged through the mud in the after math.

Had they found her vehicle on the 3rd they had the night of the 4th when the averys were at their cabin up north to do whatever they could. Planting the car with the blood evidence, disconnecting the battery, covering the car in an obvious way it would be found, Grabbing a burn barrel and shovel from the property (Questions about burn barrel? were the bones and the belongings found in the same barrel?) Scooping up her bones from the original burn area, bring it back and dumping into a burn pit on the property near his home, Takes the Plates put them in a station wagon closer to his property. Depending on the number of barrels used. I would suspect they used one to move her body and either a separate one to burn the rest of her stuff or they moved her body then decided to use that barrel to burn her stuff in hopes to further burn the evidence of her bones being moved. Anyone know how many barrels had evidence in them? One says the burn barrel 20 feet from his front door. but Leslie Eisenberg said that they found bones in burn barrel 2 at the back of the BJ residence.


For all I know Steven did kill her, moved all her parts to the quarry, the cops found it all and decided it would be better if this evidence was found on his property, so they moved it back. Shrugs. But being as the bones are found all over the place make me believe they were moved from the original burn area. Either way the police seems to be involved in some serious tampering of evidence and who is it that would investigate the police for these things in any other case?

 

[Madeleine74]

1. I want to know how 10 year old blood from a vial in the county clerk's office, a vial filled with EDTA, reasonably was obtained and planted in TH's SUV. Where was this planting done? When? Who was there? Where's the proof of this?

2. Show exactly where the key was that LE picked up in order to "wipe it off and then somehow get SA DNA on it." Where was that key for the cops to get in the first place?

3. If police wanted someone to find TH's SUV (that they so helpfully 'planted' on the Avery lot) where was the SUV? Who drove the SUV to the Avery yard and when? Then why did they cover the SUV with a variety of materials to try and obscure it? Why would LE remove the plates when the plates would help someone ID the vehicle? How and when did LE then 'plant' the removed and folded plates into another vehicle that was sitting between the SA and Dassey trailer?

The amount of illogical twist and loops that one has to go through to make LE the culprit in this case is mind boggling.

 

[MysticJynx]

The whole problem hinges on the Sheriff Department from Manitowoc County, had they done the right thing in the beginning, BACKING OFF, Allowing Calumet to lead the investigation and collect the evidence they would not be in the position of being question of their corruption, ethics and integrity. However on most searches of the property that produced any relevant evidence. Search teams were 3 to 1 of searching officers. The lead investigators being Calumet had one officer to the 3 common Manitowoc Sheriff Officers, Lenk, Colborn, and Remiker. Officer Tyson from Calumet is the only one who did his job when he was given this team. He did not give the opportunity for Manitowoc to plant any evidence on Nov 7th 2005. He was told to WATCH them, Babysit them. So why were they babysitting and not leading the investigations while searching the property. The investigation was supposed to be in their hands. Since they knew that they needed to be watched they should not have been on the property to compromise the other officers searching, by having to watch the ones who were not supposed to be there.

 

[Sinsaint]

1. I want to know how 10 year old blood from a vial in the county clerk's office, a vial filled with EDTA, reasonably was obtained and planted in TH's SUV. Where was this planting done? When? Who was there? Where's the proof of this?

2. Show exactly where the key was that LE picked up in order to "wipe it off and then somehow get SA DNA on it." Where was that key for the cops to get in the first place?

3. If police wanted someone to find TH's SUV (that they so helpfully 'planted' on the Avery lot) where was the SUV? Who drove the SUV to the Avery yard and when? Then why did they cover the SUV with a variety of materials to try and obscure it? Why would LE remove the plates when the plates would help someone ID the vehicle? How and when did LE then 'plant' the removed and folded plates into another vehicle that was sitting between the SA and Dassey trailer?

The amount of illogical twist and loops that one has to go through to make LE the culprit in this case is mind boggling.

Let's see... Colborn called in Halbach's plates on 11/3. She had clearly been reported missing at that point because the female operator said that on the call. Halbach's SUV was discovered on 11/5. That's roughly 48 hours in which to get Avery's blood, plant it in her SUV and transport it to the Avery junk yard.

As for the key, it along with her camera, phone and palm pilot could have been in the SUV at the time it was discovered. Either Colborn or Lenk could have removed these items to plant on the Avery property at any time and either one could have driven the SUV to the junk yard to plant it. Removing the plates seems like something the investigators would decide to do over Avery. Her license plate would be common knowledge to the public, including any of the Avery's. Leaving the plates on it would allow any of the Avery's to identify it and basically call the cops on themselves if the discovered it. However, the police didn't need those plates because the VIN would be enough to identify the SUV. And the plates weren't found in a vehicle between Avery and Dassey's homes. They were found in another vehicle in the junk yard near where the SUV was discovered.

 

[missy1974]

1. I want to know how 10 year old blood from a vial in the county clerk's office, a vial filled with EDTA, reasonably was obtained and planted in TH's SUV. Where was this planting done? When? Who was there? Where's the proof of this?

2. Show exactly where the key was that LE picked up in order to "wipe it off and then somehow get SA DNA on it." Where was that key for the cops to get in the first place?

3. If police wanted someone to find TH's SUV (that they so helpfully 'planted' on the Avery lot) where was the SUV? Who drove the SUV to the Avery yard and when? Then why did they cover the SUV with a variety of materials to try and obscure it? Why would LE remove the plates when the plates would help someone ID the vehicle? How and when did LE then 'plant' the removed and folded plates into another vehicle that was sitting between the SA and Dassey trailer?

The amount of illogical twist and loops that one has to go through to make LE the culprit in this case is mind boggling.

1. It was stated by a County Clerks employee that the box with the blood evidence was accessible and that pretty much anyone that had access to that building, including LE, had access to it. As for the opportunity to plant it.... before the 5th? while it was waiting to be taken away? before it was processed?
2. The key could have been in the SUV. Rather than ask how did SA's DNA get on it (which is extremely easy considering LE had access to the entire property during that time and IIRC I did read trial transcripts that indicate these investigators did NOT change gloves after touching every single item collected, example: processing SA's car.... then proceeding to the SUV and touching the latch WITHOUT changing gloves).... so stop and ask not how his DNA got on the key... but how in the world did TH's get OFF the key?
3. The phone call from Colborn on the 3rd of November calling in the plates sure does make some of us sceptical. Actually putting that stuff around the SUV in that junk yard probably made it stand out more than if they had just left it out in the open IMO. Why remove the plates... maybe because someone called in the plates 2 days beforehand?

as for asking about proof.... I don't need to have proof, I need to have reasonable doubt, which I do. Do I think that LE killed her? I haven't seen evidence of that, but I do think that I have reasonable doubts about the evidence in this case. That's why I'm here.... I'm not basing my opinions on a 10 hour documentary, if someone could show me more evidence that beyond a reasonable doubt LE did not plant some of (or all) of this evidence, then great! I still haven't decided whether I believe SA killed her or not, it's so clouded by what I consider "tainted" evidence, I just don't know.

I wish there were more clear answers to your questions and mine, I've been reading about this for 2+ weeks and I am still as unsure as the first day I started reading/researching.

 

[MysticJynx]

1. I want to know how 10 year old blood from a vial in the county clerk's office, a vial filled with EDTA, reasonably was obtained and planted in TH's SUV. Where was this planting done? When? Who was there? Where's the proof of this?

2. Show exactly where the key was that LE picked up in order to "wipe it off and then somehow get SA DNA on it." Where was that key for the cops to get in the first place?

3. If police wanted someone to find TH's SUV (that they so helpfully 'planted' on the Avery lot) where was the SUV? Who drove the SUV to the Avery yard and when? Then why did they cover the SUV with a variety of materials to try and obscure it? Why would LE remove the plates when the plates would help someone ID the vehicle? How and when did LE then 'plant' the removed and folded plates into another vehicle that was sitting between the SA and Dassey trailer?

The amount of illogical twist and loops that one has to go through to make LE the culprit in this case is mind boggling.

1... I think they had 36 hours to get into the clerks office tamper with the evidence take less then a milliliter of blood from that vial, and put it in the car that was found the night of Nov 3 by Colborn who called in her plates that night. After she was missing, After he knew she was by Averys place. Like I said the averys were off the property on the night of Nov 4 2005.

2..... Had they found the crime scene in the quarry where some of Teresa's bones were found, Belive it was fragments of her pelvis that was found in the quarry. There is possibly that Teresa's body had already been burned and her car parked near by, with the key, the camera, the phone, pda purse still in it. To be later placed and burned in the barrel they moved her bones with. Believe they even state there was a burnt shovel in the barrel.

3. The car was in the quarry, I believe that they moved it from there the back way into the lot. The removed the plates because he knew there would be a recording of him calling them in. If they weren't on the vehicle how could he call them in.


I have made a map of how the car could have been driven to the spot it was found...

And these are just my thoughts and opinions. Red and Yellow line would be possible back ways into the Yard.

 

[missy1974]

Wow, thanks for the map MysticJynx, I didn't realize the quarry was that far away. If I was going to burn a body and didn't want to be seen, that's where I would do it (opposed to the fire pit and burn barrel).

 

[Safeguard]

I'm pretty certain that there is a tiny % of people who believe that the police killed her. You should probably talk to them directly. Start a thread regarding the probability that LE was involved in killing TH. You could probably list all the reasons that's improbable.

The majority of us, just accept some believe that way, and pay it very little mind.

I don't think LE is above murder. Hell, you see it in the news all the time now. (Not to mention ; if we wanted to eliminate SA, we would have just killed him.) I doubt LE killed Teresa just because of the complicated evidence. Would have been easier to just dump a body on the property, plant whatever and be done.

I do think that SA was being watched, very closely, long before TH went missing. Would stand to reason, that with the depositions from the civil case rolling along, they would have had him under stealthy surveillance hoping to get him for something.

( when I was a kid/teen, the cops could beat the living crap out of ya during an "interview " and no one so much as batted an eye. It was well known, as was planting evidence on someone). A lot of LE officials do think they are above the law.

 

[MaxManning]

1... I think they had 36 hours to get into the clerks office tamper with the evidence take less then a milliliter of blood from that vial, and put it in the car that was found the night of Nov 3 by Colborn who called in her plates that night. After she was missing, After he knew she was by Averys place. Like I said the averys were off the property on the night of Nov 4 2005.

2..... Had they found the crime scene in the quarry where some of Teresa's bones were found, Belive it was fragments of her pelvis that was found in the quarry. There is possibly that Teresa's body had already been burned and her car parked near by, with the key, the camera, the phone, pda purse still in it. To be later placed and burned in the barrel they moved her bones with. Believe they even state there was a burnt shovel in the barrel.

3. The car was in the quarry, I believe that they moved it from there the back way into the lot. The removed the plates because he knew there would be a recording of him calling them in. If they weren't on the vehicle how could he call them in.


I have made a map of how the car could have been driven to the spot it was found...

And these are just my thoughts and opinions. Red and Yellow line would be possible back ways into the Yard.

Have you seen any images of the area where that pelvic bone was found ? I have been looking for images from that location and can't find anything.

 

[Madeleine74]

if someone could show me more evidence that beyond a reasonable doubt LE did not plant some of (or all) of this evidence, then great!

A negative can't be proved.

 

[MysticJynx]

Have you seen any images of the area where that pelvic bone was found ? I have been looking for images from that location and can't find anything.

No I have not but on the other thread someone posted that they did find some male DNA that is unknown at the quarry. think this is on thread 3 of the netflix thread.. All these threads are hard to keep up with.

 

[MysticJynx]

Is there away to find out if the car was in the quarry by testing those samples and not just the junk yard

 

[MaxManning]

No I have not but on the other thread someone posted that they did find some male DNA that is unknown at the quarry. think this is on thread 3 of the netflix thread.. All these threads are hard to keep up with.

It's taken me some getting used to, but I find the threads to be more organized than our old single thread for this case.

Finding male DNA at the quarry, not even sure what relevance that has, unless it was on a bone or something that can be tied to this case.

If a quarry / pelvic bone thread doesn't already exist, we should probably start one. I don't know much about that beyond a discussion on reddit about how they knew it was TH's bone.

 

[MaxManning]

Good question. Doesn't necessarily mean it got there that night, but worth questioning.

 

[Sinsaint]

Is there away to find out if the car was in the quarry by testing those samples and not just the junk yard

Looking at the aerial view of the property, I would guess the quarry. There are tests available to determine the exact make-up of dirt and where it's most likely source is.

 

[Soulmagent]

Feel free to open a thread on the topic. For me, it's not something I care to discuss. I have considered it, but I find it unlikely. If I see things that fit that theory, I'll be sure to post them.

I do see things that point to potential planting, so much more interested in exploring that possibility to find evidence that might support it or exclude it.

I went ahead and printed the lab reports out and some of the language on the report is different then other language on the report . I dont know if it is a big deal or not but when really examining the documents it does give me pause as for when item descriptions are unclear or change ever so slightly were you could assume they are talking about one thing but it really could be something else.
Has anyone else noticed any examples of this ?

One item this happens to is item BZ -Two pieces of charred apparent charred material .It is on exhibit 312.

Later the description shifts to charred remains.

I am unsure what piece of evidence this becomes at trial and the description is so that it could be applied to a number of items recovered and it listed no location of the find where in the first Lab reports reported locations were listed .

The report also has conclusion about evidence not listed as being examined on the list associated with that conclusion . In other words conclusion about evidence not listed are included without reference to them on that report.

 

[missy1974]

It's taken me some getting used to, but I find the threads to be more organized than our old single thread for this case.

Finding male DNA at the quarry, not even sure what relevance that has, unless it was on a bone or something that can be tied to this case.

If a quarry / pelvic bone thread doesn't already exist, we should probably start one. I don't know much about that beyond a discussion on reddit about how they knew it was TH's bone.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?298351-Bones/page4
there is a "bone" thread already. If we start breaking up the areas where they were found into their own threads, it could get quite complicated and hard to piece it all together. IMO

The male DNA was found on a "questioned stain", it doesn't indicate how big or what or where. I don't think there is much more that can be added to that at the moment.

 

[Tawny]

I think it's interesting that some people who are upset that LE considered Avery a suspect (perhaps the only real suspect) are pointing their fingers at LE as having been the ones to murder Teresa, then burn her body somewhere, then transport the charred bits to SA's burn pit and burn barrel, all to frame someone because he sued the county.

The very same behaviors that LE are accused of (unfairly targeting SA) are some of the very same behaviors being projected onto the MC Sheriff's Dept., with no proof shown yet, but lots of "well what about his 1982 conviction, what if's, could'a, I believe they did" thrown about. The irony is quite rich.

I'm all for the truth and proper investigation and accountability, but to point fingers for TH's murder at LE, or at the very least claiming LE somehow come across TH's body somewhere, then decided to move it to plant on Avery property is laughable. Where's the evidence of that occurring? (yes, I have read that very theory on WS more than once).

First, your entire post is really condescending and insulting in general, and second, MOST people who believe LE to be involved do NOT believe LE killed her.

 

[Sinsaint]

It's taken me some getting used to, but I find the threads to be more organized than our old single thread for this case.

Finding male DNA at the quarry, not even sure what relevance that has, unless it was on a bone or something that can be tied to this case.

If a quarry / pelvic bone thread doesn't already exist, we should probably start one. I don't know much about that beyond a discussion on reddit about how they knew it was TH's bone.

That DNA could be significant if it belongs to a person who has no business being there and/or is someone with a tie to the Halbach case. We know it's not Avery family DNA otherwise it would have been determined.

 

[Soulmagent]

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?298351-Bones/page4
there is a "bone" thread already. If we start breaking up the areas where they were found into their own threads, it could get quite complicated and hard to piece it all together. IMO

The male DNA was found on a "questioned stain", it doesn't indicate how big or what or where. I don't think there is much more that can be added to that at the moment.

Other then it was compared and excluded as from being from Bobby, Earl ,Charles,Delores Barb,Allen ,Bryan and Steve . I have not seen where Brendan was excluded