Who do you think the Zodiac Killer actually is?

[snarast]

And yes, I've long wondered about that too, if he actually wore glasses regularly. I think too much credence is put on the SF police sketch from 1969.

Lenses became available in the US in around 1965, so he could have been swapping lenses for glasses whenever.

Not sure how great those 60s lenses were, though.

 

[Austin023]

Lenses became available in the US in around 1965, so he could have been swapping lenses for glasses whenever.

Not sure how great those 60s lenses were, though.

Maybe, though in the late 60s lenses hadn't really become that common yet, though of course it's always a possibility he had them. However, the facial description of Z given by witnesses and survivors varied; survivor Michael Mugeau said the gunman didn't have glasses. So did a few other possible witnesses of various crimes/scenes nearby. I'm wondering if the SF police sketch of Z was even him at all. I think people give it too much credence. But Z easily could have intentionally altered his appearance a bit time to time, as the glasses might suggest...id take that SF sketch with a few grains of salt however.

 

[snarast]

Maybe, though in the late 60s lenses hadn't really become that common yet, though of course it's always a possibility he had them. However, the facial description of Z given by witnesses and survivors varied; survivor Michael Mugeau said the gunman didn't have glasses. So did a few other possible witnesses of various crimes/scenes nearby. I'm wondering if the SF police sketch of Z was even him at all. I think people give it too much credence. But Z easily could have intentionally altered his appearance a bit time to time, as the glasses might suggest...id take that SF sketch with a few grains of salt however.

If Z was switching glasses on and off, it might point to him having reached the age of 30-40 in the late 1960s.

That’s generally the age when people need glasses later in life, but are in the process of getting used to it, thus not wearing them all the time.

 

[Zapoleon]

For me Arthur Leigh Allen was the zodiac killer. Little doubt about that.

 

[Austin023]

If Z was switching glasses on and off, it might point to him having reached the age of 30-40 in the late 1960s.

That’s generally the age when people need glasses later in life, but are in the process of getting used to it, thus not wearing them all the time.

Some witnesses and survivors indicated Z was a bit "older", like middle to later 30s to middle 40s perhaps. While the victims at Lake Berryessa didn't see Z's face as he was masked, they thought he was around later 30s/early 40s based on his build and speech (they said he spoke with a kind of drawl).
Others basically agreed that he was early middle age. So, that would put Z as born right around 1925 to 1935. A number of good suspects fit well in that age range, such as Arthur Lee Allen who was born in 1933.

 

[Austin023]

For me Arthur Leigh Allen was the zodiac killer. Little doubt about that.

I do admit he has made a pretty good suspect. I'm unsure if he really was Z or not, but I definitely wouldn't rule him out. I think if someday a DNA profile can be had from viable, confirmed evidence, like one of the letters, or something else Z touched, then this case can be solved...it at least blown wide open.
While I know, and I agree, that the Cheri Jo Bates murder in Riverside might not have been Zodiac's "work", viable DNA was found in a watchband found at her murder scene by the RCC Library. Generic genealogy at this point could at least give us some good clues!

 

[Zapoleon]

Cheri Jo Bates murder in Riverside might not have been Zodiac's "work", viable DNA was found in a watchband found at her murder scene by the RCC Library. Generic genealogy at this point could at least give us some good clues!

Was it viable DNA found on the watch though? I am not so sure about that. I don't keep up to date or follow the Bates case that much.

I know a DNA expert who worked her case in the past testing items of her clothing for DNA etc Suzanna Ryan maybe over a year ago gave an interview where she said she felt is was unlikely DNA could solve her case just due to the fact its all degraded and lost with age given it was properly collected and stored.

​

 

[LIONofTheNorth]

Look for the word MORMON. What does Pontiac, MI have to do with MORMONISM? Paul Avery’s family tree had significant followers of Joseph Smith. The Mormon Prophet from Nauvoo. Who is Lucy Mack? FYI: Paul Avery was related to Cheri Josephine Bates. Paul Avery, Arthur Leigh Allen and many of Zodiac/Zodius’ Victims shared Mayflower bloodlines.

 

[TheRockingRev]

I don't know too much about the Zodiac killings. I've seen the movie, a couple of documentaries and read stuff on-line, but recently I came across something which I've never seen mentioned before (but if it has - please excuse me, like I say I'm no expert).
It's always been speculated that the Zodiac name came from the Astrology chart, but a little while ago I was reading something and came across this: The Zodiac: Cosmic Sounds - Wikipedia

It's from the West Coast, it was released 18 months before the killings supposedly started. Now it was based on Astrology, so yeah the killer did get his name from that, but what if the reason he did so wasn't actually that, but because he was a fan of this electronic album? Ok, it doesn't solve the mystery of who he was - and probably has all to do with it all, but I did think it was a peculiar little connection.

 

[peppermintpatti]

I have three opinions in this case.

1. Z is about as likely to be identified as Jack the Ripper.
2. Z may not be one person.
3. Paul Stine’s murder is very strange and could hold the key in some way.

Re 3 - it’s a bland murder, a very puzzling finale for this flamboyant murderer in love with upping the ante.

So either, that isn’t Z - or PS himself, or something about the location (by name, coordinates) holds a clue.

Or Z was somehow “unarmed” right before or after this event, meaning uhm it’s just basically part of a distraction tactic aiming to cloud Z’s last moves. But that would mean he’s like a walking, talking never ending conspiracy theory in the flesh. Kinda.

Good point about the murder of Paul Stine.

It does seem to lack "drama"... not to mention any females, who appeared to be Zodiac's preferred target.

It does make you wonder.

 

[sandy betts]

Good point about the murder of Paul Stine.

It does seem to lack "drama"... not to mention any females, who appeared to be Zodiac's preferred target.

It does make you wonder.

The victim who I believe held the key to who Zodiac actually is, was Darlene Ferrin. We know he stalked her before shooting her and Mike M. She knew him well, she was about to talk to the police about him, telling what she knew he had done, she was killed before she talked! I got away from the man who was stalking her. Darlene's family ID'd the picture I took of him in 1990! I saw his face up close, in 1969, then years later took two pictures of him, and gave it to VPD, NPD and SFPD. I am very sure one of his latest victims was Dick Hansen, who was followed from San Jose, to Sunnyvale, and shot twice in the chest with a 9 ml. April 29th, 1991. I asked the detectives to please show Dicks girlfriend the picture of my suspect, which fit the man she saw shoot Dick, as far as I know, they have not shown her the picture!

 

[Austin023]

The victim who I believe held the key to who Zodiac actually is, was Darlene Ferrin. We know he stalked her before shooting her and Mike M. She knew him well, she was about to talk to the police about him, telling what she knew he had done, she was killed before she talked! I got away from the man who was stalking her. Darlene's family ID'd the picture I took of him in 1990! I saw his face up close, in 1969, then years later took two pictures of him, and gave it to VPD, NPD and SFPD. I am very sure one of his latest victims was Dick Hansen, who was followed from San Jose, to Sunnyvale, and shot twice in the chest with a 9 ml. April 29th, 1991. I asked the detectives to please show Dicks girlfriend the picture of my suspect, which fit the man she saw shoot Dick, as far as I know, they have not shown her the picture!

I have long wondered about Darline and what role she might have played in her own murder. The striking similarity in appearance of Ferrin and Betty Lou Jensen, who had been killed with her boyfriend Faraday in December, 1968...was the Jensen-Faraday killing a mistaken identity?
The two killings are eeriely similar too. Then the subsequent ones are quite different. I think this case has a lot of smoke and mirrors, partly a deliberate act by whoever Z was...or if more than one person. I'd not rule that out

 

[Hustling01]

Loring d hill is a great suspect everything matches hes still a work in progress. Zodiac killer and me on fb has way more info on. He is one of the best suspects iv seen in a while

 

[bdsjr]

I have three opinions in this case.

1. Z is about as likely to be identified as Jack the Ripper.
2. Z may not be one person.
3. Paul Stine’s murder is very strange and could hold the key in some way.

Re 3 - it’s a bland murder, a very puzzling finale for this flamboyant murderer in love with upping the ante.

So either, that isn’t Z - or PS himself, or something about the location (by name, coordinates) holds a clue.

Or Z was somehow “unarmed” right before or after this event, meaning uhm it’s just basically part of a distraction tactic aiming to cloud Z’s last moves. But that would mean he’s like a walking, talking never ending conspiracy theory in the flesh. Kinda.

You are on the right track about the Stine murder. First and foremost, it was his way to control all aspects of the murder. He decided the pick-up point, he decided the murder scene, and he decided everything about his victim ahead of time in the 3 mile ride over there. I am of the opinion that the entire thing is a puzzle, from pick-up point to escape route. Even the change one block west to Cherry from the original location of Maple.

 

[JBowie]

Having now read Horan's book The Myth of the Zodiac Killer: A Literary Investigation, I have come around to his point of view that Zodiac is a invention of newspaper people, principally Robert Graysmith.

Horan convincingly demolishes Graysmith's book, page by page, one lie/invention after another.

 

[sandy betts]

Austin023, Darlene was in a bad crowd who were into all types of crime. After she bought her home and had her baby, she wanted out. Then she went out with my boyfriend, who was a Vallejo Cop. The group was afraid she would talk about the crime ring. Her murder was not random; it was a hit! Zodiac continued to kill through 1999, I am not sure if he killed after 1999. I found some girls he tried to kill; they saw the picture I took of him and said for sure that he was the killer! He has killed over a dozen females in Contra Costa County during the 1980s and 90s.

 

[JimmyDurham]

I don't know if you saw this, but recently, Jack the Ripper was identified, using DNA that was found on the clothing of one of his victims. It was the Polish immigrant butcher.

He wasn't identified. There are a series of monumental problems with the supposed shawl and associated DNA.

There is more chance of Zodiac being identified than there is Jack. That's not saying much mind you given that there is a very small notch above zero chance of Jack being identified.

Hello from England.