Hm. That in and of itself tells you something. I have never much bought into the BDI theory, but for AH who was so intent on really shielding the Ramsey's from EVERYTHING, to straight up juts refuse to accept those statements? Makes you wonder.
Who molested/abused Jonbenet?
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There is such a thing as a "situational molester". These people are not true pedophiles. They do not have a sexual attraction to ALL children. But their victim is often a child close to them, accessible and compliant, and someone who would see them as someone who "loves" them. It is no secret that JB was a sexualized child. Patsy herself was heard to say that JB sometimes acted "too flirtatious". If JR was the one who was abusing her, it does not mean he would have gone on to molest other children or had molested other children in the past. This is also true if her abuser was one (or both) of her brothers. The did not have to be or become pedophiles to have molested her.
If I could offer a (somewhat half-baked) possibility (and work in a shameless plug to boot!), we're talking a 6-y/o who was dressed up like a Vegas showgirl and taught to act sexually. She would have been the ideal victim: combining an overlay of adult sexuality with a child's malleability and vulnerability to bribery or coercion. Moreso in this case, due to being made obedient by her mother and grandmother.
This is absolutely true, and the one thing that I do feel expands this possibility is PR's illness and the general family decline because of it...I mean, who knows, I would assume their sex life was not very active through that, and adding in the stress of Beth's death could have just triggered something?
Very true. I've often wondered about the effect Patsy's illness had on their sex life. John had cheated before, he was away from home a lot, and with his money I'm sure the temptation was there. Could he have set his sites on his daughter? I guess anything is possible.
midwest mama
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How ironic JR remarried a former LasVegas showgirl costume designer. Though this article does not specify she designed showgirl costumes, I do recall reading another one that did.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/01/john-ramsey-father-of-mur_n_915211.html
Both PR and Jan were 14 years younger than JR when they married. I'd bet a good chunk of money any mistresses he had over the years were also much younger.
Sorry, the lizard lip-licking guy just creeps me out.
questfortrue
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Much of my post has been discussed years ago, but Ill restate some of it as it is central, imo, to why the crime was covered up. Who the perpetrator of the abuse was, I dont believe anyone could say without a confession, but its relatively safe to say that it was someone(s) who had easy ongoing access to the child.
Itd be important to also mention some findings of the ME. Dr. Meyer, observed circumferential hyperemia within the vaginal vault and signs of chronic inflammation around the vaginal orifice. It was believed that these injuries had been inflicted in the days or weeks before the acute injury that was responsible for causing the bleeding at the time of her death. The chronic abuse was noted as consistent with digital abuse. But its thought that the acute abuse from the night of her death may have been perpetrated with a paintbrush. Ill leave to others to decide if that was done to disguise previous abuse, as some think, or if it was done by a juvenile.
SBP:
Kolar did not develop his SBP theory out of thin air, imo. He must have read reports written by detectives who interviewed people who knew the Rs had dealt with inappropriate behavior between siblings. From the delight in fire, to some perpetrators liking to tie up their abused victim, to scatological incidence - there's a picture developing relevant to the pathology of SBP.
Grooming:
As SuperDave has mentioned sometime back, there were also signs of grooming, which some believe signifies something occurring between an older person and JB. Unfortunately we dont know when some of these signs were noticed. One comment was from JBs photographer who claimed that JB had developed a worldly facial expression, possibly indicative of abuse by an older person. Another comment was from the wife of the pilot who said that PR had expressed concerns about JB acting too friendly and manifesting flirty behavior. From what I understand those whove worked with sexually abused children know that these kids are manipulated into not telling. Hypothetically, in a grooming scenario, if JB had received emotional rewards such as attention, unique treatment, etc., she may have been led to believe this is something special and may even be confused that the touching is a good thing. Someone would be conditioning her and, again, manipulating her to never tell. But kids may not understand that their behavior gives off subtle clues of something inappropriate happening with them.
In addition to this the issues the family faced with PRs cancer and the death of JRs eldest daughter add more wrinkles to understanding the whole picture. Ive no doubt that these traumas devastated this family who were still out there proving their social status and perfect family image. Psychologists reference a situation of emotional incest as triangulation of the spousal relationship with a child. Sometimes a spouse will rely on a child to fulfill an emotional vacuum PR recovering from cancer, an absent spouse and reliving her best years with pageants through JB. In the case of JR with the loss of his first daughter Beth, he seemingly relied on his young daughter, not his wife, for comfort. One can only imagine the effect of all this on the kids.
Ive wondered previously if more than one person in the home had crossed boundaries with JB and have reconciled that there is no way to know this. (The situation of two perpetrators in a household is higher than any of us want to think - from statistics its somewhere between 20% and 30%) All that we have from experts reports is that she had been chronically abused.
Moo, beneath the pretty façade which PR worked so hard to project, there was a very big problem in the home which PR, at least, knew about. As if JBs death wasnt cruel in and of itself, her molestation adds another element of heartbreak to the crime. And it was always denied by the Rs.
MHO
Itd be important to also mention some findings of the ME. Dr. Meyer, observed circumferential hyperemia within the vaginal vault and signs of chronic inflammation around the vaginal orifice. It was believed that these injuries had been inflicted in the days or weeks before the acute injury that was responsible for causing the bleeding at the time of her death. The chronic abuse was noted as consistent with digital abuse. But its thought that the acute abuse from the night of her death may have been perpetrated with a paintbrush. Ill leave to others to decide if that was done to disguise previous abuse, as some think, or if it was done by a juvenile.
SBP:
Kolar did not develop his SBP theory out of thin air, imo. He must have read reports written by detectives who interviewed people who knew the Rs had dealt with inappropriate behavior between siblings. From the delight in fire, to some perpetrators liking to tie up their abused victim, to scatological incidence - there's a picture developing relevant to the pathology of SBP.
Grooming:
As SuperDave has mentioned sometime back, there were also signs of grooming, which some believe signifies something occurring between an older person and JB. Unfortunately we dont know when some of these signs were noticed. One comment was from JBs photographer who claimed that JB had developed a worldly facial expression, possibly indicative of abuse by an older person. Another comment was from the wife of the pilot who said that PR had expressed concerns about JB acting too friendly and manifesting flirty behavior. From what I understand those whove worked with sexually abused children know that these kids are manipulated into not telling. Hypothetically, in a grooming scenario, if JB had received emotional rewards such as attention, unique treatment, etc., she may have been led to believe this is something special and may even be confused that the touching is a good thing. Someone would be conditioning her and, again, manipulating her to never tell. But kids may not understand that their behavior gives off subtle clues of something inappropriate happening with them.
In addition to this the issues the family faced with PRs cancer and the death of JRs eldest daughter add more wrinkles to understanding the whole picture. Ive no doubt that these traumas devastated this family who were still out there proving their social status and perfect family image. Psychologists reference a situation of emotional incest as triangulation of the spousal relationship with a child. Sometimes a spouse will rely on a child to fulfill an emotional vacuum PR recovering from cancer, an absent spouse and reliving her best years with pageants through JB. In the case of JR with the loss of his first daughter Beth, he seemingly relied on his young daughter, not his wife, for comfort. One can only imagine the effect of all this on the kids.
Ive wondered previously if more than one person in the home had crossed boundaries with JB and have reconciled that there is no way to know this. (The situation of two perpetrators in a household is higher than any of us want to think - from statistics its somewhere between 20% and 30%) All that we have from experts reports is that she had been chronically abused.
Moo, beneath the pretty façade which PR worked so hard to project, there was a very big problem in the home which PR, at least, knew about. As if JBs death wasnt cruel in and of itself, her molestation adds another element of heartbreak to the crime. And it was always denied by the Rs.
MHO
questfortrue,
Depending on your favorite theory its more likely that JonBenet was sexually assaulted the same night she died. Masking chronic abuse might suggest more than one person is tacitly aware that it is taking place?
Its also unlikely that the person staging any assault via a paintbrush handle would be aware of the existence of prior internal scarring.
.
questfortrue
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The paintbrush was a sexual assault, no matter the motivation or who perpetrated it.
UKGuy, youve astutely pointed out for years, the staging of the crime is discordant because two adults were involved in this staging. The facts include that the assault was done right before or right after JBs death, cleaned up, and hidden. Agreed no-one would be considering an injury to her vaginal vault as concealing past abuse. But if it were one of the adults there may be another motivation.
There are just a couple choices pertaining to this:
1) a paintbrush injury by the one who perpetrated the head blow, and the blood cleaned up by either that person or a second person (one of the adults likely).
2) or a paintbrush injury by one adult to point to a sadistic intruder - like the idea behind a garrote, not the ligature strangulation per se. If one disguises the death with a garrote (though as a garrote it seems pretty non-functional) and one utilizes a paintbrush, the stager may hope no one will believe the family could have anything to do with JBs death. However, not foreseen by that adult intent on staging something horrific is that subsequently a second adult on the scene would clean her up, wrap her papoose-like and place her Barbie nightgown next to her.
IMHO, the paintbrush injury carries significance, for more reasons than Im going into in this post.
questfortrue,
Wow and how do you know all this stuff, were you present when JonBenet was penetrated with the paintbrush?
If the paintbrush assault represents staging then it implies others were aware JonBenet was being abused.
The paintbrush, IMO, will one day become the defining characteristic of this case!
questfortrue
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For reference, this was information from 3 books PMPT, IRMI, FF
The police would have to track down the origin of a small amount of cellulose that had been found in JonBenéts vagina.* The possibility existed that it could have come from the broken paintbrush used for the ligature. Schiller PMPT (pp. 508-509), Kindle Edition.
If the cellulose did, in fact, come from the paintbrush, then most probably the garrote had been assembled before JonBenét was violated. Schiller PMPT (p. 559), Kindle Edition.
The site of the damaged tissue was excised and prepared for a pathology slide. Later examination would reveal the presence of cellulose material in the membrane of the hymeneal opening that was consistent with the wood of the paintbrush used as a handle in the cord of the garrote. Kolar FF (pp 828-830), Kindle Edition.
The splinter in the vagina had caused a disagreement among the examiners. Some examiners said it had been in the vagina as long as a week, but the detectives sided with Dr. Spitzs conclusion that it was inserted about the time of death as a part of the staging. Thomas, Steve; Davis, Donald A. IRMI (p. 305), Kindle Edition.
Some have speculated that a splinter could have been transferred on a finger, though that wasn't the interpretation of McCann, who evaluated JB's injuries.
Also, I was quoting a legal definition of sexual assault. Even if, in someones mind this is an act of staging, to portray an act of a deviant intruder perhaps, but not necessarily implying past knowledge of abuse, it still constitutes an act of assault. From the US Dept. of Justice definition: Sexual assault is any type of sexual contact or behavior that occurs without the explicit consent of the recipient.
UKguy, perhaps I caused some offense, and if so, I apologize. I was not trying to be purposely cryptic; I simply would need to get permission from someone to add additional info to what I recently wrote. I always appreciate your posts.
All of this is just mho.
andreww,
I forget the details but my understanding is that it is not a federal offence to sexually assault a corpse, although some states, as you suggest, have their own laws and statutes that cover indignity to a corpse.
.
For reference, this was information from 3 books PMPT, IRMI, FF
The police would have to track down the origin of a small amount of cellulose that had been found in JonBenéts vagina.* The possibility existed that it could have come from the broken paintbrush used for the ligature. Schiller PMPT (pp. 508-509), Kindle Edition.
If the cellulose did, in fact, come from the paintbrush, then most probably the garrote had been assembled before JonBenét was violated. Schiller PMPT (p. 559), Kindle Edition.
The site of the damaged tissue was excised and prepared for a pathology slide. Later examination would reveal the presence of cellulose material in the membrane of the hymeneal opening that was consistent with the wood of the paintbrush used as a handle in the cord of the garrote. Kolar FF (pp 828-830), Kindle Edition.
The splinter in the vagina had caused a disagreement among the examiners. Some examiners said it had been in the vagina as long as a week, but the detectives sided with Dr. Spitzs conclusion that it was inserted about the time of death as a part of the staging. Thomas, Steve; Davis, Donald A. IRMI (p. 305), Kindle Edition.
Some have speculated that a splinter could have been transferred on a finger, though that wasn't the interpretation of McCann, who evaluated JB's injuries.
Also, I was quoting a legal definition of sexual assault. Even if, in someones mind this is an act of staging, to portray an act of a deviant intruder perhaps, but not necessarily implying past knowledge of abuse, it still constitutes an act of assault. From the US Dept. of Justice definition: Sexual assault is any type of sexual contact or behavior that occurs without the explicit consent of the recipient.
UKguy, perhaps I caused some offense, and if so, I apologize. I was not trying to be purposely cryptic; I simply would need to get permission from someone to add additional info to what I recently wrote. I always appreciate your posts.
All of this is just mho.
questfortrue,
No offence caused, thats just my occassional hyperbolic reply. Much of the interpretation relies on inference, so how can we know?
Sexual assault is any type of sexual contact or behavior that occurs without the explicit consent of the recipient.
Patently dead bodies cannot offer consent!
Although not his interpretation, he cannot rule it out?
i.e. why would someone asphyxiate JonBenet with a convoluted asphyxiation device, then digitally penetrate JonBenet, thereby transferring a splinter of the paintbrush?
Alternatively why do all the above then insert the remainder of the paintbrush handle, i.e. who gains advantage when a paintbrush handle is employed over a finger?
.
questfortrue
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I still allow that a juvenile could have been responsible for the paintbrush injury, depending on some other issues of timing I haven't yet resolved. But the only view I currently hold is that the intent of the RN and of the rest of the actions taken that night by the adults was to point the crime away from the family.
As far as the other comment about whether JB was even still alive, in general:
A number of rulings in several states have stipulated that its not actually imperative that the state determine time of death, when putting a specific definition to a crime. For example, what the courts rulings have evaluated is whether a crime of a sexual assault has occurred during a criminal episode or on a continuum of a criminal event, not whether the victim was actually still alive. These rulings came about because of some defense arguments in certain cases that someone was likely dead after a stabbing or gunshot to the brain, and therefore a rape could not have occurred. (I really don't know how the Colorado courts would rule in this circumstance. There is the argument that she bled and so was possibly/probably still alive.)
Given that its Boulder, this is a moot point anyway. Imo, AH would have blasted his own ear drums and cut off his tongue, rendering himself a deaf mute, in order not to take this case to trial, so strongly was he compelled to bury it. My hyperbole and mho.
As far as the other comment about whether JB was even still alive, in general:
A number of rulings in several states have stipulated that its not actually imperative that the state determine time of death, when putting a specific definition to a crime. For example, what the courts rulings have evaluated is whether a crime of a sexual assault has occurred during a criminal episode or on a continuum of a criminal event, not whether the victim was actually still alive. These rulings came about because of some defense arguments in certain cases that someone was likely dead after a stabbing or gunshot to the brain, and therefore a rape could not have occurred. (I really don't know how the Colorado courts would rule in this circumstance. There is the argument that she bled and so was possibly/probably still alive.)
Given that its Boulder, this is a moot point anyway. Imo, AH would have blasted his own ear drums and cut off his tongue, rendering himself a deaf mute, in order not to take this case to trial, so strongly was he compelled to bury it. My hyperbole and mho.
questfortrue,
That is if there is one? The cellulose found inside JonBenet may have been transferred by someones finger, it might simply represent artifact that arrived by accident?
There is a missing piece of the paintbrush and nobody has ever said if it was found. It might suggest redacted forensic evidence, common in a homicide case, where only the killer would know about the paintbrush handles eventual locations.
I reckon the paintbrush was used to internally injure JonBenet, possibly to mask prior acute abuse? I cannot see why anyone would want to digitally assault JonBenet for the purpose of staging?
This matches up with the use of the other piece of the paintbrush as an asphyxiation device, done to fabricate staging.
It might just be that the cellulose forensic evidence is artifact, something that arrived by accident and all the speculation has no basis in fact?
.
Its an interesting conundrum: If the splinter is from the paintbrush, does that mean the "garrotte" was indeed constructed first? If it was, where did the blood seen under UV at autopsy come from? She would not bleed if she was already dead by strangulation.
If it is not from the paintbrush, but rather from a finger as speculated, what caused the injury?
If it is not from the paintbrush, but rather from a finger as speculated, what caused the injury?
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If the garrote was constructed first, would the pen knife have been employed? I believe i read that it was last seen upstairs in or near the linen closet. (Is that right? I can't give you a link to where I read that.) Could the cord have come from some new item stored in the closet and still tied up with it, cut off with the knife for use in making the garrote? I have purchased towel sets that were tied together in a little stack, though more commonly with pretty ribbons or twill tape as opposed the cheap nylon stuff found on the body. The only time I remember seeing that kind of cord was when having Christmas trees or other large purchases secured to the top of my car. Anyway, that would explain why no source for more cord was found in the house. Could that pen knife itself have been used for penetration that night, or at earlier times?
Annapurna,
The splinter does indeed seem to originate from the paintbrush. The garrote may have been constructed last, i.e. as an afterthought, an addition to the ligature, since we can infer from the knotting that the paintbrush handle was tied in place.
The blood may have been residue from when she was cleaned up.
What is curious is if JonBenet was assaulted internally by the paintbrush why was there not more damage caused? Even the missing piece with its assumed pointed end might have punctured JonBenet internally?
In this picture both ends of the paintbrush appear ragged.
.
Was the garrotte still around her neck when John carried her upstairs?
And as to the supposed "splinter", it is my understanding that it wasn't actually a splinter, but a piece of cellulose. Now I'm not a scientist but I do know that cellulose is a component in lacquer finishes. So I am assuming that the theory is this cellulose is a small particle of the lacquer that was used to finish the wood handle of the paintbrush?. If that be the case, its hard to fathom her being violated with the splintered end of that brush with no other larger pieces being found.
And as to the supposed "splinter", it is my understanding that it wasn't actually a splinter, but a piece of cellulose. Now I'm not a scientist but I do know that cellulose is a component in lacquer finishes. So I am assuming that the theory is this cellulose is a small particle of the lacquer that was used to finish the wood handle of the paintbrush?. If that be the case, its hard to fathom her being violated with the splintered end of that brush with no other larger pieces being found.
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