Who was George Brody?- Part 2.

[Odyssey]

You're right Cubby, I forgot there was that other married GB. What I meant is, are we 100% sure that the Oakland GB is our GB or did we just think it probably was because the timeline fit? I think it's important to be sure, because otherwise we can't be positive our GB claimed he was born in Russia. I can't recall if we were ever 100% sure Oakland GB was our GB but at the time I requested the court record, it was because I wanted to see Oakland GB's handwriting. It's been a long time though so I wasn't sure if it was ever confirmed.

 

[Odyssey]

I didn't recall GB in Oakland with MK. If that's the case we can consider it fact that they are the same. That's what I was trying to find out.

 

[InterestedNHelping]

I live a couple of hours from the bay area and if we have a directive to research something specific, I can go in when I am there and do microfilm and data research if I have the place and dates, ect. I have also asked my friends in the tech community about using facial recognition software on the photo of Brody that was a business pose. Will keep you all posted if anything comes of it.

 

[Odyssey]

Hi Interested!

There was a news article in 1941 in Oakland which said GB was picketing and got punched by someone. The police came and there was some mention of going to court. I do not recall the exact date but it is here somewhere in one of the threads. I believe it was a criminal case but am not 100% certain, it could have been a civil suit where GB sued him.

I don't think there is much to be gained from the court records other than if there is a complaint handwritten by him. That would eliminate any doubt that the GB who was in Oakland is the same GB who was later in San Francisco with GW.

I think from what Cubby said it may already be confirmed that they are the same person so I'm not sure it would be necessary.

im a little fuzzy on some of the details.

 

[Cubby]

Good to see you, INH.

Odyssey there was mention of Anna's family knowing the land lord who GB and MK rented from in 1962. IIRC, it was the home on Noe street. I'd have to look again, but from memory GB resided in Oakland prior to his meeting GW and MK's death. It was only after GB met GW that he resided in SF .

 

[Odyssey]

Cubby,

That is pretty much what I remembered. Our GB first appeared at Noe St in San Francisco with MK in 1962 and we pretty much know his movements from then until his death.

Then when the 1940 census came out we found that GB in Oakland which led to finding him in some 1940's Oakland city directories and that news article. But I don't believe (at least to my knowledge) that we were ever sure the one in Oakland was our GB. I think Annasmon had doubts because the one in Oakland claimed he was from Russia and Annasmom did not believe our GB was foreign born. Also I just looked at the timeline and there seems to be a big gap between the last listing for GB in Oakland (1944) and the first in San Francisco (1962) which also had caused some doubt.

I made that timeline over 6 years ago so very possible there were new findings since then but at the time I was referring to "Oakland GB" in the timeline because I wasn't 100% convinced he was our GB.

I hope I am making sense, it was just something at the time that was still in question.

 

[Odyssey]

Also while I am thinking about it I can't recall if the big gap is because the missing years weren't available online to search or if we searched and he wasn't listed. InH, that could be another thing if you are nearby and have time. One of the main libraries (Oakland or Berkeley) would probably have all the Oakland city directories, it would be great to see if we can find him in Oakland at anytime from 1945-1961. I am no longer in California.

 

[SideKick]

Hi!

I could be wrong, but the name Patel comes to mind as one of the landlords.

 

[Skully]

Cubby,

That is pretty much what I remembered. Our GB first appeared at Noe St in San Francisco with MK in 1962 and we pretty much know his movements from then until his death.

Then when the 1940 census came out we found that GB in Oakland which led to finding him in some 1940's Oakland city directories and that news article. But I don't believe (at least to my knowledge) that we were ever sure the one in Oakland was our GB. I think Annasmon had doubts because the one in Oakland claimed he was from Russia and Annasmom did not believe our GB was foreign born. Also I just looked at the timeline and there seems to be a big gap between the last listing for GB in Oakland (1944) and the first in San Francisco (1962) which also had caused some doubt.

I made that timeline over 6 years ago so very possible there were new findings since then but at the time I was referring to "Oakland GB" in the timeline because I wasn't 100% convinced he was our GB.

I hope I am making sense, it was just something at the time that was still in question.

I just want to throw something out here, if I may. I know family are working on her case, and lots here, but does Anna have a cold case detective assigned to her case? I am sure there is, but is he or she contacted with all the information you have dug up and found? Any little thing should be checked out. Sorry if I sound uninformed but I don't ever take any thing for granted.

 

[Cubby]

Hi!

I could be wrong, but the name Patel comes to mind as one of the landlords.

Patel was the name of a former owner of the hotel the two G's lived in, the same one Joe Ford stayed in while doing his surveillance.

 

[Cubby]

Cubby,

That is pretty much what I remembered. Our GB first appeared at Noe St in San Francisco with MK in 1962 and we pretty much know his movements from then until his death.

Then when the 1940 census came out we found that GB in Oakland which led to finding him in some 1940's Oakland city directories and that news article. But I don't believe (at least to my knowledge) that we were ever sure the one in Oakland was our GB. I think Annasmon had doubts because the one in Oakland claimed he was from Russia and Annasmom did not believe our GB was foreign born. Also I just looked at the timeline and there seems to be a big gap between the last listing for GB in Oakland (1944) and the first in San Francisco (1962) which also had caused some doubt.

I made that timeline over 6 years ago so very possible there were new findings since then but at the time I was referring to "Oakland GB" in the timeline because I wasn't 100% convinced he was our GB.

I hope I am making sense, it was just something at the time that was still in question.

IIRC GB never claimed to have been from Russia. He only said back east. Russia first came into play when the 1940 census came out and the only GB in Oakland?/correct area that fit the correct age range and couldn't be ruled out as being our GB had Russia listed as a birth place. That is where the uncertainty came in because the Russian GB born in 1905 had " "'s on the census to carry down dark complexion. We questioned the accuracy of the complexion and Annasmom did not think he was foreign born. We were never able to rule in or out with certainty.

I am of the belief that Russian GB is our GB, and that neither of the G's were involved in Anna's disappearance.

 

[SideKick]

IIRC GB never claimed to have been from Russia. He only said back east. Russia first came into play when the 1940 census came out and the only GB in Oakland?/correct area that fit the correct age range and couldn't be ruled out as being our GB had Russia listed as a birth place. That is where the uncertainty came in because the Russian GB born in 1905 had " "'s on the census to carry down dark complexion. We questioned the accuracy of the complexion and Annasmom did not think he was foreign born. We were never able to rule in or out with certainty.

This sounds very familiar Cubby. Thank you for the recap of GB. It's interesting how one can live somewhat anonymous.
We all carry or have sin numbers, birth certificate's, proof of who we are on this planet. GB was either I'd theft, extreme... Or hiding his lure existance for some odd reason. Perhaps he was just that odd!


I am of the belief that Russian GB is our GB, and that neither of the G's were involved in Anna's disappearance.

I'd love to chat more about reasons we think the G's were or were not involved. Over the years I will say, I have jumped back and forth, albeit they may have had a hand in it, hiring or others doing the job. Which, brings up 3 senerios.
Yes they did
No they did not
Possibly planned but others did the kidnapping.

Love to hear your thought on that Cubby, thanks!

 

[Cubby]

just as there was no evidence Anna went into the creek, I think the plan and the info uncovered from the bfh isn't strong enough for me. Imo, The Plan occurring in January can easily be explained as sort of a new years resolution. Lots of people like to make new plans that start with the new year and they never obtained any real significant insurance policies.


More later ........

 

[Cubby]

Am back, had to run out.

Back to GB. IIRC, one of the reasons we thought the Russian GB is our GB is because he couldn't be ruled out like we were able to rule out some of the other possibilities.

 

[Odyssey]

Thanks Cubby. . I think it would be worthwhile to try to obtain something with Oakland GB's handwriting just to confirm then. I can request it again by mail but Interested N Helping also offered to try going in person. I will look for the article again and get a rough date of when that incident happened.

I just remembered too that another reason we thought Oakland GB was our GB was that the safe deposit box was in Oakland and we knew that belonged to our GB because Annasmom has the key.

FWIW, I am still torn on the G's. Not enough to say they were involved and not enough to say they weren't. I think the report of the person (who I'm assuming knew nothing about the G's) saying they saw a vehicle with a younger guy and an older man in the area kind of makes me think they were involved.

When Jaycee Dugard was found and she said "there were others" I instantly thought of the man and woman in the car that Anna's brother mentioned but I think Doogie said that Anna's disappearance was too early to have involved Philip and Nancy Garrido. I still think whoever was in that car may have been involved though. I never thought she fell in the creek personally.

 

[Cubby]

I like the idea of comparing handwriting. What would we be comparing the samples from the bfh to?

With the two overly friendly men, seen by CB, why would we think two guys who were generally paranoid about being followed be so friendly on a day they would be trying to abduct a child? It doesn't make sense they would draw attention to themselves just prior to abducting a child.

Personally, I couldn't dismiss the possibility of the creek for a long time, but after rereading SFA earlier this summer, I am convinced if she went into the creek something would have been found. The force of the water would have caused her clothing or at least some clothing to come off. There is no way, imo, that a small child and her clothing and especially oversized rubber boots would have all been silted over never to be uncovered for decades.

I think she was taken by someone who was familiar with those utilizing the property. If not someone who used the property frequently then an acquaintance of someone who did. Whether it was for nefarious reasons or to raise a child, IDK, but I lean toward to raise a child.... Because I think we've done a lot of digging into possible child predators and been able to basically rule them out.

Anyhoo, that's what I came away with after rereading SFA again, slowly while enjoying the sun and uninterupted.

 

[Odyssey]

=Cubby;12761129]I like the idea of comparing handwriting. What would we be comparing the samples from the bfh to?

I am hoping that punching incident in 1941 will have some document handwritten by GB - a complaint or a statement or something along those lines. I don't expect to gain any other information from the court records, just the handwriting.

My thoughts are:

If we can be sure that Oakland GB and our GB are one and the same, then we will know that our GB claimed to have been born in Russia. It will leave the question of where he was from 1945-1961, what happened that caused what seemed like a fairly ordinary man, listed in directories, calling police, registered to vote, etc. to disappear for several years only to resurface in SF with MK, now a paranoid man who uses aliases and had to rely on others to 'support' him. Since Oakland GB traces back to the 30's, if they turn out to be the same GB, then I think George Brody, or some variation of it, was his real identity. It didn't seem like he was hiding at all while in Oakland.

If it turns out that Oakland GB is NOT our GB, and perhaps is just someone with the same name that died in the 40's (unlikely if he was born in 1905), then I think it's unlikely that George Brody was our GB's real name which would lead me to think he was involved in something shady and was hiding from something.

I am also hindered by the fact that I can't recall if we are missing 1945-1961 because those years weren't online to be searched, or if they were searched and he wasn't there. That's something I plan to go back and double check also, I need to read back through the threads and have started to but it takes awhile. It's a lot to read.

Oakland GB was also registered to vote so he must have become a citizen? I think there were some searches for those records also but can't recall if we found anything. I believe that for naturalization records he would have had to name someone he was going to be staying with or something along those lines. It could lead to where he was prior to Oakland, but it's useless if he was not our GB.

 

[Odyssey]

I wanted to add that I just found the article again, it printed 10/2/1941. It says GB is the plaintiff, so it was a civil suit. The defendants last name was Sgroe. I am glad it's a civil case, better chance of finding something handwritten imo.

 

[Skully]

I am hoping that punching incident in 1941 will have some document handwritten by GB - a complaint or a statement or something along those lines. I don't expect to gain any other information from the court records, just the handwriting.

My thoughts are:

If we can be sure that Oakland GB and our GB are one and the same, then we will know that our GB claimed to have been born in Russia. It will leave the question of where he was from 1945-1961, what happened that caused what seemed like a fairly ordinary man, listed in directories, calling police, registered to vote, etc. to disappear for several years only to resurface in SF with MK, now a paranoid man who uses aliases and had to rely on others to 'support' him. Since Oakland GB traces back to the 30's, if they turn out to be the same GB, then I think George Brody, or some variation of it, was his real identity. It didn't seem like he was hiding at all while in Oakland.

If it turns out that Oakland GB is NOT our GB, and perhaps is just someone with the same name that died in the 40's (unlikely if he was born in 1905), then I think it's unlikely that George Brody was our GB's real name which would lead me to think he was involved in something shady and was hiding from something.

I am also hindered by the fact that I can't recall if we are missing 1945-1961 because those years weren't online to be searched, or if they were searched and he wasn't there. That's something I plan to go back and double check also, I need to read back through the threads and have started to but it takes awhile. It's a lot to read.

Oakland GB was also registered to vote so he must have become a citizen? I think there were some searches for those records also but can't recall if we found anything. I believe that for naturalization records he would have had to name someone he was going to be staying with or something along those lines. It could lead to where he was prior to Oakland, but it's useless if he was not our GB.

Is it possible that GB in SF took the ID of GB from Russia?

 

[Skully]

I like the idea of comparing handwriting. What would we be comparing the samples from the bfh to?

With the two overly friendly men, seen by CB, why would we think two guys who were generally paranoid about being followed be so friendly on a day they would be trying to abduct a child? It doesn't make sense they would draw attention to themselves just prior to abducting a child.

Personally, I couldn't dismiss the possibility of the creek for a long time, but after rereading SFA earlier this summer, I am convinced if she went into the creek something would have been found. The force of the water would have caused her clothing or at least some clothing to come off. There is no way, imo, that a small child and her clothing and especially oversized rubber boots would have all been silted over never to be uncovered for decades.

I think she was taken by someone who was familiar with those utilizing the property. If not someone who used the property frequently then an acquaintance of someone who did. Whether it was for nefarious reasons or to raise a child, IDK, but I lean toward to raise a child.... Because I think we've done a lot of digging into possible child predators and been able to basically rule them out.

Anyhoo, that's what I came away with after rereading SFA again, slowly while enjoying the sun and uninterupted.

I agree that she was taken by someone who knew her routine, knew the house, the road and could wait until it was the right opportunity. They also needed a motive, like wanting a child to raise, or even not wanting to pay child support. The birth certificate was a huge red flag to me (the name change). I still feel she was taken away and given to another couple to raise. She was so beautiful and cute. I love her pictures in the album here. This case just breaks my heart and I want so badly to help. You are all so dedicated and good at this, I know if anyone can crack it, you guys can.