WI WI - Kelly Dwyer, 27, Milwaukee, 11 Oct 2013 - #1

[J Block]

It's true that a warrant must specify two things: the place to be searched, and the items they are searching for. Without seeing the actual warrant, I can't say whether the CDs and hard drive were within the "four corners" of the warrant. But, I would be very surprised (it does sometimes happen, but not often) if the officers seized something not covered by the warrant. Am I correct that the CDs and hard drive were seized on a second search warrant--not the one initially executed to search for drugs, but one that was issued to search for evidence of his involvement in KD's disappearance? If that is the case, I would expect that the warrant specifically covered computers, hard drives, CDs etc. Again, I'd need to see the actual warrant to be sure, but that would be pretty standard. If the hard drive and CDs were seized in the drug search warrant, then it's still possible the warrant would have included digital storage devices like hard drives and CDs because they were apparently investigating the crime of maintaining a drug house and possession with intent to deliver, and they could have asked for those things with the idea that records of drug deals might be on such items. I haven't typically seen that in my experience (because drug dealers don't usually keep this info on computer, but usually on paper), but it's not impossible.

Now, search warrants can only be issued on a judicial finding of probable cause to believe that a crime was committed and that evidence of that crime is at the place to be searched. Once a warrant is issued, most states say that anything seized by an officer acting in good faith on that warrant, cannot be excluded by a judge later determining that there really wasn't enough to meet the probable cause standard. (The state I practice in is actually a little different in this regard, but that's because our state constitution contains stronger privacy rights than the 4th Amendment under the US Const.) However, if the defense can establish that any misinformation was given to the judge to obtain the search warrant or if any information was omitted from the application for the warrant, and had that misinformation not been included or omitted, there would not have been probable cause to issue the warrant, then the warrant and any evidence obtained as a result can be thrown out. (There are some other things that can lead to evidence being thrown out--if the warrant is executed in an unreasonable way, like breaking down the door when you have a key, doing the search at night w/o the warrant specifically authorizing it, failing to knock and announce your presence etc. But I haven't seen anything to indicate anything like that is in play here.)

The way Miranda rights play into this, of course, is that, if any of the information given to the judge to get the warrant was itself illegally obtained, in violation of Miranda for example, then the court has to determine if there was still probable cause to issue the warrant even without any of that information.

I hope that helps, without being too much "legalese."

Thank you AGAIN for expounding on my OTHER brief synopsis. Attorney 2. Cop 0.

 

[bwt42]

BBM. Smooth, my ears pricked up when I heard that too. He specifically said from SURROUNDING buildings. Not one single camera recorded her leaving. That is significant.

This information has been mentioned in msm many times. The 20 some surveillance cameras reviewed were not all in the building that KZ lived in.

 

[UncannyCanuck]

Thanksgiving is here and Kelly isn't - so sad. My prayers go out to her family on this day that families should celebrate together.

On the issue of KZ possibly getting off on a technicality, rightly or wrongly I believe his life has been forever altered. The stain of child is going to remain with him even if his prosecution is unsuccessful. Poetic justice IMHO, and not undeserved if he really did have something to do with Kelly's disappearance. One way or another, he is paying a price.

Although I know this is counter to his constitutional rights (i.e. the "presumption" of innocence until proven guilty), it seems abundantly clear to me that he had a large amount of very offensive child in his possession and deserves whatever is coming to him.

 

[Snoods]

It's true that a warrant must specify two things: the place to be searched, and the items they are searching for. Without seeing the actual warrant, I can't say whether the CDs and hard drive were within the "four corners" of the warrant. But, I would be very surprised (it does sometimes happen, but not often) if the officers seized something not covered by the warrant. Am I correct that the CDs and hard drive were seized on a second search warrant--not the one initially executed to search for drugs, but one that was issued to search for evidence of his involvement in KD's disappearance? If that is the case, I would expect that the warrant specifically covered computers, hard drives, CDs etc. Again, I'd need to see the actual warrant to be sure, but that would be pretty standard. If the hard drive and CDs were seized in the drug search warrant, then it's still possible the warrant would have included digital storage devices like hard drives and CDs because they were apparently investigating the crime of maintaining a drug house and possession with intent to deliver, and they could have asked for those things with the idea that records of drug deals might be on such items. I haven't typically seen that in my experience (because drug dealers don't usually keep this info on computer, but usually on paper), but it's not impossible.

Now, search warrants can only be issued on a judicial finding of probable cause to believe that a crime was committed and that evidence of that crime is at the place to be searched. Once a warrant is issued, most states say that anything seized by an officer acting in good faith on that warrant, cannot be excluded by a judge later determining that there really wasn't enough to meet the probable cause standard. (The state I practice in is actually a little different in this regard, but that's because our state constitution contains stronger privacy rights than the 4th Amendment under the US Const.) However, if the defense can establish that any misinformation was given to the judge to obtain the search warrant or if any information was omitted from the application for the warrant, and had that misinformation not been included or omitted, there would not have been probable cause to issue the warrant, then the warrant and any evidence obtained as a result can be thrown out. (There are some other things that can lead to evidence being thrown out--if the warrant is executed in an unreasonable way, like breaking down the door when you have a key, doing the search at night w/o the warrant specifically authorizing it, failing to knock and announce your presence etc. But I haven't seen anything to indicate anything like that is in play here.)

The way Miranda rights play into this, of course, is that, if any of the information given to the judge to get the warrant was itself illegally obtained, in violation of Miranda for example, then the court has to determine if there was still probable cause to issue the warrant even without any of that information.

I hope that helps, without being too much "legalese."

Yes, it helps very much! Thank you for taking the time to reply.

 

[Snoods]

This information has been mentioned in msm many times. The 20 some surveillance cameras reviewed were not all in the building that KZ lived in.

Okay thanks, sorry about that everyone. I thought this was new information. :blushing:

 

[soyesterday]

I have a friend who is doing the same thing...she's been going on this dating site for weeks now and taking to 10 to 15 different guys and talking about meeting up with a few of them. Bad thing is she is married. Not a good idea!!!! She has a great husband and I'm really not happy with her behavior right now but she's an adult. I can only hope she doesn't do something stupid like meet up with a total stranger. She may end up being a thread on WS!

I seriously got chills and felt sick reading this post. Cuz it sounds so much like me this year.
I know this is a little off topic, but my husband and i just went through a divorce and i started acting recklessly too. I've never been like this before, not even when i was younger, but just this summer, i joined a few different dating sites too.
I hate admitting this, but i did things i never imagined i would do, espcially after being on Webslueths for so long and seeing some of the things that could happen so easily.
I was one of the girls who met different guys online and would go out in the middle of the night and meet complete strangers.
I've had some bad experiences and met some sketchy guys. Including married men that would completely lie about being married and i would find out the truth on my own when it was too late.
I honestly believe and i do know that i am VERY lucky to be alive.
The things i was doing were so unsafe and if i was here reading about it on Webslueths, i would seriously be saying, "No don't do it!"
It's so scary to think about now.
I got off all the dating sites and am just so thankful that i made it out alive.
I just wanted to share this...
I have to catch up now on the rest of the thread....

 

[SmoothOperator]

I seriously got chills and felt sick reading this post. Cuz it sounds so much like me this year.
I know this is a little off topic, but my husband and i just went through a divorce and i started acting recklessly too. I've never been like this before, not even when i was younger, but just this summer, i joined a few different dating sites too.
I hate admitting this, but i did things i never imagined i would do, espcially after being on Webslueths for so long and seeing some of the things that could happen so easily.
I was one of the girls who met different guys online and would go out in the middle of the night and meet complete strangers.
I've had some bad experiences and met some sketchy guys. Including married men that would completely lie about being married and i would find out the truth on my own when it was too late.
I honestly believe and i do know that i am VERY lucky to be alive.
The things i was doing were so unsafe and if i was here reading about it on Webslueths, i would seriously be saying, "No don't do it!"
It's so scary to think about now.
I got off all the dating sites and am just so thankful that i made it out alive.
I just wanted to share this...
I have to catch up now on the rest of the thread....

Thanks for sharing, soyesterday.. Its scary to know just how many of us have gone through living recklessly at some point in our lives..and that while most of us live to tell, and learn from those poor choices we made, there are those who unfortunately end up paying with their lives for poor choices made..

I fear that Kelly is one whose life was ended due to some of the choices she made.. And its so very scary to really take a step back, look at her life and realize that there are many of us who have put ourselves in somewhat similar situations at some point in our lives..and the terrifying reality check that this so very easily could have been us..

While Kelly's case is being somewhat highlighted in garnering media attention..sadly these type occurrences happen all too frequently..its a horrifying fact and even more so when the family is left in the ultimate hell of limbo..the just not knowing what happened to her and where she is at.. The constant worries of if she's still alive and suffering in pain..being tortured or assaulted.. Just the hell of not knowing..with no closure or peace of mind.. The fact that families are left in this state of limbo for years and even decades is just a fate worse than death, IMO..

The not knowing is just so much worse..and the family will quickly become just a literal shell of a living, breathing human being..it destroys you quickly..and its why I want so desperately for those like Kelly's family to receive the answers for which they will never ever stop seeking.. Until the day they die. Where is Kelly?

**Please forgive the limitations that come w/my posting via mobile ATM**

 

[Kipper_MKE]

How did the search go this weekend?

 

[Oploc2005]

The family could not make it down also we had to go thru some info on the case so we can use the k9 services best. Has anyone heard of Robert Larson he has said he will come down and help. I did here some mention possability cops visited KZ parents area with dogs but LE won't confirm. My organization any family was out there few weeks ago putting up fliers. Then this week the sheriff out there caught up to me someone complained I was in there subdivision putting up fliers. Little more then you asked wantes to bring everyone up to date on efforts. This weekend family and our group along with k9 team will be going over entire area. We will need volunteers to search a wooded area.

 

[graceholl]

This case really bothers me...why no new info in such a long time...what's going on...?

 

[Woe.be.gone]

http://wtaq.com/news/articles/2013/nov/06/kris-zocco-pleads-not-guilty-to-possessing-child-🤬🤬🤬🤬/

Hello. To remind, if no changes have been made to the schedule, a conference (hearing?) is supposed to take place on Thursday (Dec. 5) surrounding KZ's charges. Info given before was that a trial date could be set at this time.

Oploc, I've read about Mr. Larson before. For the life of me I can't recall where (which case). But, iirc, before he arrived to help, the body was discovered.

He's had some successes and stated LE gives up too soon.

http://www.myfoxchicago.com/story/2...g-trainers-offer-to-search-for-missing-infant

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...es-plaines-river-lakeshia-baker-bryeon-hunter

Robet Larson attempted to help find Julie Peters in Edwards, Illinois. Before he made it there (delayed trying to arrange funding), she was found in her car in the Illinois River by someone using sonar iirc.

Also tried to assist finding Nick Steward, a missing Lake Villa man.
I believe RL assisted searching in the corn field but not sure to what extent or if he and his dog had anything to do with the outcome of the body being located.

 

[mikkismom]

Boyfriend of missing woman in court Thursday

http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/Boyfriend-of-missing-woman-in-court-Thursday-234575551.html

 

[RainyAlaska]

<snip>Kris Zocco is charged in two unrelated cases, and after the hearing today, it was clear just how intense the investigation of Zocco is, and the pressure surrounding his supporters. <snip>

SOURCE: 620 WTMJ Newsradio http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/Zocco-person-of-interest-in-Dwyer-case-in-court-Thursday-234622901.html

That means LE is putting the heat on. Wonder what pressure his supporters are under? Does LE think someone in KZ's circle will talk? LE may have more evidence than we know. ???????????

 

[seattlechiquita]

<snip>Kris Zocco is charged in two unrelated cases, and after the hearing today, it was clear just how intense the investigation of Zocco is, and the pressure surrounding his supporters. <snip>

SOURCE: 620 WTMJ Newsradio http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/Zocco-person-of-interest-in-Dwyer-case-in-court-Thursday-234622901.html

That means LE is putting the heat on. Wonder what pressure his supporters are under? Does LE think someone in KZ's circle will talk? LE may have more evidence than we know. ???????????

I hope he does not get out and take off. He has the means, and people who enjoy *puke* child help each other go underground.

 

[SmoothOperator]

Holy ****!.. Kelly's precious family is suffering terribly.. Below is a quote from Kelly's uncle who "religiously attends EVERY ONE OF Kris Zocco's court hearings".. It really tore me up watching him speak on the video at the link(which is where the direct quote is transcribed from)

"By the end of January my buddy Kris could be smoking a joint, doing some lines of coke, and having a bowl of popcorn watching kiddie ..meanwhile Kelly's body is out there rotting away some where.. Who the hell knows"..<his voice cracking>
http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/Z...n-Dwyer-case-in-court-Thursday-234622901.html

Her poor family..its heartbreaking and I am very fearful of just what KZ's family's money is possibly going to "buy" him in terms of the current charges(drugs and child ).. It seems her poor family definitely worries that the family money will be able to some how "buy" him out of trouble.. I so hope that's not the case and desperately want to believe that evil criminal behavior will face severe consequences regardless of the individual's family wealth and status!!

I just hurt for her loved ones.. They definitely are very understanding of the fact that Kelly is very, very likely deceased and they must live every minute, of everyday knowing that their loved one's body is just out there, somewhere in the elements..God how my heart aches for them!

 

[katherine5]

I am surprised that KZ's employer still wants him associated with their company. Regardless of what involvement he did or didn't have in Kelly's disappearance, wouldn't the child charges (and drug charges too - but minor in comparison) be enough to have the company he works for disassociate themselves from him? Wow! How does that work? I would have been fired a long time ago if that were me.

 

[katherine5]

Thanksgiving is here and Kelly isn't - so sad. My prayers go out to her family on this day that families should celebrate together.

On the issue of KZ possibly getting off on a technicality, rightly or wrongly I believe his life has been forever altered. The stain of child is going to remain with him even if his prosecution is unsuccessful. Poetic justice IMHO, and not undeserved if he really did have something to do with Kelly's disappearance. One way or another, he is paying a price.

Although I know this is counter to his constitutional rights (i.e. the "presumption" of innocence until proven guilty), it seems abundantly clear to me that he had a large amount of very offensive child in his possession and deserves whatever is coming to him.

I agree with you; however, if his employer wants him to be working for them, then what does that say? I am confused. What business wants that stigma? Something is not right?!

 

[TodHackett]

I think his mom is one of the principals.

 

[katherine5]

Yes, you are correct; but from a business standpoint, family or not, wouldn't you want to try to hide him or cover up the situation? I wouldn't want to do business with this company. Now everyone knows that he still works at the same company. After reading the completely disgusting police document on the child charges, I wouldn't be able to stomach anything associated with him.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

<snip>Kris Zocco is charged in two unrelated cases, and after the hearing today, it was clear just how intense the investigation of Zocco is, and the pressure surrounding his supporters. <snip>

SOURCE: 620 WTMJ Newsradio http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/Zocco-person-of-interest-in-Dwyer-case-in-court-Thursday-234622901.html

That means LE is putting the heat on. Wonder what pressure his supporters are under? Does LE think someone in KZ's circle will talk? LE may have more evidence than we know. ???????????

Though I do not know exactly what "putting the pressure" on Zocco's supporters entails... I do admit I am encouraged that LE is still proactively working Kelly's case...

JMO