Woman Faces Fines for Watching Neighbors' Kids Before Bus Comes

[Lyn1001]

That's absolutely ridiculous. Social Services doesn't do the job they should be doing (protecting or removing abused kids), yet they don't want this lady watching out for someone else's children.

What's wrong with this world?

This is so ridiculous. Michigan has trouble making a budget and yet they have money to pay CPS workers to look into a situation like this? :banghead:

Oh for stupid! Social services has time for this when there are children being abused and killed every day in their homes. Somebody needs a reality check!

This is an example of a law that serves a good purpose (trying to prevent non-licensed and non-regulated daycares from operating under the radar) being abused by the nuts. This crazy neighbor is using the law (granted it's poorly written) to cause trouble for her neighbors.

Michigan Social Workers / CPS don't have any choice but to enforce the law if it's brought to their attention, which is what happened. And the law won't get changed soon because Michigan is in the middle of a budget crisis, so the attention is elsewhere. It's a mess no matter how you look at it.

What if something happened in this home? There would be a lot of screaming that all unlicensed daycares should be shut down. How could she do that, how selfish of her to try to make some money without registering and following the law.

I'm so excited I figured out how to quote more than one person! Now, to respond to a few things.

The part of the agency that deals with licensing daycares is completely different that CPS. Different workers, different trainings, etc.. So, the state is not having CPS investigating (as far as I'm aware). Both are under the umbrella of the Department of Human Services, but they are not the same job.

I agree with the posters who mentioned that it is a good law that is being used poorly in this situation. Workers have to follow the law, whether they "agree" with the circumstance or not. This woman should have probably never been turned in, but now that she has been, there is nothing the worker can do but follow policy and law.

Overall, the situation pretty much sucks for all involved.

 

[MCDRAW]

What if something happened in this home? There would be a lot of screaming that all unlicensed daycares should be shut down. How could she do that, how selfish of her to try to make some money without registering and following the law.

Good people break the law, sometimes without knowing. Just because someone is a good person or has good intents doesn't exempt them from the laws, rules, and regulations.

http://news.aol.com/article/michigan-tells-lisa-snyder-to-stop-baby/692754
Snyder said she started watching the other children this school year to help her friends; they often baby-sit for each other during evenings and weekends.
After receiving the state agency's letter, she said she called the agency and tried to explain that she wasn't running a day care center or accepting money from her friends.

 

[Vegas Bride]

I wonder how much it would cost for her to become licenced? If she's able to do that, then no problem right?
It would be nice if the families she is helping would all pitch in and pay the fees for her.

VB

 

[OrdinaryLife]

The complaint call had to be followed through even though they (Social Services) agreed it was ridiculous. There is absolutely nothing wrong with neighbors helping neighbors. No laws are involved or were broken. My goodness, she has the neighbors kids for a short time while they wait for the bus!

The call was made to cause trouble for others. A very bitter person who spends too much time looking out the window watching the neighbors. They should probably switch to decaf and watch the Weather Channel in the morning. And, the afternoon. Dork.

 

[kgeaux]

What if something happened in this home? There would be a lot of screaming that all unlicensed daycares should be shut down. How could she do that, how selfish of her to try to make some money without registering and following the law.

Good people break the law, sometimes without knowing. Just because someone is a good person or has good intents doesn't exempt them from the laws, rules, and regulations.

She is not paid. She is not running a day-care. Given the circumstances, I cannot even imagine that she selfishly determined not to register as a day care: who in her situation would consider herself as a day care center instead of a neighbor helping neighbor. She is providing a safe place for her neighbors' kids to stay between the time their parents leave for work and the time their bus comes.

Even given the law, it still doesn't seem to me that her neighborly help qualifies as a day-care. It would be the first free day-care I've ever heard of!

 

[kgeaux]

http://news.aol.com/article/michigan-tells-lisa-snyder-to-stop-baby/692754
Snyder said she started watching the other children this school year to help her friends; they often baby-sit for each other during evenings and weekends.
After receiving the state agency's letter, she said she called the agency and tried to explain that she wasn't running a day care center or accepting money from her friends.

A quote from the article: On Tuesday, agency Director Ismael Ahmed said good neighbors should be allowed to help each other ensure their children are safe. Gov. Jennifer Granholm instructed Ahmed to work with the state Legislature to change the law, he said.
"Being a good neighbor means helping your neighbors who are in need," Ahmed said in a written statement. "This could be as simple as providing a cup of sugar, monitoring their house while they're on vacation or making sure their children are safe while they wait for the school bus."

The problem seems to be an extremely poorly written law that cannot differentiate between what separates a day care from situations like this.

I'm so excited I figured out how to quote more than one person! Now, to respond to a few things.

The part of the agency that deals with licensing daycares is completely different that CPS. Different workers, different trainings, etc.. So, the state is not having CPS investigating (as far as I'm aware). Both are under the umbrella of the Department of Human Services, but they are not the same job.

I agree with the posters who mentioned that it is a good law that is being used poorly in this situation. Workers have to follow the law, whether they "agree" with the circumstance or not. This woman should have probably never been turned in, but now that she has been, there is nothing the worker can do but follow policy and law.

Overall, the situation pretty much sucks for all involved.

Im not sure I agree that the law is a good one. It seems to me that the original aim of the law was good, but the law itself is so poorly written that it allows government agencies to insinuate themselves into private lives with no cause at all.
I do totally agree that the situation sucks alright! And it seems to me that if parents would leave small children in the rain and snow in the early morning with nothing but an umbrella to keep them safe, THEN CPS would need to step in......

 

[RainbowsAndGumdrops]

ETA: http://www.mlive.com/news/kzgazette/index.ssf?/base/news-35/1254025207205180.xml&coll=7 This article indicates that it's just two other children (5 and 7, not even infants) than her own. So, I guess your own children are included in the three or more rule. Crazy!! I would totally have a play date with two other children with my son. I can't believe that's illegal in that state.

I read this story this morning on Yahoo and there were 3 women who's children she was watching.

The link above tells a different story. If it is true that there are only 2 children that she is watching, she is abiding by the law. However, it wouldn't make sense that she would need to plead for an exception if that were the case.

The law makers do have to make a decision on when to call something a daycare and when not to. Is it your kids plus 2? your kids plus 4 others? Is it 7 kids total? They have to draw a line and stick with it, or the laws become useless.

It sounds like new legislation is being drafted so that if you aren't running a daycare as a business you are exempted.

 

[palmerk]

The law was written because of the following:
Let's say that you are running a daycare and operating illegally --taking $ under the table to take care of your neighbor's kids. You don't report the income. And maybe you're not exactly a safe environment for kids.

Someone turns you in. You say, hey, I'm not making any money, I'm just helping a neighbor. Sure, I've been doing it for a bit, but it's just until she finds daycare (or a job, or whatever).

The intention of the law was to prevent this from happening and prevent kids from being unsafe --I think we can all agree that's a good thing.

The problem is the way the law was written is that it's too open --the crazy neighbor found a loophole and now the poor moms are stuck. I don't think they need to trash the law, but they do need to tack on an amendment providing for this type of situation (the Mom watching kids at the bus stop), while still protecting kids.

I have to laugh because we broke this law A LOT growing up. We lived on the corner out in the country growing up. The bus stop was on the corner, and if you lived anywhere in the quarter mile radius, you had to walk to the corner. Lots of snow (Michigan) and freezing temps. Most mornings my parents had half the neighborhood waiting in the house!!

 

[OrdinaryLife]

I read this story this morning on Yahoo and there were 3 women who's children she was watching.

The link above tells a different story. If it is true that there are only 2 children that she is watching, she is abiding by the law. However, it wouldn't make sense that she would need to plead for an exception if that were the case.

The law makers do have to make a decision on when to call something a daycare and when not to. Is it your kids plus 2? your kids plus 4 others? Is it 7 kids total? They have to draw a line and stick with it, or the laws become useless.

It sounds like new legislation is being drafted so that if you aren't running a daycare as a business you are exempted.

This is a woman who watched children for a short time before they took the bus to school. In her neighborhood. What is the big deal? My goodness, should we now be concerned with what neighbors do for each other?

 

[passionflower]

Rediculous! I watched many children because my house was the bus stop!
I had children before and after shool.
They would watch TV, eat with my children until it was time for bus or go home.
I was the only stay at home mom at that time!
It takes a village to raise a child.
I was the 'snoopy' house cleared for any child to come for help at my door.
This is so terrible..........

 

[kgeaux]

The problem is the way the law was written is that it's too open --the crazy neighbor found a loophole and now the poor moms are stuck. I don't think they need to trash the law, but they do need to tack on an amendment providing for this type of situation (the Mom watching kids at the bus stop), while still protecting kids.

I have to laugh because we broke this law A LOT growing up. We lived on the corner out in the country growing up. The bus stop was on the corner, and if you lived anywhere in the quarter mile radius, you had to walk to the corner. Lots of snow (Michigan) and freezing temps. Most mornings my parents had half the neighborhood waiting in the house!!

I agree with you so much! Yes, the law should ensure that every family who needs day-care is protected from anyone who would run a sub-standard business. Yes, the law needs to be amended to provide for this type of situation---Lord knows we do NOT NEED little children standing on street corners in the freezing rain and snow with only an umbrella to protect them from the elements.

And I especially agree with your last paragraph! Louisiana doesn't have much snow, and very little freezing weather, but my family home was nick-named "Grand Central Station" when I was young. My mom had lots of children and always welcomed more. Children gathered at my house, and my Mom fed them, watched them and loved them----never charged a dime for her services, either. Of course when Momma needed help, our neighbors were always quick to take us into their homes and care for us. Neighbors back then would have DIED before they failed to help one another. ESPECIALLY when the safety of little ones was involved. That is part of what makes a neighborhood a community and part of what makes us strong.

We need MORE people like this woman, not less, and we need to support them, not charge them with all sorts of ridiculous charges. Don't tell me that the gov't agency believes this lady is running a day care: they KNOW she's not. This is a law begging to be changed!

 

[Miss_Scarlett]

What's a "snoopy" house?

 

[RJA00]

geez, wonder why my mother never got a letter lol
back in the 80's there was a lot more latch key kids,

my mother was the only mom on the block that didnt work, she took care of them all
about 8 of us was always playing in the yard,
do they have the same law in Maryland

i watch two kids at the bus stop, there mother has to leave for work 15 min before the bus comes, and one kid father is having heart trouble so we watch him at the bus stop too

this is just crazy, im out there anyway
I hope there no law in TN

 

[SeriouslySearching]

It is ridiculous and heads should be rolling for allowing this to happen. I have no doubt it was done by someone who is running a daycare in the area. Another parent would not know the law or consider turning in someone for kids "visiting" in the mornings before school. (I think someone said all of this before and I agree!)

I think not only should the law be changed, but school districts need to rethink the entire situation of having students wait at bus stops because of weather and leaving them vulnerable to predators plus other dangers. Maybe it is time the school districts came up with a better plan for the safety of all students.

We learned nothing from the disappearance of Jaycee Dugard 18 years ago. How many children have gone missing from walking to school or to the bus stop since then? Will we ever find a better way or continue down the same literal path from now on because it is the cheapest route?

 

[RayStar]

Here's a link with both an article and a video: http://www.woodtv.com/dpp/news/local/kent_county/Bus_stop_controversy_in_Middleville

I hope they expose the person who reported them.

I agree. This busy body needs to be exposed ASAP.

 

[Miss_Scarlett]

I can't remember if I wrote this before, but that law was written in something like 1973 before everyone realized how dangerous it was to let your children wait or walk in certain areas alone. It definitely needs to be changed.

 

[kgeaux]

I agree. This busy body needs to be exposed ASAP.

I don't know if I want to know the identity of the person---not if it would break social services policy to reveal who made the complaint---but I'd sure like to know the motivation.